disability insurance fraud 60 minutes

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http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-57606233/disability-usa/

There is a Senate hearing scheduled tomorrow on a subject of some importance to millions of Americans, but with the government shutdown it's not clear that the Senate Committee on Government Affairs will be able to pay for a stenographer to record the event. The hearing involves the Federal Disability Insurance Program, which could become the first government benefits program to run out of money. When it began back in the 1950s it was envisioned as a small program to assist people who were unable to work because of illness or injury.


Today, it serves nearly 12 million people -- up 20 percent in the last six years -- and has a budget of $135 billion. That's more than the government spent last year on the Department of Homeland Security, the Justice Department, and the Labor Department combined. It's been called a "secret welfare system" with it's own "disability industrial complex," a system ravaged by waste and fraud. A lot of people want to know what's going on. Especially Sen. Tom Coburn of Oklahoma.


Tom Coburn: Go read the statute. If there's any job in the economy you can perform, you are not eligible for disability. That's pretty clear. So, where'd all those disabled people come from?


The Social Security Administration, which runs the disability program says the explosive surge is due to aging baby boomers and the lingering effects of a bad economy. But Sen. Tom Coburn of Oklahoma, the ranking Republican on the Senate Subcommittee for Investigations -- who's also a physician -- says it's more complicated than that. Last year, his staff randomly selected hundreds of disability files and found that 25 percent of them should never have been approved -- another 20 percent, he said, were highly questionable.


Tom Coburn: If all these people are disabled that apply, I want 'em all to get it. And then we need to figure out how we're going to fund it. But my investigation tells me and my common sense tells me that we got a system that's being gamed pretty big right now.


And by a lot of different people exploiting a vulnerable system. Coburn says you need look no further than the commercials of disability lawyers trolling for new clients. Namely, the two thirds of the people who have already applied for disability and been rejected. There's not much to lose, really. It doesn't cost you anything unless you win the appeal and the lawyers collect from the federal government.


Marilyn Zahm: If the American public knew what was going on in our system, half would be outraged and the other half would apply for benefits.


Marilyn Zahm and Randy Frye are two of the country's 1,500 disability judges. They are also the president and vice president of the Association of Administrative Law Judges. They are each expected to read, hear, and decide up to 700 appeals a year to clear a backlog of nearly a million cases. They say disability lawyers have flooded the system with cases that shouldn't be there.


Marilyn Zahm: In 1971, fewer than 20 percent of claimants were represented. Now, over 80 percent of claimants are represented by attorneys or representatives.


Steve Kroft: Why do you think there's so many more lawyers involved in this than there used to be?


Marilyn Zahm: It's lucrative.


Randy Frye: Follow the money.


Last year the Social Security Administration paid a billion dollars to claimants' lawyers out of its cash-strapped disability trust fund. The biggest chunk -- $70 million - went to Binder & Binder, the largest disability firm in the country. Lawyer Jenna Fliszar and Jessica White worked for Binder & Binder representing clients in front of disability judges from New Hampshire to West Virginia.


Jenna Fliszar: I call it a legal factory because that's all it is. I mean, they have figured out the system and they've made it into a huge national firm that makes millions of dollars a year on Social Security disability.


Jessica White: I was hired at the end of 2008 and business was booming because the economy was so bad. We had a lot of people who -- their unemployment ran out and this was the next step.


Jenna Fliszar: If you're unable to find a job, and you have any type of physical issue, then it really becomes a last ditch effort because the job market is so bad.


Many of the cases they handled involved ailments with subjective symptoms like backache, depression and fibromyalgia, which is joint and muscle pain along with chronic fatigue.


Steve Kroft: Hard to prove you've got it?


Jenna Fliszar: Yes. And there's really no diagnostic testing for it.


Steve Kroft: Hard to deny you don't have it.


Jenna Fliszar: Correct.


Steve Kroft: Out of the hundreds of people that you represented, how many of these cases involved strong cases for disability?


Jenna Fliszar: Strong cases I would say maybe 30 percent to 40 percent. And then I would say half of my cases were not deserving of disability.


Steve Kroft: How many of them ultimately ended up getting benefits?

