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Thread: Vox - Itís time for Americans to buy less stuff

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    Default Vox - Itís time for Americans to buy less stuff

    It's a long article so I just posted the link. The gist is really focused on climate change and the (negative) effects our consumption habits have on the environment, thus the need for us to purchase and consume less.

    Fair enough. My question is an economic one. We know how much spending drives our economy. And to a certain group politically the argument in support of higher taxes and transferring of money is the rich don't spend enough and thus giving it to people who will (lower income folks) stimulates more growth.

    How can these two co-exist? One can argue we should consume less because its best for the planet and if we get slower economic growth as a result then so be it. But realistically its hard to win elections on that message (slower growth is good). The article references shopping sustainably but states that even that is still consumption.

    Anyone here have a way they blend the two?



    Itís time for Americans to buy less stuff

    Thanks to the supply chain crisis, holiday shopping wonít be easy this year ó even if you buy early.


    https://www.vox.com/the-goods/227250...liday-shopping

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    It's a pretty interesting contradiction, as you state.

    I think the premise is correct, though. It's like we're in the infant stage of humanity, and will eventually mature & understand how to live in a way that is more conducive for the planet's health & long-term survival.

    The answer likely lies in rethinking the economy entirely. An economy as reliant on consumer spending as ours is just isn't compatible with the future health of our environment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    It's a long article so I just posted the link. The gist is really focused on climate change and the (negative) effects our consumption habits have on the environment, thus the need for us to purchase and consume less.

    Fair enough. My question is an economic one. We know how much spending drives our economy. And to a certain group politically the argument in support of higher taxes and transferring of money is the rich don't spend enough and thus giving it to people who will (lower income folks) stimulates more growth.

    How can these two co-exist? One can argue we should consume less because its best for the planet and if we get slower economic growth as a result then so be it. But realistically its hard to win elections on that message (slower growth is good). The article references shopping sustainably but states that even that is still consumption.

    Anyone here have a way they blend the two?
    Itís time for Americans to buy less stuff
    Thanks to the supply chain crisis, holiday shopping wonít be easy this year ó even if you buy early.


    https://www.vox.com/the-goods/227250...liday-shopping
    think China is going to consume less? India- and the rest of the world?
    (Reminds me of Paris Accord)

    It's pathetic. live in a cave use bear hides to keep warm and dont buy stuff. Dem prosperity

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    The Virus is just one kink in the Supply Chain! Stagnant wages is another.

    Seeing all of those container ships backed up is a reminder of what a global economy we are part of- and how much we depend on it.

    Should be a wake-up call for some- even if the kink is just a temporary problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by anatta View Post
    think China is going to consume less? India- and the rest of the world?
    (Reminds me of Paris Accord)

    It's pathetic. live in a cave use bear hides to keep warm and dont buy stuff. Dem prosperity
    You bring up an excellent point. There are tens, if not hundreds, of millions of people in those two countries who desire to move up into a more middle class lifestyle. And if they do so that would include middle class purchase/consumption habits which would have large effects on the climate. Can't see them reacting too positively to the rest of the world telling them if would be bad for all of us if they do (move up to a middle class life style).

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    Discontinuing procreation seems like the best answer to every problem.
    Let's give cockroaches an opportunity to run the planet for a while.
    They're supposed to be pretty durable.
    Maybe, given the opportunity, they'll be creative as well.
    Patriotism is the last refuge of a a scoundrel. Samuel Johnson, 1775
    Religion....is the opiate of the people. Karl Marx, 1848

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    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    It's a long article so I just posted the link. The gist is really focused on climate change and the (negative) effects our consumption habits have on the environment, thus the need for us to purchase and consume less.

    Fair enough. My question is an economic one. We know how much spending drives our economy. And to a certain group politically the argument in support of higher taxes and transferring of money is the rich don't spend enough and thus giving it to people who will (lower income folks) stimulates more growth.

