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Thread: The Swiss Difference: A Gun Culture That Works

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    Lightbulb The Swiss Difference: A Gun Culture That Works

    Even as the gun-control debate rises again in the U.S. in the aftermath of the horrific school shooting in Newtown, Conn., the gun-loving Swiss are not about to lay down their arms. Guns are ubiquitous in this neutral nation, with sharpshooting considered a fun and wholesome recreational activity for people of all ages.

    Even though Switzerland has not been involved in an armed conflict since a standoff between Catholics and Protestants in 1847, the Swiss are very serious not only about their right to own weapons but also to carry them around in public. Because of this general acceptance and even pride in gun ownership, nobody bats an eye at the sight of a civilian riding a bus, bike or motorcycle to the shooting range, with a rifle slung across the shoulder.

    “We will never change our attitude about the responsible use of weapons by law-abiding citizens,” says Hermann Suter, vice president of Pro-Tell, the country’s gun lobby, named after legendary apple shooter William Tell, who used a crossbow to target enemies long before firearms were invented.

    Switzerland trails behind only the U.S, Yemen and Serbia in the number of guns per capita; between 2.3 million and 4.5 million military and private firearms are estimated to be in circulation in a country of only 8 million people. Yet, despite the prevalence of guns, the violent-crime rate is low: government figures show about 0.5 gun homicides per 100,000 inhabitants in 2010. By comparison, the U.S rate in the same year was about 5 firearm killings per 100,000 people, according to a 2011 U.N. report.

    Unlike some other heavily armed nations, Switzerland’s gun ownership is deeply rooted in a sense of patriotic duty and national identity. Weapons are kept at home because of the long-held belief that enemies could invade tiny Switzerland quickly, so every soldier had to be able to fight his way to his regiment’s assembly point. (Switzerland was at risk of being invaded by Germany during World War II but was spared, historians say, because every Swiss man was armed and trained to shoot.)

    But the “gun in every closet” tradition was challenged in 2001, after a disgruntled citizen opened fire with his army rifle inside a regional parliament, killing 14 and injuring 14 others — the only mass shooting in Switzerland’s recent history. The subsequent opposition to widespread gun ownership spearheaded a push for stricter arms legislation. The government and pro-gun groups argued, however, that the country’s existing laws regulating the sale, ownership and licensing of private guns, which includes a ban on carrying concealed weapons, are stringent enough. The law allows citizens or legal residents over the age of 18, who have obtained a permit from the government and who have no criminal record or history of mental illness, to buy up to three weapons from an authorized dealer, with the exception of automatic firearms and selective fire weapons, which are banned. Semiautomatics, which have caused havoc in the U.S., can be legally purchased.

    The authorities made one concession, though: since 2008, all military — but not private — ammunition must be stored in central arsenals rather than in soldiers’ homes. The debate culminated in a nationwide referendum last year, when 56% of voters rejected the proposal initiated by anti-gun organizations to ban army rifles from homes altogether.

    Although guns are responsible for between 200 and 300 suicides each year in Switzerland, Pro-Tell’s Suter says these statistics have to be put in a wider perspective. He points out that the bullets used in suicides are only a tiny fraction of the 75 million rounds of ammunition that are fired each year in Switzerland during military and civilian target practice.

    One of the reasons the crime rate in Switzerland is low despite the prevalence of weapons — and also why the Swiss mentality can’t be transposed to the current American reality — is the culture of responsibility and safety that is anchored in society and passed from generation to generation. Kids as young as 12 belong to gun groups in their local communities, where they learn sharpshooting. The Swiss Shooting Sports Association runs about 3,000 clubs and has 150,000 members, including a youth section. Many members keep their guns and ammunition at home, while others choose to leave them at the club. And yet, despite such easy access to pistols and rifles, “no members have ever used their guns for criminal purposes,” says Max Flueckiger, the association’s spokesperson.

    Social conditions are fundamental in deterring crime,” says Peter Squires, professor of criminology and public policy at the University of Brighton in Great Britain, who has studied gun violence in different countries and concluded that a “culture of support” rather than focus on individualism, can deter mass killings.

    “If people have a responsible, disciplined and organized introduction into an activity like shooting, there will be less risk of gun violence,” he tells TIME.

    That sense of social and civic responsibility is one of the reasons the Swiss have never allowed their guns to come under fire.
    http://world.time.com/2012/12/20/the...re-that-works/

    Imagine that. A nation with overwhelming gun ownership with no significant problem of mass shootings or much violent crime at all. Clearly, it's not the guns.

