Gee... I thought the health care debate was settled?

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Congress passed Obamacare in the house and senate, and the president signed it into law... The Supreme Court just ruled that it can go forward with the plan to be implemented fully in 2014... Pinheads were all wild-eyed and giddy... dancing in the streets, hooting down conservatives with "in your face" chants and such... you'd think this would be the one issue that had been settled, and it would be of little interest for them to spend time on now... but... We are seeing virtually every hot thread on the board, slowly be turned into a debate over health care, as if we were still debating passage of Obamacare! What gives???

Did someone turn Libs clocks back to 2007 and not tell them? What a cruel joke to play!

 

[Onceler]

I thought the court decision was a big victory for conservatives?

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Did you think that? Really OneCell?

 

[apple0154]

Congress passed Obamacare in the house and senate, and the president signed it into law... The Supreme Court just ruled that it can go forward with the plan to be implemented fully in 2014... Pinheads were all wild-eyed and giddy... dancing in the streets, hooting down conservatives with "in your face" chants and such... you'd think this would be the one issue that had been settled, and it would be of little interest for them to spend time on now... but... We are seeing virtually every hot thread on the board, slowly be turned into a debate over health care, as if we were still debating passage of Obamacare! What gives???

Did someone turn Libs clocks back to 2007 and not tell them? What a cruel joke to play!

No, no, no, no, no, Dix. Think of the Supreme Court ruling as a signal to start the debate. During Obama's second term you'll witness the Repubs pulling their hair out as Obama and the Dems "fine tune" Obamacare. The SC ruling basically sanctioned the march towards a one payer/universal/government system. The Repubs now realize there is nothing to stop the implementation of a one payer/universal/government system so they'll either be welcomed on board or thrown overboard. If they want any say in how the new system will unfold they'll have to undergo an attitude adjustment. It's no longer a question of "is such a system legal" or "should there be such a system".

There was a nasty fight and the Dems won. To the winner go the spoils and the spoils are they'll decide what will and won't be part of the make-up of OmamaCare. Should the Repubs mind their place and respectfully submit ideas I'm sure the Dems will consider them. However, should the Repubs step out of line they'll be swiftly dismissed from class and told to stand in the hall similar to what happened in the past. The only difference is there will be far less tolerance this time around. Old, tired, worn out ideas will be summarily dismissed. It will be an atmosphere of "to get along, you go along". The time is now. The Dems are already in the back room drawing up plans. Come January constructive criticism will be accepted but should the Repubs stall by bringing up old, tired, worn out talking points the gavel will come crashing down and debate ended. Your Emperor is losing patience!

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

Well it that were actually the case, it would seem Liberals would be spending all their time talking about their next great idea? The fight is over and Democrats won, right? So why is every thread devolving in another Obamacare debate, as if we hadn't even passed it yet? This is bizzaro world for sure... You won, the issue's over, it's settled... but you still feel compelled to present arguments for it and act like it is something we need to debate?

Explain that?

 

[Howey]

During Obama's second term you'll witness the Repubs pulling their hair out

Oh...I'm sure the pubs will be going ballistic. But the one I want to see is Dicksee....he's going to have to set up an entire forum of his own just for the crazed ramblings!

 

[christiefan915]

"When pre-existing conditions are outlawed, only outlaws will have pre-existing conditions." ROTFL.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Think of the Supreme Court ruling as a signal to start the debate. During Obama's second term you'll witness the Repubs pulling their hair out as Obama and the Dems "fine tune" Obamacare. The SC ruling basically sanctioned the march towards a one payer/universal/government system.

so we can blame a conservative justice for destroying competent healthcare and replacing it with cheaper, but wholly inadequate, healthcare? wow, you libs don't take any responsibility for anything, do you?

 

[apple0154]

Well it that were actually the case, it would seem Liberals would be spending all their time talking about their next great idea? The fight is over and Democrats won, right? So why is every thread devolving in another Obamacare debate, as if we hadn't even passed it yet? This is bizzaro world for sure... You won, the issue's over, it's settled... but you still feel compelled to present arguments for it and act like it is something we need to debate?

Explain that?

The reason for the continued debate is there are people who still comment on the redundancy of Obamacare. You know, people who say free clinics are the same thing. Stuff like that.

 

[apple0154]

so we can blame a conservative justice for destroying competent healthcare and replacing it with cheaper, but wholly inadequate, healthcare? wow, you libs don't take any responsibility for anything, do you?

Justice Roberts, by his ruling, has lent legitimacy to the entire Repub/Conservative gang. We can no longer say every Repub/Conservative is nuts because someone will bring up Robert's name. The Repubs/Conservatives should be thanking him.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

the real debate should actually be on the broken system of the federal government and what can be done to fix it.

