Public School A-F Grading System ... For The School

leaningright

leaningright

Moderate Republican
Staff member
I know better than to post things on a Sunday but it is thundering and sleeting outside and church services are cancelled for tonight so here I am. I will preface this with the fact that the school where I teach is received an A last year and does a decent job overall. But since the implementation of the A-F grading system in our state I have been concerned about the misconception a blanket grade would portray. When a school gets an F does that mean they aren't doing their job? Not necessarily. The following is the first in a series of articles that the Tulsa World is doing on an "F" school. I teach in a school that is well over 80% free and reduced lunch but cannot imagine the problems this poor school (and by extension, the poor teachers) faces every day.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/educ...0-a0a9-11e3-bb77-0017a43b2370.html?mode=story

"Every other Friday without fail, Judi Wilson, LaChelle Harris and Kenneth Stanley Sr. can be found at Hawthorne Elementary School selling sour pickles and fresh-popped popcorn to raise money for the PTA.
It’s a good thing they do, because they’re three of only five parents in the PTA at a school with 386 students. In December, teachers were the only ones who attended the monthly PTA meeting.
 
leaningright said:
I know better than to post things on a Sunday but it is thundering and sleeting outside and church services are cancelled for tonight so here I am. I will preface this with the fact that the school where I teach is received an A last year and does a decent job overall. But since the implementation of the A-F grading system in our state I have been concerned about the misconception a blanket grade would portray. When a school gets an F does that mean they aren't doing their job? Not necessarily. The following is the first in a series of articles that the Tulsa World is doing on an "F" school. I teach in a school that is well over 80% free and reduced lunch but cannot imagine the problems this poor school (and by extension, the poor teachers) faces every day.

http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/educ...0-a0a9-11e3-bb77-0017a43b2370.html?mode=story

"Every other Friday without fail, Judi Wilson, LaChelle Harris and Kenneth Stanley Sr. can be found at Hawthorne Elementary School selling sour pickles and fresh-popped popcorn to raise money for the PTA.
It’s a good thing they do, because they’re three of only five parents in the PTA at a school with 386 students. In December, teachers were the only ones who attended the monthly PTA meeting.
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Don't you know it's you crummy teachers and your unions fault. ;)

Really, with problems of this magnitude, it's over whelming...where do you begin? How do you get generationally disadvantaged parents to care about their education? That's seems to be 90% of the battle. Parents.

Of course you know that Teachers will get the blame for parents failure.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Don't you know it's you crummy teachers and your unions fault. ;)

Really, with problems of this magnitude, it's over whelming...where do you begin? How do you get generationally disadvantaged parents to care about their education? That's seems to be 90% of the battle. Parents.

Of course you know that Teachers will get the blame for parents failure.
Click to expand...

On this, Mott, I have absolutely no idea where to begin. I can't even fathom a child who has had such limited human contact/communication that he can't speak in complete sentences by school age (4 or 5). And how do you get 108% mobility rate? I didn't even know that they could go that high. Teachers who teach in schools like this shouldn't get castigated by the general public, they should be praised....as well as paid. They deserve more than what I make.
 
CAN it be a teacher problem ? Yes.
CAN it be a union problem ? Yes.
CAN it be a leadership problem ? Yes.
But the lion's share is the parent(s) and we can no longer afford to ignore the problem. But evaluating isnt a problem its necessary to insure uf all the lesser causes are in play and need attention.
Time for a frank conversation on what we do about irresponsible parents. Nobody wants to do this of course but with the problems this causes the economy there is no acceptable excuse for kicking this down the road.
 
Celticguy said:
CAN it be a teacher problem ? Yes.
CAN it be a union problem ? Yes.
CAN it be a leadership problem ? Yes.
But the lion's share is the parent(s) and we can no longer afford to ignore the problem. But evaluating isnt a problem its necessary to insure uf all the lesser causes are in play and need attention.
Time for a frank conversation on what we do about irresponsible parents. Nobody wants to do this of course but with the problems this causes the economy there is no acceptable excuse for kicking this down the road.
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Evaluating isn't a problem unless its results are used as a bludgeon.
 
This is a tough one. The government can't force parents to be more involved in their kids lives but clearly we'd all be better off if more parents did.
 
Celticguy said:
depending on the cause, a bludgeon may be just whats needed. I had hoped that my post made the point of identifying the cause of the effect. Seems it did not.
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So if I get you right you are saying that the "cause" of the irresponsible and uninvolved parents is the "effect" of bad teachers/schools?
 
leaningright said:
On this, Mott, I have absolutely no idea where to begin. I can't even fathom a child who has had such limited human contact/communication that he can't speak in complete sentences by school age (4 or 5). And how do you get 108% mobility rate? I didn't even know that they could go that high. Teachers who teach in schools like this shouldn't get castigated by the general public, they should be praised....as well as paid. They deserve more than what I make.
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I agree...whole heartedly.....but the sad truth is these are exactly the teachers that are demonized as failures and are blamed for failing schools.
 
leaningright said:
Evaluating isn't a problem unless its results are used as a bludgeon.
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Evaluation has become a tool for those who have a political agenda to undermine public education. Unions and tenure are meant to protect public school teachers from people like Celticguy who want to demonize them as the problem. Unions and tenure only make it difficult to fire a poor performing teacher, not impossible. The fact is that the overwhelming majority of public school teachers are competent, passionate and dedicated professionals who could make far more doing something else than trying to drum knowledge into some paste eater.

