There are 120 guns for every 100 Americans

[BartenderElite]

I support the 2nd amendment, and the right to own a gun.

But there is something wrong w/ America. Gun ownership has a near-religious devotion among some segments of the population. We hear "God, guns & gays" from voters in some regions, and for many, it is the top voting issue. Every small regulation or background check is a "slippery slope." The NRA refuses to postpone or move a large event that is taking place within days of a devastating shooting in a nearby location.

Like Trump support, it's a bit of a cult, and always a battle for those who are believers. The government is just an entity that wants to "grab their guns."

We're unique in the world in this respect. The 2nd country on the list has half the guns per capita that America does.

We're a gun nation.

[T. A. Gardner]

So?

[BartenderElite]

So?

So, it's a topic for discussion. We lead the world in gun ownership, and in gun violence. This is not a coincidence.

It's worth discussing. I don't know what the answer is. Maybe people are fine that we lead the world in gun violence, and this is just the way it is.

[T. A. Gardner]

It's an irrelevance. Guns aren't the problem, crazy people, criminals, and such are. Without guns we'd still have just as much violence, only it'd be with knives, hammers, or whatever instead.

The place to start is trying to reduce, or at least restrict, the ability of the crazy, insane, drug addled, and emotionally unstable from getting access to guns. Criminals are going to be a problem regardless. That's true anywhere. I've already suggested a more flexible approach to restricting access to firearms one where you put someone on "The List" fairly easy with some evidence, but they can get off that list fairly easily by contacting the authorities and being interviewed.

That would massively cut down on gun violence on its own. The current system is difficult to put someone on the Red Flag list, and once you are on that list it's nearly impossible to get off it. That 0 - 1 approach is wrong. We need a middle way.

[BartenderElite]

It's an irrelevance. Guns aren't the problem, crazy people, criminals, and such are. Without guns we'd still have just as much violence, only it'd be with knives, hammers, or whatever instead.

The place to start is trying to reduce, or at least restrict, the ability of the crazy, insane, drug addled, and emotionally unstable from getting access to guns. Criminals are going to be a problem regardless. That's true anywhere. I've already suggested a more flexible approach to restricting access to firearms one where you put someone on "The List" fairly easy with some evidence, but they can get off that list fairly easily by contacting the authorities and being interviewed.

That would massively cut down on gun violence on its own. The current system is difficult to put someone on the Red Flag list, and once you are on that list it's nearly impossible to get off it. That 0 - 1 approach is wrong. We need a middle way.

People always say the bolded. Is it true?

How do we know?

Is it a total coincidence that we lead the world in gun ownership by a significant margin - and we also lead the world in gun violence by a significant margin? Do other countries not have similar issues w/ mental health?

It seems like there is only one variable in the equation, and it's getting harder to deny.

[Earl]

Americans need guns to defend themselves and their families.

Biden is responsible for releasing scores of criminals who use gums and then are released back onto the streets.

Biden is responsible for open borders with scores of violent gangs and drugs.

[BartenderElite]

Americans need guns to defend themselves and their families.

Biden is responsible for releasing scores of criminals who use gums and then are released back onto the streets.

Biden is responsible for open borders with scores of violent gangs and drugs.

Most of these mass shootings are not the scores of released criminals, or violent gangs, or related to the border, or drug-related.

[Bigdog]

People always say the bolded. Is it true?

How do we know?

Is it a total coincidence that we lead the world in gun ownership by a significant margin - and we also lead the world in gun violence by a significant margin? Do other countries not have similar issues w/ mental health?

It seems like there is only one variable in the equation, and it's getting harder to deny.

"Stabbings surge in Victoria as young people 'arm up' - Daily Mailhttps://www.dailymail.co.uk › news › article-10629425
Mar 19, 2022 — 'Everyone's carrying knives now': Stabbings surge in Aussie state as young people 'arm up' in frightening escalation of knife crime across ..."



Take away guns from women, and you will see a rise in sexual assault as well.

[Bigdog]

Most of these mass shootings are not the scores of released criminals, or violent gangs, or related to the border, or drug-related.

Most are committed by feminized Millenial Bidenesque males. This wasn't a problem before they were created.

[Bigdog]

It's an irrelevance. Guns aren't the problem, crazy people, criminals, and such are. Without guns we'd still have just as much violence, only it'd be with knives, hammers, or whatever instead.

