Dr. King would not have supported Obama or the Democratic Party of today

blackascoal

The Force is With Me
Tell Obama What Dr. King Told LBJ: "God Didn't Choose America"

Don't let anybody make you think that God chose America to be the policeman of the world. -- Dr. Martin Luther King

Celebration of Obama's second inauguration is already being dampened by news of his mulling the commencement of more drone bombing, of yet another African country, Mali, destabilized and engulfed in violence, in no small part due to spillover of the violence from U.S.-NATO bombing of Libya for regime change (see "America's Shadow Wars in Africa"; "The war in Libya was seen as a success, now here we are engaging with the blowback in Mali"; and "Mali and the Lure of Intervention"). Whoever said "the neo-cons are like pyromaniacs who set a fire and then laugh when no one can put it out" was quite perceptive. France's military entrance into Mali has already led to a hostage crisis and killing in Algeria. Would more drone bombing help put out the fire or only fuel it? Does anyone remember Dr. King's sober advice about how "violence begets violence?"

The coinciding of Inauguration Day with the Martin Luther King holiday must be more than serendipity. There is probably nothing more important right now to remind Obama about than what Dr. King thought about U.S. exceptionalist-based interventionism. Dr. King's full quote was this: "Don't let anybody make you think God chose America as his divine messianic force to be a sort of policeman of the whole world."

From the start, evident in his weird Orwellian acceptance of the Nobel "Peace" Prize, Obama instead embraced Bush's "war presidency" and distanced himself from Dr. King's beliefs. Consequently, U.S.-NATO continues to be caught up in the "smart power" dance that is anything but smart based on reckless "whack a mole" and "enemy of my enemy is my friend" strategies. Its attempt to cloak itself in "humanitarianism" and playing on American exceptionalism to project altruistic, paternalistic good intentions does seem to fool liberals and conservatives alike, but even worse, it fools many of its own participants, the Empire builders themselves. (Peter Van Buren's insider book about the Iraq fiasco is aptly titled We Meant Well.) The American public is thus propagandized to believe that the ends always justify the means, that torture saves lives, that war is the answer, that it's possible to "bomb the village to save it." The Military Industrial Complex-
controlled Empire is, of course, never truly well-intentioned. But the fighting for power in Mali seems even more complicated and convoluted than what's happening in Syria. It's doubtful there are any "good revolutionaries" in the three separate violent match-ups in Mali -- it's probably more akin to trying to gain control over an Animal Farm type situation. But once a country is so destabilized and degenerated into violence, it's an easy task for our humanitarian Western Empire to make the "right to protect" arguments that it "has to do something." So of course that "something" is always to drone bomb them. Casualty-free drone bombing that only takes foreign citizens' lives and extrajudicial killing that flows from elevating the lawlessness of war over the rule of law is sold as the US' new miracle cure. That's how the Zero Dark Thirty propaganda coincidentally works to get Americans to cheer for the end of the film and get sucked into believing in and supporting the role of US Lethal Enforcer of "world peace"--see "Rebranding the War on Terror for the age of Obama: 'Zero Dark Thirty' and the promotion of extra judicial killing" and "'Zero Dark Thirty' Is bin Laden's Last Victory."

Along with preying upon our (liberal) heartstrings and tugging at our American Exceptionalist-Interventionist impulses, there is also the extremely problematic over-emphasis at play by international law academics and "human rights" groups in the U.S.-NATO-Israel hegemony who have been led to almost totally ignore the "supreme crime" under international law. The problem with this type of emphasis only on "human rights" (Universal Declaration of Human Rights) and the "humanitarian law of warfare" (Geneva Conventions, etc. the rules about how war is waged) is that the more ingrained, older concept of jus ad bellum is forgotten. That wars of aggression are the supreme crime does not mix well with the "policeman of the world" notion. The "policeman of the world" role is of course seen as above the old (petty) Nuremberg Principle prohibition just as Nixon declared it wasn't illegal if the president does it.

In line with Martin Luther King Jr.'s warning NOT to believe that God chose America to be policeman of the world and that violence begets violence, President Obama should note that King simply pleaded for America to come home. That would have certainly included U.S. drones.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/coleen-rowley/tell-obama-what-dr-king-t_b_2508654.html
 

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Martini Luther king day!!!

Gin or vodka?

Or tequila?
Margarita Luther king!
His transsexual alter ego!
 
