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Thread: Con Law - Lesson 1 "The Preamble"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    In young, sane people, yes. On JPP the demographic is primarily Euro-American males over 65. Most of them have problems changing their Depends much less their minds.

    Jus' sayin'.
    LMAO it always has been! What's amazing is when one dies off, they release two from the group home to replace him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darla View Post
    LMAO it always has been! What's amazing is when one dies off, they release two from the group home to replace him.
    Whew! That explains it. I thought a lot of them were paranoid schizos. Good to know they're just limp-dicked geezer losers.

    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    Its becoming more and more clear to me the Defeated President is done. These people still exist, waiting for another justification to come back from their hiding places.
    Agreed. Going after a former President is an unusual thing. Nixon was the last. He was smart enough to resign and forestall legal action. That won't happen with Trump.

    TrumpCo has some very serious problems facing it. Trump himself is going to get exactly what he wanted: The most famous President in the 21st Century. ROFLMAO

    Stephanie Grisham stated in a CNN interview this morning that Ivanka was "the voice of reason" in the room. She also stated that Trump liked to have private meetings in the residence, not the Oval Office, leading up to the Insurrection plot. Although Grisham knows (and testified) who was in these meetings, she never knew what happened in them.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

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    Hello Jarod,

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    "We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."


    These 52 words were presented to the Constitutional Convention by the "Committee on Style" and adopted to be what we call the Preamble to the Constitution. It is as good of a place to start our study of the United States Constitution as any. While there is debate as to the use of the Preamble to establish law and or structure of American government, it is clearly an attempt to set the tone and explain what the document is, how it is to be viewed and the what the document is intended to be and do.

    1) "We the People of the United States..." The first seven words show us the class of people who this document applies to... There were several drafts of this portion of the Constitution including "We the people of the various states" as is used in the Articles of Confederation and there was" or "We the People of the various states" and "The People of the united States... (listing them)" as was used in the Treaty of France. It is commonly noted that the drafters did not know how many States would sign on so listing them was a bad idea. The choice of the novel previously unused phrase "We the People of the United States" creates the existence of an actual Nation of people called the United States... Note that they capitalized the phrase "United States" making it an entity on its own. The States are not even mentioned in the preamble.

    2) "In Order to form a more perfect Union" - The reason the Constitution was written, and to establish its supremacy over the previous Government created by the Articles of Confederation.

    3) "This Constitution..." is also another important phrase, establishing that this is it, the entirety of what is to be considered The Constitution, establishing that it was to be this single document as distinguished from what English Government calls its Document which is a series of Writings and Documents cobbled together to establish the form and structure of their government. The single document Constitution was a novel idea for these former English Subjects.

    4) Particularly interesting is the actual power the "Preamble" has had when interpreting the Constitution of the United States, the Supreme Court has used it to illustrate the intent of the framers as to what powers they actually intended to give with the subsequent Articles. In, Berman v. Parker, 348 US 26 (1954) the Court held that the term "promote the general welfare.." illustrates that the writers intended to give the Federal Government powers that enabled them to promote the general welfare, in that case use the right of eminent domain.
    Well, as soon as you wanted to talk about promoting the general welfare the right was out. No interest. They simply lack the capacity to even recognize those words. It's like the first half of the second amendment. As far as they are concerned, it doesn't exist.
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.

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    Hello Dutch,

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    What's to discuss? Trumpers want to shred the Constitution, all other Americans want to support and defend it.

    I'm in the "support and defend against all enemies, foreign and domestic" category.
    But if you ask them, it's the other way around. They think liberals want to trash the constitution, think they are the ones upholding it.
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by PoliTalker View Post
    Hello Dutch,

    But if you ask them, it's the other way around. They think liberals want to trash the constitution, think they are the ones upholding it.
    They lie a lot just like their hero, Il Douche.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

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    Hello Jarod,

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    I just wondered if with a little education some might see the errors of their ways.
    Dreaming is fun.
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.