 

[SmarterthanYou]

Justice Roberts, by his ruling, has lent legitimacy to the entire Repub/Conservative gang. We can no longer say every Repub/Conservative is nuts because someone will bring up Robert's name. The Repubs/Conservatives should be thanking him.

maybe they should, but those of us who know how to read and understand the constitution are rightly furious at about 80% of the population right now.

 

[apple0154]

the real debate should actually be on the broken system of the federal government and what can be done to fix it.

As far as health care a one payer/universal system is the fix. It's been used by dozens of countries. The citizens in every country with government health care are adamant about keeping it. The solution is simple and has been proven. The citizens in every country approve of it. A simple solution to please the citizens and end the discussion. The only problem is the Repubs constantly trying to thwart Obama's sensible, logical, proven plan. That's why a Democratic majority is necessary. The Repubs have to be put to the side and let government work.

 

[NOVA]

Anytime you TAKE from what others have worked hard and sacrificed for what they have, and give it to those that refuse to take responsibility for themselves, those in the second group will be adamant about their support for that injustice to the first group and convince themselves its their right and, Oh so just....we all know that.....socialism is nothing more than buying political support from societies parasites....
Our governments job is the guarantee that every citizen has the opportunity to thrive in this country to the best of their ability......if they don't or won't, thats a burden for them to overcome, and be thankful they have what they worked for no matter how much it is.....if they can't, then its governments duty to provide them the NECESSITIES to exist.....not buy them flat screen tv's or cellphones or cigarettes or booze, etc.

If people that climb mountains for fun, fall and get seriously hurt, or smoke and get cancer, its their problem. Its their choice and they alone must take responsibility for their lifestyle......I have no compassion for those that murder, rob, steal, or hurt others in any way, none....my compassion is for those that, through no obvious fault of their own, become the victims of life's unforeseen and inescapable dangers...

 

[apple0154]

maybe they should, but those of us who know how to read and understand the constitution are rightly furious at about 80% of the population right now.

What part of the Constitution could possibly be relevant to today's health care? The only thing relevant is the Preamble which the "courts have referred to it as reliable evidence of, the Founding Fathers' intentions regarding the Constitution's meaning" and the Preamble reads. "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

If people believe the Founding Fathers intentions were to form the best country on the planet by ensuring what is best for the citizens then certainly health has to figure at the top. How could they have possibly been interested in justice and tranquility and welfare and securing the blessings of liberty for the citizens while not caring about whether the citizens lived or died? It doesn't make sense for someone to say the Founding Fathers never cared about that because it wasn't specifically mentioned. How could they mention something they knew nothing about? It wasn't until 60 years later, in 1856, that Louis Pasteur discovered germs. It took another 70 years, in 1928, before antibiotics were discovered. Did the Founding Fathers even imagine one pill (Metoprolol) selling for as little as 25 cents for a daily dose, at today's prices, could increase a person's life by 20 years or more?

If the Founding Fathers' goal was to form a government ensuring citizens the best life possible surely that included life itself.

 

[NOVA]

What part of the Constitution could possibly be relevant to today's health care? The only thing relevant is the Preamble which the "courts have referred to it as reliable evidence of, the Founding Fathers' intentions regarding the Constitution's meaning" and the Preamble reads. "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

If people believe the Founding Fathers intentions were to form the best country on the planet by ensuring what is best for the citizens then certainly health has to figure at the top. Yet they make no mention of this in any way, shape or form, nada, ziltch....go figure, huh

How could they have possibly been interested in justice and tranquility and welfare and securing the blessings of liberty for the citizens while not caring about whether the citizens lived or died? Thats why it specifically says to 'provide for the common defense'....

It doesn't make sense for someone to say the Founding Fathers never cared about that because it wasn't specifically mentioned. How could they mention something they knew nothing about? It wasn't until 60 years later, in 1856, that Louis Pasteur discovered germs. It took another 70 years, in 1928, before antibiotics were discovered. Did the Founding Fathers even imagine one pill (Metoprolol) selling for as little as 25 cents for a daily dose, at today's prices, could increase a person's life by 20 years or more?

If the Founding Fathers' goal was to form a government ensuring citizens the best life possible surely that included life itself.

What doesn't make sense it your personal interpretation of the words and what they mean...

The Founding Fathers, put into words how "a more Union" is to be achieved.......

