solid proof of evolution

The Ugly Truth said:
If someone calls themselves a Christian and say they believe in evolution, then they are calling God a liar. So they can't be Christians. "In the beginning, God created..." It says so, right in the Bible.
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Not really, someone can believe the genesis story is allegorical and that God initiated evolution as his mechanism to create man in his image.
I think it's unlikely that was the author's intent with genesis, but it is less stupid than your belief that it is literal and therefore all the science
it defies is wrong. I think those people are coming to an uncomfortable accommodation, and you should let them. Their only alternative
is to leave the fold or accept your narrow, rigid exegesis? Your membership will winnow down from a global religion to the population
of Mississippi.
 
Darth Omar said:
The universe isn’t somehow ‘less scientific’ if God created it lol.

Granted, the creative event itself would lie beyond science but the rest of the universe would be amenable to science. In fact, a universe that is the product of an infinite mind would be MORE ‘scientific’ because all the physical laws and constants would ultimately be based in rationality.

And what do we find?

Patterns, mathematical symmetry in the laws and constants. All the planets, asteroids and comets obey Newtonian physics which causes them to be as predictable as any Swiss watch.

All of the physical constants are fined tuned to such an extent that if any of them varied a tiny a bit I wouldn’t be sitting here typing this.

Biology is infused with rationality and it is more scientific on account of it. DNA functions exactly like computer code—except that ours is primitive by comparison. All cellular structures and events proceed in strict accordance with a *rational* code contained in the DNA molecule.

I would argue the universe is MORE scientific if it the product of an infinite mind.
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Common misconception. DNA coding is nothing like computer coding. Mathematically computer programs are pure mechanical binary (base 2) systems, on or off (a bit).

DNA is mathematically a quaternary (base 4) chemical system e.g., A, T, C, G,. That represents twice the exponential values of a mechanical binary system.

In other words DNA’s information processing is, mathematically, nothing like the information processing of a mechanical computer binary system.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Common misconception. DNA coding is nothing like computer coding. Mathematically computer programs are pure mechanical binary (base 2) systems, on or off (a bit).

DNA is mathematically a quaternary (base 4) chemical system e.g., A, T, C, G,. That represents twice the exponential values of a mechanical binary system.

In other words DNA’s information processing is, mathematically, nothing like the information processing of a mechanical computer binary system.
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Does this difference suggest that either is flawed or one preferable?

I think the more common misconception is irreparable, wool dyed strict fundamentalists think that any degree of order connotes intelligence and an intelligent cause,
so whether or not dna differs from bits and bytes doesn't heal what ails them. They simply look around at order and structure in the universe and see the hand of
a grey haired Merlyn looking cloud daddy.
 
Micawber said:
Does this difference suggest that either is flawed or one preferable?

I think the more common misconception is irreparable, wool dyed strict fundamentalists think that any degree of order connotes intelligence and an intelligent cause,
so whether or not dna differs from bits and bytes doesn't heal what ails them. They simply look around at order and structure in the universe and see the hand of
a grey haired Merlyn looking cloud daddy.
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There is nothing wrong with that at all; feeling wonder and gratitude is good for the body and the soul as well. However, insisting that everyone else see things your way (with an implied and dire "or else") sort of negates the whole thing.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
There is nothing wrong with that at all; feeling wonder and gratitude is good for the body and the soul as well. However, insisting that everyone else see things your way (with an implied and dire "or else") sort of negates the whole thing.
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I go yes and no on that. If we look around with awe and wonder, that is good if it causes us (human race) to seek knowledge, if your awe and wonder makes you adopt a stultifying conclusion
like god did it, game over, end of story, stop studying (like it did during the dark ages) then it is, I maintain, a very bad thing. How many children of fundamentalist christians will not grow
to be Nobel Prize winning geneticists, neuroscientists or biochemists because their parent's beliefs inculcated them and they were steerted to Bob Jones U instead of Cal Tech it is anyone's guess.

We won't continue to be a great country with a bunch of brainwashed science doubters, and don't think that isn't happening. It quite obviously is. In fact they have managed to take power
in the Republican party. I think it all matters and I don't think it's disconnected.
 
Micawber said:
Does this difference suggest that either is flawed or one preferable?

I think the more common misconception is irreparable, wool dyed strict fundamentalists think that any degree of order connotes intelligence and an intelligent cause,
so whether or not dna differs from bits and bytes doesn't heal what ails them. They simply look around at order and structure in the universe and see the hand of
a grey haired Merlyn looking cloud daddy.
Click to expand...
Well that’s their perogitive. It’s a free world. To me that’s not what is important. In debating them on this topic I have no expectations of changing their minds. Nor am I interested in satisfying my own ego that I have proven them wrong.

My goal in debating them is to educate other readers of these posts who do not have scientific expertise, but do have open minds, the difference between science and that which is not science.

If someone wants to believe a false analogy, for example, that DNA and Computers, process information in the same way, I intend to provide others the facts as to why that’s not correct. If someone wishes to use an a argument to rationalize their own beliefs I don’t expect to change their minds. I will, however, point out for others to fairly evaluate that these arguments are not supported by scientific fact.

Otherwise I would just be wasting my time in these debates on evolution.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Well that’s their perogitive. It’s a free world. To me that’s not what is important. In debating them on this topic I have no expectations of changing their minds. Nor am I interested in satisfying my own ego that I have proven them wrong.

My goal in debating them is to educate other readers of these posts who do not have scientific expertise, but do have open minds, the difference between science and that which is not science.

If someone wants to believe a false analogy, for example, that DNA and Computers, process information in the same way, I intend to provide others the facts as to why that’s not correct. If someone wishes to use an a argument to rationalize their own beliefs I don’t expect to change their minds. I will, however, point out for others to fairly evaluate that these arguments are not supported by scientific fact.

