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Thread: The Big Lie and the future of the American Experiment

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    Default The Big Lie and the future of the American Experiment

    We're at that stage of our development where we are now taking the miracle that the founders concocted very much for granted. It's like the stage a sports dynasty gets to when they've been winning a long time. They get complacent, and think it will always be that way, so they let great players walk, decide to rest on their laurels and within a year or 2 find themselves in last place.

    Newsom called it, with the clumsiest but most appropriate analogy of his speech: our democracy is not a football to be tossed around. It is a precious, fragile antique vase.

    The persistence of the Big Lie is a threat to all future elections and the very foundation on which we are built. Even now, Trump and the GOP are promoting candidates for 2022 with belief & promotion of the Big Lie as the top qualifying criteria. They want candidates who push the idea that American elections have no integrity.

    In short, we're blowing it. We have a very good thing going here. We live better than literally billions have lived throughout world history. Free lives, where we can choose to be just about anything we want to be. Go back 100 years, and no country in the world - through thousands of years of history - ever knew this kind of liberty and opportunity.

    And in future classrooms, students will ask how this version of the American republic ended, and why people believed the Big Lie. And the teacher will respond that there was no evidence or even anything unusual about the 2020 election. The only reason millions of people believed it was stolen was because a pathological liar who hates losing told them it was stolen.

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    the great experiment died at the hands of Lincoln in the mid 1800s
    A sad commentary on we, as a people, and our viewpoint of our freedom can be summed up like this. We have liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, yet those very people look at Constitutionalists as radical and extreme.................so those liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans must believe that the constitution is radical and extreme.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    We're at that stage of our development where we are now taking the miracle that the founders concocted very much for granted. It's like the stage a sports dynasty gets to when they've been winning a long time. They get complacent, and think it will always be that way, so they let great players walk, decide to rest on their laurels and within a year or 2 find themselves in last place.

    Newsom called it, with the clumsiest but most appropriate analogy of his speech: our democracy is not a football to be tossed around. It is a precious, fragile antique vase.

    The persistence of the Big Lie is a threat to all future elections and the very foundation on which we are built. Even now, Trump and the GOP are promoting candidates for 2022 with belief & promotion of the Big Lie as the top qualifying criteria. They want candidates who push the idea that American elections have no integrity.

    In short, we're blowing it. We have a very good thing going here. We live better than literally billions have lived throughout world history. Free lives, where we can choose to be just about anything we want to be. Go back 100 years, and no country in the world - through thousands of years of history - ever knew this kind of liberty and opportunity.

    And in future classrooms, students will ask how this version of the American republic ended, and why people believed the Big Lie. And the teacher will respond that there was no evidence or even anything unusual about the 2020 election. The only reason millions of people believed it was stolen was because a pathological liar who hates losing told them it was stolen.

    Republicans talk values and Democrats talk procedures. Biden thinks Americans want to hear about vaccines every single day and wants to be a practical president.
    One consequence is we may solve the pandemic and lose our democracy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BidenPresident View Post
    Republicans talk values and Democrats talk procedures.
    A sad commentary on we, as a people, and our viewpoint of our freedom can be summed up like this. We have liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, yet those very people look at Constitutionalists as radical and extreme.................so those liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans must believe that the constitution is radical and extreme.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SmarterthanYou View Post
    :lgh:
    ^^Moron

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    Quote Originally Posted by BidenPresident View Post
    ^^Moron
    need some butthurt salve, you low information zombie?
    A sad commentary on we, as a people, and our viewpoint of our freedom can be summed up like this. We have liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, yet those very people look at Constitutionalists as radical and extreme.................so those liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans must believe that the constitution is radical and extreme.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SmarterthanYou View Post
    need some butthurt salve, you low information zombie?
    you're a worthless troll

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    Quote Originally Posted by SmarterthanYou View Post
    the great experiment died at the hands of Lincoln in the mid 1800s
    ? Could you elaborate?

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    Default The right-wing media is helping Trump destroy democracy.

    The PRRI poll finds that 69 percent of Americans do not believe the election was stolen, while only 29 percent do believe this. That latter number largely reflects Republicans, among whom 71 percent believe it. Only very small minorities of independents and Democrats do.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...s-jan-6-trump/

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    Quote Originally Posted by anonymoose View Post
    ? Could you elaborate?
    https://www.ihr.org/jhr/v07/v07p319_Dickson.html
    A sad commentary on we, as a people, and our viewpoint of our freedom can be summed up like this. We have liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans, yet those very people look at Constitutionalists as radical and extreme.................so those liberals and conservatives, Democrats and Republicans must believe that the constitution is radical and extreme.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BidenPresident View Post
    The PRRI poll finds that 69 percent of Americans do not believe the election was stolen, while only 29 percent do believe this. That latter number largely reflects Republicans, among whom 71 percent believe it. Only very small minorities of independents and Democrats do.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...s-jan-6-trump/
    The Republican #'s are ridiculous. Over 70% who doubt the election.

    That is scary.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    The Republican #'s are ridiculous. Over 70% who doubt the election.

    That is scary.
    What’s the percentage of democrats and independents?
    Coup has started. First of many steps. Impeachment will follow ultimately~WB attorney Mark Zaid, January 2017

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    The Republican #'s are ridiculous. Over 70% who doubt the election.

    That is scary.
    Philosophers distinguish between fact and value. You can value Trump and want him to be president, but you cannot deny the facts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Omar View Post
    What’s the percentage of democrats and independents?
    The poll says that 86% of Dems trust the results. I didn't see a summary that broke down the remaining 14% (whether they're unsure or don't trust the election).

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    Quote Originally Posted by BartenderElite View Post
    The poll says that 86% of Dems trust the results. I didn't see a summary that broke down the remaining 14% (whether they're unsure or don't trust the election).
    In either case, that’s kind of a problem?

    The solution is: a) those who are skeptical stay shut up about it?

    Or b) do whatever is possible to make every election auditable down to the last vote cast. Go back to paper ballots if necessary.
    Coup has started. First of many steps. Impeachment will follow ultimately~WB attorney Mark Zaid, January 2017

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