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    Hello Jarod,

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    Its becoming more and more clear to me the Defeated President is done. These people still exist, waiting for another justification to come back from their hiding places.
    No he is not. We have to lock him up to keep him out of office.
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    Agreed. Going after a former President is an unusual thing. Nixon was the last. He was smart enough to resign and forestall legal action. That won't happen with Trump.

    TrumpCo has some very serious problems facing it. Trump himself is going to get exactly what he wanted: The most famous President in the 21st Century. ROFLMAO

    Stephanie Grisham stated in a CNN interview this morning that Ivanka was "the voice of reason" in the room. She also stated that Trump liked to have private meetings in the residence, not the Oval Office, leading up to the Insurrection plot. Although Grisham knows (and testified) who was in these meetings, she never knew what happened in them.
    Secrecy can be evidence of conciousness of guilt.
    4,487

    18 U.S. Code § 2071 - Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally
    44 U.S.C. 2202 - The United States shall reserve and retain complete ownership, possession, and control of Presidential records; and such records shall be administered in accordance with the provisions of this chapter.


    LOCK HIM UP!

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    Quote Originally Posted by PoliTalker View Post
    Hello Jarod,



    Well, as soon as you wanted to talk about promoting the general welfare the right was out. No interest. They simply lack the capacity to even recognize those words. It's like the first half of the second amendment. As far as they are concerned, it doesn't exist.
    This is my point, they need to learn about the Constitution if they are going to pretend things are unconstitutional.
    4,487

    18 U.S. Code § 2071 - Concealment, removal, or mutilation generally
    44 U.S.C. 2202 - The United States shall reserve and retain complete ownership, possession, and control of Presidential records; and such records shall be administered in accordance with the provisions of this chapter.


    LOCK HIM UP!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    Secrecy can be evidence of conciousness of guilt.
    True. It's circumstantial but is evidence that a closer look is warranted. The fact that every time a state takes a closer look at TrumpCo they find dirt should be disturbing to many.

    In 2016 I recall an interview of business/political insiders who commented that Trump was warned that by running for President, his businesses and personal activities would come under intense scrutiny for any crimes. Trump blew them off. LOL
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

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    Hello Jarod,

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    This is my point, they need to learn about the Constitution if they are going to pretend things are unconstitutional.
    Good luck. The right will not listen to reason. They get all their knowledge from entertainment pundits who testify in court that everyone should know they cannot be relied upon to report fact.

    We have to wonder why it is called the right when they have such a penchant for getting things so wrong!
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    This is my point, they need to learn about the Constitution if they are going to pretend things are unconstitutional.
    Good theory but you're referencing limp-dicked geezers living in a retirement facility with nothing to do but support Trump and hate America ideals of freedom, democracy and unity.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarod View Post
    this is just the start. If and when I have time I will continue with other parts of the constitution. Parts are important, including the preamble. Very significant part of the preamble is the promotion of the common good. The writers were very specific about the words they chose the capitalizations and the sentence structure.

    It’s more than just a forward, it’s an intention statement, that can be used when discussing the framers intent in later portions.
    Actually, not. The preamble is like an executive summary in a long report. It isn't the 'meat and potatoes' of the Constitution and is essentially a throw-away sentence in importance.

    The Constitution, as written, was meant as a check on government, a restraint. "To promote the common welfare" is so vague a statement as to be meaningless other than as a platitude. What restraint is placed on that statement? What are the limits of it? That's how the rest of the Constitution is framed, so why would those writing it put in a clause or sentence that could be interpreted so broadly as to render most of the rest of the document meaningless unless that sentence was meant to be meaningless?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    Translation: Fuck the Preamble. Trump can shit all over it because "It isn't law".

    Agreed it's not law, but disagreed that you and your fellow traitors can shit all over it.


    BTW, more and more Republicans are supporting the Republican party over the Party of Trump. How long before houses that sport Trump stickers and flags are treated like those with Nazi flags?

    Eggs? TP? A gallon of gasoline? Some people are truly fucking stupid....but sometimes are useful idiots.

    Get some professional help dude. Your TDS is at insane levels.

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