The place to start is trying to reduce, or at least restrict, the ability of the crazy, insane, drug addled, and emotionally unstable from getting access to guns. Criminals are going to be a problem regardless. That's true anywhere. I've already suggested a more flexible approach to restricting access to firearms one where you put someone on "The List" fairly easy with some evidence, but they can get off that list fairly easily by contacting the authorities and being interviewed.

That would massively cut down on gun violence on its own. The current system is difficult to put someone on the Red Flag list, and once you are on that list it's nearly impossible to get off it. That 0 - 1 approach is wrong. We need a middle way.

The liberals on the SCOTUS, in 1999, limited the ability of the States to deal with their mental health situations. The Libs basically emptied the State Asylums just 2 months after Columbine, and limited the States rights to keep the rest of society safe.

NY has red flag laws and Buffalo and the Subway shooter still happened.

[T. A. Gardner]

People always say the bolded. Is it true?

How do we know?

Is it a total coincidence that we lead the world in gun ownership by a significant margin - and we also lead the world in gun violence by a significant margin? Do other countries not have similar issues w/ mental health?

It seems like there is only one variable in the equation, and it's getting harder to deny.

Well, we can look to the UK for an example. In the UK a near complete ban on firearms was implemented in 1996. In 2007 even most knives were banned along with draconian restrictions put on their purchase.

Since then, crime in the UK has remained nearly the same as it was pre-ban.

In the decade following the (Tory) party's election in 1997, the number of recorded violent attacks soared by 77 per cent to 1.158 million - or more than two every minute.

The figures, compiled from reports released by the European Commission and United Nations, also show:

The UK has the second highest overall crime rate in the EU.

It has a higher homicide rate than most of our western European neighbours, including France, Germany, Italy and Spain.

The UK has the fifth highest robbery rate in the EU.

It has the fourth highest burglary rate and the highest absolute number of burglaries in the EU, with double the number of offences than recorded in Germany and France.

https://www.buckeyefirearms.org/gun-...-violent-crime

Guns are also being smuggled in by criminals so gun crime continues to occur.

The number of gun crimes committed in the United Kingdom has increased by 27 per cent in five years and the number of firearms seized has quadrupled, despite the country having some of the strictest gun control laws in the world.

https://www.breitbart.com/europe/202...d-in-one-year/

A new study suggests the use of handguns in crime rose by 40% in the two years after the weapons were banned.
The research, commissioned by the Countryside Alliance's Campaign for Shooting, has concluded that existing laws are targeting legitimate users of firearms rather than criminals.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/1440764.stm

While gun crimes overall have fallen dramatically in the UK, the same overall number of violent criminal acts has remained flat or increased now seeing the use of knives or other non-firearm weapons replacing guns. So, after an initial drop, criminals and others wanting to commit violent crimes simply adjusted to the 'new normal' and continued on as before.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2043448/

[Stone]

I grew up in a home that generally had anywhere from 9-12 guns in it. All sitting safely in their gun cabinets. We used them for what they were intended to be used for. We hunted during the different hunting seasons and once in a blue moon used them for target practice. Otherwise they just sat in their cabinets, unloaded. Very very few people ever owned hand guns back then...because...WHY? No need for them. Of course thats when people were still normal before the whole country went to shit ,....so..........

[Earl]

I grew up in a home that generally had anywhere from 9-12 guns in it. All sitting safely in their gun cabinets. We used them for what they were intended to be used for. We hunted during the different hunting seasons and once in a blue moon used them for target practice. Otherwise they just sat in their cabinets, unloaded. Very very few people ever owned hand guns back then...because...WHY? No need for them. Of course that's when people were still normal before the whole country went to shit ,....so..........

Same here, Stone.

They remained in gun cabinets until quail, dove or rabbit season opened.

They were there for home protection but were never needed.

[Callinectes]

We're a gun nation.

Thank God

[Stone]

My first gun that was officially MINE was a break open single shot 30-30 that came with an interchangeable 20 gauge barrel that Harrington Richardson used to make. Take out one screw, pop off the 30 barrel . and on went the 20 gauge barrel. Single shot,....one shot...one kill.. GREAT starter gun for a kid. Got it on my 13th birthday.