    How can these two co-exist? One can argue we should consume less because its best for the planet and if we get slower economic growth as a result then so be it. But realistically its hard to win elections on that message (slower growth is good). The article references shopping sustainably but states that even that is still consumption.

    Anyone here have a way they blend the two?



    It’s time for Americans to buy less stuff

    Thanks to the supply chain crisis, holiday shopping won’t be easy this year — even if you buy early.


    https://www.vox.com/the-goods/227250...liday-shopping
    Too much packaging
    Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. Albert Einstein

    America's future is bright, not white



    ברוך השם

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    It's a pretty interesting contradiction, as you state.

    I think the premise is correct, though. It's like we're in the infant stage of humanity, and will eventually mature & understand how to live in a way that is more conducive for the planet's health & long-term survival.

    The answer likely lies in rethinking the economy entirely. An economy as reliant on consumer spending as ours is just isn't compatible with the future health of our environment.
    I would dearly love to know what you think IS compatible with the future health of the environment
    In a combat situation it is about 16 times better to do something useful and violent right away than to wait and figure out something even more useful and violent later.
    ďwhenever you put your faith in big government for any reason, sooner or later you end up an apologist for mass murder.Ē

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geeko Sportivo View Post
    The Virus is just one kink in the Supply Chain! Stagnant wages is another.

    Seeing all of those container ships backed up is a reminder of what a global economy we are part of- and how much we depend on it.

    Should be a wake-up call for some- even if the kink is just a temporary problem.
    would you be averse to a more locally defined economy?
    In a combat situation it is about 16 times better to do something useful and violent right away than to wait and figure out something even more useful and violent later.
    ďwhenever you put your faith in big government for any reason, sooner or later you end up an apologist for mass murder.Ē

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    Quote Originally Posted by SmarterthanYou View Post
    would you be averse to a more locally defined economy?
    Well, sure when we start growing our own coffee beans, growing our own bananas, and spinning our own silk!

    I'm all for it- I say go for it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geeko Sportivo View Post
    Well, sure when we start growing our own coffee beans, growing our own bananas, and spinning our own silk!

    I'm all for it- I say go for it!
    but it has to start with something, right? so how do you excuse local municipalities prohibiting gardens in the confines of ones own property? or the ability to keep livestock on ones own property?

    LOCAL, remember?
    In a combat situation it is about 16 times better to do something useful and violent right away than to wait and figure out something even more useful and violent later.
    ďwhenever you put your faith in big government for any reason, sooner or later you end up an apologist for mass murder.Ē

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    We still my need people for dress shoes, sunglasses, and the last of the internal combustion grand touring cars.
    Not to mention olive oil. Otherwise we're buying it from Greeks or Spaniards anyway.
    Patriotism is the last refuge of a a scoundrel. Samuel Johnson, 1775
    Religion....is the opiate of the people. Karl Marx, 1848

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    Quote Originally Posted by NiftyNiblick View Post
    We still my need people for dress shoes, sunglasses, and the last of the internal combustion grand touring cars.
    Not to mention olive oil. Otherwise we're buying it from Greeks or Spaniards anyway.
    can dress shoes not be made in America? sunglasses? IC engines? what can you not do with any other kind of oil, except olive oil?
    In a combat situation it is about 16 times better to do something useful and violent right away than to wait and figure out something even more useful and violent later.
    ďwhenever you put your faith in big government for any reason, sooner or later you end up an apologist for mass murder.Ē

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    Quote Originally Posted by SmarterthanYou View Post
    but it has to start with something, right? so how do you excuse local municipalities prohibiting gardens in the confines of ones own property? or the ability to keep livestock on ones own property?

    LOCAL, remember?
    I think we agree on property rights my friend!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geeko Sportivo View Post
    I think we agree on property rights my friend!
    I hope so. I seem to remember most of it. given that, do you not think that a local economy could do as well as any global economy?
    In a combat situation it is about 16 times better to do something useful and violent right away than to wait and figure out something even more useful and violent later.
    ďwhenever you put your faith in big government for any reason, sooner or later you end up an apologist for mass murder.Ē

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