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    Default Conservatives and War

    Only because the post on Conservatives and the Justice System was part of a bigger blog. It is all well written

    The Right loves war. Right-wing foreign policy "realists" believe that negotiation, diplomacy and containment are for wimps and simply does not work. War is not a last option, but a first priority for the Frum-Perle-Wolfowitz Axis of Aggression. The Right lied and deceived its way into getting a war with Iraq, a war against a nation that posed no real threat to the United States. Instead of admitting their error, the authoritarians have instead been giving each other high-fives and hoping they can soon create another conflict with Damascus or Tehran.

    How many people on the right have called out their masters on their lying and deception with this war? Not many. It’s because they don’t really a problem with it (unless it’s a Democrat doing the lying). In their eyes the lies and distortions were justifiable means to a noble end. They got their war and they got their occupation. Tough luck for anyone who doesn’t like it.

    Conservatives also show themselves to be incredibly calloused to the suffering of foreigners caused by their beloved wars. I’ve heard not a few conservatives make remarks like, "We ought to just make the entire Middle East a parking lot." Most of these people saying this were only half-serious. But I fail to see how it is funny to joke about causing the mass killing of millions of people because you don’t like them.

    To fight all the conservatives’ desired wars you need more manpower. Who is more likely to support the draft? The Left or the Right? The Right, which supposedly hates government, loves the military. They believe in enormous wasteful spending to keep the bloated military machine obese. Not only that, many have no problem with the anti-freedom concept of the draft. Not only are you obligated through the force of law to fund the military machine through your taxes, you also owe the State your body and possibly your life.

    Many on the Authoritarian Right have prattled on about how the draft is great for American because it teaches young people "responsibility" and contributes to the safety of America. What it really does is teaches young people that they are slaves of the State and that their hopes, dreams and freedoms take a back seat to the wishes of government thugs who want to use them to do their dirty work.

    Speaking of the government’s dirty work, again conservatives assume that the government can do no wrong with nations that it is ticked off at. Thus all the conservatives stumbling and bumbling while they try to come up with excuses for the government’s deception for the latest Iraq war. The government would never, ever lie to us about why it’s going to war! The government simply can’t be wrong that Country A is bad and that we need to bomb them. Just as in the legal system, when it comes to foreign policy, the government is never ever wrong – especially if it’s a conservative running the show.

    In the eyes of the Authoritarian Right, America is always right, everyone else is always wrong. If you question this, then you are a liberal, or even worse you are a subversive that doesn’t support our country! The final recourse for any frustrated conservative discussing foreign policy with a non-aggressor is telling them to leave the country if they don’t like it. When all else fails, the authoritarian attacks the person’s patriotism, intelligence, personal morality, and allegiance to their homeland. This is rather fitting for the authoritarian conservative, who would prefer dissenters get out of the way and physically leave the country rather than have their statist agenda challenged.

    Conclusion

    When one really takes a look at mainstream conservative thought, it becomes quite clear that they are not really supporters of freedom and liberty. In fact, they can support some of the worst forms of tyranny and repression possible. As has been stated in the body of this essay, they have no problem with the government so long as they are the ones running it. They seek not to shrink, but to expand the government into our daily lives. They put a blind and dangerous faith in the legal system and support injustice in the name of being "tough on crime." Most dangerously, they believe in using the U.S. military to impose their authoritarianism around the world, no matter what the cost is to human life and personal freedom.

    Those of us who have awakened to this fact have said goodbye to the mainstream conservative movement. While not liberals or leftists by any means, we seek not to associate ourselves with the Republican Party. We have in fact realized something that most Republicans and conservatives have not noticed: that the government is not our friend and that statism and authoritarianism can only be used for harm and not good.

    Today’s conservative movement is boiling down to this: You can either support the watered down statism of the mainstream Right and their troubling authoritarianism, or you can subscribe to a more logically consistent and freedom-loving philosophy of those of us dissenters who reject both traditional Left and Right paradigms.

    Basically, if you call yourself a conservative, you can support one of two political and social philosophies. One supports statism, authoritarianism, and war, and the other represents what LRC stands for, "property, freedom, and peace." For me, it’s not that difficult to choose.

    Authoritarian Conservatism - by Bill Barnwell

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    The Right loves war.

    Sorry, but I refuse to read threads which begin with a flat out lie.

    NO ONE LIKES WAR DUMBASS!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dixie View Post
    Sorry, but I refuse to read threads which begin with a flat out lie.

