MILITARY - aircraft carriers are dinosaurs? Agree or disagree?

[McRocket]

1) Stop building ridiculous, Carrier Strike Groups.

They are fucking dinosaurs and cost GIGANTIC, amounts of money.
Once hypersonic missiles are perfected and in mass production? That is the END of the aircraft carrier as THE naval weapon system.
50 hypersonic missiles with mid-course guidance adjustments and multiple decoys could EASILY overpower a US Carrier Strike Group's AA assets.
No way Ticonderoga's and Arleigh Burke's can defend the group from over 150 targets (with decoys) coming in at 200 feet at Mach 10. Especially if the first one takes out any AEW assets that were airborne (a Hawkeye).
Over-the-horizon limitations would limit the time the Carrier group would have to acquire the targets, Say their radar was 80 feet off of the surface? That means they would not acquire the missiles until they were about 175 miles away or so. Maybe a bit more.
https://science.howstuffworks.com/question198.htm

At Mach 10 (and they might be faster) or about 2 miles a second? That gives them 100 seconds TOPS from the time they first acquire the targets to track them, lock on to them and fire.
It is virtually (to my knowledge) impossible for 2 Ticonderoga's and 3 Arleigh Burke's (the normal maximum escorts in a Carrier Strike Group) to take out ALL of the missiles/decoys in 100 seconds.
And even if they have new, laser anti-missile systems on board and they are effective.
At least - IMO - 5 or 6 of those 50 missiles will get through.
And I doubt that even a Ford Class aircraft carrier could withstand the kinetic energy alone of 5 or 6 missiles plowing into her at 7,000 miles an hour. Certainly, she would be COMPLETELY out of action for a while.

Aircraft carriers are DINOSAURS.


2) SSGN's are the future.

An Ohio SSGN can carry up to 154 Tomahawk cruise missiles.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Ohio_(SSGN-726)

And each missiles can attack up to five, separate targets and have mid-course, guidance correction.
https://www.shephardmedia.com/news/n...rminal-guidan/

That means the Ohio could sail undetected to the coast of China, surface, launch off all of her missiles, re-submerge, sail away for missile replenishment without significant risk of getting attacked.
And her missiles could - theoretically - take out over 700 targets.
All with NO risk of a pilot being shot down and killed/captured.
And 1 SSGN costs about 1/10'th of a Carrier Strike Group.
If not less.

Amphibious Assault ships still have some role to play.
But dinosaurs?
America should stop building new ones IMMEDIATELY.
And they could then cut back on all these insane numbers of cruisers and destroyers to escort these lumbering hogs.

And save hundreds of billions over ten years.

[Hawkeye10]

aircraft carriers are dinosaurs? Agree or disagree?

I have not made up my mind, but this is a subject that I am highly interested in.

I am pretty sure however that the Empire (The New Chinese Empire...China/Russia/Iran and probably pakistan) believe that the days of the carrier are over.

I also saw the other day one of the top Admirals saying that he wished we had three times the number of carriers that we have.

I wondered what planet he lives on.

[Hawkeye10]

I suspect that the Chinese have made the calculation that all they need to do is sink two carriers with extensive lose of life to get us to sit down and shut up.

And that they dont figure this to be a problem.

[Hawkeye10]

Boy, our newest carrier sure is a very expensive piece of shit.

The Chinese and their friends are no doubt laughing their asses off.

[Hawkeye10]

With a Navy that is fucked as ours is does what they have even matter?

[McRocket]

I have not made up my mind, but this is a subject that I am highly interested in.

I am pretty sure however that the Empire (The New Chinese Empire...China/Russia/Iran and probably pakistan) believe that the days of the carrier are over.

I also saw the other day one of the top Admirals saying that he wished we had three times the number of carriers that we have.

I wondered what planet he lives on.

I don't even understand why medium sized countries are - lately, seemingly - getting addicted to them?

I still see the purpose of an amphibious assault ship.
Especially for those smaller countries.

But what the HECK Great Britain is EVER going to do with two, 65,000 ton carriers?
When her 'empire' in the Pacific consists of only Pitcairn Island with 50 people?
Is TOTALLY beyond me.