    American gun culture is fucked. Gun control is doing, and will continue to do, no good. Maybe it's time for us to take a look at the Swiss model...
    “I was not born to be forced. I will breathe after my own fashion. Let us see who is the strongest.” - Henry David Thoreau


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    Quote Originally Posted by TrippyHippy View Post
    http://world.time.com/2012/12/20/the...re-that-works/

    Imagine that. A nation with overwhelming gun ownership with no significant problem of mass shootings or much violent crime at all. Clearly, it's not the guns.

    American gun culture is fucked. Gun control is doing, and will continue to do, no good. Maybe it's time for us to take a look at the Swiss model...
    I have been to Switzerland several times and even backpacked around it many moons ago, but had never seen a gun on open display. They have tightened up the law after several gun incidents including one where 14 people were killed back in 2001.

    Leibacher, who had a grudge against the officials of the Zug parliament, shot dead 14 people and injured 18 others before turning the gun on himself.]

    "All that noise..." says Anne hesitantly with her eyes closed. "And yet so much quiet too, as people hid or pretended to be dead. I remember a silence, and his swearing…and just the noise of his boots pacing around the room."

    Anne Ithen was shot three times, in the spine, the thigh and the abdomen.

    In 2006, the champion Swiss skier Corrinne Rey-Bellet and her brother were murdered by Corinne's estranged husband, who shot them with his old militia rifle before killing himself.

    Since that incident, gun laws concerning army weapons have tightened. Although it is still possible for a former soldier to buy his firearm after he finishes military service, he must provide a justification for keeping the weapon and apply for a permit.
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21379912

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    Last edited by cancel2 2022; 02-18-2018 at 02:47 AM.

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    " A nation with overwhelming gun ownership " TH #1
    I'm not sure it's a distinction worth making, and I do not know the exact details of the law as applied in Switzerland.

    BUT !!

    "Ownership" may not be the most accurate term.

    a) Are there significantly more firearms per capita in Switzerland than there are on other countries?
    Or is it merely that Switzerland has fewer (or more disbursed) armories?

    b) I suspect the firearms at issue are not technically owned, but merely possessed, in this rare case.
    I imagine they're "issued", signed for by the individual recipient, and tracked by serial number.

    If they were owned, when obsolete & replaced, they might end up for sale by individuals.

    But though I'm guessing wildly, I suspect the government controls the ownership, and simply lends (issues) them.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sear View Post
    I'm not sure it's a distinction worth making, and I do not know the exact details of the law as applied in Switzerland.

    BUT !!

    "Ownership" may not be the most accurate term.

    a) Are there significantly more firearms per capita in Switzerland than there are on other countries?
    Or is it merely that Switzerland has fewer (or more disbursed) armories?

    b) I suspect the firearms at issue are not technically owned, but merely possessed, in this rare case.
    I imagine they're "issued", signed for by the individual recipient, and tracked by serial number.

    If they were owned, when obsolete & replaced, they might end up for sale by individuals.

    But though I'm guessing wildly, I suspect the government controls the ownership, and simply lends (issues) them.
    Man you're an idiot, if you had read post 2 then you've have answered your question!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-21379912

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    Quote Originally Posted by TrippyHippy View Post
    http://world.time.com/2012/12/20/the...re-that-works/

    Imagine that. A nation with overwhelming gun ownership with no significant problem of mass shootings or much violent crime at all. Clearly, it's not the guns.

    American gun culture is fucked. Gun control is doing, and will continue to do, no good. Maybe it's time for us to take a look at the Swiss model...
    Clearly, the Swiss have a different culture than we do.

    They also don’t have as many large cities with gangs in them and etc. So if we adopted their cultural norms with guns it wouldn’t be a panacea.

    Ironically, it’s fear of guns that’s contributing to the problem with mass shootings here. ‘Gun free zones’ have become the punchline to a joke in this country because of the tendency of mass shooters to gravitate towards them.

    These people are insane but not illogical.

    The quickest route to cutting down on school shootings is to place armed people on the campus. Either allow teachers to be armed or hire someone to do it. Then make it clear that the campus is NOT A GUN FREE ZONE.

    There’s no rational basis to fear being shot in a mass shooting [statistically], but if one has such a fear I would recommend avoiding gun free zones lol. Or, I’ll guarantee this happens, break the law yourself and carry a weapon for protection when you go there.

    But it would require enough people to get over the fear of guns before making schools ‘non-gun free zones’ would pass in most communities in this country.
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