I love the way it is conveniently forgotten that both the Malians and West Africans welcomed the French intervention with open arms. They had been begging the UN to get its arse in gear for months but they are so useless they couldn't even organise a piss up in a brewery. No doubt you would have just sat back and left the Tutsis in Ruanda to their fate as well!!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jan/16/malians-welcome-french-intervention

Somehow I don't think the Malian's were begging for double tap drone strikes to rain down from the sky. :palm:

(note that I left out "you fucking idiot" even though I felt like saying it)
 
I love the way it is conveniently forgotten that both the Malians and West Africans welcomed the French intervention with open arms. They had been begging the UN to get its arse in gear for months but they are so useless they couldn't even organise a piss up in a brewery. No doubt you would have just sat back and left the Tutsis in Ruanda to their fate as well!!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jan/16/malians-welcome-french-intervention

I don't imagine that you'd have a clue who King was and what he stood for.

Thanks for the insight.
 
He seems to have been able to get along with LBJ when he was bombing the shit out of the Vietnamese!!

The Gulf of Tonkin Resolution, which gave the President the exclusive right to use military force without consulting the Senate, was based on a false pretext, as Johnson later admitted.[SUP][96][/SUP] By the end of 1964, there were approximately 23,000 military personnel in South Vietnam. U.S. casualties for 1964 totaled 1,278.[SUP][92][/SUP] Johnson began America's direct involvement in the ground war in Vietnam when the first U.S. combat troops began arriving in March 1965.[SUP][97][/SUP] By 1968, over 550,000 American soldiers were in Vietnam; during 1967 and 1968 they were being killed at the rate of 1,000 a month.[SUP][98][/SUP]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lyndon_B._Johnson#Vietnam_War


A Political Alliance

Germany says Johnson was leery of being too closely identified with King. "Johnson is deeply suspicious of King and doesn't want to be publicly linked to King unless he can control the circumstances, because Johnson is being fed reports by the FBI that King is consorting with Communists," he says.
The men jousted subtly throughout the talk. King reminded Johnson, a Democrat, that the only Southern states he lost in 1964 were those where fewer than 40% of blacks were registered to vote.
Johnson replied: "It's very important that we … take the position that every person born in this country, and when they reach a certain age, that he have a right to vote just like he has a right to fight. And that we just extend it whether it's a Negro or whether it's a Mexican."

y reach a certain age, that he have a right to vote just like he has a right to fight. And that we just extend it whether it's a Negro or whether it's a Mexican."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/mart...johnson-talks-resonate-obama/story?id=9576074
 
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Like I said .. you don't know shit about King.

Martin Luther King's Speech Against the Vietnam War

"Over the past two years, as I have moved to break the betrayal of my own silences and to speak from the burnings of my own heart, as I have called for radical departures from the destruction of Vietnam, many persons have questioned me about the wisdom of my path. At the heart of their concerns this query has often loomed large and loud: 'Why are you speaking about the war, Dr. King?' 'Why are you joining the voices of dissent?' 'Peace and civil rights don't mix,' they say. 'Aren't you hurting the cause of your people,' they ask? And when I hear them, though I often understand the source of their concern, I am nevertheless greatly saddened, for such questions mean that the inquirers have not really known me, my commitment or my calling. Indeed, their questions suggest that they do not know the world in which they live.

http://antiwar.com/orig/bromwich.php?articleid=12844

You should quote some shit from the Queen or Henry the VIII ..because you don't know shit about King.
 
I love the way it is conveniently forgotten that both the Malians and West Africans welcomed the French intervention with open arms. They had been begging the UN to get its arse in gear for months but they are so useless they couldn't even organise a piss up in a brewery. No doubt you would have just sat back and left the Tutsis in Ruanda to their fate as well!!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jan/16/malians-welcome-french-intervention

Why not? Is it any of our business?
 
Like I said .. you don't know shit about King.

Martin Luther King's Speech Against the Vietnam War

"Over the past two years, as I have moved to break the betrayal of my own silences and to speak from the burnings of my own heart, as I have called for radical departures from the destruction of Vietnam, many persons have questioned me about the wisdom of my path. At the heart of their concerns this query has often loomed large and loud: 'Why are you speaking about the war, Dr. King?' 'Why are you joining the voices of dissent?' 'Peace and civil rights don't mix,' they say. 'Aren't you hurting the cause of your people,' they ask? And when I hear them, though I often understand the source of their concern, I am nevertheless greatly saddened, for such questions mean that the inquirers have not really known me, my commitment or my calling. Indeed, their questions suggest that they do not know the world in which they live.

http://antiwar.com/orig/bromwich.php?articleid=12844

You should quote some shit from the Queen or Henry the VIII ..because you don't know shit about King.
You completely missed Tom's point. Despite his opposition to the Vietnam war King worked quite well with LBJ.

The argument of the OP is a lousy exercise in logic. We have a two party system. Who would King have supported today? The Republicans? Libertarians? Greens? C'mon give me a break.

