Defeated Zelenskies describe their retreat from Russia.

[Scott]

Some perhaps, but the western mainstream media has neglected to tell most of its audience. I suspect this war will be over before the year is out though, with Russia essentially getting what it's been demanding all this time.

What have they been demanding?

I'll let Professor Jeffrey Sachs, an advisor to 3 U.N. Secretary Generals, answer that one:
**
The draft peace agreement (dated April 15, 2022) and the Istanbul Communique (dated March 29, 2022) on which it was based, offered a sensible and straightforward way to end the conflict. It’s true that three years after Ukraine broke off the negotiations, during which time Ukraine has incurred major losses, Ukraine will eventually cede more territory than it would have in April 2022 — yet it will gain the essentials: sovereignty, international security arrangements, and peace.

In the 2022 negotiations, the agreed issues were Ukraine’s permanent neutrality and international security guarantees for Ukraine. The final disposition of the contested territories was to be decided over time, based on negotiations between the parties, during which both sides committed to refrain from using force to change boundaries. Given the current realities, Ukraine will cede Crimea and parts of southern and eastern Ukraine, reflecting the battlefield outcomes of the past three years.

Such an agreement can be signed almost immediately and in fact is likely to be signed in the coming months.
**
Full article:

Jeffrey Sachs: Negotiating a Lasting Peace in Ukraine

The time has arrived for diplomacy that brings collective security to Europe, Ukraine, and Russia.

scheerpost.com

The above article was published on March 6th, which I believe is when Trump had temporarily ceased supporting Ukraine, but I think he's probably still right.

 

[anonymoose]

I'll let Professor Jeffrey Sachs, an advisor to 3 U.N. Secretary Generals, answer that one:
**
The draft peace agreement (dated April 15, 2022) and the Istanbul Communique (dated March 29, 2022) on which it was based, offered a sensible and straightforward way to end the conflict. It’s true that three years after Ukraine broke off the negotiations, during which time Ukraine has incurred major losses, Ukraine will eventually cede more territory than it would have in April 2022 — yet it will gain the essentials: sovereignty, international security arrangements, and peace.

In the 2022 negotiations, the agreed issues were Ukraine’s permanent neutrality and international security guarantees for Ukraine. The final disposition of the contested territories was to be decided over time, based on negotiations between the parties, during which both sides committed to refrain from using force to change boundaries. Given the current realities, Ukraine will cede Crimea and parts of southern and eastern Ukraine, reflecting the battlefield outcomes of the past three years.

Such an agreement can be signed almost immediately and in fact is likely to be signed in the coming months.
**
Full article:

Jeffrey Sachs: Negotiating a Lasting Peace in Ukraine

The time has arrived for diplomacy that brings collective security to Europe, Ukraine, and Russia.

scheerpost.com

The above article was published on March 6th, which I believe is when Trump had temporarily ceased supporting Ukraine, but I think he's probably still right.

Thanks for the article. Sure looks like the Obama administration, with the help of Senator War Pig himself and Victoria Nuland really dropped the ball in regards to the future of Ukraine .

upload photo

I get that they feel they now deserve Donetsk and Luhansk and Crimea but they want parts of Ukraine that want nothing to do with Russia.

 

[Scott]

Thanks for the article. Sure looks like the Obama administration, with the help of Senator War Pig himself and Victoria Nuland really dropped the ball in regards to the future of Ukraine .

upload photo

I get that they feel they now deserve Donetsk and Luhansk and Crimea but they want parts of Ukraine that want nothing to do with Russia.

Agreed on Nuland, not sure who the Senator you're referring to is. As you can see from your map, Russia currently holds -very- little territory in the 4 oblasts west of the 4 that they've annexed. I strongly suspect that Ukraine may be able to hold on to most if not all of the territory it currently holds in any peace agreement, but the longer it waits to get to the negotiating table, the more likely it is that Russia will take yet more territory.

 

[anonymoose]

Agreed on Nuland, not sure who the Senator you're referring to is.

McCain.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Some perhaps, but the western mainstream media has neglected to tell most of its audience. I suspect this war will be over before the year is out though, with Russia essentially getting what it's been demanding all this time.

My grapevine to include The Duran has reported that just before the CongressCritters approved $70 billion for Ukraine a paper was passed around the Swamp (Written by who I dont remember) stating that the war is lost, there is no way to save it.....it was not one guy saying it....it was a conscious view after extensive study and conversation.

Most if not all in Congress were not told of it.....News of it came out where I travel about 6 months after....it was of course super secret.

 

[Damocles]

What will Moon do when peace breaks out in Ukraine and he can't cheerlead Russian aggression any longer?

 

[Hawkeye10]

What will Moon do when peace breaks out in Ukraine and he can't cheerlead Russian aggression any longer?

We are nowhere near that....the Ukrainians have not suffered enough yet.

 

[Scott]

What will Moon do when peace breaks out in Ukraine and he can't cheerlead Russian aggression any longer?

