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Thread: Simple solutions to school shootings

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    Quote Originally Posted by USFREEDOM911 View Post
    You saying, is not proof.
    I am not saying it, Louis Klarevas in his book Rampage Nation is saying it.

    For his 2016 book “Rampage Nation,” Klarevas collected data on every gun massacre — which he defines as six or more people shot and killed — for the 50 years before 2016. His aim was to see whether there was any change in the number of gun massacres while the 10-year federal ban on assault weapons was in place.
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...e-experts-say/




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    Barring the fact that once again the FBI in Florida was tipped off to this shooter weeks in advance and didn't feel the need to do anything about it here are some facts about gun deaths and how they relate to other types of deaths in the United States that might give some perspective to this issue as it relates to the country.


    There are 30,000 gun related deaths per year by firearms, and this number is not disputed. The U.S. population is 324,059,091 as of June 22, 2016. Do the math: 0.0009% of the population dies from gun related actions each year. Statistically speaking, this is insignificant! What is never told, however, is a breakdown of those 30,000 deaths, to put them in perspective as compared to other causes of death:
    • 65% of those deaths are by suicide, which would never be prevented by gun laws.
    • 15% are by law enforcement in the line of duty and justified.
    • 17% are through criminal activity, gang and drug related or mentally ill persons – better known as gun violence.
    • 3% are accidental discharge deaths.
    So technically, "gun violence" is not 30,000 annually, but drops to 5,100. Still too many? Now lets look at how those deaths spanned across the nation.... Now we could even get more detailed and break it down by type of gun in which case you'll find just hundreds of deaths from assault rifles and almost all the other deaths from pistols.. and of course I won't bore you with the statistics of how many people are bludgeoned to death and stabbed to death because they in turn exceed the number of gun deaths as well...
    • 480 homicides (9.4%) were in Chicago
    • 344 homicides (6.7%) were in Baltimore
    • 333 homicides (6.5%) were in Detroit
    • 119 homicides (2.3%) were in Washington D.C. (a 54% increase over prior years)


    So basically, 25% of all gun crime happens in just 4 cities. All 4 of those cities have strict gun laws, so it is not the lack of law that is the root cause.
    This basically leaves 3,825 for the entire rest of the nation, or about 75 deaths per state. That is an average because some States have much higher rates than others. For example, California had 1,169 and Alabama had 1.
    Now, who has the strictest gun laws by far? California, of course, but understand, it is not guns causing this. It is a crime rate spawned by the number of criminal persons residing in those cities and states. So if all cities and states are not created equal, then there must be something other than the tool causing the gun deaths.


    Are 5,100 deaths per year horrific? How about in comparison to other deaths? All death is sad and especially so when it is in the commission of a crime and or senseless but that is the nature of things. Robbery, death, rape, assault are all done by criminals. It is ludicrous to think that criminals will obey laws. Hell we can't even keep drugs out of federal prisons...


    But what about other deaths each year?
    • 40,000+ die from a drug overdose! That number will be over 50,000 this year...
    • 36,000 people die per year from the flu, far exceeding the criminal gun deaths.
    • 34,000 people die per year in traffic fatalities(exceeding gun deaths even if you include suicide).
    Now it gets good:
    • 200,000+ people die each year (and growing) from preventable medical errors. You are safer walking in the worst areas of Chicago than you are when you are in a hospital!
    • 710,000 people die per year from heart disease.


    If Congress focused their attention on heart disease, even a 10% decrease in cardiac deaths would save twice the number of lives annually of all gun-related deaths (including suicide, law enforcement, etc.). A 10% reduction in medical errors would be 66% of the total number of gun deaths or 4 times the number of criminal homicides ................ Simple, easily preventable 10% reductions!


    And in all fairness I'm not a statistician or researcher and these are rough approximations so they're going to be inaccurate to some degree but the fact of the matter is is guns are not even on the top 10 list of problems we need to tackle in this country...


    Gun control = Jedi mind fuck... "Move Along these aren't the droids you're looking for..." by Frank Rowley.
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    Quote Originally Posted by J Craft View Post
    Barring the fact that once again the FBI in Florida was tipped off to this shooter weeks in advance and didn't feel the need to do anything about it here are some facts about gun deaths and how they relate to other types of deaths in the United States that might give some perspective to this issue as it relates to the country.


