Michigan Rs email show gerrymandering plans

I hope this Michigan referendum passes and is implemented; it could very well serve as a model for other states to do the same. Whether you prefer (D)s or (R)s or something else entirely, an end to gerrymandering will benefit us all.
 
Kacper said:
No they are 5 who will be a party of 1 each up against parties who are 4 of each who will backroom deal to make sure the 1's never get the chance to replace one of the 4's.
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Sure thing, bucko. Guess we'll just have to leave things as they are because it's just too hard.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
I hope this Michigan referendum passes and is implemented; it could very well serve as a model for other states to do the same. Whether you prefer (D)s or (R)s or something else entirely, an end to gerrymandering will benefit us all.
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Including the 23 gerrymandered or 30 gerrymandered black or hispanic districts? No one seems to mention them.

2 of the 23 black majority districts are in YOUR state of Michigan.
 
Kacper said:
Still doesn't say who gets to decide as far as its weighted application process. If you want to end gerrymandering you have to take the demographics completely out of it. It needs to be done based on population numbers alone and some agreed upon metric as far as the geography. Anything else, is gerrymandering by another name.
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I'm assuming you mean the VRA and I agree. By definition the VRA and majority minority districts are gerrymandered. If the goal is to eliminate politicians and their bias from the process (and that's a worthy goal) and have algorithms do it, how can it co-exist with VRA laws?
 
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cawacko said:
I'm assuming you mean the VRA and I agree. By definition the VRA and majority minority districts are gerrymandered. If the goal is to eliminate politicians and their bias from the process (and that's a worthy goal) and have algorithms do it, how can it do-exist with VRA laws?
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I find it interesting that many who complain about political gerrymandering have no problem with majority minority gerrymandering. A politically gerrymandered district favoring the political party that ultimately controls the district drawing process in their State can't take race into account or draw districts purposely designed to weaken a particular racial group. However, it's find and dandy to draw a district where race/ethnicity is the sole factor in drawing the boundaries. Sounds a lot like affirmative action. You can't use RACE to deny because it's wrong but you can use RACE to benefit.
 
Kacper said:
You don't have to leave things as they are, but so far you have not shown how this isn't California's same rigged system.
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California has the only gerrymandered Asian majority minority district in the country and 14 of its districts have a gerrymandered hispanic majority.

I'm curious as to why those that complain about political gerrymandering have no problem with racial gerrymandering.
 
cawacko said:
I'm assuming you mean the VRA and I agree. By definition the VRA and majority minority districts are gerrymandered. If the goal is to eliminate politicians and their bias from the process (and that's a worthy goal) and have algorithms do it, how can it do-exist with VRA laws?
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The VRA act enforcement provisions were struck down by the SCOTUS a couple years back and have yet to be replaced by Congress. The easiest way to be race neutral is to never look at race to begin with, or anything reflective of race with winks and nods. Divide the population by the number of seats, and just start plotting off that whole number per district with the goal of creating as many compact contiguous districts as possible.
 
The good news ..

President Trump won Michigan by the narrowest of margins in last November’s election – receiving just over 10,000 more votes than Democrat Hillary Clinton out of 4.8 million votes cast. But his fellow Republicans swept the state’s congressional districts, capturing nine of 14 seats statewide.

Gerrymandering in Michigan and across the nation are known and are being challenged in courts and by rising citizen's groups.

Trump won Michigan by a thin margin .. with Michigan being one of the worst gerrymandered states in America.

That change is coming.
 
blackascoal said:
The good news ..

President Trump won Michigan by the narrowest of margins in last November’s election – receiving just over 10,000 more votes than Democrat Hillary Clinton out of 4.8 million votes cast. But his fellow Republicans swept the state’s congressional districts, capturing nine of 14 seats statewide.

Gerrymandering in Michigan and across the nation are known and are being challenged in courts and by rising citizen's groups.

Trump won Michigan by a thin margin .. with Michigan being one of the worst gerrymandered states in America.

That change is coming.
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Strange how you say nothing about Michigan having 2 of the 23 black gerrymandered majority minority districts.
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
I'd like to see it done completely dispassionately with computer programs and grids, rather than the sloppy shit we have now.

Edited to add:
From the link:
"All applicants who fit the criteria and who are not disqualified will go into a general pool from which 200 finalists will be randomly selected- 50% from open public applications and 50% from randomly mailed invitations. Each application will be weighted (using widely accepted statistical weighting methods) to ensure that this pool of 200 applicants mirrors the geographic and demographic makeup of the state as closely as possible. The final Commission of 13 Michigan voters will be randomly selected from the pool - 4 Republicans*, 4 Democrats*, and 5 who affiliate with neither party."
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Calfornia passed a referendum establishing a citizen's redistricting commission, which takes the matter out of the hands of the legislature, and is at least an attempt to make re-districting reasonably fair and non-partisan.

So, while California is trying to improve democracy, Michigan Republicans (and Republicans elsewhere) are trying to subvert democracy.
 
Kacper said:
Still doesn't say who gets to decide as far as its weighted application process. If you want to end gerrymandering you have to take the demographics completely out of it. It needs to be done based on population numbers alone and some agreed upon metric as far as the geography. Anything else, is gerrymandering by another name.
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bullshit


it can be done to make sure the state represents the mix of voters as their real votes represent

stories like this PROVE the republican party hates democracy and cant be trusted
 
ThatOwlWoman said:
I'd like to see it done completely dispassionately with computer programs and grids, rather than the sloppy shit we have now.

Edited to add:
From the link:
"All applicants who fit the criteria and who are not disqualified will go into a general pool from which 200 finalists will be randomly selected- 50% from open public applications and 50% from randomly mailed invitations. Each application will be weighted (using widely accepted statistical weighting methods) to ensure that this pool of 200 applicants mirrors the geographic and demographic makeup of the state as closely as possible. The final Commission of 13 Michigan voters will be randomly selected from the pool - 4 Republicans*, 4 Democrats*, and 5 who affiliate with neither party."
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It can be done by humans


the republicans just hate this nation being a democracy



they are traitors to this nation
 
Cypress said:
Calfornia passed a referendum establishing a citizen's redistricting commission, which takes the matter out of the hands of the legislature, and is at least an attempt to make re-districting reasonably fair and non-partisan.

So, while California is trying to improve democracy, Michigan Republicans (and Republicans elsewhere) are trying to subvert democracy.
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GREAT point.

California’s redistricting commission has some free advice for Michigan
https://www.bridgemi.com/public-sec...ting-commission-has-some-free-advice-michigan
 
Kacper said:
That's fine but your ballot initiative doesn't get you there. 4 democrats and 4 republicans still maintains the current party duopoly.
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the Democrats didnt do this


THE REPUBLICANS DID


Quit trying to make the Democrats be blamed for what republicans do
 
Michigan Repubs are ruthless. We are terribly gerrymandered. Dems get a slim majority of the vote and the seat advantage is lobsided red. They rule our house like despots. They have voice votes and the Red leader says, aye to Red and will not allow a vote count. Couple elections ago, we had a ballot initiative about the Emergency Managers. The people voted to end them. The Repubs passed a law reinstituting them and added a rule so a vote on them could not happen again. Fuck the people, we will do what we want.
 
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