Pentagon blames Trump for resurgence of ISIS

Darth Omar said:
Water under the bridge.
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understanding the sequence of the fall of the Iraqi troops - and the rise of the Shia milita's in tandem with said gives the lie to the claim Obama had anything much to do with recapturing and defeating ISIS

Darth Omar said:
As I said before, the least-bad option for Trump is whack a mole in Afghanistan and I think he should withdraw before 2020. Al Qaeda attacked us from Afghanistan prior to our post-9/11 counter terrorism measures instituted under Bush The Hated and kept in place by Obama The Blameless.

Trump needs to stick to his America First guns on this: unless ISIS in Afghanistan becomes a top tier threat to the homeland—they/it gets kicked to the back burner. If it looks like they are going to amass more territory, there’s plenty we can do with air power and drones to make their lives miserable. That means accepting some collateral damage [especially with the drones] but it’s a least-bad thing.

But if there are better options—let’s hear them.
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the drone strategy ( counter-terrorism) collateral damage does incite our relations with Pakistan -
to effected Afghani's as well.

But you are correct -this is the only viable long term play -suppression and killing it's leadership.
collateral damage or not

we just walked away (temporary) from direct talks with the Taliban. Trump is trying to dump US troops there faster then a hot potato -good for him.
Any negotiations with the Taliban are worthless anyway -even the Afghan gov't isn't in on these
 
dukkha said:
understanding the sequence of the fall of the Iraqi troops - and the rise of the Shia milita's in tandem with said gives the lie to the claim Obama had anything much to do with recapturing and defeating ISIS


the drone strategy ( counter-terrorism) collateral damage does incite our relations with Pakistan -
to effected Afghani's as well.

But you are correct -this is the only viable long term play -suppression and killing it's leadership.
collateral damage or not

we just walked away (temporary) from direct talks with the Taliban. Trump is trying to dump US troops there faster then a hot potato -good for him.
Any negotiations with the Taliban are worthless anyway -even the Afghan gov't isn't in on these
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The Taliban are going to do what their religious doctrine compels them to, period. Regardless of what they say otherwise, so you’re right that it’s pointless to negotiate with them.

We had justification to go into Afghanistan in 2002 but that was 17 years ago. It’s evolved into a Stupid War and Trump campaigned on getting out of them and/or not getting into them. Trump gets an A on not getting into them but right now he’s sitting on a ‘C’ in getting us out of them.

He needs to act. Plus the timing would be excellent with 2020 approaching.
 
Darth Omar said:
The Taliban are going to do what their religious doctrine compels them to, period. Regardless of what they say otherwise, so you’re right that it’s pointless to negotiate with them.

We had justification to go into Afghanistan in 2002 but that was 17 years ago. It’s evolved into a Stupid War and Trump campaigned on getting out of them and/or not getting into them. Trump gets an A on not getting into them but right now he’s sitting on a ‘C’ in getting us out of them.

He needs to act. Plus the timing would be excellent with 2020 approaching.
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he is negotiating a face saving withdrawal
 
Darth Omar said:
Water under the bridge.

As I said before, the least-bad option for Trump is whack a mole in Afghanistan and I think he should withdraw before 2020. Al Qaeda attacked us from Afghanistan prior to our post-9/11 counter terrorism measures instituted under Bush The Hated and kept in place by Obama The Blameless.

Trump needs to stick to his America First guns on this: unless ISIS in Afghanistan becomes a top tier threat to the homeland—they/it gets kicked to the back burner. If it looks like they are going to amass more territory, there’s plenty we can do with air power and drones to make their lives miserable. That means accepting some collateral damage [especially with the drones] but it’s a least-bad thing.

But if there are better options—let’s hear them.
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Our reason for remaining in Afg lies mainly in the knowledge that Pakistan is powerless to protect its nukes from the Taliban.

Otherwise, we could let the region continue with it's centuries old war of attrition.
 
Darth Omar said:
The Taliban are going to do what their religious doctrine compels them to, period. Regardless of what they say otherwise, so you’re right that it’s pointless to negotiate with them.

We had justification to go into Afghanistan in 2002 but that was 17 years ago. It’s evolved into a Stupid War and Trump campaigned on getting out of them and/or not getting into them. Trump gets an A on not getting into them but right now he’s sitting on a ‘C’ in getting us out of them.

He needs to act. Plus the timing would be excellent with 2020 approaching.
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We never 'negotiated' with the Taliban. We bribed their leaders, who went right back to attacking us as soon as we left the village on the way to the next.


trump's problem is that he bragged about 'getting rid of ISIS' on the campaign trail. He waltzed into office with mop up detail in Mosul. After taking credit for Obama's work against ISIS, he cannot simply do what is ultimately necessary...getting our troops home.

It won't play well when ISIS makes a resurgence during his campaign. He can't blame it on Hillary or Obama.

Maybe Epstein will be scapegoated?
 
Althea said:
We never 'negotiated' with the Taliban. We bribed their leaders, who went right back to attacking us as soon as we left the village on the way to the next.


trump's problem is that he bragged about 'getting rid of ISIS' on the campaign trail. He waltzed into office with mop up detail in Mosul. After taking credit for Obama's work against ISIS, he cannot simply do what is ultimately necessary...getting our troops home.