1.....establish Justice,......................................................................equal treatment under the law(as in providing an equal playing field- JUSTICE for all)
2.....insure domestic Tranquility,........................................................enforcing and upholding the laws enacted by the People(as in protecting our borders)
3.....provide for the common defense,.................................................establish the Armed Forces for defense of the Nation and its sovereignty...
4.....promote the general Welfare,......................................................protection of the nations resources and infrastructure for everyones benefit
5.....and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity.....guarantee and protect the freedoms given to us ...out inalienable rights

NO MORE and NO LESS and NO SUBSTITUTIONS or ADDITIONS without amending constitution as provided for by the Constitution....

 

[christiefan915]

Anytime you TAKE from what others have worked hard and sacrificed for what they have, and give it to those that refuse to take responsibility for themselves, those in the second group will be adamant about their support for that injustice to the first group and convince themselves its their right and, Oh so just....we all know that.....socialism is nothing more than buying political support from societies parasites....
Our governments job is the guarantee that every citizen has the opportunity to thrive in this country to the best of their ability......if they don't or won't, thats a burden for them to overcome, and be thankful they have what they worked for no matter how much it is.....if they can't, then its governments duty to provide them the NECESSITIES to exist.....not buy them flat screen tv's or cellphones or cigarettes or booze, etc.

If people that climb mountains for fun, fall and get seriously hurt, or smoke and get cancer, its their problem. Its their choice and they alone must take responsibility for their lifestyle......I have no compassion for those that murder, rob, steal, or hurt others in any way, none....my compassion is for those that, through no obvious fault of their own, become the victims of life's unforeseen and inescapable dangers...

1. I got mine, screw you.

2. It's your own fault for getting sick, hurt, pregnant, etc.

 

[NOVA]

1. I got mine, screw you.

2. It's your own fault for getting sick, hurt, pregnant, etc.

Right and wrong.....

I worked 35+ hard years and did my duty and I'm not giving up what I've labored for and earned to care for the rest of humanity unless its MY DECISION.....
So, yeah.....I've earned my way, you freakin' earn yours.......

Getting sick is not your 'fault' .....No sane person gets sick or contracts a disease on purpose..... It is not possible to go through life without getting sick or having an accident......so, in this respect, you're just plain full of shit.....and I've already stated I have much compassion for those people.....

Getting pregnant is not a disease, not a sickness and in the overwhelming course of events, entirely possible to prevent even for those with a minimum of common sense........in any other scenario, you are a victim, and as already stated.....they too have my compassion......

And by compassion, I mean victims deserve any and all assistance they need to order to cope with diffucultly....that goes without saying


This is....."promoting the general Welfare"....

 

[NOVA]

You teabaggers don't know how to read, you fucking asshole.

You didn't get to address the post.....try again...

Anytime you TAKE from what others have worked hard and sacrificed for what they have, and give it to those that refuse to take responsibility for themselves, those in the second group will be adamant about their support for that injustice to the first group and convince themselves its their right and, Oh so just....we all know that.....socialism is nothing more than buying political support from societies parasites....
Our governments job is the guarantee that every citizen has the opportunity to thrive in this country to the best of their ability......if they don't or won't, thats a burden for them to overcome, and be thankful they have what they worked for no matter how much it is.....if they can't, then its governments duty to provide them the NECESSITIES to exist.....not buy them flat screen tv's or cellphones or cigarettes or booze, etc.

If people that climb mountains for fun, fall and get seriously hurt, or smoke and get cancer, its their problem. Its their choice and they alone must take responsibility for their lifestyle......I have no compassion for those that murder, rob, steal, or hurt others in any way, none....my compassion is for those that, through no obvious fault of their own, become the victims of life's unforeseen and inescapable dangers...

 

[Dixie - In Memoriam]

The reason for the continued debate is there are people who still comment on the redundancy of Obamacare. You know, people who say free clinics are the same thing. Stuff like that.

Well I have often argued that Medicaid was established to do what Obamacare claims to want to do, and I have often asked why the great and wonderful Liberal idea of government medical called "Medicaid" has apparently "failed" and we need this new massive system to do what has supposed to already be handled? I've literally gotten no explanation to date.... but that is beside the point here. IF Obamacare is set in concrete now, what with the ruling and all... and IF the debate is over and it's settled, what difference does it make what I argue now? Seems like you'd just laugh and move on, because it's a moot point? But that's not what we see... no.... Liberals are coming out of the woodwork, foaming at the mouth and snarling over their resolve to keep Obamacare!

It's almost like... and I know this sounds crazy... you somehow think this isn't really settled yet? Like maybe there is still something that could derail Obamacare? Now we all know how silly and ridiculous that is, because it's settled and the fight is over, right? There are a LOT of other problems out there, and with this issue so clearly settled and in the can, it's interesting how much time liberals are devoting to it... seems like you'd be politically better off to stop arguing for something that you've already accomplished, and move on to something else?