Democrats hate tanks at the National Mall but they loved them at Waco

[Jack]

Conservatives do not support fascism. Fascism is a form of socialism.

I don't subscribe to that.

"Fascism is a form of radical right-wing, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy which came to prominence in early 20th-century Europe. Wikipedia"

'Authoritarianism' and 'forcible suppression of opposition' is what I fear. Using a Goon Squad to kill Americans isn't MY America.

[Into the Night]

I don't subscribe to that.

"Fascism is a form of radical right-wing, authoritarian ultranationalism characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition and strong regimentation of society and of the economy which came to prominence in early 20th-century Europe. Wikipedia"

'Authoritarianism' and 'forcible suppression of opposition' is what I fear. Using a Goon Squad to kill Americans isn't MY America.

Wikipedia is not a valid source. You can't use it as a reference with me. It is biased, its articles are often badly written or incomplete, or even outright wrong. All references to Wikipedia are summarily dismissed.

Fascism is a form of socialism. Communism is the other. Both economic systems are from the teachings of Karl Marx. Fascism is on the road to communism. Both are described in the Communist Manifesto. Like all forms of socialism, it can only exist by stealing wealth. Thus, it can only exist under dictatorships or oligarchies. The word was originally coined by Mussolini to describe his version of socialist Italy. Hitler picked up on the term and also used it to describe his version of socialist Germany, creating the NAZI party, or the National Socialist German Worker's Party.

The idea that fascism is a hard right wing concept is a lie perpetuated by liberals in an effort to distance themselves from what many of them are.

[Jack]

Night: "Wikipedia is not a valid source. You can't use it as a reference with me. It is biased, its articles are often badly written or incomplete, or even outright wrong. All references to Wikipedia are summarily dismissed."
Jack: One of the first things to having a meaningful conversation is to agree upon the meaning of 'words'. Without that, you might as well be talking in foreign languages to each other.

Night: "Fascism is a form of socialism. Communism is the other. Both economic systems are from the teachings of Karl Marx. Fascism is on the road to communism. Both are described in the Communist Manifesto. Like all forms of socialism, it can only exist by stealing wealth. Thus, it can only exist under dictatorships or oligarchies. The word was originally coined by Mussolini to describe his version of socialist Italy. Hitler picked up on the term and also used it to describe his version of socialist Germany, creating the NAZI party, or the National Socialist German Worker's Party.'
Jack: Do you agree that the Public School System is a socialist idea and practice? State School Buildings. State paid Teachers. Free to every child. Paid for by everyone.

Night: "The idea that fascism is a hard right wing concept is a lie perpetuated by liberals in an effort to distance themselves from what many of them are."
Jack: I believe there are 'Blue Team' fascists. The Book Burners that want to eliminate the word 'nigger' from literature and Movies. The PC Cultural Police that want to tear down Statues honoring the dead in Confederate Cemeteries, etc.

Wikipedia is not a valid source. You can't use it as a reference with me. It is biased, its articles are often badly written or incomplete, or even outright wrong. All references to Wikipedia are summarily dismissed.

Fascism is a form of socialism. Communism is the other. Both economic systems are from the teachings of Karl Marx. Fascism is on the road to communism. Both are described in the Communist Manifesto. Like all forms of socialism, it can only exist by stealing wealth. Thus, it can only exist under dictatorships or oligarchies. The word was originally coined by Mussolini to describe his version of socialist Italy. Hitler picked up on the term and also used it to describe his version of socialist Germany, creating the NAZI party, or the National Socialist German Worker's Party.

The idea that fascism is a hard right wing concept is a lie perpetuated by liberals in an effort to distance themselves from what many of them are.

[Gonzomin]

Fascism is a right-wing philosophy that desires extreme power at the top with Corporations and the military as active participants. It controls the press and has power over the judiciary. In short, Trump's blueprint. There is nothing lefty in it. It eats the people.

[Taichiliberal]

Originally Posted by Taichiliberal
Eisenhower: right after winning WWII, no surprise there.
Kennedy: the Cold War, no surprise there.
1939: Again, WWII, the beginning...no surprise there.

Now to be fair, the 4th celebrations has always had a military tinge to them, but that was in the background since the end of the COLD WAR. What the Orange Oaf is doing is just exploiting that to back HIS "MAGA" BS....forget that FACT that since the end of the Cold War (and maybe even before), America does not pull the parades similar to the old Soviet Union or current China or North Korea.

As the saying goes, "Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel".

What about the chronology of the posts?

What about them? They don't change the accuracy of the previous post, now does it.

[Taichiliberal]

I have something for our Blue Team Fascists supporters.

"The 1993 Waco siege is often categorized as one of the more violent, militaristic, domestic actions by U.S. law enforcement in recent memory. And it should be. At the Branch Davidian’s “compound” a fatal combination of government arrogance, fear, impatience, and aggression lead to 76 bodies, including 20 children."