What makes the argument of the OP just incredibly silly is that it makes the assumption that ones support of a politician is absolute, complete and with out condition and that's just silly.

If King we're alive today I don't think there would be any doubt that he'd support Obama, considering what his alternatives would be. Would he support Obama unconditionaly and absolutely? C'mon....that's a fools argument.
 
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I don't imagine that you'd have a clue who King was and what he stood for.

Thanks for the insight.

I know very well who he is and what's more I have been to the National Museum of American History where there was an area dedicated to him. It may not be there now as it was back in the late '80s.
 
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I know very well who he is and what's more I have been to the National Museum of American History where there is an area dedicated to him.
A couple of years back I took my wife to Memphis for a long weekend of partying (Memphis is a great party town). I also took her to see Graceland and the Civil Rights Museum. The fine folks of Memphis purchased the Lorraine Hotel where King was assasinated and converted it into a Civil Rights museum. Though my wife lacked the cultural frame of reference to really appreciate Dr. King or the Civil Rights movement and having been raised during that era, I found the museuam fascinating. Well worth a visit if you happen to be in Memphis.
 
I know very well who he is and what's more I have been to the National Museum of American History where there was an area dedicated to him. It may not be there now as it was back in the late '80s.

Just realised that I got the museum wrong, it was actually the National Archives on Pennsylvania Ave, Washington, DC. It's the one that has the Constitution, Bill of Rights etc.
 
A couple of years back I took my wife to Memphis for a long weekend of partying (Memphis is a great party town). I also took her to see Graceland and the Civil Rights Museum. The fine folks of Memphis purchased the Lorraine Hotel where King was assasinated and converted it into a Civil Rights museum. Though my wife lacked the cultural frame of reference to really appreciate Dr. King or the Civil Rights movement and having been raised during that era, I found the museuam fascinating. Well worth a visit if you happen to be in Memphis.

He was undoubtedly a brave man especially confronting some of the fascist cops in the Deep South but there has been a movement in later years to elevate him to sainthood.
 
He was undoubtedly a brave man especially confronting some of the fascist cops in the Deep South but there has been a movement in later years to elevate him to sainthood.
That's certainly understandable. He faced more than just fascist cops and institutionalized racism. J. Edgar Hoover hated him and personally tried to ruin or jail him (he failed) and there were plenty of white racist who wanted him dead for no other reason than he was a trouble making niger (they succeeded in killing him) and King was aware that these institutionalized powers wanted to destroy him and that white racist wanted him dead and he knew that they would try to kill him (which indeed they did) yet he continued on with his activitism in the face of near certain death. Man that takes balls.

To me the most poignant speech King gave was in Memphis during the sanitation workers strike the day before he was assasinated. His "I've been to the mountain top" speech where he foresaw the fruits of the work they were doing succeeding but knowing he wouldn't live to see it because some "sick white brother" would probably kill him. Now tell me, how many people have that kind of courage behind their conviction? I know I don't. I like living too much. So yea....I can see why in the eyes of the people who have enjoyed the fruts of Kings labor would deify him. He had a profound influence on their lives.
 
You completely missed Tom's point. Despite his opposition to the Vietnam war King worked quite well with LBJ.

King worked well with republicans as well. In fact, he was a republican.

The suggestion that King supported LBJ because he worked well with him is no suggestion that he supported his war. Have you read his Vietnam speech?

The argument of the OP is a lousy exercise in logic. We have a two party system. Who would King have supported today? The Republicans? Libertarians? Greens? C'mon give me a break.

Perhaps you weren't here at the time, but King was quite apolitical. He didn't sing the praises of either party, not did he tell his followers to go vote for either of them. He most certainly had a political ministry .. but he didn't give a damn about the two party system.

Roy Wilkins and Bayard Rustin warned King that speaking out against the war would harm his so-called relationship with Johnson. King didn't care. Back then there was a thing called "principle." Today it's called "but there are only two parties."

King was part of a revolution. You think it beyond his capacity to discuss 3rd parties or a political revolution?

What makes the argument of the OP just incredibly silly is that it makes the assumption that ones support of a politician is absolute, complete and with out condition and that's just silly.

If King we're alive today I don't think there would be any doubt that he'd support Obama, considering what his alternatives would be. Would he support Obama unconditionaly and absolutely? C'mon....that's a fools argument.

King's alternatives were never your alternatives. King was not lacking in bold, courage, and principle.

To suggest that he would just lie down and not be strong and vocal against Obama's murdering of children is a complete distortion of him.
 
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I know very well who he is and what's more I have been to the National Museum of American History where there was an area dedicated to him. It may not be there now as it was back in the late '80s.

You don't have a clue.

All you got were the cliffnotes.
 
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