    NO ONE LIKES WAR DUMBASS!
    Then you are missing out on a good read by a serious libertarian and NOT a lefty. I think you might get a lot out of it. But suit yourself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Socrtease View Post
    Then you are missing out on a good read by a serious libertarian and NOT a lefty. I think you might get a lot out of it. But suit yourself.
    Like I said, if it begins with a lie, I refuse to read on. Chances are, the whole thing is full of the same kind of lies, distortions, and misrepresentations. No one LOVES war, that should be a given, and if the author is too intellectually biased to admit that, I have no use to read a damn thing he/she writes. Sorry!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canceled View Post
    Like I said, if it begins with a lie, I refuse to read on. Chances are, the whole thing is full of the same kind of lies, distortions, and misrepresentations. No one LOVES war, that should be a given, and if the author is too intellectually biased to admit that, I have no use to read a damn thing he/she writes. Sorry!
    Have someone read it to you. Then have someone read Eisenhowers farewell address. http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/ike.htm The military is destroying the US from the inside. Want to know where your health care is? Want to know where the high class schools went? Want to know where your infrastructure is? It went to almost 900 military bases, a huge army that is always fighting. A huge amount of money on weapons . It went into the CIA and secret wars. We are destroying ourselves for imaginary safety. North Korea is showing you the truth. Security comes from being a good and honest neighbor, not a bully.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nordberg View Post
    Have someone read it to you. Then have someone read Eisenhowers farewell address. http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/ike.htm The military is destroying the US from the inside. Want to know where your health care is? Want to know where the high class schools went? Want to know where your infrastructure is? It went to almost 900 military bases, a huge army that is always fighting. A huge amount of money on weapons . It went into the CIA and secret wars. We are destroying ourselves for imaginary safety. North Korea is showing you the truth. Security comes from being a good and honest neighbor, not a bully.
    Just curious; but how long ago did your Physiatrist determine that as long as you're on your meds, that you're not a threat to yourself or others and release you from the treatment center.
    SEDITION: incitement of resistance to or insurrection against lawful authority.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Socrtease View Post
    Then you are missing out on a good read by a serious libertarian and NOT a lefty. I think you might get a lot out of it. But suit yourself.
    Sochead, being the open-minded and fair individual I am, I gave you the benefit of the doubt on this and went ahead and read it. I convinced myself that the first sentence, which is a lie, might actually be intended as sarcasm, and maybe there was some rationale in the context of the piece. I was wrong. I counted five lies in the first paragraph, and by the time I reached the fourth, I had lost count.

    Upon finishing his lie-fest, I decided to check out his blog, since you claimed he was libertarian. He does indeed claim to be a Libertarian, but his articles are pretty much devoted to attacking conservatism viciously, especially the religious right. I actually think he is a radical left-wing anti-war liberal, and he hides behind the banner of Libertarianism as a foil. Lots of lefties do that, because it insulates them from criticism of the radical liberal Democrat party. You see, the left can't really convert conservatives to liberalism, but there is a possibility of converting a conservative to libertarian, and anything is better than them remaining conservative, so this guy is a liberal warrior disguised as a libertarian for that purpose, as best I can tell. I mean, my god, one of his articles is explaining why Obama is a good pick for president! I know of NO Libertarian who voted for Obama. Most of Obama's Big Government agenda is completely contradictory of Libertarianism. Yet, this cat felt compelled to write a fluff piece to cheerlead Obama. I think you've been duped.

    In the first part, he lies about the Right LOVES war, then goes on your typical left-wing anti-war rant for the next two paragraphs, parroting the exact same thing Democrats have been saying for 7 years. Nothing new, more of the same lies, distortions, misrepresentations, and contempt for Bush. More of the same overblown rhetoric about the war, and exaggerations regarding it. Then he goes from sublime to ridiculous with this statement...

    Who is more likely to support the draft? The Left or the Right? The Right, which supposedly hates government, loves the military.....Many on the Authoritarian Right have prattled on about how the draft is great for American because it teaches young people "responsibility" and contributes to the safety of America.

    Just where the hell does he get his information? I have never heard anyone on the Right, endorse, suggest, support, or otherwise condone, selective service! In fact, the record shows, it is something leftist DEMOCRATS continue to push and try to get implemented, not the Right! Add THAT to the long list of lies he has told in this one article.

    He goes on to conclude that the Right are "statists" and that too is false, it is the Democrat Liberals who are supreme statists. He ends by presenting a 'choice' for conservatives, they can either support war and statism or do as he has done and join the Libertarians. This should be enough to convince the most brain-dead moron in the world, the guy is not sincere and not really a Libertarian. I mean, take a look, Democrat Liberals control both branches of Congress and the White House, yet instead of attempting to sway the opinions of Liberals and siphon off Liberal votes, he is going after the Right! That only makes practical sense, if you want Liberals to continue in power, because Libertarians got all of 2% in the most recent election, and will be about the same next election. What he is doing is very clever, but deceitful and dishonest. But what else do we expect from Liberals?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dixie View Post
    Sochead, being the open-minded and fair individual I am, I gave you the benefit of the doubt on this and went ahead and read it. I convinced myself that the first sentence, which is a lie, might actually be intended as sarcasm, and maybe there was some rationale in the context of the piece. I was wrong. I counted five lies in the first paragraph, and by the time I reached the fourth, I had lost count.

