How Corporate Greed Is Starving Our Public School System

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signalmankenneth

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http://www.alternet.org/print/corpo...orate-greed-starving-our-public-school-system

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An incredibly insightful article. If we quit giving tax breaks to businesses all at once, they'd still build and our economies will flourish.
 
You cannot blame corporations for taking advantage of the loopholes that exist. What do you want them to do, write a check to the IRS for an additional, arbitrary amount? Tax reform is a topic worthy of discussion, but until the tax code is modified, we can't blame corporations (or individuals) for being shrewd with their money. But then, this is a foreign concept to communists such as Ken.
 
Rationalist said:
You cannot blame corporations for taking advantage of the loopholes that exist. What do you want them to do, write a check to the IRS for an additional, arbitrary amount? Tax reform is a topic worthy of discussion, but until the tax code is modified, we can't blame corporations (or individuals) for being shrewd with their money. But then, this is a foreign concept to communists such as Ken.
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Not everything is a "loophole".

However, I do agree that simplification of the tax code is warranted. Oddly enough, both parties talk about it, but nothing ever happens. Why? Because the tax code is the main way to shift societal behaviors. Both parties love to do it. They just don't like when the other side does it. If one were to design a tax code he would be psychotic to start with our current state.

I don't hold out any hope that anything meaningful will change unfortunately. Neither party has a vested interest in change.
 
Rationalist said:
You cannot blame corporations for taking advantage of the loopholes that exist. What do you want them to do, write a check to the IRS for an additional, arbitrary amount? Tax reform is a topic worthy of discussion, but until the tax code is modified, we can't blame corporations (or individuals) for being shrewd with their money. But then, this is a foreign concept to communists such as Ken.
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Can we blame them for hiring K Street to lobby for the laws that provide these tax benefits and for the unlimited donations to the politicians that pass these laws?
I thought you were going to stop being simple.
 
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Rune said:
Can we blame them for hiring K Street to lobby for the laws that provide these tax benefits and for the unlimited donations to the politicians that pass these laws?
I thought you were going to stop being simple.
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So long as they are not breaking the law, no, we cannot blame them. They are simply doing what every good company does: find every legal avenue whereby profits may be maximized.

Rather than attack corporations and stir up class warfare, I think a better approach would be to work to change laws. Insinuating that people are criminals for taking advantage of the system we have isn't going to fix the problem.

And no, I will never be a doctrinaire liberal, if that is what you were expecting. I'll never be a doctrinaire anything. I support what works best, whether that be a liberal idea or a conservative one (though, I would say liberal ideas generally have a higher rate of success).
 
Rationalist said:
So long as they are not breaking the law, no, we cannot blame them. They are simply doing what every good company does: find every legal avenue whereby profits may be maximized.

Rather than attack corporations and stir up class warfare, I think a better approach would be to work to change laws. Insinuating that people are criminals for taking advantage of the system we have isn't going to fix the problem.

And no, I will never be a doctrinaire liberal, if that is what you were expecting. I'll never be a doctrinaire anything. I support what works best, whether that be a liberal idea or a conservative one (though, I would say liberal ideas generally have a higher rate of success).
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And when their influence creates the laws...and regular people have no say or recourse than to elect the next corporate stooge that attracts the most donations and can afford to bombard us with what we want to hear then do what his/her benefactors demand once in office?

THAT'S the issue we're facing.
 
Steelplate said:
And when their influence creates the laws...and regular people have no say or recourse than to elect the next corporate stooge that attracts the most donations and can afford to bombard us with what we want to hear then do what his/her benefactors demand once in office?

THAT'S the issue we're facing.
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That is why the basic underpinnings of our system of government (any government for that matter) relied on a moral people. It is obvious that Washington DC is filled with immoral people. The corporations can only buy those who can be bought.

Now, you don't much care about that because you are more interested in Big Indian Little Indian. You like to play the "my side good" and "your side bad" game and the whole time both sides are bending you over.

As usual you are blaming the wrong people, but then your masters like it that way so carry on.
 
Steelplate said:
And when their influence creates the laws...and regular people have no say or recourse than to elect the next corporate stooge that attracts the most donations and can afford to bombard us with what we want to hear then do what his/her benefactors demand once in office?

THAT'S the issue we're facing.
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Then we deserve to fail for lacking an ounce of character, committment or moral fiber. If we can simply say, "oh, we're being bought off," then Mr. Darwin would have a word with us.
 
Steelplate said:
And when their influence creates the laws...and regular people have no say or recourse than to elect the next corporate stooge that attracts the most donations and can afford to bombard us with what we want to hear then do what his/her benefactors demand once in office?

