Members banned from this thread: BRUTALITOPS, Minister of Truth, The Anonymous, cancel2 2022, PostmodernProphet, Legion, Truth Detector, Niche Political Commentor, Superfreak, volsrock, Yurt, Earl, Lord Yurt, saltydancin, OG Yurt, serenity, Yakuda and ParachuteAdams


Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 31 to 39 of 39

Thread: Aristotle meets Hinduism

  1. #31 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    136,580
    Thanks
    46,730
    Thanked 68,586 Times in 51,899 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 2,506 Times in 2,463 Posts
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    My understanding is that the lesson of Baghavad Gita is that the disciplined person acts with commitment to duty and obligation, regardless of the results of the action. Too much attachment to results lead to desire, anger, frustration.

    > One cannot go through life simply trying to avoid bad karma. Spiritual liberation can be achieved by disciplined commitment to family and caste.
    Agreed. People who worship sports or political heroes are eventually disappointed.

    People who respect the higher callings of duty, honor, country are less disappointed in my experience.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

  2. #32 | Top
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    57,777
    Thanks
    35,457
    Thanked 50,276 Times in 27,089 Posts
    Groans
    22
    Groaned 2,975 Times in 2,692 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    Agreed. People who worship sports or political heroes are eventually disappointed.

    People who respect the higher callings of duty, honor, country are less disappointed in my experience.
    That is where the Hindus split off from the Jains

    Jainism embraces a concept of total non-violence.
    .
    The Hindus maintain that you may have to go to war and kill people for a just cause, and technically that will bring you bad karma. But the act of pure commitment to duty, obligation, and family is in itself a form of spiritual purification.

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Cypress For This Post:

    Doc Dutch (01-11-2022)

  4. #33 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    136,580
    Thanks
    46,730
    Thanked 68,586 Times in 51,899 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 2,506 Times in 2,463 Posts
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    That is where the Hindus split off from the Jains

    Jainism embraces a concept of total non-violence.
    .
    The Hindus maintain that you may have to go to war and kill people for a just cause, and technically that will bring you bad karma. But the act of pure commitment to duty, obligation, and family is in itself a form of spiritual purification.
    Which do you believe is most accurate?

    Studying the history of religion is great. What makes it greater is what we, as a species, learn from it.

    Personally, I'm with the Hindis on this one: there is universal truth but there is not a universal requirement for behavior. There are a lot of "It depends".

    Example; is self-defense moral? IMO, yes, but there are a lot of "it depends" such as "Did I provoke the attack in the first place"?

    If we are to believe that our actions as mortals affect our post-mortal existence, then we're not really talking about "killing" people, right?

    More like "Kick out of out of the club"? They just move on to wherever we all go.

    OTOH, if killing them means they are D-E-A-D forever, then so what? No posts-mortal consequences, only mortal ones.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to Doc Dutch For This Post:

    Cypress (01-11-2022)

  6. #34 | Top
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    57,777
    Thanks
    35,457
    Thanked 50,276 Times in 27,089 Posts
    Groans
    22
    Groaned 2,975 Times in 2,692 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    Which do you believe is most accurate?

    Studying the history of religion is great. What makes it greater is what we, as a species, learn from it.

    Personally, I'm with the Hindis on this one: there is universal truth but there is not a universal requirement for behavior. There are a lot of "It depends".

    Example; is self-defense moral? IMO, yes, but there are a lot of "it depends" such as "Did I provoke the attack in the first place"?

    If we are to believe that our actions as mortals affect our post-mortal existence, then we're not really talking about "killing" people, right?

    More like "Kick out of out of the club"? They just move on to wherever we all go.

    OTOH, if killing them means they are D-E-A-D forever, then so what? No posts-mortal consequences, only mortal ones.
    I respect the Christian pacifism of the Quakers, and the binding commitment to non-violence of the Jains.

    But the fact is that duty and moral obligation may require actions which superficially bring bad karma or are seemingly contrary to Jesus' pacifism.

    The Hindus, Saint Augustine, and Muhammed all basically made the case for a type of just war, in light of that dilemma.

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Cypress For This Post:

    Doc Dutch (01-11-2022)

  8. #35 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    136,580
    Thanks
    46,730
    Thanked 68,586 Times in 51,899 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 2,506 Times in 2,463 Posts
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    I respect the Christian pacifism of the Quakers, and the binding commitment to non-violence of the Jains.

    But the fact is that duty and moral obligation may require actions which superficially bring bad karma or are seemingly contrary to Jesus' pacifism.

    The Hindus, Saint Augustine, and Muhammed all basically made the case for a type of just war, in light of that dilemma.
    I see no bad karma in a just cause.

    If an attacker murders a mother and is raping one of her kids, I have no problem shooting him in the back of the head. Sad? Yes. Sadder for the motherless child and the trauma they suffer.

