PoliTalker (09-08-2021)
The problem with those using the defense that they thought they were following the president's wishes is that they are admitting to what they did.
I'm not sure anything leaked out. The Reuters study said a "former FBI" official said there was not collusion. That is probably true for the entire event but obviously there was some planning and collusion among individual smaller groups.
PoliTalker (09-08-2021)
The definition of a word is too vague to be used for a criminal conviction. A law has elements all of which must be met to convict.
Do you think the BLM rioters were trying to overthrow the government? You would have to show their intent to do so. The same applies to the Capitol rioters. It would be very difficult to do.
The prison term for insurrection or rebellion is no longer than ten years. A serious assault on a federal police officer probably carries a longer sentence.
PoliTalker (09-08-2021)
A federal judge has questioned one of the most serious charges against the rioters as being too vague and hard to distinguish from similar actions with less serious punishment:
"U.S. District Judge Amit P. Mehta asked how federal prosecutors distinguish felony conduct qualifying as “obstructing an official proceeding” of Congress — punishable by up to 20 years in prison — from misdemeanor offenses the government has charged others with, such as shouting to interrupt a congressional hearing."
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local...VsB7GwGWzOg_xk
Hello Flash,
We are not determining a criminal conviction here.
We are having a political discussion. You're trying to use rules which do not apply.
Now see? Nothing prevents you from going off into a different discussion. That would not be allowed in a court. You're trying to apply courtroom rules to deny other arguments, but breaking the same to forward your own. Duplicitous at best.
Now there's a good point. You've possibly hit on why we are not seeing charges for insurrection. It isn't because none of these cases meet the definition. It's because prosecutors can get longer sentencing by going after assault instead of insurrection.
Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.
Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.
Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.
I thought we were discussing whether the rioters could be charged with rebellion or insurrection. The rules would not apply in court but if we are having a political discussion it could be part of that discussion.
I know it would not be allowed in court, but it is part of our political discussion. I wasn't suggesting it could be used in court but the difficulties of insurrection charges.
You ignore the difficulty of insurrection charges. How do you prove the intent of the rioters was to overthrow the government? I think there were probably many different motivations involved including just joining the crowd. Mob psychology is powerful.
PoliTalker (09-08-2021)
Hello Flash,
News to me. I thought it was a discussion about trying to relabel the defendants as 'political prisoners.'
It's only part of the discussion because certain participants are trying to control the terminology and refuse to call and insurrection an insurrection. The problem is: it was an insurrection. A group revolted against our government and tried to force our government to do what they wanted instead of allowing the official proceeding to continue it's course.
I'm not trying to change the charges. I would simply like to see justice done.
Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.
Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you will be PERMANENTLY Ignore Listed. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I'll never read a word you write, even if quoted by another, nor respond to you, nor participate in your threads. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: Feel free to adopt my PIP. It works well.
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