Manufacturing Jobs Are Never Coming Back

cawacko

Well-known member
This is a big part of Trump's appeal. Maybe his lower educated supporters can get jobs cleaning hotels, gardening, washing dishes in restaurants etc. after all the illegals are kicked out.




Manufacturing Jobs Are Never Coming Back


A plea to presidential candidates: Stop talking about bringing manufacturing jobs back from China. In fact, talk a lot less about manufacturing, period.

It’s understandable that voters are angry about trade. The U.S. has lost more than 4.5 million manufacturing jobs since NAFTA took effect in 1994. And as Eduardo Porter wrote this week, there’s mounting evidence that U.S. trade policy, particularly with China, has caused lasting harm to many American workers. But rather than play to that anger, candidates ought to be talking about ways to ensure that the service sector can fill manufacturing’s former role as a provider of dependable, decent-paying jobs.

Here’s the problem: Whether or not those manufacturing jobs could have been saved, they aren’t coming back, at least not most of them. How do we know? Because in recent years, factories have been coming back, but the jobs haven’t. Because of rising wages in China, the need for shorter supply chains and other factors, a small but growing group of companies are shifting production back to the U.S. But the factories they build here are heavily automated, employing a small fraction of the workers they would have a generation ago.

Look at the chart below: Since the recession ended in 2009, manufacturing output — the value of all the goods that U.S. factories produce, adjusted for inflation — has risen by more than 20 percent, because of a combination of “reshoring” and increased domestic demand. But manufacturing employment is up just 5 percent. And much of that job growth represents a rebound from the recession, not a sustainable trend. (The Washington Post’s Abha Bhattarai had a great story this week on what the much-touted “manufacturing renaissance” really looks like through the eyes of one Georgia town.)

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None of that, though, stops Donald Trump from promising at every debate and campaign stop to “take our jobs back from China and all these other countries.” Nor does it stop the other candidates from visiting factories in Southern and Midwestern towns and promising — albeit in less grandiose terms — to restore the lost luster of American manufacturing. “I’m tired of seeing them creating jobs all over the world while they’re laying off American workers,” Bernie Sanders told a crowd in Youngstown, Ohio, last weekend. “Not acceptable. That is going to end.”

There’s no mystery why candidates love to focus on manufacturing and trade. The U.S. economy faces deep structural challenges — stagnant wages, rising inequality, falling employment rates among men and other groups — and China presents an easy scapegoat. (Wall Street often plays a similar role, especially on the Democratic side.) And manufacturing in particular embodies something that seems to be disappearing in today’s economy: jobs with decent pay and benefits available to workers without a college degree. The average factory worker earns more than $25 an hour before overtime; the typical retail worker makes less than $18 an hour.

But those factory photo ops ignore an important reality: In 1994 there were 3.5 million more Americans working in manufacturing than in retail. Today, those numbers have almost exactly reversed, and the gap is widening. More than 80 percent of all private jobs are now in the service sector.

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There is nothing wrong with politicians’ trying to save what remains of U.S. manufacturing, nor with trying to avoid repeating old mistakes on trade. But like it or not, the U.S. is now a service-based economy. It’s time candidates started talking about making that economy work for workers, rather than pining for one that’s never coming back.


http://fivethirtyeight.com/features/manufacturing-jobs-are-never-coming-back/?ex_cid=538twitter
 
Really interesting article. I hope this becomes a topic of discussion in the campaign.

Things are shifting so fast. It's a cliche, but our workforce really needs to adjust to the changing times.

If Trump does get elected, none of this will matter to him. He'll claim in 4 years that he did bring back millions of jobs, and a certain % of people will just believe him regardless.
 
It is seriously painful to watch that buffoon speak about how tariffs will be "good" for America. Truly.
 
This is not an area I am well-versed on, but, I imagine it is like the evolving system of retirement. In the old days, Pre-Greatest, Greatest and Lost Generation, plus early Boomers, could retire on a traditional pension/benefits plan and SS (Medicare/Medicaid came along, as well), and be set. Nowadays, you probably aren't going to receive a traditional pension plan or SS. Now, it's all about building an IRA/Roth, 401k, investment portfolio (even if it's just mutual funds and annuities), and, hopefully, a decent long-term care insurance policy.


The idea that we are a services, rather than a manufacturing, economy, has always sounded a bit irksome and defeatist to me. This is a good article, though.
 
Energy jobs are essentially manufacturing jobs since energy will always need produced. We still have an abundance of it. We need leadership with imagination. I'd start with EPA regulations.
 
I don't know what they need to do. I've been to a number of workshops this year where they are assuring us (teachers) that there will be no jobs in America for people without some sort of post high school training in the coming years. That is a recipe for disaster and for just what we have happening now...a bunch of young people voting for socialism whether Bernie Sanders' brand of it or someone else's. It is all some of these kids can do to get through high school. Not everyone is meant for college. It is simply not practical to think that a society doesn't need unskilled labor positions. And when these kids can't make a living when they get out of high school, they're going to look for someone to take care of them. Right now it's Grandpa Bernie.
 
I don't know what they need to do. I've been to a number of workshops this year where they are assuring us (teachers) that there will be no jobs in America for people without some sort of post high school training in the coming years. That is a recipe for disaster and for just what we have happening now...a bunch of young people voting for socialism whether Bernie Sanders' brand of it or someone else's. It is all some of these kids can do to get through high school. Not everyone is meant for college. It is simply not practical to think that a society doesn't need unskilled labor positions. And when these kids can't make a living when they get out of high school, they're going to look for someone to take care of them. Right now it's Grandpa Bernie.

There will always be jobs, the question of course is the quality of them for those who aren't as well educated. We all know college isn't for everyone but that doesn't mean an individual who doesn't go is a bad person or has no future. In that case it's about having a skill that is in demand and people find desirable.
 
There is nothing wrong with free trade so long as it is two way. There is also nothing wrong with telling our partners we expect them to follow their agreements. We have seen what failing to do so has brought us.

Will textiles return ? No time soon.
Will commodity manufacture return ? No time soon.

And tariffs won't change that.

But we can and should look out for higher tech jobs here. They will require skills but not necessarily degrees.

The key to that is having the govt stop picking winners and encourage innovation.

Status quo ain't working. Trump knows it, Average Joe knows it and the DC establishment relies on it.

You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows l.
 
Trump is someone who would challenge the status quo and the received wisdom that some jobs will 'never' return.

Conventional wisdom is so often wrong it nearly rates being an oxymoron.
 
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This is for you PR though I doubt you'd have the capacity to fully internalize

And this is for you .. big government progressive.

Your republican party sucks and just as you suck up to the forum progressive left being one of their more popular and agreeable posters, your party has sold it's voters out because all it has been doing is give Obama everything he wants on a silver platter.

Your party is in the process of demonstrating for good over this stop Trump fervor that it is no different than the Democratic party and both parties make up the establishment party.

You should be real proud of yourself being aligned with such groups as black lives matter, moveon.org, and Bill Ayers, now aren't you cwacako? And you call me an extremist.
 
And this is for you .. big government progressive.

Your republican party sucks and just as you suck up to the forum progressive left being one of their more popular and agreeable posters, your party has sold it's voters out because all it has been doing is give Obama everything he wants on a silver platter.

Your party is in the process of demonstrating for good over this stop Trump fervor that it is no different than the Democratic party and both parties make up the establishment party.

You should be real proud of yourself being aligned with such groups as black lives matter, moveon.org, and Bill Ayers, now aren't you cwacako? And you call me an extremist.

As I suspected you are incapable of discussing the economic topic of manufacturing jobs. You probably believe tariffs and trade wars are a good thing and will magically return us to a 1950's style economy.
 
Trump is someone who would challenge the status quo and the received wisdom that some jobs will 'never' return.

Conventional wisdom is so often wrong it nearly rates being an oxymoron.