It won't play well when ISIS makes a resurgence during his campaign. He can't blame it on Hillary or Obama.

Maybe Epstein will be scapegoated?
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He can, and he will -- and as we've seen here, the marks will dutifully repeat that it's not Trump's fault till it magically becomes true. Wait for it.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
He can, and he will -- and as we've seen here, the marks will dutifully repeat that it's not Trump's fault till it magically becomes true. Wait for it.
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Sure. That's predictable. The question remains as to how many Independents are going to fall for his comedy routine this time.
 
Althea said:
And you don't want to accept Bush's responsibility. At least Obama recognized a problem and dealt with it.
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suggestion, if you want to be taken seriously, stop defending Obama, on anything.

he was lost, the lost 8 years is best forgotten

Althea said:
Sure. That's predictable. The question remains as to how many Independents are going to fall for his comedy routine this time.
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If you are that electoral college braindead, that's fine. We have books, and google you know
 
Althea said:
We never 'negotiated' with the Taliban. We bribed their leaders, who went right back to attacking us as soon as we left the village on the way to the next.


trump's problem is that he bragged about 'getting rid of ISIS' on the campaign trail. He waltzed into office with mop up detail in Mosul. After taking credit for Obama's work against ISIS, he cannot simply do what is ultimately necessary...getting our troops home.

It won't play well when ISIS makes a resurgence during his campaign. He can't blame it on Hillary or Obama.

Maybe Epstein will be scapegoated?
Click to expand...

Bush II famously warned about what would happen if they withdrew from Iraq prematurely; and sure enough, ISIS grew from obscurity to a household name in a year *under Obama’s nose*.

In spite of Bush’s warnings, Obama was, as you conceded, ‘unenthusiastic’ about the SOFA negotiations.

I think that pretty well covers it.
 
Darth Omar said:
Bush II famously warned about what would happen if they withdrew from Iraq prematurely; and sure enough, ISIS grew from obscurity to a household name in a year *under Obama’s nose*.

In spite of Bush’s warnings, Obama was, as you conceded, ‘unenthusiastic’ about the SOFA negotiations.

I think that pretty well covers it.
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That Bush fucked up and created ISIS?

On that we agree.
 
rjhenn said:
If ISIS is gone, it's largely due to the Kurds, who Trump keeps undermining.
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"undermining" how? you blithering Idiot.
The Kurds did their area but the Iranians and Shi'a militia and Iraqi army did their ISIS cleaning areas as well
 
Darth Omar said:
Bush II famously warned about what would happen if they withdrew from Iraq prematurely; and sure enough, ISIS grew from obscurity to a household name in a year *under Obama’s nose*.

In spite of Bush’s warnings, Obama was, as you conceded, ‘unenthusiastic’ about the SOFA negotiations.

I think that pretty well covers it.
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NotAllThere is in serious denial about the role played by Obama in enabling ISIS, he should stick to wood whittling.
 
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Havana Moon said:
NotAllThere is in serious denial about the role played in enabling ISIS, be should stick to wood whittling.
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look at this:
Althea said:
We never 'negotiated' with the Taliban. We bribed their leaders, who went right back to attacking us as soon as we left the village on the way to the next.


trump's problem is that he bragged about 'getting rid of ISIS' on the campaign trail. He waltzed into office with mop up detail in Mosul. After taking credit for Obama's work against ISIS, he cannot simply do what is ultimately necessary...getting our troops home.

It won't play well when ISIS makes a resurgence during his campaign. He can't blame it on Hillary or Obama.
Click to expand...

first off he doesn't understand we are in direct negotiations with Taliban, and had unproductive talks before
( Qatar talks) -what is this "bribing their leaders"???
~~

Mosul was never "a mop up operation" - it was house to house street fighting in the Old City,
and Trump came into office while ISIS still had significant territory in Syria -and some still in Iraq.

Trump's contribution was battlefield autonomy for commanders on the ground
It accelerated the real time ability for decision making , while Obama had everything cleared thru the WH

It won't play well when ISIS makes a resurgence during his campaign.
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gross stupidity. ISIS is back to a virulent insurgency just like it was before (AQI)
 
anatta said:
look at this:


first off he doesn't understand we are in direct negotiations with Taliban, and had unproductive talks before
( Qatar talks) -what is this "bribing their leaders"???
~~

Mosul was never "a mop up operation" - it was house to house street fighting in the Old City,
and Trump came into office while ISIS still had significant territory in Syria -and some still in Iraq.

Trump's contribution was battlefield autonomy for commanders on the ground
It accelerated the real time ability for decision making , while Obama had everything cleared thru the WH



gross stupidity. ISIS is back to a virulent insurgency just like it was before (AQI)
Click to expand...

Which puts us right back to the least-bad option: when ISIS starts to get too rowdy—dust off the drones. Nobody is a big fan of drones but drones coupled with our intelligence [we know where they are] gives us a means to keep them in check.

The alternatives are an eternal presence in Afghanistan or ignoring them—which is what Obama did and we know how that ends up.

Neither is acceptable.
 
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