Otherwise I would just be wasting my time in these debates on evolution.
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Well I appreciate your injecting some science in to the discussion.
Looking at the bible isn't going to answer what lies behind the big bang or what force is pulling the universe apart.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Common misconception. DNA coding is nothing like computer coding. Mathematically computer programs are pure mechanical binary (base 2) systems, on or off (a bit).

DNA is mathematically a quaternary (base 4) chemical system e.g., A, T, C, G,. That represents twice the exponential values of a mechanical binary system.

In other words DNA’s information processing is, mathematically, nothing like the information processing of a mechanical computer binary system.
Click to expand...

Yet, it is an information processing system lol.

And quite a bit more sophisticated than anything Bill Gates could come up with.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Well that’s their perogitive. It’s a free world. To me that’s not what is important. In debating them on this topic I have no expectations of changing their minds. Nor am I interested in satisfying my own ego that I have proven them wrong.

My goal in debating them is to educate other readers of these posts who do not have scientific expertise, but do have open minds, the difference between science and that which is not science.

If someone wants to believe a false analogy, for example, that DNA and Computers, process information in the same way, I intend to provide others the facts as to why that’s not correct. If someone wishes to use an a argument to rationalize their own beliefs I don’t expect to change their minds. I will, however, point out for others to fairly evaluate that these arguments are not supported by scientific fact.

Otherwise I would just be wasting my time in these debates on evolution.
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remember when people here used to scoff at me saying non posters read these posts?

this is the new townhall

people come to these sites to listen to what Americans are thinking


its nice that they see real THNKING sometimes
 
Micawber said:
Well I appreciate your injecting some science in to the discussion.
Looking at the bible isn't going to answer what lies behind the big bang or what force is pulling the universe apart.
Click to expand...

My role in these debates is to keep the materialist philosophers in line lol.
 
Did god just create the ordered stuff like crystals and dna or did he also go in for entropy and cancer and asteroids
smashing planets and quantum flux and tsunamis and NCAA brackets. More shit is unpredictable than can be resolved by general accounting principles.
 
Micawber said:
I go yes and no on that. If we look around with awe and wonder, that is good if it causes us (human race) to seek knowledge, if your awe and wonder makes you adopt a stultifying conclusion
like god did it, game over, end of story, stop studying (like it did during the dark ages) then it is, I maintain, a very bad thing. How many children of fundamentalist christians will not grow
to be Nobel Prize winning geneticists, neuroscientists or biochemists because their parent's beliefs inculcated them and they were steerted to Bob Jones U instead of Cal Tech it is anyone's guess.

We won't continue to be a great country with a bunch of brainwashed science doubters, and don't think that isn't happening. It quite obviously is. In fact they have managed to take power
in the Republican party. I think it all matters and I don't think it's disconnected.
Click to expand...

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/


Just FYI....about 74% of the US population is Christian
and about 18% are agnostic......interesting

Is 74% of the US population 'science doubters".....I hardly think so.....nor are they Conservatives or Republicans....to believe that is to adopt a stultifying conclusion.
Thinking is better than ranting illogical nonsense....

Awe and wonder doesn't hamper ones enthusiasm for knowledge at all, but instead, does just the opposite....it arouses the curiosity and enhances our thirst for knowledge....
 
NOVA said:
http://www.logicalfallacies.info/


Just FYI....about 74% of the US population is Christian
and about 18% are agnostic......interesting

Is 74% of the US population 'science doubters".....I hardly think so.....nor are they Conservatives or Republicans....to believe that is to adopt a stultifying conclusion.
Thinking is better than ranting illogical nonsense....

Awe and wonder doesn't hamper ones enthusiasm for knowledge at all, but instead, does just the opposite....it arouses the curiosity and enhances our thirst for knowledge....
Click to expand...

If 74% of the US population is Christian than this country is a piss poor representation of true Christian values, such as they are.

Not something to brag about really.
 
NOVA said:
http://www.logicalfallacies.info/


Just FYI....about 74% of the US population is Christian
and about 18% are agnostic......interesting

Is 74% of the US population 'science doubters".....I hardly think so.....nor are they Conservatives or Republicans....to believe that is to adopt a stultifying conclusion.
Thinking is better than ranting illogical nonsense....

Awe and wonder doesn't hamper ones enthusiasm for knowledge at all, but instead, does just the opposite....it arouses the curiosity and enhances our thirst for knowledge....
Click to expand...

You can't be a party made up of people that relentlessly deny evolution, and then howl in protest when anyone points out the GOP is an anti-science party of ignoramuses.

Only Six Percent Of Scientists Are Republicans: Pew Poll

A new study by the Pew Research Center finds that the GOP is alienating scientists to a startling degree.

Only six percent of America’s scientists identify themselves as Republicans; fifty-five percent call themselves Democrats. By comparison, 23 percent of the overall public considers itself Republican, while 35 percent say they’re Democrats.

The ideological discrepancies were similar. Nine percent of scientists said they were “conservative” while 52 percent described themselves as “liberal,” and 14 percent “very liberal.” The corresponding figures for the general public were 37, 20 and 5 percent.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/07/10/only-six-percent-of-scien_n_229382.html
Click to expand...
 
Cypress said:
You can't be a party made up of people that relentlessly deny evolution, and then howl in protest when anyone points out the GOP is an anti-science party of ignoramuses.
Click to expand...
Consider the source....liberal/conservative/republican/democrat have nothing to do with science
Just and another mime in the old political bullshit claim that we are smarter than you....and again, irrelevant to the thread topic.

There us no political party that is made up of only those the deny evolution or is anti-science....
 
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