    There are 30,000 gun related deaths per year by firearms, and this number is not disputed. The U.S. population is 324,059,091 as of June 22, 2016. Do the math: 0.0009% of the population dies from gun related actions each year. Statistically speaking, this is insignificant! What is never told, however, is a breakdown of those 30,000 deaths, to put them in perspective as compared to other causes of death:
    • 65% of those deaths are by suicide, which would never be prevented by gun laws.
    • 15% are by law enforcement in the line of duty and justified.
    • 17% are through criminal activity, gang and drug related or mentally ill persons – better known as gun violence.
    • 3% are accidental discharge deaths.
    So technically, "gun violence" is not 30,000 annually, but drops to 5,100. Still too many? Now lets look at how those deaths spanned across the nation.... Now we could even get more detailed and break it down by type of gun in which case you'll find just hundreds of deaths from assault rifles and almost all the other deaths from pistols.. and of course I won't bore you with the statistics of how many people are bludgeoned to death and stabbed to death because they in turn exceed the number of gun deaths as well...
    • 480 homicides (9.4%) were in Chicago
    • 344 homicides (6.7%) were in Baltimore
    • 333 homicides (6.5%) were in Detroit
    • 119 homicides (2.3%) were in Washington D.C. (a 54% increase over prior years)


    So basically, 25% of all gun crime happens in just 4 cities. All 4 of those cities have strict gun laws, so it is not the lack of law that is the root cause.
    This basically leaves 3,825 for the entire rest of the nation, or about 75 deaths per state. That is an average because some States have much higher rates than others. For example, California had 1,169 and Alabama had 1.
    Now, who has the strictest gun laws by far? California, of course, but understand, it is not guns causing this. It is a crime rate spawned by the number of criminal persons residing in those cities and states. So if all cities and states are not created equal, then there must be something other than the tool causing the gun deaths.


    Are 5,100 deaths per year horrific? How about in comparison to other deaths? All death is sad and especially so when it is in the commission of a crime and or senseless but that is the nature of things. Robbery, death, rape, assault are all done by criminals. It is ludicrous to think that criminals will obey laws. Hell we can't even keep drugs out of federal prisons...


    But what about other deaths each year?
    • 40,000+ die from a drug overdose! That number will be over 50,000 this year...
    • 36,000 people die per year from the flu, far exceeding the criminal gun deaths.
    • 34,000 people die per year in traffic fatalities(exceeding gun deaths even if you include suicide).
    Now it gets good:
    • 200,000+ people die each year (and growing) from preventable medical errors. You are safer walking in the worst areas of Chicago than you are when you are in a hospital!
    • 710,000 people die per year from heart disease.


    If Congress focused their attention on heart disease, even a 10% decrease in cardiac deaths would save twice the number of lives annually of all gun-related deaths (including suicide, law enforcement, etc.). A 10% reduction in medical errors would be 66% of the total number of gun deaths or 4 times the number of criminal homicides ................ Simple, easily preventable 10% reductions!


    And in all fairness I'm not a statistician or researcher and these are rough approximations so they're going to be inaccurate to some degree but the fact of the matter is is guns are not even on the top 10 list of problems we need to tackle in this country...


    Gun control = Jedi mind fuck... "Move Along these aren't the droids you're looking for..." by Frank Rowley.
    Can you just explain to me why anyone needs magazines that can hold 30, 60 or even 100 rounds? That study I quoted found the biggest reason for the fall in mass shootings was down to the banning of high-capacity magazines.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Taichiliberal View Post
    Okay, listen up NRA flunkies and republican/conservative wonks. To prevent shootings like what recently happened in Florida, you do the following:

    1. Reinstate the Assault Weapons Ban. Had this been in place, Cruz would NOT have had an AR-15 in his possession.

    2. Treat ALL weapons like an automobile. This means that they have to be licensed and registered, and the owner has to pass a written and physical competency test. This will severely cut down on the trafficking of illegal gun sales and greatly assist in the tracking of guns used in a crime.

    Got that?
    You certainly do put the "simple" in "simple solutions to school shootings". Maybe you should stick to video games, or, reality shows and the like.

    Every life matters

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havana Moon View Post
    Can you just explain to me why anyone needs magazines that can hold 30, 60 or even 100 rounds? That study I quoted found the biggest reason for the fall in mass shootings was down to the banning of high-capacity magazines.