    Looking at the bigger picture; if we see everything as one, then shooting the rapist/murderer is no different than removing a cancerous mole in order to preserve the integrity of the whole being.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

  9. #36 | Top
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    57,777
    Thanks
    35,457
    Thanked 50,276 Times in 27,089 Posts
    Groans
    22
    Groaned 2,975 Times in 2,692 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    I see no bad karma in a just cause.

    If an attacker murders a mother and is raping one of her kids, I have no problem shooting him in the back of the head. Sad? Yes. Sadder for the motherless child and the trauma they suffer.

    Looking at the bigger picture; if we see everything as one, then shooting the rapist/murderer is no different than removing a cancerous mole in order to preserve the integrity of the whole being.
    Yes, in those extreme cases, the moral imperatives seems crystal clear.

    In Baghavad Gita, Arjuna is faced with the prospect of killing his own cousins, friends, and teachers who are fielded in the opposing army, creating for him a moral dilemma.

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to Cypress For This Post:

    Doc Dutch (01-11-2022)

  11. #37 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    136,580
    Thanks
    46,730
    Thanked 68,586 Times in 51,899 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 2,506 Times in 2,463 Posts
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    Yes, in those extreme cases, the moral imperatives seems crystal clear.

    In Baghavad Gita, Arjuna is faced with the prospect of killing his own cousins, friends, and teachers who are fielded in the opposing army, creating for him a moral dilemma.
    Stories like Arjuna's, like the parables of Jesus, are great for conveying ideas and dilemmas facing each of us be it the Prodigal Son or killing friends and relatives in an opposing army.

    Again, I do not see it as a moral dilemma. One gives their word, their word is their bond and if that bond means fighting an opposing enemy to the death, then the moral thing to do is fight.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Doc Dutch For This Post:

    Cypress (01-11-2022)

  13. #38 | Top
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    57,777
    Thanks
    35,457
    Thanked 50,276 Times in 27,089 Posts
    Groans
    22
    Groaned 2,975 Times in 2,692 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    Stories like Arjuna's, like the parables of Jesus, are great for conveying ideas and dilemmas facing each of us be it the Prodigal Son or killing friends and relatives in an opposing army.

    Again, I do not see it as a moral dilemma. One gives their word, their word is their bond and if that bond means fighting an opposing enemy to the death, then the moral thing to do is fight.
    understood.

    My project is to read or skim one foundational text from each major world faith tradition.

    I wrapped up Saint Augustine's Confessions and the Analects of Confucius. On my picklist are Buddhism's Lotus Sutra, the Zhuangzi from the Daoist tradition, and probably some combination of Ruth and Isiah from the Hebrew Bible. Not sure what I am going to do about Islam yet. Maybe Fox News will have some tips!

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to Cypress For This Post:

    Doc Dutch (01-15-2022)

  15. #39 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    136,580
    Thanks
    46,730
    Thanked 68,586 Times in 51,899 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 2,506 Times in 2,463 Posts
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    understood.

    My project is to read or skim one foundational text from each major world faith tradition.

    I wrapped up Saint Augustine's Confessions and the Analects of Confucius. On my picklist are Buddhism's Lotus Sutra, the Zhuangzi from the Daoist tradition, and probably some combination of Ruth and Isiah from the Hebrew Bible. Not sure what I am going to do about Islam yet. Maybe Fox News will have some tips!
    Obviously all are great topics of research in ancient and current major religions.

    My best advice is to invert that list. When I was working on my International Relations masters in 1989 most of the classes were on the Soviet Union. The cracks were already visible in the USSR and, looking to break out of the officer promotion pack, started looking at where the next wars would be; I picked South America and the Middle-East. Good for everyone is that the South American thing didn't pan out. LOL

    With that logic in mind, and to better understand both the modern world and direction mankind is heading, I'd study the largest/most influential religions first.
    Academically, your order would be the most logical. Using "practical reasoning" would be my approach.
    God bless America and those who defend our Constitution.

    "Hatred is a failure of imagination" - Graham Greene, "The Power and the Glory"

  16. The Following User Says Thank You to Doc Dutch For This Post:

    Cypress (01-15-2022)

Similar Threads

  1. Aristotle's idea of God
    By BidenPresident in forum Religion, Philosophy, and Ethics
    Replies: 56
    Last Post: 09-20-2021, 06:12 PM
  2. The truth others dont want to hear Complex of Aristotle ,
    By Bulletbob in forum Current Events Forum
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 09-12-2021, 06:00 PM
  3. Aristotle outs Democrats on multiculturalism and 1/6
    By artichoke in forum Current Events Forum
    Replies: 24
    Last Post: 07-13-2021, 10:00 AM
  4. US meets Russia
    By Micawber in forum Current Events Forum
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 06-16-2021, 11:21 AM
  5. Aristotle Would Repeal The XVII Amendment
    By Flanders in forum Conspiracies and Conspiracy Theories Forum
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 09-28-2019, 02:39 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Rules

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •