I started this thread because I don't post in APP, and I know ILA put it there because he knows that and wants to make it look like I don't want to respond.
ILA's "Hillary's email lies debunked once and for all"
- Thread starter Jarod
- Start date
I started this thread because I don't post in APP, and I know ILA put it there because he knows that and wants to make it look like I don't want to respond.
So, we know that information in emails found in HRC's account contain information that is currently classified.
We don't know if it was classified at the time it was placed on the server.
We don't know if HRC knew it was or would ever be classified.
We don't know if this information was ever accessed by anyone other than HRC.
We don't have any evidence this information was ever disclosed to anyone who it was not permitted to be disclosed to.
Don't get me wrong, I don't love HRC and don't put it past her to do underhanded things, but Republicans, who don't have many relevant facts are jumping the gun and have already convicted her in their minds. Many of them have convicted her of anything they can imagine she might have done, its how the Republican scandal machine works. They investigated Bill Clinton his entire presidency, until finally one of those investigations turned up a personal affair. An affair that occured years after the investigation had begun, and used that investigation to expose the affair and to set him up for charges related to trying to keep the affair secret. This appears to be the same thing, they were spending years and billions of dollars investigating her on Benghazi and in do doing found an unrelated practice HRC was engaged in as to how she stored her email. When it became clear they had nothing with the Benghazi investigations they leapfrogged onto this.
I wont call it a false scandal yet, because all the facts are not yet known, but as of now it has all the hallmarks of a product of the Republican false scandal machine.
We don't know if it was classified at the time it was placed on the server.
We don't know if HRC knew it was or would ever be classified.
We don't know if this information was ever accessed by anyone other than HRC.
We don't have any evidence this information was ever disclosed to anyone who it was not permitted to be disclosed to.
Don't get me wrong, I don't love HRC and don't put it past her to do underhanded things, but Republicans, who don't have many relevant facts are jumping the gun and have already convicted her in their minds. Many of them have convicted her of anything they can imagine she might have done, its how the Republican scandal machine works. They investigated Bill Clinton his entire presidency, until finally one of those investigations turned up a personal affair. An affair that occured years after the investigation had begun, and used that investigation to expose the affair and to set him up for charges related to trying to keep the affair secret. This appears to be the same thing, they were spending years and billions of dollars investigating her on Benghazi and in do doing found an unrelated practice HRC was engaged in as to how she stored her email. When it became clear they had nothing with the Benghazi investigations they leapfrogged onto this.
I wont call it a false scandal yet, because all the facts are not yet known, but as of now it has all the hallmarks of a product of the Republican false scandal machine.
in the OP :
also a Sec of State she had the ability to classify, when she saw sensitive info, and she didn't.
also she was sending/receiving much from Sid Blumenthal, who wasn't even a gov't employee ,and was prohibited from working in the WH by Obama..
Much of that led Clinton to support regime change ( and the current ISIS , failed state) of Libya. She's a consumate screw up.
do you know what that means? Classified can be marked, but it can also be "presumed classified" -
Dozens of Clinton emails were classified from the start, U.S. rules suggest
also a Sec of State she had the ability to classify, when she saw sensitive info, and she didn't.
also she was sending/receiving much from Sid Blumenthal, who wasn't even a gov't employee ,and was prohibited from working in the WH by Obama..
Much of that led Clinton to support regime change ( and the current ISIS , failed state) of Libya. She's a consumate screw up.
The above contains a lot of assumptions, that might add up to something if its true. Yet, we have Republicans right and left calling for her to be imprisoned based on the limited information that has been released. They are desperate to promote a scandal regardless of if there is one or not.
The information in the emails just as easily might NOT Have been presumed classified at the time they were sent out.
Remember that Republicans did not seem to see much of a scandal when the clearly classified name of Secret Agent Valery Plame was leaked by the Bush Administration, it was decided at the very last second not to charge Karl Rove even though most believe he was technically guilty.
SmarterthanYou
rebel
the real scandal over all of this should be the realization that high level people in our federal government are being lackadaisical and outright defiant of electronic security and handling of classified material. but I don't expect any of you establishment lovers to do anything about it other than point fingers at each other.
I agree with this, with the proviso that much of what is called Classified should not be Classified. Classified status is used by government officials to cover their asses more often than it is used to protect vital interests.
Airstrip One
Completely Effed
Why don't you post in APP?
IMT
New member
Dear JPP Reader:
Three miles north of Wall Street at the New School for Social Research in Manhattan, Senator Clinton's July 1, 2015 speech 'addressed every major social issue in America from the standpoint of swelling the bottom line for US corporations.'
Some serve corportocracy Senator Clinton's way, and others serve corportocracy by diverting attention from Senator Clinton's way.
Either way, you're all on the corportocracy side...
Crickets?
IMT
Three miles north of Wall Street at the New School for Social Research in Manhattan, Senator Clinton's July 1, 2015 speech 'addressed every major social issue in America from the standpoint of swelling the bottom line for US corporations.'
Some serve corportocracy Senator Clinton's way, and others serve corportocracy by diverting attention from Senator Clinton's way.
Either way, you're all on the corportocracy side...
Crickets?
IMT
Last edited:
Incorrect. Presumed classified is just that. read the article I posed.
I'm not all that interested in Rove/Plame -I a interested in examining a leading candidate for POTUS - that is Hillary. The priority of the moment.
She is the poster child for arrogance of power.
Sure Republicans want to promote a scandal....does partisan duplicity really surprise you?
Sorry sonny, we can't presume anything like it might not have been classified....what we should presume is that if the content is now classified it would have been classified at its birth.
Its the content that matters....the fact is, Hillary prevented any information from being classified, one way or the other, by entirely bypassing any government scrutiny.
