Fact of the Day: U.S. Defense Spending Dwarfs Rest Of The World

Disillusioned said:
When was the last time switzerland got bombed?
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WW2. We bombed them a good bit. 'Accidentally'.

As for the idea that the europeans need our protection... Protection from what? For the first time EVER the europeans are trying out peace, they need our protection from the... other peaceful europeans? Get over yourself america, go back to isolationism, and don't come out until somebody actually drops a nuke.
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Europe needs protection from itself, for the reason you just stated.
 
Lucius Cornelius Sulla said:
WW2. We bombed them a good bit. 'Accidentally'.



Europe needs protection from itself, for the reason you just stated.
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Europe can deal with it's own problems, mostly which come down to not executing enough idiots, but that's a different argument. They'd be just fine without our bases, and we'd be out a costly expenditure and an excuse to interfere.
 
Lucius Cornelius Sulla said:
It is my proposal, and has been for some time now, that we close ALL overseas bases except Diego Garcia (which I'm pretty sure is our island anyways). Let the rest of the world fend for themselves. They would decry us as "policing the world" yet gleefuly accept our bases. Fuck them and their hypocracy.
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Diego Garcia is British, we shamefully booted out the natives and handed it over to the US in the '60s.

As for the removal of foreign bases, would you just let China take over Taiwan and North Korea attack South Korea? I am also sure that the Chinese would be wetting themselves with glee if the US pulled out of Asia.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2012/feb/15/diego-garcia-few-man-fridays
 
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Disillusioned said:
Europe can deal with it's own problems, mostly which come down to not executing enough idiots, but that's a different argument. They'd be just fine without our bases, and we'd be out a costly expenditure and an excuse to interfere.
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Does that include Menwith Hill? I am sure that you've never heard of it so use Google.
 
bac

quite true, however, china is endeavoring to catch up, but they have a long way to go

oth, they have the money they lent to us to help them...

still we do need to cut or reduce some of the pentagon's programs
 
Don Quixote said:
bac

quite true, however, china is endeavoring to catch up, but they have a long way to go

oth, they have the money they lent to us to help them...

still we do need to cut or reduce some of the pentagon's programs
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I am not sure that the Chinese expenditure figure is very accurate or useful. Their labour costs are much less and I'm sure that much if it is hidden.
 
Aoxomoxoa said:
I am not sure that the Chinese expenditure figure is very accurate or useful. Their labour costs are much less and I'm sure that much if it is hidden.
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we know that they have nuclear tipped missiles and a very large army, but not much of a navy

and naval vessels are very difficult to hide, both while being built and when at sea

their air force is better than it was, but once more it is difficult to hide

the russians are maintaining their nuclear tipped icbms, but i wonder just what sort of shape they are in, they are not something that can be neglected and cost money to maintain

what the satellites cannot see is what spies are for

also, there is electronic surveillance and vehicle tracking
 
Aoxomoxoa said:
Diego Garcia is British, we shamefully booted out the natives and handed it over to the US in the '60s.
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So it's ours then?

As for the removal of foreign bases, would you just let China take over Taiwan
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Not my problem, it's their problem. Not that China could pull such an operation off.
North Korea attack South Korea?
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Yeah, the South can MORE than handle themselves in that instance.
I am also sure that the Chinese would be wetting themselves with glee if the US pulled out of Asia.
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Good for them. They can police Asia. See what that does for their fledgling economy.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2012/feb/15/diego-garcia-few-man-fridays[/QUOTE]
 
Foreign spending should be cut until we can feed and house our own, and then maybe then we can talk about military funding but as long as we are sending food, arms, and money to other countries, NOPE, take Egypt for example they hate us, and Israel but we send em money and arms.
 
patriot66 said:
Foreign spending should be cut until we can feed and house our own, and then maybe then we can talk about military funding but as long as we are sending food, arms, and money to other countries, NOPE, take Egypt for example they hate us, and Israel but we send em money and arms.
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Why shouldn't we talk about military spending now? What's your rational for not cutting, say, $150,000,000,000?
 
Lucius Cornelius Sulla said:
So it's ours then?