Jenna Fliszar: Half.


We tried repeatedly to reach Binder & Binder for comment, but our phone calls were not returned.


Tom Coburn: We ought to err on the side of somebody being potentially disabled. And we have a ton of people in our country that are, but what's coming about now with where we are, is the very people who are truly disabled, because we have so many scallywags in the system, are going to get hurt severely when this trust fund runs outta money.
 
Sen. Coburn says disability payments are now propping up the economy in some of the poorest regions in the country. Which is why he sent his investigators to the border area of Kentucky and West Virginia.


More than a quarter of a million people in this area are on disability -- 10 to 15 percent of the population -- about three times the national average. Jennifer Griffith and Sarah Carver processed disability claims at the Social Security regional office in Huntington, West Virginia.


Steve Kroft: How important are disability checks to people in this part of the country?


Jennifer Griffith: They're a vital part of our economy. A lot of people depend on them to survive.


To see it first hand, they suggested we come back right after the disability checks went out. And we did, to find crowds and traffic jams.


Jennifer Griffith: You avoid the pharmacy. You avoid Wal-Mart. You avoid, you know, restaurants because it's just--


Sarah Carver: Any grocery stores.


Jennifer Griffith: It's just extremely crowded. Everybody's received their benefits. Let's go shopping.


Not everyone in the throngs we saw is on disability, but Jennifer Griffith and Sarah Carver say there's no question that a lot of them are and probably shouldn't be.


Sarah Carver: We have a lot of people who have exhausted their unemployment checks and have moved onto Social Security disability.


Steve Kroft: This is, sort of, a bridge between unemployment and collecting Social Security.


Sarah Carver: Generally, yes.


Steve Kroft: Are they disabled?


Sarah Carver: Not always, no.


Jennifer Griffith: More often than not, no.


Around here, people call it "getting on the draw" or "getting on the check," but they have other names for it.


Sarah Carver: I think you could call it a scheme. You could call it a scam. You could call it fraud. I mean, there's different definitions for it.


Steve Kroft: Large scale?


Jennifer Griffith: Very large scale.


They began complaining to their bosses at the Social Security Administration six years ago after discovering that an outsized number of claims and some questionable medical evidence was being submitted by Eric Conn, a flamboyant attorney whose face is plastered on billboards throughout the area and on local TV.


He runs the third largest disability practice in the country out of the Eric C. Conn Law Center which is just off Route 23 in Stanville, Ky. It's a complex of several doublewides welded together with an imposing replica of the Lincoln Memorial in the parking lot. Surprisingly, it has only one space for the disabled.


Steve Kroft: I mean, it's kinda hard to miss Eric Conn around here, isn't it, with all the billboards and--


Jennifer Griffith: You'd be hard pressed to find somebody who doesn't know who he is in this area.


Steve Kroft: He calls himself Mr. Social Security. And some of his ads say "guaranteed success." How can he make that claim?


Sarah Carver: He backs that up.


Steve Kroft: A slam dunk?


Sarah Carver: Uh-huh (affirm). Pretty much.


Steve Kroft: That's a remarkable record.


Sarah Carver: Yes, it is.


Steve Kroft: Is he that good a lawyer?


Sarah Carver:: You know--


Jennifer Griffith: No. (laugh)


A lot of Conn's success, they say, had to do with a particularly friendly disability judge, David Daugherty, who sought out Conn's cases and approved virtually all 1,823 of them, awarding a half a billion dollars worth of lifetime benefits to Conn's clients. The decisions were based on the recommendations of a loyal group of doctors who often examined Conn's clients right in his law offices and always endorsed them for the disability rolls.


Steve Kroft: Were most of the medical reports submitted by the same doctors?


Jennifer Griffith: Yes.


Sarah Carver: Yes. Sometimes up to 13 to 20 reports a day.


Jennifer Griffith: I know on one, we counted 16 exams by the same doctor
 
Conn didn't want to go into it with Sen. Coburn's investigators either. They've been quietly working on the case for two years, interviewing witnesses and pouring over disability documents. That's why they asked us to protect their identities.


Steve Kroft: What did you find out in West Virginia and Kentucky?


Tom Coburn: Significant fraud.