    Upon finishing his lie-fest, I decided to check out his blog, since you claimed he was libertarian. He does indeed claim to be a Libertarian, but his articles are pretty much devoted to attacking conservatism viciously, especially the religious right. I actually think he is a radical left-wing anti-war liberal, and he hides behind the banner of Libertarianism as a foil. Lots of lefties do that, because it insulates them from criticism of the radical liberal Democrat party. You see, the left can't really convert conservatives to liberalism, but there is a possibility of converting a conservative to libertarian, and anything is better than them remaining conservative, so this guy is a liberal warrior disguised as a libertarian for that purpose, as best I can tell. I mean, my god, one of his articles is explaining why Obama is a good pick for president! I know of NO Libertarian who voted for Obama. Most of Obama's Big Government agenda is completely contradictory of Libertarianism. Yet, this cat felt compelled to write a fluff piece to cheerlead Obama. I think you've been duped.

    In the first part, he lies about the Right LOVES war, then goes on your typical left-wing anti-war rant for the next two paragraphs, parroting the exact same thing Democrats have been saying for 7 years. Nothing new, more of the same lies, distortions, misrepresentations, and contempt for Bush. More of the same overblown rhetoric about the war, and exaggerations regarding it. Then he goes from sublime to ridiculous with this statement...

    Who is more likely to support the draft? The Left or the Right? The Right, which supposedly hates government, loves the military.....Many on the Authoritarian Right have prattled on about how the draft is great for American because it teaches young people "responsibility" and contributes to the safety of America.

    Just where the hell does he get his information? I have never heard anyone on the Right, endorse, suggest, support, or otherwise condone, selective service! In fact, the record shows, it is something leftist DEMOCRATS continue to push and try to get implemented, not the Right! Add THAT to the long list of lies he has told in this one article.

    He goes on to conclude that the Right are "statists" and that too is false, it is the Democrat Liberals who are supreme statists. He ends by presenting a 'choice' for conservatives, they can either support war and statism or do as he has done and join the Libertarians. This should be enough to convince the most brain-dead moron in the world, the guy is not sincere and not really a Libertarian. I mean, take a look, Democrat Liberals control both branches of Congress and the White House, yet instead of attempting to sway the opinions of Liberals and siphon off Liberal votes, he is going after the Right! That only makes practical sense, if you want Liberals to continue in power, because Libertarians got all of 2% in the most recent election, and will be about the same next election. What he is doing is very clever, but deceitful and dishonest. But what else do we expect from Liberals?
    First of all the article was written Mar 11, 2004 before Obama was elected and Democrats had control of either house...

    I am part JFK liberal and part Goldwater libertarian, and I can tell you there are things Barnwell writes that I don't agree with. And if you visit Lew Rockwell.com, there will be things you agree with and things disagree with. I supported Ron Paul who is a libertarian in the beginning of the primaries...and I don't agree with all his views...

    I can also tell you that Goldwater Republicans are the MOST vocal about the current state of the GOP...they had their party hijacked by the far right Christian hawks and the far left Trotskyist hawks (the neocons)...

    The GOP has moved to the extreme right...THAT is why they had their heads handed to them in '06 and '08...and the "base" wants to PURIFY the party... get rid of all the moderate Republicans... sounds like the Nazi party!

    You say there are no libertarians that voted for Obama? How about Republicans and TRUE conservatives... Colin Powell, Susan Eisenhower and Christopher Buckley, son of William F...Chris said: "Let me be the latest conservative/libertarian/whatever to leap onto the Barack Obama bandwagon." Just to name a few...

    “You know, I’ve spent my entire life time separating the Right from the kooks.”
    William F. Buckley Jr.
    The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for selfishness.
    John Kenneth Galbraith

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    Quote Originally Posted by Socrtease View Post
    Then you are missing out on a good read by a serious libertarian and NOT a lefty. I think you might get a lot out of it. But suit yourself.
    Douchey is your political identity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dixie View Post
    Sorry, but I refuse to read threads which begin with a flat out lie.

    NO ONE LIKES WAR DUMBASS!


    This picture says it all about the right and war!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dixie View Post
    Sorry, but I refuse to read threads which begin with a flat out lie.

    NO ONE LIKES WAR DUMBASS!
    I got slghtly further, to this, another lie: "War is not a last option, but a first priority for the Frum-Perle-Wolfowitz Axis of Aggression."

    The fact is that war is simply a tool of diplomacy. Unless you're willing to have it ready you'll have a weak bargaining position with dictators and those who would like to do you harm. Only a fool would leave it off the table.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
    I got slghtly further, to this, another lie: "War is not a last option, but a first priority for the Frum-Perle-Wolfowitz Axis of Aggression."

    The fact is that war is simply a tool of diplomacy. Unless you're willing to have it ready you'll have a weak bargaining position with dictators and those who would like to do you harm. Only a fool would leave it off the table.
    I think you mixed up your metaphor. War is not a tool of diplomacy. War and Diplomacy are tools of Policy.
    You're Never Alone With A Schizophrenic!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mottleydude View Post
    I think you mixed up your metaphor. War is not a tool of diplomacy. War and Diplomacy are tools of Policy.
    I didn't use a metaphor; I simply stated a fact.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
    I didn't use a metaphor; I simply stated a fact.
    War occurs when diplomacy fails.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Canceled View Post
    Sorry, but I refuse to read threads which begin with a flat out lie.

    NO ONE LIKES WAR DUMBASS!
    Only idiots who have never been in combat think war isn't so bad.

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