Can there be a proof of God?

[Concart]

I do not think so.

All proofs of God presuppose you already believe.

Not unless he appears in Times Square and lets scientists measure his shoe size. There is no proof for a supernatural posit. And there never can be.

[saltydancin]

Okay, no proof of God. No problem with you believing.

While Russia's rootin' tootin' Putin's current relentless annihilation of Ukraine's fabricated Nazis & all those crooks on Capital Hill continuing malfeasance with over 60 years of under color of law thieving old glorys presented by Eisenhower arsonists interpretation of "one nation under God with equal justice under law" Christiananality pedophilia "man is God" tautology is proof of God believing existence of suicidal super egos sociopsychopathilogical homicidal human farming in their Peter Principle pyramid scheme of survival of the fittest fascists....

[ZenMode]

Yes, that is what I am talking about.

As with many things, Christians tend to see what they want to see and explain away anything they don't. For a Christian, the weed I pulled in my front yard was "proof" of God's existence. Never mind that, in Biblical times, God spoke directly to people from the heavens on a regular basis, sent himself to earth to perform miracles and had angels talking to people often. Apparently God got tired of putting forth any effort into acquiring/keeping his believers.... though he apparently still holds eternal torture over our heads if we don't believe.

god-loves-you-so-much.jpg

[T. A. Gardner]

Why is free will important?

Without it you are nothing but a puppet or slave.

[T. A. Gardner]

That is really bad theology.
According to mainstream Christian theology going all the way back to Augustine, free will was given to humans by God. Supposedly, free will is why there is sin and corruption in the world, because humans are free to choose.

And, if God showed up and made a proclamation to the contrary, are the one that will argue with God about it? The point I'm making is once there's absolute, positive proof of God there's no more choice about believing or not. I suppose you could deny God's existence after that, but you'd be insane in doing so.

[archives]

I do not think so.

All proofs of God presuppose you already believe.

No, Aquinas was wrong, Augustine right, it is a matter of faith

[Doc Dutch]

That is really bad theology.
According to mainstream Christian theology going all the way back to Augustine, free will was given to humans by God. Supposedly, free will is why there is sin and corruption in the world, because humans are free to choose.

Agreed. God has the power to make us do but doesn't...which is why modern Christianity and I disagree on the concept of a "personal God" that grants wishes to those who pray hard enough.

IMO, God is designed the Universe and all of its laws then has let things run their course without interference. To interfere would be breaking the rules and, therefore, cheat. I believe God is honest and never cheats.

[Doc Dutch]

As with many things, Christians tend to see what they want to see and explain away anything they don't. For a Christian, the weed I pulled in my front yard was "proof" of God's existence. Never mind that, in Biblical times, God spoke directly to people from the heavens on a regular basis, sent himself to earth to perform miracles and had angels talking to people often. Apparently God got tired of putting forth any effort into acquiring/keeping his believers.... though he apparently still holds eternal torture over our heads if we don't believe.

god-loves-you-so-much.jpg

...and in Buddhism you'll come back as a cockroach?

[BidenPresident]

Without it you are nothing but a puppet or slave.

How would I know the difference?

[BidenPresident]

As with many things, Christians tend to see what they want to see and explain away anything they don't. For a Christian, the weed I pulled in my front yard was "proof" of God's existence. Never mind that, in Biblical times, God spoke directly to people from the heavens on a regular basis, sent himself to earth to perform miracles and had angels talking to people often. Apparently God got tired of putting forth any effort into acquiring/keeping his believers.... though he apparently still holds eternal torture over our heads if we don't believe.

god-loves-you-so-much.jpg

Well said.

[BidenPresident]

You obviously won't believe in God no matter what because you don't want to.

Not my point. I am only saying there cannot be proof of God.

[Doc Dutch]

And, if God showed up and made a proclamation to the contrary, are the one that will argue with God about it? The point I'm making is once there's absolute, positive proof of God there's no more choice about believing or not. I suppose you could deny God's existence after that, but you'd be insane in doing so.

Most people can't comprehend the size of our own country much less God.

If Jesus showed up at Times Square, how many people would want him executed for blasphemy? Most of the Evangelistas? Prosperity Christians?

[Doc Dutch]

Not my point. I am only saying there cannot be proof of God.

Agreed. There's zero evidence of the supernatural, magic or anything beyond the physical universe.

[BidenPresident]

People usually conflate the word proof with the word evidence.

I did not do that. The topic of the thread is proof.

[Jarod]

Infer it, maybe. But what is your point?

My point is that even if you don’t feel god within yourself, you can possibly infer gods existence in others.