By tariffs and trade wars? The article explains well why these jobs are gone. You can't fight the advancement of technology. You have to understand it to better prepare for the future but Trump has shown no signs of that.
 
Energy jobs are essentially manufacturing jobs since energy will always need produced. We still have an abundance of it. We need leadership with imagination. I'd start with EPA regulations.
LOL, LOL, LOL, LOL. Real imagination there. Lock us into obsolete technologies while giving away free exemption to pollute.
 
I don't know what they need to do. I've been to a number of workshops this year where they are assuring us (teachers) that there will be no jobs in America for people without some sort of post high school training in the coming years. That is a recipe for disaster and for just what we have happening now...a bunch of young people voting for socialism whether Bernie Sanders' brand of it or someone else's. It is all some of these kids can do to get through high school. Not everyone is meant for college. It is simply not practical to think that a society doesn't need unskilled labor positions. And when these kids can't make a living when they get out of high school, they're going to look for someone to take care of them. Right now it's Grandpa Bernie.
Oh you guys are such pessimist. As the Who said...the kids are all right. We're the ones who are screwed up. Bernie isn't no different than the New Deal Democrats who saved capitalism from itself in the thirties.

Manufacturing jobs are impacted by automation, technology eliminates jobs in some areas but, and the article fails to mention this fact, creates jobs in service, supply, logistics, technology, technical support, customer support, financial services, etc, downstream.

The economic outlook for kids today, even the low achieving kids, is far better for them than it was for me at their age. So kids will have to deal with more education. Ok fine. My grandfathers Generation only about 25% of the population had high school education. That was only up to 75 % in my fathers generation. In my generation only about 20% of the population had college degrees. Now fully 40% or more have college education or tech training beyond high school.

So what's the solution? The same thing it's always been. More investment in public education, including post secondary education in traditional liberal arts and non-traditional technical training and trades.

Now who out there has thus far sighted commitment to extensive investment in education like we did after WWII....Oh yeah it's that no good rotten demon of a Socialist Bernie Sanders.

Deride it as socialism if you want but Bernies right. We need to invest aggressively in our children's education at all levels if they are going to compete with other kids from other countries who do have the fore sight to make these investments on education. So demonizing a good...no a great...idea with the socialism boogeyman gets us no where.
 
Oh you guys are such pessimist. As the Who said...the kids are all right. We're the ones who are screwed up. Bernie isn't no different than the New Deal Democrats who saved capitalism from itself in the thirties.

Manufacturing jobs are impacted by automation, technology eliminates jobs in some areas but, and the article fails to mention this fact, creates jobs in service, supply, logistics, technology, technical support, customer support, financial services, etc, downstream.

The economic outlook for kids today, even the low achieving kids, is far better for them than it was for me at their age. So kids will have to deal with more education. Ok fine. My grandfathers Generation only about 25% of the population had high school education. That was only up to 75 % in my fathers generation. In my generation only about 20% of the population had college degrees. Now fully 40% or more have college education or tech training beyond high school.

So what's the solution? The same thing it's always been. More investment in public education, including post secondary education in traditional liberal arts and non-traditional technical training and trades.

Now who out there has thus far sighted commitment to extensive investment in education like we did after WWII....Oh yeah it's that no good rotten demon of a Socialist Bernie Sanders.

Deride it as socialism if you want but Bernies right. We need to invest aggressively in our children's education at all levels if they are going to compete with other kids from other countries who do have the fore sight to make these investments on education. So demonizing a good...no a great...idea with the socialism boogeyman gets us no where.

The reason Bernie gets rightfully criticized on education is his idea that one size fits all public school education based on a 20th century model is what's needed in the 21st century.

On a per student basis not many countries outspend the U.S. That's not to say more money wouldn't be better but Bernie doesn't speak about changes in the system, just in delivery of dollars.

And ultimately Bernie's plan of "free" education will hurt the product, not improve it. So his socialism is rightly demonized.
 
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