^OK. That's the white people. ^

Here's some black people --->"A less bloody confrontation took place in Philadelphia on May 13, 1985 — but the relatively low body count in the MOVE standoff (11 people, including 5 children) was no thanks to law enforcement. MOVE were a group of black activists who were anti-technology and government, pro-environmentalist, and who had a history of confrontations with law enforcement. Their neighbors had complained the group was loud and messy and aggressive. On May 13, attempts to evict MOVE and serve arrest warrants for four of the members led to an armed standoff. And when law enforcement grew too impatient to wait out the group, they simply dropped a C4/Tovex bomb on the house — ostensibly to dislodge a wooden structure on the roof — which turned into a fire that spread unchecked and took out 60-some homes, the entire block."
"Like Waco, this standoff with so-called radicals involved disputed who-fired-first exchanges of gunfire; it also involved members being jailed, while government and law enforcement officials got — at best — a stern talking-to. By 1999, when law enforcement finally admitted they had used incendiary devices at Waco, many people felt that the standoff had been a disaster. But nobody in the ATF, FBI, or Department of Justice was ever charged. And nine surviving Branch Davidians went to jail, one for 15 years."

"There are more parallels with Waco: accusations that the MOVE members set a fire themselves, counter-accusations that police held firefighters back (this was definitely true at Waco and MOVE both)."
https://www.antiwar.com/blog/2013/05...-a-city-block/

OK. Any Blue Team Cheerleaders on this one?

Okay, it took over a month before the final shoot out....why didn't Koresh let people go, especially after the fire started? How did one flash bang start a raging fire in separate parts of the enclosure? Why are you ignoring all the relatives and ex-members and the PI pointing out how people were not allowed to leave, that Koresh and acolytes were armed, or the accusations of statutory rape? Or that Koresh was a prime suspect in a murder of a police officer?

Why are defending this, and what the hell does this half to do with Trump exploiting the 4th with exaggerated military might at a celebration?

[Taichiliberal]

The Cover Up.

"Roland Ballesteros, one of the agents assigned to the ATF door team that assaulted the front door, told Texas Rangers and Waco police that he thought the first shots came from the ATF dog team assigned to neutralize the Branch Davidians' dogs, but later at the trial he insisted that the Branch Davidians had shot first.[85] The Branch Davidians claimed that the ATF door team then opened fire at the door, and they returned fire in self-defense. An Austin Chronicle article noted, "Long before the fire, the Davidians were discussing the evidence contained in the doors. During the siege, in a phone conversation with the FBI, Steve Schneider, one of Koresh's main confidants, told FBI agents that 'the evidence from the front door will clearly show how many bullets and what happened'."[86] Houston attorney Dick DeGuerin, who went inside Mount Carmel during the siege, testified at the trial that protruding metal on the inside of the right-hand entry door made it clear that the bullet holes were made by incoming rounds. DeGuerin also testified that only the right-hand entry door had bullet holes, while the left-hand entry door was intact. The government presented the left-hand entry door at the trial, claiming that the right-hand entry door had been lost. The left-hand door contained numerous bullet holes made by both outgoing and incoming rounds. Texas Trooper Sgt. David Keys testified that he witnessed two men loading what could have been the missing door into a U-Haul van shortly after the siege had ended, but he did not see the object itself.[86] Michael Caddell, the lead attorney for the Branch Davidians' wrongful death lawsuit explained, "The fact that the left-hand door is in the condition it's in tells you that the right-hand door was not consumed by the fire. It was lost on purpose by somebody." Caddell offered no evidence to support this allegation, which has never been proved. However, fire investigators stated that it was "extremely unlikely" that the steel right door could have suffered damage in the fire much greater than did the steel left door, and both doors would have been found together. The right door remains missing, and the entire site was under close supervision by law enforcement officials until the debris—including both doors—had been removed.[86]"

Source please?

[Jack]

Okay, it took over a month before the final shoot out....why didn't Koresh let people go, especially after the fire started? How did one flash bang start a raging fire in separate parts of the enclosure? Why are you ignoring all the relatives and ex-members and the PI pointing out how people were not allowed to leave, that Koresh and acolytes were armed, or the accusations of statutory rape? Or that Koresh was a prime suspect in a murder of a police officer?

Why are defending this, and what the hell does this half to do with Trump exploiting the 4th with exaggerated military might at a celebration?

I believe the charge against Koresh and the Davidians was a 'gun charge'. One of their members was a licensed Gun Dealer, they sold guns at Gun Shows. The ATF could have served a Warrant by knocking on the door and handing him a Subpoena to show up in Court, or they could have arrested him in Town or when he jogged on Double E Road. The ATF put on a Big Production, because as it turned out, they were asking Congress for MORE money for the ATF.

I have no idea what you are talking about with "Koresh was a prime suspect in a murder of a police officer". Is this something you just made up, or is this something you got off the same site that 'Hillary was running a child sex ring out of a Pizza Shop'?