And not content to mess up their finances with building the two QE's?
Then they turn around and make them V/STOL carriers?
A 65,000 ton V/STOL carrier?
And now the RN is stuck with American F-35B's that can carry far less internally and with a far shorter range than the 'C' variant.
Or just about any other fixed-wing, carrier-based, combat aircraft.
And they are barely 'stealthy' at all.
http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-2009-01.html

They should have just did what the French did (with less teething troubles).
Assuming they just HAD to have carriers.
Make them about 40,000 tons and with catapults.
And navalize their 'Typhoons' for the job.
And buy Hawkeye AEW's.
Instead of sticking Crowsnest pods on their Merlins.
That they now realize are garbage...so they are retiring them.
https://defbrief.com/2021/05/12/roya...rs-of-service/

I am no genius.
Why can I (and others) see the obviousness of all this and the ones in charge cannot?

[Hawkeye10]

I don't even understand why medium sized countries are - lately, seemingly - getting addicted to them?

I still see the purpose of an amphibious assault ship.
Especially for those smaller countries.

But what the HECK Great Britain is EVER going to do with two, 65,000 ton carriers?
When her 'empire' in the Pacific consists of only Pitcairn Island with 50 people?
Is TOTALLY beyond me.

And not content to mess up their finances with building the two QE's?
Then they turn around and make them V/STOL carriers?
A 65,000 ton V/STOL carrier?
And now the RN is stuck with American F-35B's that can carry far less internally and with a far shorter range than the 'C' variant.
Or just about any other fixed-wing, carrier-based, combat aircraft.

They should have just did what the French did (with less teething troubles).
Assuming they just HAD to have carriers.
Make them about 40,000 tons and with catapults.
And navalize their 'Typhoons' for the job.
And buy Hawkeye AEW's.
Instead of sticking Crowsnest pods on their Merlins.
That they now realize are garbage...so they are retiring them.
https://defbrief.com/2021/05/12/roya...rs-of-service/

I am no genius.
Why can I (and others) see the obviousness of all this and the ones in charge cannot?

I am too far gone for this...I drink, I eat only the best, I am a sex fiend, I smoke 90% indica 10% indica kief bowls every day....I know what I am doing!

You are a breath of fresh air.

Please Stay.

[McRocket]

I am too far gone for this...I drink, I eat only the best, I am a sex fiend, I smoke 90% indica 10% indica kief bowls every day....I know what I am doing!

You are a breath of fresh air.

Please Stay.

Thank you very much.


So are you.
Seriously.

BTW - sounds like you have a HECK of a good life.

[Hawkeye10]

Thank you very much.


So are you.
Seriously.

BTW - sounds like you have a HECK of a good life.

I come from an abuse background and here is something I learned by age 11:

Living well is the best revenge.

I did that.

[Hawkeye10]

Look....I have been in some places and I have been thrown out of almost of them.

But I am here still.

Think about it.

[Hawkeye10]

Damo might just be a GOD.

Right under TOP!

[McRocket]

I come from an abuse background and here is something I learned by age 11:

Living well is the best revenge.

I did that.

I am sincerely sorry you had to learn that.
At 11 no less!

But it pleases me you are now living well.

[Hawkeye10]

I am sincerely sorry you had to learn that.
At 11 no less!

But it pleases me you are now living well.

Thank You.

The abuse in many ways turned out to be a blessing, which I am not allowed to say, but the West is dying, so I have stopped caring about the rules.

The RULES have not worked.

Steve.

[Hawkeye10]

So far as I can tell China and Russia already have denial of access so fine tuned that carriers are now useless against the Empire.

Maybe against Iran....maybe.

[Jack]

I think nuclear detonations eliminate submarines.

"A nuclear depth bomb is the nuclear equivalent of the conventional depth charge, and can be used in anti-submarine warfare for attacking submerged submarines. The Royal Navy, Soviet Navy, and United States Navy had nuclear depth bombs in their arsenals at one point.

Nuclear depth bomb - Wikipedia"