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Thread: Russia offers Ukraine negotiations for surrender terms.

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    Quote Originally Posted by McRocket View Post
    You are comparing Russia's invasion of Ukraine to Napoleon's Russian invasion and/or Nazi Germany's invasion?
    Both invasions of Russia started far better than this, and ended very badly. Napoleon had no trouble capturing Moscow. Hitler reached the outer suburbs of Moscow. They both did that with ease. But there things slowed down, and later started to really collapse.

    We will have to wait to see how Putin does in a stalemate war during Winter, but it says a lot that it now seems probable that Putin will be in a stalemate war during Winter.
    Daniel Patrick Moynihan said it best, "You are entitled to your opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts."
    Paul Begala, "Politics is show business for ugly people."
    Stephen Colbert, "Reality has a well known liberal bias."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    it now seems probable that Putin will be in a stalemate war during Winter.
    Define ' stalemate '.
    " First they came for the journalists...
    We don't know what happened after that . "

    Maria Ressa.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moon View Post
    Define ' stalemate '.
    It is looking highly unlikely that Putin can invade all of Ukraine. He might agree to a ceasefire, but there is a good chance he will not. That leaves him fighting through the winter, but not advancing. There is a danger [for him] that his supply lines will get cut, and he will face a sudden collapse.
    Daniel Patrick Moynihan said it best, "You are entitled to your opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts."
    Paul Begala, "Politics is show business for ugly people."
    Stephen Colbert, "Reality has a well known liberal bias."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    It is looking highly unlikely that Putin can invade all of Ukraine. He might agree to a ceasefire, but there is a good chance he will not. That leaves him fighting through the winter, but not advancing. There is a danger [for him] that his supply lines will get cut, and he will face a sudden collapse.
    The Russians are eating up Ukrainian territory in small, daily bites. As their captured territory is adjacent to Russia itself how do you envision their supply lines to be cut ?
    Every territorial gain becomes part of Russia.
    " First they came for the journalists...
    We don't know what happened after that . "

    Maria Ressa.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Walt View Post
    Both invasions of Russia started far better than this, and ended very badly. Napoleon had no trouble capturing Moscow. Hitler reached the outer suburbs of Moscow. They both did that with ease. But there things slowed down, and later started to really collapse.

    We will have to wait to see how Putin does in a stalemate war during Winter, but it says a lot that it now seems probable that Putin will be in a stalemate war during Winter.
    Fair enough.

    Though I have to disagree with the former.
    Though the numbers vary.
    Napoleon, by the time he entered Moscow (that was half burned down), he had lost anywhere from 1/2 to 2/3 of his original army.


    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French..._Russia#Losses

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    Hitler didn't learn from Napoleon, NATO hasn't learned from either.
    " First they came for the journalists...
    We don't know what happened after that . "

    Maria Ressa.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moon View Post
    You're away with the fairies.
    You're in Putin's pocket.

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    Future generations will look upon America's refusal to defend the Ukraine with disgust.

    Biden is the new Neville Chamberlain.
    Patriotism is the last refuge of a a scoundrel. Samuel Johnson, 1775
    Religion....is the opiate of the people. Karl Marx, 1848
    I'm surrounded by stunads. Nifty Niblick, 2022

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye10 View Post
    I am annoyed that this late into it we are still getting no reports on the proficiency of the Russian Forces.

    There seems to be an information embargo, and I have no idea why one would be in place.
    You were excited for this war to be a showcase for Russian military prowess and proficiency, but what this war actually did is show Russian military ineptness and weakness.

    I don't think NATO armed forces have anything to fear from a conventional military engagement with Putin, especially with the addition of the professional and capable Swedish and Finnish armed forces.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkeye10 View Post
    How is the Russian military performing? I cant find anyone on the internet willing to tell me.
    Their performance is shitty and inept.

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    Quote Originally Posted by moon View Post
    the US will be defeated in another war of its own making in somebody else's back yard.
    Russia's security concerns were legitimate. Should have listened to them.
    The consensus and the facts on the ground are that Russia is not winning and Ukraine is never going to surrender.

    Putin just signed Russia up for a Vietnam style disaster.

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    Dutch Uncle (05-20-2022)

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    Quote Originally Posted by moon View Post
    Russia offers Ukraine negotiations for surrender terms.
    Another post that didn't travel well.

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    Cypress (05-20-2022)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    The consensus and the facts on the ground are that Russia is not winning and Ukraine is never going to surrender.

    Putin just signed Russia up for a Vietnam style disaster.
    Even worse since he's lost a third of his military, most of them the best he has, in a few short months. He's boxed himself in.

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    Cypress (05-20-2022)

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    Quote Originally Posted by NiftyNiblick View Post
    Future generations will look upon America's refusal to defend the Ukraine with disgust.

    Biden is the new Neville Chamberlain.
    There won't be any future generations if Biden plays stoopid.
    " First they came for the journalists...
    We don't know what happened after that . "

    Maria Ressa.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    The consensus and the facts on the ground are that Russia is not winning and Ukraine is never going to surrender.
    The cream of Ukrainian Nazism just surrendered at Mariupol. You should perhaps stfu.
    " First they came for the journalists...
    We don't know what happened after that . "

    Maria Ressa.

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