The biggest problem in public education today are apathetic parents and those with a political agenda that are determined to undermine public education.
 
I agree that we'll never be able to assess the damage caused by unions and administrations, because parents are overwhelmingly the cause of our educational system's failures. Nothing else even comes close.
 
Celticguy said:
depending on the cause, a bludgeon may be just whats needed. I had hoped that my post made the point of identifying the cause of the effect. Seems it did not.
Click to expand...
Seems to me your just trying to rationalize your anti-teacher, anti-union beliefs than identify either problems or cause and affect.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Evaluation has become a tool for those who have a political agenda to undermine public education. Unions and tenure are meant to protect public school teachers from people like Celticguy who want to demonize them as the problem. Unions and tenure only make it difficult to fire a poor performing teacher, not impossible. The fact is that the overwhelming majority of public school teachers are competent, passionate and dedicated professionals who could make far more doing something else than trying to drum knowledge into some paste eater.

The biggest problem in public education today are apathetic parents and those with a political agenda that are determined to undermine public education.
Click to expand...

What other job do you know that has no evaluation at all of your performance? Yet we think there should no evaluating those in charge of educating our youth? It seems to me those are the one's with the political agenda.
 
cawacko said:
How?
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Look at the history of public education. Do you think the poor and uneducated when "Whippee! Free School!" when it was first mandated? No, it wasn't known as "public education" for a long time. It was known as "compulsory education." and those who didn't permit their children to get educated or permitted their child's truancy was called to account by law. In other worlds you were (and still are) compelled by the government to educate your children. So government can and always has played a role in enforcing public education.
 
leaningright said:
So if I get you right you are saying that the "cause" of the irresponsible and uninvolved parents is the "effect" of bad teachers/schools?
Click to expand...

No. The cause of failing kids (for the most part) is the effect of failed parent(s). And to date that is the one unmentionable thing in the education conversation. Except for Bill Cosby. Even the president did his typical two step of acknowledge the problem but flat refuse to address it. But that was his handlers talking. Unions say throw more money down the toilet and expect a different result than all the other times its been tried.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Look at the history of public education. Do you think the poor and uneducated when "Whippee! Free School!" when it was first mandated? No, it wasn't known as "public education" for a long time. It was known as "compulsory education." and those who didn't permit their children to get educated or permitted their child's truancy was called to account by law. In other worlds you were (and still are) compelled by the government to educate your children. So government can and always has played a role in enforcing public education.
Click to expand...

Ok but what I was referring to was the government not having the ability to make a parent give a shit such as helping your kid with school work and being supportive and being involved. I think most would agree it's important a parent do all those things but we can't really force them to via legislation.
 
cawacko said:
What other job do you know that has no evaluation at all of your performance? Yet we think there should no evaluating those in charge of educating our youth? It seems to me those are the one's with the political agenda.
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Bullshit. That's a strawman and a false assumption on your part that their is no evaluation that there is no accountability for teachers.

Educators need to be protected, to some degree, from those with political, religious and social agendas, those who wish to undermine public education for their own selfish partisan reasons and the public pressures of irrational parents and neophytes who think they know more about the education profession than the professionals do.

One of the issues involved in education is getting the best people to dedicate themselves to the profession knowing that they are going to be demonized by political hacks and paid far less than they can make in the private sector while being blamed for the parenting failures of half the knuckle draggers in town. We need these protections for educators to help attract quality people into the profession.

I know from my own experience of flirting with an education career when I was offered a job as a high school biology teacher. Not only was I offered slightly more than half of what I was currently making but it's hinted strongly that I not teach biological evolution or more correctly that I do so in a cursory manner that would not upset religious parents. I flat out refused in the interview and expressed dismay that they would even consider not teaching one of the most important foundational concepts of the topic and that in regards to the public pressures were concerned that I didn't believe that it was the place of those who are uneducated in that field of science to dictate to those of us who are what ought to be taught in the classroom. This is a perfect example of why public school teachers need these kinds of protection.

The real fact is that only a minute handful of educators perform their jobs poorly and most of those don't keep their jobs for long and that those who try to exaggerate the issue and demonize public educators are those with a political and ideological agenda to undermine one of this nations greatest accomplisments. Universal Public Education.

The fact is, is that the vast majority of public school educators in our nations are unappreciated heros who make tremendous personal sacrifices to pursue a profession and vocation that they love and are passionate about.
 
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