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Thread: Muhammad Ali Was No Draft Dodger; His Stance Against War Was Libertarian

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    Default Muhammad Ali Was No Draft Dodger; His Stance Against War Was Libertarian



    America awoke today to the sad news that boxing legend Muhammad Ali has passed away. And while the overwhelming majority of public remembrances will be praiseworthy, there are still those who have never forgiven Ali for his refusal to comply with the military draft in the 1960s. Even his archrival, Smokin’ Joe Frazier, resorted to calling Ali a “draft dodger.”

    Ali took some controversial racial positions early in his career, some of which he regretted later in life, but the charge of draft dodger is completely unfounded. Ali never dodged the draft; he opposed it, accepting the legal consequences without any attempt to evade them. He didn’t flee to Canada or enroll in college to obtain a deferment. From the moment he learned of his induction, Ali stood firmly in the proud tradition of civil disobedience, saying “just take me to jail.”


    And while Ali cited his religion as the chief basis for his objection to the war, most of his statements were firmly rooted in the libertarian principle of non-aggression:


    “Why should me and other so-called ‘negroes’ go 10,000 miles away from home, here in America, to drop bombs and bullets on other innocent brown people who’s never bothered us and I will say directly: No, I will not go.”
    ...


    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tom-mu..._10296556.html
    Leviticus 19:33 And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not do him wrong. 34 The stranger that sojourneth with you shall be unto you as the homeborn among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasa Diga Eebowai View Post


    America awoke today to the sad news that boxing legend Muhammad Ali has passed away. And while the overwhelming majority of public remembrances will be praiseworthy, there are still those who have never forgiven Ali for his refusal to comply with the military draft in the 1960s. Even his archrival, Smokin’ Joe Frazier, resorted to calling Ali a “draft dodger.”

    Ali took some controversial racial positions early in his career, some of which he regretted later in life, but the charge of draft dodger is completely unfounded. Ali never dodged the draft; he opposed it, accepting the legal consequences without any attempt to evade them. He didn’t flee to Canada or enroll in college to obtain a deferment. From the moment he learned of his induction, Ali stood firmly in the proud tradition of civil disobedience, saying “just take me to jail.”


    And while Ali cited his religion as the chief basis for his objection to the war, most of his statements were firmly rooted in the libertarian principle of non-aggression:


    “Why should me and other so-called ‘negroes’ go 10,000 miles away from home, here in America, to drop bombs and bullets on other innocent brown people who’s never bothered us and I will say directly: No, I will not go.”
    ...


    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tom-mu..._10296556.html
    Rather then have this denigrate into a "discussion" about this, why can't we just remember him and let him RIP?

    Pascal argues that a rational person should live as though God exists and seek to believe in God. If God does not actually exist, such a person will have only a finite loss, whereas they stand to receive infinite gains and avoid infinite losses.

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    Quote Originally Posted by USFREEDOM911 View Post
    Rather then have this denigrate into a "discussion" about this, why can't we just remember him and let him RIP?
    I remember him as being at odds with the validity the Vietnam war, and I remember he was correct.
    That is worth remembering.
    We have the intellect to imagine the finality of our own demise but do not have the sophistication to overcome our survival instinct and accept it.
    Solution? Magical thinking and childish promises of everlasting life.
    Ergo, religion.

    rac·ist
    rāsəst/noun
    a person who believes that a particular race is superior to another.
    Ask yourself honestly if this describes what you believe to be true.
    If the answer is yes, you are a racist.

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    What was the religious basis for his objection to the war?
    DRINK MOR KOFFEE


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    Quote Originally Posted by Establishment View Post
    What was the religious basis for his objection to the war?
    Eh, the Sixth Commandment!!
    In rejecting their view [Spinoza, Leibnitz and Hegel], as I shall contend that we must, we are committing ourselves to the opinion that “truth” in empirical material has a meaning different from that which it bears in logic and mathematics.”

    Bertrand Russell, “An Inquiry Into Meaning & Truth” (1940)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Establishment View Post
    What was the religious basis for his objection to the war?
    “Why should me and other so-called ‘negroes’ go 10,000 miles away from home, here in America, to drop bombs and bullets on other innocent brown people who’s never bothered us and I will say directly: No, I will not go.”
    Leviticus 19:33 And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not do him wrong. 34 The stranger that sojourneth with you shall be unto you as the homeborn among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

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    it was a conscientious objection. a personal one. not (overtly)religious or philosophical

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    Quote Originally Posted by anatta View Post
    it was a conscientious objection. a personal one. not (overtly)religious or philosophical
    I don't believe it was overtly religious. I do not see how a conscientious objection could escape being philosophical even if it were a personal philosophy. Of course, there is no reason why a religious belief, however well founded in some "sacred" text, should give one more rights than a personal belief.
    Leviticus 19:33 And if a stranger sojourn with thee in your land, ye shall not do him wrong. 34 The stranger that sojourneth with you shall be unto you as the homeborn among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself; for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

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    He was brave and courageous to face the draft and most of all he was correct.
    It's no small matter that he won.

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    Ali was no libertarian. He actually accomplished something.
    You're Never Alone With A Schizophrenic!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasa Diga Eebowai View Post
    I don't believe it was overtly religious. I do not see how a conscientious objection could escape being philosophical even if it were a personal philosophy. Of course, there is no reason why a religious belief, however well founded in some "sacred" text, should give one more rights than a personal belief.
    I agree with your ideas, though we stated it differently.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hasa Diga Eebowai View Post
    “Why should me and other so-called ‘negroes’ go 10,000 miles away from home, here in America, to drop bombs and bullets on other innocent brown people who’s never bothered us and I will say directly: No, I will not go.”
    That's a reasonable objection.
    DRINK MOR KOFFEE


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    Quote Originally Posted by USFREEDOM911 View Post
    Rather then have this denigrate into a "discussion" about this, why can't we just remember him and let him RIP?
    Because you brought it up ?
    If beating people up is just his job he clearly had no objection to violence.
    But this is very old news so who cares ?
    Great boxer. Nothing more nothing less.
    Just because you don't understand it does not make it bad. Celticguy

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    A draft dodger or draft resister is someone who evades a national military conscription, also known as a draft. As a general rule, the term “draft dodger” is used in a pejorative way, to describe someone who shirks on his or her duty.

    try again, weasels.....the truth will set you free.
    Put blame where it belongs
    ATF decided it could not regulate bump stocks during the Obama administration.
    It that time," the NRA wrote in a statement. "The NRA believes that devices designed to allow semiautomatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations."
    The ATF and Obama admin. ignored the NRA recommendations.


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    Quote Originally Posted by NOVA View Post
    A draft dodger or draft resister is someone who evades a national military conscription, also known as a draft. As a general rule, the term “draft dodger” is used in a pejorative way, to describe someone who shirks on his or her duty.

    .
    As Trump did?
    Poor Blabo.
    We have the intellect to imagine the finality of our own demise but do not have the sophistication to overcome our survival instinct and accept it.
    Solution? Magical thinking and childish promises of everlasting life.
    Ergo, religion.

    rac·ist
    rāsəst/noun
    a person who believes that a particular race is superior to another.
    Ask yourself honestly if this describes what you believe to be true.
    If the answer is yes, you are a racist.

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