First, I think that Moon is a woman, but if I'm mistaken, my apologies to Moon. Second, as I've stated many times, it wasn't Russia that started this war, but it's understandable that you'd think so, as it's what the mainstream media has been saying for quite some time now. Time and again, it's been western elites that have been antagonizing Russia. It started with NATO's encroachment eastwards despite assurances to Gorbachev that NATO would expand one inch east of Germany. Professor Jeffrey Sachs, advisor to 3 U.N. Secretary Generals, gets into this in a speech he gave to the European Union that's now been turned into an article. It can be seen here:

Jeffrey Sachs: The Geopolitics of Peace

The author explains manipulative U.S. post-war foreign policy to European MPs, explodes myths about Ukraine and urges an independent European foreign policy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjcMoDFU1xg&ab_channel=MichaelvonderSchulenburg This is an edited transcript of Professor Jeffrey Sachs’

consortiumnews.com

Then there was Euromaidan:

Timeline: Euromaidan, the original “Ukraine Crisis”

As Russia actually do launch an invasion or “special operation” in Ukraine, we thought now was a good time to recap on how we got here. The historical, political and ethnic divisions in…

off-guardian.org

After that, the Ukrainian civil war that lasted for 8 years and finally the Ukrainian military's attack on the Donbass Republics literally days before Russia's military operation. Few people know about that last part, but fortunately, former Swiss Intelligence Officer Jacques Baud revealed this fact shortly after Russia's military operation in Ukraine began. The article where he does this has been translated and can be seen here:

Former NATO Military Analyst Blows the Whistle on West’s Ukraine Invasion Narrative

Jacques Baud, a NATO expert, denounces western coverage of the Ukraine invasion.

scheerpost.com

Despite all of this, Russia had still been willing to cut a very reasonable deal with Ukraine shortly after its military operation began. Zelensky almost took the deal, but western powers persuaded him not to. Professor Jeffrey Sachs gets into this in the article of his that I referenced above as well.

 

[Scott]

What will Moon do when peace breaks out in Ukraine and he can't cheerlead Russian aggression any longer?

We are nowhere near that....the Ukrainians have not suffered enough yet.

I think they have. Unfortunately, the Ukrainian leadership thinks that continuing the war is their best option. Perhaps it is, in the short term. Because when it's all over, I think it's safe to say that the Ukrainian people will boot them out. From what I've read, they'd have already gotten rid of Zelensky if he hadn't cancelled Presidential elections.

 

[Hawkeye10]

I think they have. Unfortunately, the Ukrainian leadership thinks that continuing the war is their best option. Perhaps it is, in the short term. Because when it's all over, I think it's safe to say that the Ukrainian people will boot them out. From what I've read, they'd have already gotten rid of Zelensky if he hadn't cancelled Presidential elections.

Even after the military collapse there will be constant terrorism launched against Russia from the Rump of Ukraine, not just from the Ukrainians but also a large batch of ISIS-K that have been being trained....in Africa I think.

There will be no peace.

 

[Scott]

I think they have. Unfortunately, the Ukrainian leadership thinks that continuing the war is their best option. Perhaps it is, in the short term. Because when it's all over, I think it's safe to say that the Ukrainian people will boot them out. From what I've read, they'd have already gotten rid of Zelensky if he hadn't cancelled Presidential elections.

Even after the military collapse there will be constant terrorism launched against Russia from the Rump of Ukraine, not just from the Ukrainians but also a large batch of ISIS-K that have been being trained....in Africa I think.

There will be no peace.

Well, I guess we'll find out.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Well, I guess we'll find out.

1.2-1.5 million Ukrainians are dead....it is America's fault....but the NAZI's blame the Russians who they call orcs......the killing will not stop.

 

[moon]

What will Moon do when peace breaks out in Ukraine and he can't cheerlead Russian aggression any longer?

The US, all post-war administrations, have created a Russian ' monster ' in order to keep Americans toeing the line and slaving to feed the military/industrial complex. You're a NATO fan-boy, you own this conflict, not I.

 

[Damocles]

The US, all post-war administrations, have created a Russian ' monster ' in order to keep Americans toeing the line and slaving to feed the military/industrial complex. You're a NATO fan-boy, you own this conflict, not I.

lol. Stuff like this makes me laugh. One guy says I'm a Russian empathizer, then you...

What I am is for peace. Russian aggression needs to end.

 

[Scott]

The US, all post-war administrations, have created a Russian ' monster ' in order to keep Americans toeing the line and slaving to feed the military/industrial complex. You're a NATO fan-boy, you own this conflict, not I.

lol. Stuff like this makes me laugh. One guy says I'm a Russian empathizer, then you...

What I am is for peace. Russian aggression needs to end.

You can be for peace and still be gravely mistaken on the causes of the Ukraine war. As you may know, I provided a lot of information in response to another of your posts here in post #28 in this thread.

 

[Jarod]

Volodymyr: 'Drones around the clock'
On 9 March, "Volodymyr" sent a Telegram post to the BBC saying he was still in Sudzha, where there was "panic and collapse of the front".

Ukrainian troops "are trying to leave - columns of troops and equipment. Some of them are burned by Russian drones on the road. It is impossible to leave during the day."

Movement of men, logistics and equipment had been reliant on one major route between Sudzha and Ukraine's Sumy region.

Volodymyr said it was possible to travel on that road relatively safely a month ago. By 9 March it was "all under the fire control of the enemy - drones around the clock. In one minute you can see two to three drones. That's a lot," he said.

"We have all the logistics here on one Sudzha-Sumy highway. And everyone knew that the [Russians] would try to cut it. But this again came as a surprise to our command."

At the time of writing, just before Russia retook Sudzha, Volodymyr said Ukrainian forces were being pressed from three sides.

Retreat from Kursk: Ukrainian troops tell of catastrophe and panic

Five soldiers tell the BBC of their withdrawal in the face of overwhelming firepower and drones.

www.bbc.co.uk

Defeated France agreed to Hitler taking over.

 

[Jarod]

lol. Stuff like this makes me laugh. One guy says I'm a Russian empathizer, then you...

What I am is for peace. Russian aggression needs to end.

Peace at what cost?