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    I can explain it. It's none of your business why a law abiding citizen "needs" or wants something. Maybe you could explain why law abiding citizens should be punished for the actions of criminals.
    Every life matters

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    Quote Originally Posted by countryboy View Post
    You certainly do put the "simple" in "simple solutions to school shootings". Maybe you should stick to video games, or, reality shows and the like.

    You should read this, maybe it will convince you otherwise?

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...e-experts-say/

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    What about making schools safe from guns any kind, everyone goes through a metal detectors and security
    officers, coming and going but that's to easy and it doesn't take the guns away from law abiding citizens does it, gun grabbers

    law abiding citizens will never agree to gun control because it will never end after one law is instituted then the gun grabbers will be after getting another law on and on and on. Then when no law abiding citizens has any guns, to protect his family, except the bad guys then the bad guys will know, no one has guns in their homes and guess what crime will leave the streets and come into all our homes, so then what..

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havana Moon View Post
    You should read this, maybe it will convince you otherwise?

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...e-experts-say/

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    I don't have a subscription to the Washington comPost, nor will I ever.
    Every life matters

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    Quote Originally Posted by countryboy View Post
    I don't have a subscription to the Washington comPost, nor will I ever.
    So read this instead!

    https://www.justplainpolitics.com/sh....php?p=2226344

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havana Moon View Post
    Can you just explain to me why anyone needs magazines that can hold 30, 60 or even 100 rounds? That study I quoted found the biggest reason for the fall in mass shootings was down to the banning of high-capacity magazines.

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    Yes, it’s called sport shooting. It’s a blast. That said, it’s also a right to own guns for self defense. I know that most people roll their eyes at the possibility of our government becoming like Germany’s Hitler ever again. But come on it happens in many countries- in our back yard we have Venezuela’s most recent police action against an U.N.-armed populace.

    All across Europe, I believe we will see a rise in armed terrorist actions against an unarmed populace.

    The “we need more gun laws” is a red herring. I agree with you that we need are updated databases that track all guns, legal and illegal. A requirement to report and destroy illegal guns when they are found, or a way to lawfully track and recycle them through legitimate gun dealers.

    We also need our top law enforcement agencies to get their heads into their jobs and take action. Disarming law abiding citizens should never be allowed.
    Last edited by J Craft; 02-18-2018 at 06:39 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by countryboy View Post
    I can explain it. It's none of your business why a law abiding citizen "needs" or wants something. Maybe you could explain why law abiding citizens should be punished for the actions of criminals.
    Fascinating, so if a law abiding citizen wanted some Sarin nerve gas that nobody's business, amirite?

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    Quote Originally Posted by J Craft View Post
    Yes, it’s called sport shooting. It’s a blast. That said, it’s also a right to own guns for self defense. I know that most people roll their eyes at the product of our government not becoming like Germany’s Hitler ever again. But come on it happens in many countries- in our back yard we have Venezuela’s most recent police action against an U.N.-armed populace.

    All across Europe, I believe we will see a rise in armed terrorist actions against an unarmed populace.

    The “we need more gun laws” is a red herring. I agree with you that we need are updated databases that track all guns, legal and illegal. A requirement to report and destroy illegal guns when they are found, or a way to lawfully track and recycle them through legitimate gun dealers.

    We also need our top law enforcement agencies to get their heads into their jobs and take action. Disarming law abiding citizens should never be allowed.
    Nobody needs a 100 round magazine for self-defence unless they live in a warzone.

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    Yep

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    Quote Originally Posted by Havana Moon View Post
    Nobody needs a 100 round magazine for self-defence unless they live in a warzone.

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    Like Poland, France, the Czech Republic, and Greece during the last World War? Or Venezuela now? How about Iraq, or Syria? We are currently suffering a political attempt from our own Justice department and other appointed minions to unseat a duly elected president. Our Constitution was written by men who had suffered the oppression of a civilized government-

    but I digress, magazine capacity was not the problem- killers, this latest one being no different, will use whatever would avail their ability to cause mass deaths, this killer, it is now known, had plans to build a bomb.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havana Moon View Post
    So read this instead!

    https://www.justplainpolitics.com/sh....php?p=2226344

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    Correlation doesn't necessarily equate to causation. Besides, it's a moot point either way. You still haven't told me why law abiding citizens should be punished for the actions of criminals.
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