THAT'S the issue we're facing.
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We do have a say: they are called elections. The problem is that the people usually reelect the same jackasses over and over, which is why our country is probably doomed. Reform is virtually impossible. That said, bitching about corporations isn't going to fix the problem, especially considering many corporations 1) have nothing to do with it, and 2) donate millions to charities (or schools, for that matter) every year. Ken is basically a Marxist and has essentially admitted as much. Is that who you're going to side with?
 
Threedee said:
Then we deserve to fail for lacking an ounce of character, committment or moral fiber. If we can simply say, "oh, we're being bought off," then Mr. Darwin would have a word with us.
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No... that's a false equivalence. Darwin suggested the survival of the fittest. It didn't include the notion of disinformation or outright lies to enhance the means of demise. It was based upon a simple idea of physical traits vs. a hostile world. After all... the concept of "Character", or the lack thereof....is one of indoctrination. What may be noble and brave in one culture can be viewed as shallow and cowardly in another.

In short, you have no answers. None other than to repeat the question again....just with your spin on it....because your "character" is nothing more than what you've been raised to believe.

Being "bought off" is exactly where we are at. It makes no difference as to the Political Party we belong to. Democrat.... Republican... even the vaunted Libertarian. If the powers that be want you, as a Candidate into office, they will give you the resources to get there.... and the people, as mere voters who rely on the rhetoric and spin that we are permitted to see...will accommodate that desire...by casting our vote on the squeaky wheel that gets the most financial support.
 
Rationalist said:
We do have a say: they are called elections. The problem is that the people usually reelect the same jackasses over and over, which is why our country is probably doomed. Reform is virtually impossible. That said, bitching about corporations isn't going to fix the problem, especially considering many corporations 1) have nothing to do with it, and 2) donate millions to charities (or schools, for that matter) every year. Ken is basically a Marxist and has essentially admitted as much. Is that who you're going to side with?
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It beats sticking my head in the sand and say "don't blame the poor rich folk" they are only doing what they have to do to maintain the lives they've become accustomed to....while everyone else scrapes by clawing to gain a foothold.
 
It is 100% the responsibility of the public to be informed voters on election day. There is no other way around it. Otherwise, why the fuck even call this a Constitutional Republic and/or Democracy? We might as well just select a monarch to run this place and not have to worry about what the monied interests have to say any longer.
 
Threedee said:
It is 100% the responsibility of the public to be informed voters on election day. There is no other way around it. Otherwise, why the fuck even call this a Constitutional Republic and/or Democracy? We might as well just select a monarch to run this place and not have to worry about what the monied interests have to say any longer.
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How can you say that when you know.as well as I do that the wheel that screeches the loudest gets the most grease?

Look at FoxNews....it's been outed time and time again as not being truthful and being purposely deceptive, but yet people still flock to it as their primary source of information. Same can be said about MSNBC...albeit on a smaller scale.
 
Steelplate said:
How can you say that when you know.as well as I do that the wheel that screeches the loudest gets the most grease?

Look at FoxNews....it's been outed time and time again as not being truthful and being purposely deceptive, but yet people still flock to it as their primary source of information. Same can be said about MSNBC...albeit on a smaller scale.
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It is because most Americans are stupid. I, too, was once under the impression that Fox News is "fair and balanced." Then, one day, out of the blue, it hit me: this shit is fucking crazy.

Few right-wing Americans find the truth as I have, however. Most will remain ignorant, beating their chest like the apes they are while proudly proclaiming that we are the greatest nation on earth, despite the fact that they are too stupid to even name more than a few other western democracies, let alone describe the smallest detail about their standard of living. The good news is that the dumb redneck demographic is on the decline. That can only help. But in the meantime, I'm curious as to how you would solve this dilemma. Would you exclude certain types of people from voting?
 
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Rationalist said:
So long as they are not breaking the law, no, we cannot blame them. They are simply doing what every good company does: find every legal avenue whereby profits may be maximized.

Rather than attack corporations and stir up class warfare, I think a better approach would be to work to change laws. Insinuating that people are criminals for taking advantage of the system we have isn't going to fix the problem.

And no, I will never be a doctrinaire liberal, if that is what you were expecting. I'll never be a doctrinaire anything. I support what works best, whether that be a liberal idea or a conservative one (though, I would say liberal ideas generally have a higher rate of success).
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Here is where you are wrong;

K Street is immoral if not illegal, hence it should be outlawed.
2. Politicians should not be for sale to the highest bidder, it goes directly against the intent of a representative republic.
 
Rationalist said:
We do have a say: they are called elections. The problem is that the people usually reelect the same jackasses over and over, which is why our country is probably doomed. Reform is virtually impossible. That said, bitching about corporations isn't going to fix the problem, especially considering many corporations 1) have nothing to do with it, and 2) donate millions to charities (or schools, for that matter) every year. Ken is basically a Marxist and has essentially admitted as much. Is that who you're going to side with?
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Total non sequitur

Try to address the topic please.
 
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