Not my problem, it's their problem. Not that China could pull such an operation off.
Yeah, the South can MORE than handle themselves in that instance.
Good for them. They can police Asia. See what that does for their fledgling economy.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/stage/2012/feb/15/diego-garcia-few-man-fridays
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The article said lease not own, so the answer is the US does not own Diego Garcia. As for Taiwan and South Korea, you are not there out of altruism.
 
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Superfreak said:
I would imagine most people already knew this. That said, no harm in reminding people just how much we could cut from defense and still be more than double anyone else.
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There's lots of fat in the defense budget that can be cut, perhaps including some bases. However, we should not imperil our own security or that of surrounding communities.

Mott the Hoople said:
True, I agree, but how many people are you talking about tossing out into the unemployment line and what are the political consequences of doing that? That's the trap our politicians are in and it's harder than fuck to get out of.....that is if you want to remain in office.
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Aoxomoxoa said:
What would be the effect if you closed down a load of military bases in the US tomorrow?
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Nothing will fill up a congressman's email or clog his phone lines more than the suggestion that a base in his jurisdiction be closed and rarely has a base closure been successful - either with the community or as a way to save substantial monies.

Lucius Cornelius Sulla said:
Well, many would argue that the towns would shut down, but I'm not so sure. Some would turn into ghost towns, but others (the majority) would likely repurpose themselves.
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Incorrect. See above.

Superfreak said:
Poor areas with US Military bases... he must be talking about western European US bases
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Really? Many military bases stateside were built near and with the goal of helping small communities, most poor. The best way to kill an economy in a small town is to close the base near it.

Mott the Hoople said:
Oh you should have heard the crying and wailing in the early 90's when a bunch of cold war era bases were closed down as part of the peace dividend from the cold war ending. There's no real sustainable reason for us to keep spending in excess of what we spent during the cold war. We wasted a ton of money trying to develop the infrastructure in Iran and Afghanistan. Just imagine the economic spin off if we spent 1/4 that much money on our own infrastructure which desperatly needs it.
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And the 80's. And the 60's. As a military child and member, I lived through several base closures. By the time the process is completed, we're pretty much assured the cuts will be effective and/or devastating.

Disillusioned said:
or the middle east bases or the asian bases, or in africa, or in south america.

The US has a military presence on every continent except Antarctica, apparently we're at risk of invasion from, everywhere, which says something about how much we trust the diplomats, for america military action will always be the first, last and most preferable option of dealing with people.
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Priesence? Yes. Substantial? No. There are only 30 permanent bases worldwide with large populations and/or missions. Many overseas (and stateside) installations are small support/medical facilities.

http://www.acq.osd.mil/ie/download/bsr/BSR2008Baseline.pdf

Lucius Cornelius Sulla said:
It is my proposal, and has been for some time now, that we close ALL overseas bases except Diego Garcia (which I'm pretty sure is our island anyways). Let the rest of the world fend for themselves. They would decry us as "policing the world" yet gleefuly accept our bases. Fuck them and their hypocracy.
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Disillusioned said:
I love this idea, leave the people to handle things on their own. It's wonderful, leave people alone and they'll probably leave you alone? When was the last time switzerland got bombed?

As for the idea that the europeans need our protection... Protection from what? For the first time EVER the europeans are trying out peace, they need our protection from the... other peaceful europeans? Get over yourself america, go back to isolationism, and don't come out until somebody actually drops a nuke.
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Lucius Cornelius Sulla said:
Not my problem, it's their problem.
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Unfortunately, you idiots have no idea what the word "isolationalism" means.
 
Aoxomoxoa said:
I bet if there were 2000 Irish settlers on there you wouldn't be so flippant. So what about the people that were forcibly evicted?
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Well, for the most part I'm fucking with you Tom, because I so enjoy the supposedly British past time of piss taking. I keep Diego Gracia in mind because it's such a HUGE logistical supply point. I mean, we could always buy an island out there where the natives would LOVE to be U.S. citizens and etc. As long as we close all other bases though, I'd happily include Garcia as well if it was the only sticking point.
 
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