Steve Kroft: Does the name Eric Conn ring a bell?


Tom Coburn: Uh-huh (affirm). I would tell you, I wouldn't want him for a brother-in-law. And he's got a lot of money. And the American taxpayer paid him that money.


Steve Kroft: Is he breaking the law?


Tom Coburn: That's probably going to be determined by the Department of Justice.


Coburn says the report -- to be released tomorrow -- will show that Conn collected more than $13 million in legal fees from the federal government over the past six years and that he paid five doctors roughly $2 million to regularly sign off on bogus medical forms that had been manufactured and filled out ahead of time by Conn's staff.


Steve Kroft: You think what you found there is just an isolated case?


Tom Coburn: No. I mean, it's-- it may be one of the worst cases. It just shows you how broken it is. You take a good concept that's well meaning. And then you don't manage it, you don't monitor it, you don't over-- Congress doesn't oversight it, and pretty soon, you end up with places like in West Virginia, certain counties, where, you know, you're born to be on disability.


It should be pointed out that no one is getting rich off disability payments of $1,100 a month. It's a minimum wage income with Medicare benefits after two years. But each new case will eventually cost taxpayers, on average, $300,000 in lifetime benefits. For Marilyn Zahm, the disability judge from Buffalo, the high demand for it is a measure of the low prospects that still exist for millions of Americans.


Marilyn Zahm: People run out of unemployment insurance. They are not going to die silently. They are going to look for another source of income. It is not unusual for people, especially people over 40, to have some sort of an ailment or impairment. So they will file for disability benefits based upon that. For many of these people, the plant closed. There are no jobs in their communities. What are people supposed to do?


Steve Kroft (to Coburn): Some of these people are desperate people.


Tom Coburn: Absolutely desperate. I agree. But what you're really describing is our economy and the consequences of it. And we're using a system that wasn't meant for that, because we don't have a system over there to help them. Which means we're not addressing the other concerns in our society. And that's a debate Congress ought to have
 
I do think there are fraudulent claims, and they should be ferreted out.

However, at least here in California, I've known people who truly were disabled - and they had a very hard time getting on disability. So maybe the California program is more rigorous.
 
I did like this quote from Tom Coburn; I just have my doubts that he would be willing to address the problem

Tom Coburn: Absolutely desperate. I agree. But what you're really describing is our economy and the consequences of it. And we're using a system that wasn't meant for that, because we don't have a system over there to help them. Which means we're not addressing the other concerns in our society. And that's a debate Congress ought to have
 
I do think there are fraudulent claims, and they should be ferreted out.

However, at least here in California, I've known people who truly were disabled - and they had a very hard time getting on disability. So maybe the California program is more rigorous.
I don't know. did you see this?

Federal Disability Insurance Program, which could become the first government benefits program to run out of money.
When it began back in the 1950s it was envisioned as a small program to assist people who were unable to work because of illness or injury.


Today, it serves nearly 12 million people -- up 20 percent in the last six years -- and has a budget of $135 billion.
That's more than the government spent last year on the Department of Homeland Security, the Justice Department, and the Labor Department combined
. It's been called a "secret welfare system" with it's own "disability industrial complex," a system ravaged by waste and fraud. A lot of people want to know what's going on. Especially Sen. Tom Coburn of Oklahoma.
I didn't see the whole piece, but it looks like this is being abused, as a bridge between unemployment, and SSA.

I know the economy is still not great, but without Congressional oversight, this is a catch all, and it's going to be a big part of our upcoming entiltlement crisis.

I mean I'm all about compassion, but you need to have vigorouse oversight, to keep the program solvent for the truely needy
 
I don't know. did you see this?

I didn't see the whole piece, but it looks like this is being abused, as a bridge between unemployment, and SSA.

I know the economy is still not great, but without Congressional oversight, this is a catch all, and it's going to be a big part of our upcoming entiltlement crisis.

I mean I'm all about compassion, but you need to have vigorouse oversight, to keep the program solvent for the truely needy

I think that was in the original op. I agree it shouldn't be abused; I agree actually with Coburn that Congress isn't addressing the very real needs in our society - the reasons people are going on disability - lack of jobs, lack of unemployment insurance, too young for Soc Sec. And that since we aren't addressing this big gap, it wouldn't surprise me if disability is getting abused, especially in areas without unemployment insurance and high jobless rates.