My view on Trump and the 4th, ... he was all jazzed about Macron and the French with THEIR Military Display. I don't know anything about 'the Communists, Socialists, or Dictators' you mentioned.

[Taichiliberal]

I believe the charge against Koresh and the Davidians was a 'gun charge'. One of their members was a licensed Gun Dealer, they sold guns at Gun Shows. The ATF could have served a Warrant by knocking on the door and handing him a Subpoena to show up in Court, or they could have arrested him in Town or when he jogged on Double E Road. The ATF put on a Big Production, because as it turned out, they were asking Congress for MORE money for the ATF.

I have no idea what you are talking about with "Koresh was a prime suspect in a murder of a police officer". Is this something you just made up, or is this something you got off the same site that 'Hillary was running a child sex ring out of a Pizza Shop'?

My view on Trump and the 4th, ... he was all jazzed about Macron and the French with THEIR Military Display. I don't know anything about 'the Communists, Socialists, or Dictators' you mentioned.

Seems what you don't know is a common thread in your posts. Here's a primer: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/waco-te...s-deliveryman/

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/cont...ry?id=40373481

[Jack]

Is any of your link suppose to back up your claim:
"I have no idea what you are talking about with "Koresh was a prime suspect in a murder of a police officer". Is this something you just made up, or is this something you got off the same site that 'Hillary was running a child sex ring out of a Pizza Shop'? "

Seems what you don't know is a common thread in your posts. Here's a primer: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/waco-te...s-deliveryman/

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/cont...ry?id=40373481

[Into the Night]

Fascism is a right-wing philosophy that desires extreme power at the top with Corporations and the military as active participants. It controls the press and has power over the judiciary. In short, Trump's blueprint. There is nothing lefty in it. It eats the people.

No. Fascism is a form of socialism. It is against corporations. It is the government telling a corporation how to operate, without actually owning the corporation. It is the government that controls the press, because fascism can only be implemented by oligarchy or dictatorship. Trump is not a fascist. He is a conservative. Socialism is liberalism.

[Into the Night]

Okay, it took over a month before the final shoot out...

Well at least you finally admit that.

.why didn't Koresh let people go,

They weren't prisoners.

especially after the fire started?

They killed themselves rather than submit to the federal agents outside.

How did one flash bang start a raging fire in separate parts of the enclosure?

There was more than one.

Why are you ignoring all the relatives and ex-members and the PI pointing out how people were not allowed to leave,

They were. As you say, there are ex-members.

that Koresh and acolytes were armed,

Which is their right.

or the accusations of statutory rape?

If they want to make such an accusation, they could've arrested him while he was isolated. They didn't have to kill all those people in the camp.

Or that Koresh was a prime suspect in a murder of a police officer?

So this justifies killing women and children???

Why are defending this, and what the hell does this half to do with Trump exploiting the 4th with exaggerated military might at a celebration?

Try reading the title of this thread for your answer. Stop shouting.

[Into the Night]

Seems what you don't know is a common thread in your posts. Here's a primer: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/waco-te...s-deliveryman/

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/cont...ry?id=40373481

ABC and CBS are not valid references. Discarded.

[Taichiliberal]

Is any of your link suppose to back up your claim:
"I have no idea what you are talking about with "Koresh was a prime suspect in a murder of a police officer". Is this something you just made up, or is this something you got off the same site that 'Hillary was running a child sex ring out of a Pizza Shop'? "

Nope, a bad rumor and reporting at the time. Here's your boy's history https://www.crimetraveller.org/2016/...nch-davidians/

Why are defending this POS, and what the hell does this half to do with Trump exploiting the 4th with exaggerated military might at a celebration?

[Jack]

Nope, a bad rumor and reporting at the time. Here's your boy's history https://www.crimetraveller.org/2016/...nch-davidians/

Why are defending this POS, and what the hell does this half to do with Trump exploiting the 4th with exaggerated military might at a celebration?

Taichi: "Why are defending this POS"
Jack: I'm criticizing the tactics of the Government.

Taichi, let's say there were a bunch of Orthodox Jews held up in a Compound, and they had their Rabbis bite off the tips of baby penises or some other child abuse. They had a bunch of guns because they thought that Moses told them this was the New Jerusalem and the Government might raid them.
Naturally, in THIS case, using 75 Stormtroopers and Panzer Tanks would be TOTALLY justified. And burning them all to death, even the babies, would be the only right thing to do.

--->see where I'm going here?<---

You support a Fascist Government ...
... and I don't.

Taichi: " ...this half to do with Trump exploiting the 4th with exaggerated military might at a celebration?"
Jack: I've answered this before. IMO, Trump liked the French Military display put on by Macron, and wanted to copy it here.

I'll let you keep regurgitating your stunning disbelief. I've stated MY (Jack) opinion on the matter.