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Thread: Progressives blew it, and now democracy is on the brink

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    Default Progressives blew it, and now democracy is on the brink

    Just watching what happened in Argentina, and what is unfolding hear in America w/ Trump seemingly coasting to the GOP nomination, and what looks likely to be a return to the Oval.

    Reasonable people can't help but question these things. How is this happening? How can so many people WANT this return to more authoritarian rule?

    Part of the answer is that the left gave them no palatable alternative. Progressive ideals are the correct ones - they ARE the future. In the future, people will work harder to protect our planet. LGBTQ won't even be a discussion topic, because we'll view all people equally and all will have equal rights and respect. Et al.

    But the left went too far, too fast. It allowed conservatives to define progressivism to a frightened public, for whom the changes were seen as too extreme and a threat to the lives they had gotten used to. The right was given some license to fearmonger to the extreme, painting pictures of all communities being like San Francisco (or, their interpretation of what that city represents).

    When people are afraid, they'll choose from a place of fear (logical). It's not an aspirational place. It's a reactionary place.

    Progressives blew it. And now everything they hold dear is at risk.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post

    Progressives blew it. And now everything they hold dear is at risk.
    At risk? No son. Truth is were going to blow it all to bits and cast the dying remnants to the wind which is exactly where they belong. When we are done there wont be a left.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stone View Post
    At risk? No son. Truth is were going to blow it all to bits and cast the dying remnants to the wind which is exactly where they belong. When we are done there wont be a left.
    Reactionaries ALWAYS think they're winning. But they win battles, not wars.

    Progressive thought has always prevailed in the end, from the time we invented the wheel. So, just a little spoiler for ya - it will again. But we're probably going to have to push through some dark times & a few setbacks first.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    Just watching what happened in Argentina, and what is unfolding hear in America w/ Trump seemingly coasting to the GOP nomination, and what looks likely to be a return to the Oval.

    Reasonable people can't help but question these things. How is this happening? How can so many people WANT this return to more authoritarian rule?

    Part of the answer is that the left gave them no palatable alternative. Progressive ideals are the correct ones - they ARE the future. In the future, people will work harder to protect our planet. LGBTQ won't even be a discussion topic, because we'll view all people equally and all will have equal rights and respect. Et al.

    But the left went too far, too fast. It allowed conservatives to define progressivism to a frightened public, for whom the changes were seen as too extreme and a threat to the lives they had gotten used to. The right was given some license to fearmonger to the extreme, painting pictures of all communities being like San Francisco (or, their interpretation of what that city represents).

    When people are afraid, they'll choose from a place of fear (logical). It's not an aspirational place. It's a reactionary place.

    Progressives blew it. And now everything they hold dear is at risk.
    They became very elitist.
    The Economist cited a recent poll showing a whopping 22% of black voters and 42% of Hispanic voters said they’d vote for Trump next year.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    Reactionaries ALWAYS think they're winning. But they win battles, not wars.

    Progressive thought has always prevailed in the end, from the time we invented the wheel. So, just a little spoiler for ya - it will again. But we're probably going to have to push through some dark times & a few setbacks first.
    By the time were done you wont even be a memory. Best part? YOU DID THIS. YOU put Joe and his roving band of corrupt no nothings where they are. YOU,...nobody else. Time to reap what you have sown.

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    Quote Originally Posted by anonymoose View Post
    They became very elitist.
    The Economist cited a recent poll showing a whopping 22% of black voters and 42% of Hispanic voters said they’d vote for Trump next year.
    If those numbers are even semi close to accurate that means a massive Trump landslide victory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by anonymoose View Post
    They became very elitist.
    The Economist cited a recent poll showing a whopping 22% of black voters and 42% of Hispanic voters said they’d vote for Trump next year.
    Those #'s should be real red flags.

    I think many progressives work to advance their ideals in a methodical way, and kind of behind the scenes. But some of the leaders are much more vocal, and less compromising. They see an opening to change things, and are simply going too far w/ it. It's turning a lot of more moderate voters off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stone View Post
    If those numbers are even semi close to accurate that means a massive Trump landslide victory.
    Yes. Even the OP admits that.

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    Was listening to a podcast today with four academics talking about Israel-Gaza and the reactions on college campuses. Two of the professors were leftists, the kind I strongly disagree with. For example, they both spoke about the evils of capitalism and how the West is only focused on consuming more (for economic growth) while destroying the planet.

    But what was interesting is they were old school in that weren't political partisans. They actually spoke about supporting free speech and the issues with that occurring on campuses. They spoke about faults with DE&I and how its applied inconsistently. And they spoke about issues with liberalism.

    Liberalism in the U.S. went from being outsiders and 'speaking truth to power' to now being the elite and the people in power. With power can come push back.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    Those #'s should be real red flags.

    I think many progressives work to advance their ideals in a methodical way, and kind of behind the scenes. But some of the leaders are much more vocal, and less compromising. They see an opening to change things, and are simply going too far w/ it. It's turning a lot of more moderate voters off.
    I find national politics to be very interesting these days.
    A fair number of Republicans don’t support Ukraine. A sizable number of dems are anti Israel.
    Dems are the elitists. Trump represents interests of the common man.
    Personally, I’m politically homeless.

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    Really interesting - cawacko & anonymoose both responded at the same time, and said something very similar: liberals are now the elites & the power brokers. Really, they're the establishment.

    And who likes the establishment?

    They really need to get back to being the plucky outsiders.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    Really interesting - cawacko & anonymoose both responded at the same time, and said something very similar: liberals are now the elites & the power brokers. Really, they're the establishment.

    And who likes the establishment?

    They really need to get back to being the plucky outsiders.
    The establishment can still win but when people think the establishment has gone too far they push back.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    The establishment can still win but when people think the establishment has gone too far they push back.
    The left did that - and I get why people are overreacting to it. I think most reasonable people support LGBTQ rights. But they also want to be able to walk around Target without seeing tuck friendly swimsuits prominently displayed.

    By rushing the agenda, they're hurting it.

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    The Left always blows it. They are like the world champions at blowing stuff. By pushing their agenda at all they are going to blow it. If they were giving free blow jobs they'd blow it. The Left has the Crapper Touch. Everything they touch turns to shit.

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    There are very few Progressives such as me left....those who call themselves Progressives are almost always the opposite...they are illiberal WOKE, they are regressives, and they are burning America to the ground so that UTOPIA can rise from the smoldering ashes via magic.
    I speak the truth to the best of my ability come Hell or high water.

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