42,000/year killed by secondhand smoke

[NOVA]

Those numbers are nonsense. But what more do you want to do to them?

Its the same bunk as Gore's global warming panic....

Smokers swallow that same smoke, unpolluted by clean air for 50, 60 years until it finally kills them and yet the logic we are asked to believe is that
secondhand smoke that is diluted by millions of times is toxic.....
I don't but it either.....especially considering todays rules and regulations on smokers and where they are allowed to poison themselves.....

 

[NOVA]

I have smoked for years. I have never smoked inside my home. You can't legislate against natural selection, no matter how much sense it makes to you.

You haven't noticed the regulations already in place on smoking ?

On salt in restaurants ?
On your ordering a supersized soda ?
On vending machines in schools and even 'bring from home lunch' ?
On what oil MUST be used in fast food joints ?
This is the death of thousand cuts effecting our most minor of freedoms....the freedom to eat what we want...

Like the libs say like to say when defending abortion....its OUR bodies....

 

[Timshel]

you do not believe studies or statements by the press on the subject

HELL NO. The press mangles science and makes it seem schizophrenic. That is a big reason why the right rejects science entirely while many on the left just confuse the hell out of it. A scholarly source like the journal this was published in will list all their doubts and the limitations of the study. The mainstream press just wants the headline and soundbites.

you believe that smokers will continue to abuse their children by not providing for them because they have to pay too much for tobacco

Yes. They are addicts and will even tell themselves that they use to satiate the stress caused by child rearing.

and why do you believe that only fox news/murdock will only benefit by anti-smoking commercials

Screw cnn or any other station you like too. They are all number one in my book. I am not interested in helping them. Obviously, I used that for effect but it does not change my position or the main point. You are taxing the poor to help the rich.

ps yes i am on a crusade, my step father smoked and he stank - when i washed my parents sheets they were stained by the stuff oozing out of his pores

I am sorry for your pain, but punishing him would not have helped anyone. It is certainly a disgusting habit and I have no doubt second hand smoke does some little bit of harm. At least the body of this article was careful enough to acknowledge that the deaths were PRECIPITATED by second hand smoke. But the headline was misleading, which is par for the course in the mainstream press. It does not CAUSE 42,000 deaths a year and that is not what the study indicates. I guarantee you the science journal did not use such a blatantly misleading headline.

also, have you thought about how much smoking costs the taxpayers in related health care costs and fire insurance costs

Those are valid points. Maybe, they should be included in the commercials that ALREADY exist instead of the crappy scapegoating. That is, why not tell people what their habits cost THEM and their loved ones in real terms. It is far more effective than demonizing the smoker or other market participants. They might tune it out as preachy but that sort of preaching works better than fire and brimstone which only promotes hate.

I can tell you the reason. There is no vested interest (other than the media/preacher) that will profit from that approach because it is effective. Better to outlaw it entirely so the legal and prison systems can make money off of it.

 

[NOVA]

yes, let us tax the users for the harm that they do and the costs that they inflict on taxpayers

Thats racist....

 

[Timshel]

Its the same bunk as Gore's global warming panic....

Smokers swallow that same smoke, unpolluted by clean air for 50, 60 years until it finally kills them and yet the logic we are asked to believe is that
secondhand smoke that is diluted by millions of times is toxic.....
I don't but it either.....especially considering todays rules and regulations on smokers and where they are allowed to poison themselves.....

It is not. AGW is well established and the prediction models have been very accurate for many years now. Gore certainly went overboard with it, but the complete denial of the overwhleming amount of data backing the theory is just as bad.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

I no longer care what they do about second hand smoke.......nearing my third anniversary using personal vaporizers and I haven't had a cigarette since January, 2010.....

currently using a Provari...

with a vivi nova tank...

great stuff....

 

[Timshel]

Hey pmp, can you?

[video=youtube;muA5EBmpDhA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=muA5EBmpDhA[/video]

 

[PostmodernProphet]

no....no personal vaporizer powered by an electric battery will produce enough heat......you would need something butane fired if you wanted to go that route.....

 

[Timshel]

no....no personal vaporizer powered by an electric battery will produce enough heat......you would need something butane fired if you wanted to go that route.....

Well, at least you know how something works.

I knew they kept you around for something.

 

[Lowaicue]

Thats racist....

Can you still get health insurance as a smoker. If so it should be stopped. Let smokers, alcoholics, drug users etc, pay their medical bills from their own pockets.
I don't know whether America suffers from drunks, druggies and idiots crowding out the A & E departments at weekends as happens in many places in the UK, but if so that should be stopped. Special cells should be supplied where these idiots can be thrown to piss, shit and vomit themselves into good sense and then pay the bill for cleaning their mess.
As an ex smoker I do not obsess about smoking like many ex smokers do. You wanna smoke so smoke but I'll be damned if I will contribute to any expenses you habit causes to society.

 

[Lowaicue]

I no longer care what they do about second hand smoke.......nearing my third anniversary using personal vaporizers and I haven't had a cigarette since January, 2010.....

currently using a Provari...

with a vivi nova tank...

great stuff....

