Critical Race Theory

[PoliTalker]

Hello Flash,

I clearly said I have no desire to limit discussions, but as an old guy I have heard these discussions many times. Somebody makes a point and one person gives the standard liberal response and another gives the standard conservative response.

You said you believe/accept most of the tenets of CRT; yet, you also said a theory is a set of unproven assumptions. Why do you believe something that you say is unproven?

Put a bunch of white people in a room and tell them they are racists and you have already lost whatever you are trying to achieve. And, it makes little sense when CRT tells us there is no such thing as race.

I do not propose nor endorse telling white people they are racists as a basis for discussion. That comes from the right wing propaganda machine. The purpose of this RWPM interpretation is to derail any meaningful discussions before they can even get off the ground.

A big problem on the right is that they don't listen to the left. They always listen to some slanted analysis of the left's positions.

If you want to know what somebody on the left thinks, it is advisable to actually give a listen to that particular person.

But the right rarely does that. Instead, they listen to Fox or some other right-slanted talking head telling them what the left said, or presenting cherry-picked snippets of someone on the left, followed by the RWPM interpretation.

Because the right rarely even listens to the left, America stays divided.

[PoliTalker]

Hello Flash,

Sure, but he doesn't stop any discussions of racial issues.

Do you think you are perpetuating prejudice against the wealthy and corporations?

I try to give everyone fair treatment, while also holding them accountable for anti-social behavior.

[PoliTalker]

Hello Flash,

A lot of the propositions have been taught in the classroom for years including when I was in college in the 1960s. "Institutional racism" was much easier to describe when segregation prohibited blacks from participation. Today when everyone can participate and most institutions seek greater diversity it is much harder to make the same argument.

Many of my colleagues in the social sciences wanted to be able to preach against the evils but when most of those evils disappeared they had nothing more to use so they needed new evils like white privilege to substitute for segregation. They have a need to prove their superior morality and concern for minorities.

If all of our racial problems had been solved this might be a good argument.

They have not, so this is a BS argument.

[PoliTalker]

Hello Cypress,

It is this year's "War on Christmas".

No one in the rightwing was hollering about CRT 12 months ago in any measurable way.

It is this year's "War on Christmas".

The Right Wing Propaganda Machine has to constantly produce reasons for the right to hate the left. The last thing they want is for meaningful honest discussions to take place.

[Cypress]

Hello Cypress,



The Right Wing Propaganda Machine has to constantly produce reasons for the right to hate the left. The last thing they want is for meaningful honest discussions to take place.

I do not think they have any genuine policies they believe they can sell to a majority of voters, so we are down to CRT, Wars on Christmas, and gay marriage bans.

It looks like they gave up on school prayer and creationism in public schools.

[anatta]

Since you're in the academic world I find it interesting the many complaints about (institutional) racism at our Universities. You've seen it, progressives started taking over Universities in the '60's and little has changed since. Universities aren't being run by uneducated redneck Trump supporters. Yet these places are supposedly unwelcoming to and discriminate against P.O.C.

Your post is spot on. Ibram Kendi and the whole anti-racism movement is predicated around it is racist if we don't have equal outcomes. We're not talking equal opportunity but equal outcomes.

Bingo. you can't separate CRT from "equity" of outcomes

[anonymoose]

It looks like they gave up on school prayer and creationism in public schools.

They gave up on public schools, period, in Louisiana long ago. In every corner of the state. And that includes dems that can afford private or parochial schools. It’s considered child neglect to allow your kid to go to a public school there.

[T. A. Gardner]

Hello T. A. Gardner,



It has not been established that Freire was a communist. He was widely regarded in capitalist society.

https://liberationschool.org/pedagog...mass-movement/

The book that made these insights famous, Pedagogy of the Oppressed, was published in Portuguese in 1968, and in English in 1970, fifty years ago. For a book infused with Hegel from cover to cover, and peppered with footnotes invoking Frantz Fanon, Erich Fromm, Karl Marx, and Chairman Mao, it has been surprisingly popular and enduring. More than a million copies have been sold worldwide since the 1970 English translation.

https://daily.jstor.org/paulo-freire...ssed-at-fifty/

https://booksie.com/515435-revolutio...marx-to-freire

Clearly Freire was a Communist as he was using Marxist and Hegelian (along with some Mao tossed in) dogma as the basis for his Critical Pedagogy theories. Communists in Western nations have picked up from where Freire left off and expanded this pedagogy to all parts of education.

