hvilleherb
Verified User
Trump is right.
If the other NATO nations don't buck up, we should consider disbanding the organization.
If the other NATO nations don't buck up, we should consider disbanding the organization.
NATO is a Cold War Relic
- Thread starter hvilleherb
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hvilleherb
Verified User
Trump demands NATO allies increase their financial contributions
President Trump reportedly wrote letters to a number of leaders of NATO-member nations, criticizing them for failing to live up to their spending obligations toward the international alliance.
The New York Times reported Monday that Trump wrote last month to German Chancellor Angela Merkel, Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and leaders in Belgium and Norway. The letters mark an escalation of Trump’s frequent critique that the U.S. shoulders too much of the burden in funding NATO.
http://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...to-call-for-increased-financial-contributions
President Trump reportedly wrote letters to a number of leaders of NATO-member nations, criticizing them for failing to live up to their spending obligations toward the international alliance.
The New York Times reported Monday that Trump wrote last month to German Chancellor Angela Merkel, Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau and leaders in Belgium and Norway. The letters mark an escalation of Trump’s frequent critique that the U.S. shoulders too much of the burden in funding NATO.
http://thehill.com/homenews/adminis...to-call-for-increased-financial-contributions
hvilleherb
Verified User
Mattis joined defense ministers to discuss the individual plans that NATO countries have submitted for the first time to show how they will reach a target to spend 2 percent of economic output on defense every year by 2024.
But Spain has said it will not meet the 2024 target. Belgium, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, Italy, Portugal, Norway and Denmark are also lagging. Hungary expects to meet the goal only by 2026.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...nding-plans-still-falling-short-idUSKCN1FY013
But Spain has said it will not meet the 2024 target. Belgium, the Netherlands, Luxembourg, Italy, Portugal, Norway and Denmark are also lagging. Hungary expects to meet the goal only by 2026.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...nding-plans-still-falling-short-idUSKCN1FY013
I'm not sure the US has the ability or the right to unilaterally 'disband' NATO, but we can withdraw.
The Europeans have taken American security guarantees for granted. They have spent too little on defense. When they do spend, they do little to reduce the number of weapons systems across the continent. The fact that the Europeans have seventeen different main battle tanks, 20 different fighter planes, 29 different destroyers/frigates, and 20 different torpedo systems speaks volumes. These structures are wasteful. They are reducing interoperability, not encouraging it.
So there is plenty of room for criticism and there is plenty of room for efficiencies and pooling and sharing. European finance and defense ministries together need to deal with this wasteful duplication.
http://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/70090
Billy the Great Khan
Uwaa OmO
American troops for American soil, American money for American citizens.
I do think we have far too many foreign bases.
Oorah!
Article 13: After the Treaty has been in force for twenty years, any Party may cease to be a Party one year after its notice of denunciation has been given to the Government of the United States of America, which will inform the Governments of the other Parties of the deposit of each notice of denunciation.
https://www.nato.int/cps/ie/natohq/official_texts_17120.htm
@ post 1
Obviously, this thread is riffing of Dump's overt hostility to our NATO allies.
You know, you don't have to say shit just because you think it backs Trump up.
You don't have to expend all your efforts into supporting Donald Trump with every fiber of your being.
You do not have to always feel obligated to giving his boots a tongue bath.
You can actually use your own brain and own ideas once in a while.
In my opinion, NATO continues to be a force for international stability, and serves both the interest of the U.S. and our allies.
NATO is involved in a lot of shit that has nothing to do with Cold War relics. Peace keeping missions, counter-terrorism. counter-piracy missions, humanitarian relief.
I know that conservatives prefer to use the military to invade and occupy countries that do not threaten us, but I feel like we generally get a bigger bang for our buck, and enhance our soft power, by using the military for humanitarian relief, and peace keeping operations. The Balkans conflicts are a classic example of the utility nd benefits of NATO.
Obviously, this thread is riffing of Dump's overt hostility to our NATO allies.
You know, you don't have to say shit just because you think it backs Trump up.
You don't have to expend all your efforts into supporting Donald Trump with every fiber of your being.
You do not have to always feel obligated to giving his boots a tongue bath.
You can actually use your own brain and own ideas once in a while.
In my opinion, NATO continues to be a force for international stability, and serves both the interest of the U.S. and our allies.
NATO is involved in a lot of shit that has nothing to do with Cold War relics. Peace keeping missions, counter-terrorism. counter-piracy missions, humanitarian relief.
I know that conservatives prefer to use the military to invade and occupy countries that do not threaten us, but I feel like we generally get a bigger bang for our buck, and enhance our soft power, by using the military for humanitarian relief, and peace keeping operations. The Balkans conflicts are a classic example of the utility nd benefits of NATO.
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If by "Dump" you mean Trump,
I might have thought this simple partisan sniping. It has the earmark of hyperbole.
But in this extraordinarily exceptional case, you may be right.
ditto
You are (perhaps deliberately) invoking Von Clausewitz *. Meanwhile, while our predator drones are blasting Pakistani weddings to smithereens, China is in Africa building roads, drilling safe drinking water wells, etc.
China is well on the way to replacing the U.S. as global leader, and perhaps much sooner than we may think.
* Karl Von Clausewitz (1780-1831), Prussian soldier, strategist. On War, Preface (1832)
And so is Russian aggression, irony is that it still occurs today which explains the existence of NATO
I agree they need to step up to their financial obligations. I feel the same way about the UN. I do not agree that either are relics and have outlived their usefulness.
How did that work for us in WWI? WWII? Korea?
Do you remember why we do?
hvilleherb
Verified User
So we're not supposed to protect our oil or our other interests?
NATO is a safety net for all of it's members, but most especially for former members of the Soviet Union, whom Putin would dearly love to repatriate. You would gladly allow Russia to conquer them again. You are an amoral idiot.