James Lovelock: Why are we so afraid of nuclear power?

[Bigdog]

Most SMRs will be built substantially below ground, enhancing safety and security. The reactor operates using natural circulation; hence, no pumps are needed. It safely shuts down and self-cools, indefinitely, with no operator action, no AC or DC power, and no additional water.

https://ro.usembassy.gov/u-s-small-m...rs-fact-sheet/

That's good.

One of my concerns is that terrorists will try to steal nuclear materials for dirty bombs.

Don't SMRs come in a variety of different types of reactors?

[cancel2 2022]

That's good.

One of my concerns is that terrorists will try to steal nuclear materials for dirty bombs.

Don't SMRs come in a variety of different types of reactors?

Yes they do, and they will all have that capability as well. Molten salt reactors are especially secure in that respect, as the fuel is bound up with the molten metal salts. There is a plug at the bottom which melts if the reactor overheats and everything goes directly into a drain sump where it solidifies.

[moon]

Are you serious? Were you around say.. 9/11/2001,say, around 5:14am? Are you from a different planet?

You appear to have a problem understanding my language. There's absolutely nothing wrong with my language, ergo- you're a dumbass.




Haw, haw..............................haw.

[moon]

Nuclear plants are terrorist targets.

Pay the price
or wriggle twice.


Haw, haw.............................haw.

[LurchAddams]

You appear to have a problem understanding my language. There's absolutely nothing wrong with my language, ergo- you're a dumbass.




Haw, haw..............................haw.

Actually, knew what you meant, dirbag, I'm 1000 times smarter than you, there is no doubt. The answer is:

It doesn't matter whether or not we deserve to be attacked, the fact is we ARE a target. Your question is stupid.

Do you understand or to you require an English to dumshit interpreter?

[moon]

That's good.

One of my concerns is that terrorists will try to steal nuclear materials for dirty bombs.

Don't SMRs come in a variety of different types of reactors?

Here are a few more concerns for you- and everybody else, apart from those that wallow in maggot-shit.

Shortcomings and Downsides of SMRs
Significant drawbacks of SMRs are their high capital cost per Megawatt output and the risks that come with mass manufacturing them. Supporters of SMRs contend that their modular nature would allow them to be mass manufactured which would reduce overall capital requirements for construction. Although possible in theory, the reality is that there would need to be a standardized SMR design in order to realize savings through mass manufacturing, but there are currently dozens of designs. Traditional reactors are large because of economies of scale related to reactor construction and operation. [2] Currently, there is no reliable market for SMRs which creates a two-sided economic challenge to their implementation: without manufacturing facilities, SMRs cannot achieve the cost reductions that compensate for their poor economies of scale, and without cost reductions there will be no large number of orders to stimulate the investments needed to set up the initial supply chain. [4] Even if mass manufacturing is realized how proponents plan, SMRs would have to be manufactured for the price per kilowatt to be comparable to a traditional reactor. Each kilowatt hour of electricity produced by an SMR would cost anywhere from 15% to 70% more than the same amount coming from a traditional reactor. [5] For example, an 1100 megawatt plant would cost about 3 times more to construct as an 180 megawatt plant but would produce 6 times the amount of energy meaning that the capital costs per power output would be twice as much for smaller plants. [2] Recent experiences support the skepticism around mass manufacturing of SMRs; NuScale recently announced that their pilot project to construct 12 reactors would be delayed to 2030 and costs would rise from $4.2 billion to $6.1 billion. [1]

In addition, errors made in a mass manufacturing process could propagate through an entire fleet of reactors and lead to costly fixes and widespread safety issues. Designs for light water SMRs (Fig. 1), including NuScales, rely on pressurized water reactors which if not functioning properly can be very costly to fix. In the last decade, steam generators in similar systems have been needed to be replaced prematurely and led to the shut down of two nuclear plants in San Onofre, CA. [6]

Issues regarding long-lived radioactive waste and safety are also a concern with SMRs. Radioactive waste will continue to be generated by SMRs that operate with pressurized water reactors, yet there is still no solution for how to safely store such waste. In fact, SMRs based on light water designs will produce more waste per MWh of electricity produced and the United States government is already paying billions of dollars in fines for not fulfilling their waste disposal obligations. The United States has been searching for a permanent nuclear waste repository since the mid 1980s and much of the country's waste currently sits in cooling pools that potentially leave Americans at great risk of radioactive exposure. [7] In addition, NuScale claims that because SMRs produce less amounts of radioactive waste and can be sited underground, there does not need to be as tight security measures for SMRs. This type of claim from SMR proponents has led to sharp criticism from nuclear experts who believe that as long as terrorism threats exist, it is simply irresponsible to reduce security measures for nuclear reactors of any size. [2] Furthermore, proponents of SMRs like to claim that the natural circulation cooling in SMRs makes them inherently safe, but there are accident scenarios in which heat transfer conditions could be less than ideal or an error in the reactor design could occur. No design comes with zero safety risks or is 100% reliable and marketing SMRs as inherently safe is misleading. [2] Lastly, nuclear plants withdraw large amounts of water roughly 400 gallons of water are consumed per megawatt-hour of electricity generated which adds construction and operation costs to the plant as well. [8]