Incredible. You started smoking, you stop. What the hell are you buying stuff like that for. I had my first cigarette at the age of 9. By 14 I was a regular. I gave up on April 15 2008. I have never smoked nor wanted to smoke since then. I have convinced myself that I do not like the smell of smoke. My friends all gave up at about the same time. None of us 'smell' of smoke any more. Our wardrobes to not stink of tobacco and our palates appreciate good food and wine. Enough incentive for anyone.
All I have to give up now is my natural habit of being nice to people like you, but I can feel success coming on.

 

[Timshel]

Can you still get health insurance as a smoker. If so it should be stopped. Let smokers, alcoholics, drug users etc, pay their medical bills from their own pockets.
I don't know whether America suffers from drunks, druggies and idiots crowding out the A & E departments at weekends as happens in many places in the UK, but if so that should be stopped. Special cells should be supplied where these idiots can be thrown to piss, shit and vomit themselves into good sense and then pay the bill for cleaning their mess.
As an ex smoker I do not obsess about smoking like many ex smokers do. You wanna smoke so smoke but I'll be damned if I will contribute to any expenses you habit causes to society.

Are you joking?

Why should you be able to get insurance? Based on your other post in this thread you should pay out of your pocket until at least 2015 (that's when they say your lungs will be healed). Maybe, longer since you were smoking at such a young age.

Also, why should any amount of alcohol be toleratedand how exactly are you going to determine what amount qualifies you as an alcoholic?

 

[Lowaicue]

Are you joking?

Why should you be able to get insurance? Based on your other post in this thread you should pay out of your pocket until at least 2015 (that's when they say your lungs will be healed). Maybe, longer since you were smoking at such a young age.

Also, why should any amount of alcohol be toleratedand how exactly are you going to determine what amount qualifies you as an alcoholic?

What on earth are you arguing about?
May I suggest you re-read what I have written and try again.

 

[Timshel]

What on earth are you arguing about?
May I suggest you re-read what I have written and try again.

Okay, done. My questions still stand, unless you are joking. I will rephrase them, a little.

Why should you be able to get insurance since your heatlh is still being negatively impacted by your past smoking?

Also, why shouldn't any amount of alcohol disqualify you for insurance since any amount of drug/cigarette use would? How exactly are you going to determine what amount qualifies one as an alcoholic and therefore disqualifies them for insurance?

 

[Lowaicue]

Okay, done. My questions still stand, unless you are joking. I will rephrase them, a little.

Why should you be able to get insurance since your heatlh is still being negatively impacted by your past smoking?

Also, why shouldn't any amount of alcohol disqualify you for insurance since any amount of drug/cigarette use would? How exactly are you going to determine what amount qualifies one as an alcoholic and therefore disqualifies them for insurance?

I can't answer that. My question was a simple 'closed' (yes/no) question. I asked if a smoker can get insurance in America. Simple question. No hidden meaning. No humour.
My second point concerned the immense waste of hospital resources caused by boozed or drugged up weekend revellers. So I think that, since I clearly did not express myself in a way you could understand further attention to the subject could only bring discord and that was not my aim so topic closed as far as I am concerned.
However, thank you for trying.

 

[Timshel]

You stated how you thought it should work. I was not trying to be combative, just curious if you had really thought that through. It appears you have not. What you suggest would be hard to enforce, highly subjective and, if mandated by law, very authoritarian.

 

[PostmodernProphet]

Incredible. You started smoking, you stop. What the hell are you buying stuff like that for. I had my first cigarette at the age of 9. By 14 I was a regular. I gave up on April 15 2008. I have never smoked nor wanted to smoke since then. I have convinced myself that I do not like the smell of smoke. My friends all gave up at about the same time. None of us 'smell' of smoke any more. Our wardrobes to not stink of tobacco and our palates appreciate good food and wine. Enough incentive for anyone.
All I have to give up now is my natural habit of being nice to people like you, but I can feel success coming on.

we're not all part of the master race, as you apparently are......

 

[PostmodernProphet]

Incredible. You started smoking, you stop. What the hell are you buying stuff like that for. I had my first cigarette at the age of 9. By 14 I was a regular. I gave up on April 15 2008. I have never smoked nor wanted to smoke since then. I have convinced myself that I do not like the smell of smoke. My friends all gave up at about the same time. None of us 'smell' of smoke any more. Our wardrobes to not stink of tobacco and our palates appreciate good food and wine. Enough incentive for anyone.
All I have to give up now is my natural habit of being nice to people like you, but I can feel success coming on.

we're not all part of the master race, as you apparently are......

 

[Lowaicue]

we're not all part of the master race, as you apparently are......

So true.

 

[Lowaicue]

You stated how you thought it should work. I was not trying to be combative, just curious if you had really thought that through. It appears you have not. What you suggest would be hard to enforce, highly subjective and, if mandated by law, very authoritarian.

The policies I mantioned have all been enacted under other authorities. If you weren't so mistrusting of your various governments, if you weren't so obsessed with the unimportant, if you didn't spend every waking minute looking for someone else to blame and hate then maybe, just maybe you could have what other people have or are planning to have.