You can't label information you don't know about....
SHE received it, SHE sent it, SHE is responsible for KNOWING what data is sensitive and that if should be secured, i.e., kept on a SECURED server and/or even encrypted.
Her lawyer is right now, even in possession of some of these sensitive emails and he certainly did not have a security clearance then
Obamas State Dept. has given the lawyer and caved to his request to possess the emails....Obama's State Dept, caved to her lawyer.....figure that one out.
State Department employees were told to develop a system that would let Kendall keep the emails in a State Department-provided safe at his law firm in Washington, D.C., where he and a partner had access to them...............THAT is the sorry state of our security system under the Democrats and Obama....seems they will protect Hillary at all costs.....
Clintons lawyer tells our State Dept. what to do....
Off topic.....
Its inaccurate to claim the Bush Administration outed anybody.....
Richard Armitage CONFESSED to outing Plame's name to Novak and even told Bob Woodward Plame's identity three weeks before talking to Novak.....when Novak told
Rove he was going public with an article, it was Rove that confirmed what Novak already knew....and in the end, NOBODY was 'charged' with outing Plame's identity....
Rove testified to the grand jury that he had heard from Libby that Wilson's wife worked for the CIA. Rove testified that Libby told him that he heard the information from journalists.
Rove's lawyer asserted that Rove "never knowingly disclosed classified information" and that "he did not tell any reporter that Valerie Plame worked for the CIA."
Seems it fairly common knowledge by then.
Nice try at diversion though.
And you keep whining republicans, republicans, republicans, republicans,.....its the FBI and Obama State Dept, investigating, not Republicans....
Its the content that matters....the fact is, Hillary prevented any information from being classified, one way or the other, by entirely bypassing any government scrutiny.
You can't label information you don't know about....
SHE received it, SHE sent it, SHE is responsible for KNOWING what data is sensitive and that if should be secured, i.e., kept on a SECURED server and/or even encrypted.
Her lawyer is right now, even in possession of some of these sensitive emails and he certainly did not have a security clearance then
Obamas State Dept. has given the lawyer and caved to his request to possess the emails....Obama's State Dept, caved to her lawyer.....figure that one out.
State Department employees were told to develop a system that would let Kendall keep the emails in a State Department-provided safe at his law firm in Washington, D.C., where he and a partner had access to them...............THAT is the sorry state of our security system under the Democrats and Obama....seems they will protect Hillary at all costs.....
Clintons lawyer tells our State Dept. what to do....
Off topic.....
Its inaccurate to claim the Bush Administration outed anybody.....
Richard Armitage CONFESSED to outing Plame's name to Novak and even told Bob Woodward Plame's identity three weeks before talking to Novak.....when Novak told
Rove he was going public with an article, it was Rove that confirmed what Novak already knew....and in the end, NOBODY was 'charged' with outing Plame's identity....
Rove testified to the grand jury that he had heard from Libby that Wilson's wife worked for the CIA. Rove testified that Libby told him that he heard the information from journalists.
Rove's lawyer asserted that Rove "never knowingly disclosed classified information" and that "he did not tell any reporter that Valerie Plame worked for the CIA."
Seems it fairly common knowledge by then.
Nice try at diversion though.
And you keep whining republicans, republicans, republicans, republicans,.....its the FBI and Obama State Dept, investigating, not Republicans....
SmarterthanYou
rebel
that is a completely different subject, not that I don't agree with you on that. but that's what you get when you continually elect establishment politicians, nepotists, and the otherwise tax feeding non productive members of our government.
USFREEDOM911
MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN
Because if he accepts the debate challenge he can't get the support he needs from other liberals and if it's not a debate, the respondents still have to behave themselves and follow the rules of APP.
Jarod is scared that if he can't get the support of others, then his presentations can't stand alone.
zappasguitar
Well-known member
And it's just another "typical" IHA thread.
He posts, threadbans half the board including many of those who might point out the flaws in his OP, then ridicules others for not responding.
zappasguitar
Well-known member
BINGO!
We can play "was it/wasn't it" all day long, but we will never know the status of many e-mails she received.
Given the ambiguous status of the e-mails in question back when Hillary first received them, we should forget about past and concentrate on putting measures/guidelines in place so the problem doesn't re-occur in the future.
Not everything is presumed classified.
So, using your logic, every email Secretary Clinton ever received is required to be treated as classified because if it is ever later classified it will be determined to have always been classified?
Sorry, you cant enforce an ex post facto law in criminal court.
I've explained this several times in the last few weeks.
Originally I thought it was a great idea, however as it is enforced it does not work.
The "rules" have been used to prevent me from making relevant analogies based on claims that they are off topic.
So, when I would make an argument such as... "That would be as if you..." or "In the past you felt differently when you claimed..." it was erased by the moderators.
I hated when that happened and felt censored from valid and relevant argument, they were using the rules to avoid open discussion. They were using the rules to shut down dissent and claim victory. So, While I dislike the name calling and flame wars, I put up with them and avoid APP.
classified emails that moved through Clinton’s unsecured server about 1,274, with tens of thousands more to look at.....
Airstrip One
Completely Effed
Have you ever considered that you were actually just diverting and obfuscating by going off topic?
Using the standard they are trying to hold HRC to, they will have to indict a lot more people.
A majority of those who use email in Government.
Remember when the several Republican House Speakers were thrown out in a row after they impeached Bill Clinton for lying about an affair... Newt was guilty, A few in between, then they settled on Hastert, who turned out to be a pedophile child molester!
A majority of those who use email in Government.
Remember when the several Republican House Speakers were thrown out in a row after they impeached Bill Clinton for lying about an affair... Newt was guilty, A few in between, then they settled on Hastert, who turned out to be a pedophile child molester!