[Bigdog]

Yes they do, and they will all have that capability as well. Molten salt reactors are especially secure in that respect, as the fuel is bound up with the molten metal salts. There is a plug at the bottom which melts if the reactor overheats and everything goes directly into a drain sump where it solidifies.

MSRs, like thorium, don't seem to be very common.

"Why don't we use molten salt reactors?
These problems remain relevant. Even today, no material can perform satisfactorily in the high-radiation, high-temperature, and corrosive environment inside a molten salt reactor.Jun 20, 2022

Molten salt reactors were trouble in the 1960s—and they remain trouble ...https://thebulletin.org › 2022/06 › molten-salt-reactors-we..."

[cancel2 2022]

MSRs, like thorium, don't seem to be very common.

"Why don't we use molten salt reactors?
These problems remain relevant. Even today, no material can perform satisfactorily in the high-radiation, high-temperature, and corrosive environment inside a molten salt reactor.Jun 20, 2022

Molten salt reactors were trouble in the 1960s—and they remain trouble ...https://thebulletin.org › 2022/06 › molten-salt-reactors-we..."

The Bulletin seriously? You can't get anymore anti-nuclear than them

There were corrosion problems initially back in the 60s but all that was worked out long ago, there are many alloys that are suitable for the task.

https://nucleus.iaea.org/sites/fusio...7/Surenkov.pdf

Here is a fascinating article in Interesting Engineering, well worth reading.

https://interestingengineering.com/s...roduction-boom

Thorcon is an American company that is working on a thorium based MSR, their first customer in Indonesia expects delivery in the mid 20s.

https://world-nuclear-news.org/Artic...-first-ThorCon

[Bigdog]

The Bulletin seriously, you can't get anymore anti-nuclear than them

There were corrosion problems initially back in the 60s but all that was worked out long ago, there are many alloys that are suitable for the task.

https://nucleus.iaea.org/sites/fusio...7/Surenkov.pdf

Here is a fascinating article in Interesting Engineering, well worth reading.

https://interestingengineering.com/s...roduction-boom

Thorcon is an American company that is working on a thorium based MSR, their first customer in Indonesia expects delivery in the mid 20s.

https://world-nuclear-news.org/Artic...-first-ThorCon

I did not know that about thebulletin, thanks.

I only looked at the first link. The hot salt tanks are pretty cool.

I wish them luck in making those technologies commercially competitive someday.

[Celticguy]

Nuclear plants are terrorist targets.

so are malls. how many nuclear plants have been attacked by terrorists ?

[Bigdog]

so are malls. how many nuclear plants have been attacked by terrorists ?

Nuclear plants have massive security to prevent such attacks. But I believe 2 in Ukraine have been attacked by the Russians.

[EverLich]

"Why are we so afraid of nuclear power?"

Cuz nothing can make anyone visit lower michigan?

And then there's the whole liability in war time, issue....

How many complete and total fkups has humanity had with nuclear power so far?

Can you just imagine CA when the warheads finally start raining down?

Mmmmmmmmmm...... that feels nice actually. I vote for more CA nuclear power plants.

[Bigdog]

List of 80 nuclear facilities that have been attacked ...

https://www.start.umd.edu/nuclear-fa...database-nufad

[T. A. Gardner]

Because radical Leftists, like Moon for example, are not just anti-science, they are imbeciles incapable of even beginning to understand how nuclear power actually works.

There was a joke that went around in the engineering and science majors when I was in college. I can't find a sample of it online, but it was an integration (eg., calculus--something foreign and scary to liberal arts majors) that went as GPA went from 4.0 to 0 major went from engineering / science, to business, to liberal arts, to fine arts. That is, it implied that the stupid part of the campus was where the liberal arts and fine arts majors hung out.

[Celticguy]

Nuclear plants have massive security to prevent such attacks. But I believe 2 in Ukraine have been attacked by the Russians.

rumors and the like but no Godzillas roaming the USSR.