[T. A. Gardner]

Hello T. A. Gardner,



How would you seek to end racial inequality if not by learning and teaching how it works?

Freire was extremely successful in teaching illiterate workers to read by offering lessons with which they could identify.

Is CRT a similar method to teach about racism in terms in which people can identify?

I wouldn't teach race at all. Instead, I'd seek to ignore race as much as possible treating every student equally. You can make lessons relatable without using race as the basis. CRT uses racism to teach students to be race conscious. That is, it teaches students to be racist because they make race a central part of their thinking. If students didn't give a shit about race, race wouldn't matter and the problem of racism would diminish.

[anonymoose]

I wouldn't teach race at all. Instead, I'd seek to ignore race as much as possible treating every student equally. You can make lessons relatable without using race as the basis. CRT uses racism to teach students to be race conscious. That is, it teaches students to be racist because they make race a central part of their thinking. If students didn't give a shit about race, race wouldn't matter and the problem of racism would diminish.

And there you have it.
Coming up with new inventive ways to make things racist perpetuates it when it doesn’t really exist.
E.g., healthy diet, racist birds, mathematics, the English language, systemic racism despite AA in place since at least the 70’s. The left will always come up with something creative to make anything racist to keep it going.

[PoliTalker]

Hello Cypress,

I do not think they have any genuine policies they believe they can sell to a majority of voters, so we are down to CRT, Wars on Christmas, and gay marriage bans.

It looks like they gave up on school prayer and creationism in public schools.

I kind of liked freedom fries. That was fun.

[PoliTalker]

Hello T. A. Gardner,

https://liberationschool.org/pedagog...mass-movement/


https://daily.jstor.org/paulo-freire...ssed-at-fifty/

https://booksie.com/515435-revolutio...marx-to-freire

Clearly Freire was a Communist as he was using Marxist and Hegelian (along with some Mao tossed in) dogma as the basis for his Critical Pedagogy theories. Communists in Western nations have picked up from where Freire left off and expanded this pedagogy to all parts of education.

Not enough. Just because communists found out that he quotes Mao in a book that makes him a communist? Did he SAY he was a communist? Did he join a communist party? Did he fight for communism? Did he write that capitalism should be replaced with communism?

[Flash]

Hello Flash,

If all of our racial problems had been solved this might be a good argument.

They have not, so this is a BS argument.

What "argument" are you referring to? My point was simply that we have talked about all this stuff forever. That is not a bad thing, but illustrates that the "we need to have a conversation" proposal has not solved anything and cannot possibly include anything not previously discussed--JPP is a great example. We just keep repeating the same points.

[Flash]

Hello Flash,

I do not propose nor endorse telling white people they are racists as a basis for discussion. That comes from the right wing propaganda machine. The purpose of this RWPM interpretation is to derail any meaningful discussions before they can even get off the ground.

It also comes from the practices of those seeking to teach these programs--college classes, consultants offering in-service training to employees, college orientation programs.

CRT does exactly that---it starts with the premise that white people are racist. There are plenty of people of all races who are prejudiced and discriminate, but there are better methods to improve society than telling people they are the cause of all the problems.

Nobody who teaches CRT is going to investigate its tenets and conclude they are not valid and nobody who wants CRT taught want them to conclude that.

[cawacko]

What "argument" are you referring to? My point was simply that we have talked about all this stuff forever. That is not a bad thing, but illustrates that the "we need to have a conversation" proposal has not solved anything and cannot possibly include anything not previously discussed--JPP is a great example. We just keep repeating the same points.

This is random but I go back to my Pastor saying we need to dismantle white supremacy. It made me think of goal setting. At work it might I want to achieve a certain title, or a certain productional level or on a team it's we want to reach a certain number of wins. It's something tangible. But there's a lot of abstractness when it comes to defining or determining how we would go about dismantling white supremacy. What all does it entail and what metrics would we use to judge progress?