I don't think it should get abused; it's too vital a program to those who really need it.

All I am saying is - based on my experience, which I admit is limited - it seems to be pretty tough in California to get on to disability. I've known people who had to fight for several years to get on it; and if they didn't have supportive partners/spouses, they would have been on the streets. I know other people who should be on it who just gave up because the process was so tough (which then leads to them using the ER for health care and other bad outcomes).

I have no quarrel with strict oversight; I just think we might already have it here in California. Maybe Virginia isn't as strict.
 
I don't know. did you see this?

I didn't see the whole piece, but it looks like this is being abused, as a bridge between unemployment, and SSA.

I know the economy is still not great, but without Congressional oversight, this is a catch all, and it's going to be a big part of our upcoming entiltlement crisis.

I mean I'm all about compassion, but you need to have vigorouse oversight, to keep the program solvent for the truely needy

I watched it. They're talking about federal disability not state. And you are correct many are using it as a bridge between their unemployment benefits running out and social security.

They focused on one area on the Kentucky/West Virgina border where the economy is practically propped up by those on disability and one lawyer who is tight with a judge and won basically 100% of his 1,800 or so cases. Pretty outrageous.

They interviewed two women who formerly worked for a law firm that backed patients fighting for disability who said maybe 40% of their clients had legitimate disability claims and the rest were questionable at best.

It's basically desperate people doing anything they can to can to get money. What's going to happen though is the system will go broke and those with legitimate disability claims are going to be the one's getting screwed (along with the tax payers).
 
So a massive Government handout program is subject to massive fraud and we should be surprised by this???

This was a great program which I watched on 60 minutes and Inwas struck by those who seem surprised that the welfare state is pissing away billions of tax payer dollars and that people would find a way to game the system.

Thanks to the malaise representing this Presidents pathetic economic record, is it also a surprise that there has been a massive increase in applications?

When you hand out others money like it is candy, expect people to take advantage and game the system. The Fed should not be in the businesses of handing out money for disability, welfare or healthcare. But the sheeple want their free money and by golly, Democrats willing to pander to brain dead sheeple, are going to get them their goodies to win elections.

The end of the Republic will not come from outside, but from within when the sheeple realize they can vote themselves money.
 
I watched it. They're talking about federal disability not state. And you are correct many are using it as a bridge between their unemployment benefits running out and social security.

They focused on one area on the Kentucky/West Virgina border where the economy is practically propped up by those on disability and one lawyer who is tight with a judge and won basically 100% of his 1,800 or so cases. Pretty outrageous.

They interviewed two women who formerly worked for a law firm that backed patients fighting for disability who said maybe 40% of their clients had legitimate disability claims and the rest were questionable at best.

It's basically desperate people doing anything they can to can to get money. What's going to happen though is the system will go broke and those with legitimate disability claims are going to be the one's getting screwed (along with the tax payers).
thanks, i was scrolling thru the transcripts, seems this was about Coburn, so it's in his area.

Thing is though the explosive growth of the program across the board -did you see the ad at the top of the page?

Lawyers hustling to help you "get" you BDI (Bureau of Disability Insurance).

the entitlements ahve to be addressed.
 
So a massive Government handout program is subject to massive fraud and we should be surprised by this???

This was a great program which I watched on 60 minutes and Inwas struck by those who seem surprised that the welfare state is pissing away billions of tax payer dollars and that people would find a way to game the system.

Thanks to the malaise representing this Presidents pathetic economic record, is it also a surprise that there has been a massive increase in applications?

When you hand out others money like it is candy, expect people to take advantage and game the system. The Fed should not be in the businesses of handing out money for disability, welfare or healthcare. But the sheeple want their free money and by golly, Democrats willing to pander to brain dead sheeple, are going to get them their goodies to win elections.

The end of the Republic will not come from outside, but from within when the sheeple realize they can vote themselves money.

So you think the program should be shut down and leave the poor old and disabled to die on the streets?
 
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