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Thread: Sigmund Freud vs. Carl Jung

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    Quote Originally Posted by goat View Post
    Christianity became the dominate religion through violence. My argument has always been that white suburban christian complicity is directly responsible for the situation we find ourselves in today. The marginalized are powerless but no longer depend on white suburban approval. Very few suburbanites realize the change young people are attempting to bring to America and the world as a whole.
    I think they do realize on some level. They see that young ppl are less religious, far more tolerant, more accepting of diversity and young ppl see it as a positive thing rather than the end of white/straight/Xtian hegemony. Hence their fear and anger at how the world is changing around them.
    “Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.” -- Gandhi

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantasmal View Post
    Exactly, it’s why I’m more attracted to Eastern, pagan, Native American spirituality than Judeao/Christianity.
    Same here. To know that I am part of creation satisfies my soul.

    The separation from creation taught by western religions is at least partially responsible for the environmental destruction we have wrought on the planet. Then you have ppl who live in boxes in crowded cities, far from even the local weather. They don't care about a forest 100 miles away being cut down so there can be more boxes built. They don't care if the place where they work is poisoning their air. Inside the boxes, the air seems clear enough. The water comes out and seems clean enough.
    “Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.” -- Gandhi

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantasmal View Post
    Exactly, it’s why I’m more attracted to Eastern, pagan, Native American spirituality than Judeao/Christianity.
    I like aspects of Daoism, animism, Buddhism.

    I have generally found there are bits and pieces of all religious traditions I can find inspiration in.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantasmal View Post
    I was fascinated by Jung’s archetypes. Joseph Campbell discussed them in his series with Bill Moyer. Great stuff. I would say there is no need for religion when you can feel a connection with the universe and the awe of natural occurrences.
    Moses and Monotheism tries to explain the archaeology/anthropology of early 20th century Europe. We now know that civilization goes back at least 15,000 years, or about 10,000 years before the Minoans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatOwlWoman View Post
    I think they do realize on some level. They see that young ppl are less religious, far more tolerant, more accepting of diversity and young ppl see it as a positive thing rather than the end of white/straight/Xtian hegemony. Hence their fear and anger at how the world is changing around them.
    We get to witness if suburbia accepts change. My personal belief is they will side with the police state.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    Their respective theories of religion...

    Sigmund Freud's theory of religion was based on a model of psychiatric pathology: religion as neurosis. He attacked religion on several fronts. He noted that religious rituals mirrored the ritual behavior of disturbed patients. Like a neurosis, religion thus represented a sort of safety valve that was perhaps useful for relieving pressure but not as good as getting to and resolving the real problems of life Religion, by displacing real human needs and fears
    onto unreal, symbolic entities, was a form of alienation that prevented people from coming to grips with their real problems and frustrations. People were better off without it, just as his patients were better off without their neuroses.

    Carl Gustav Jung began his career in psychiatry as one of Freud’s most promising disciples. As Jung began to reflect more independently on human psychology and its pathologies, however, he found himself increasingly convinced that religion, far from being the chronic impediment that Freud believed it to be, was also potentially a source of health, balance, and connection for people; in fact, it was a necessary component of mental health. Religion, he said, was the sense that we were connected to a reality larger than our individual selves. We might call this larger reality by many names, but it represented a kind of synchronicity, a larger web of significations, a collective unconscious that was inbuilt into the human psyche. Its contents included archetypes, universal symbolic representations that helped people to organize and give meaning to their existence. In tandem with rational, discursive thought, symbols and archetypes enabled people to approach the world in a balanced, meaningful way.



    Source credit:Professor Charles B. Jones
    I'm much more influenced by Jung than Freud. Freud was a trailblazer, whereas Jung was more of a "settler" where he built upon the field Freud founded.

    Jung was more holistic in his views of mind and body.

    http://www.differencebetween.net/sci...ung-and-freud/
    Stripping Americans of their rights, regardless if unalienable or unenumerated, is against American ideals

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    I like aspects of Daoism, animism, Buddhism.

    I have generally found there are bits and pieces of all religious traditions I can find inspiration in.
    The points where all major religions dovetail is, IMO, is where truth is found.
    Stripping Americans of their rights, regardless if unalienable or unenumerated, is against American ideals

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    Their respective theories of religion...

    Sigmund Freud's theory of religion was based on a model of psychiatric pathology: religion as neurosis. He attacked religion on several fronts. He noted that religious rituals mirrored the ritual behavior of disturbed patients. Like a neurosis, religion thus represented a sort of safety valve that was perhaps useful for relieving pressure but not as good as getting to and resolving the real problems of life Religion, by displacing real human needs and fears
    onto unreal, symbolic entities, was a form of alienation that prevented people from coming to grips with their real problems and frustrations. People were better off without it, just as his patients were better off without their neuroses.

    Carl Gustav Jung began his career in psychiatry as one of Freud’s most promising disciples. As Jung began to reflect more independently on human psychology and its pathologies, however, he found himself increasingly convinced that religion, far from being the chronic impediment that Freud believed it to be, was also potentially a source of health, balance, and connection for people; in fact, it was a necessary component of mental health. Religion, he said, was the sense that we were connected to a reality larger than our individual selves. We might call this larger reality by many names, but it represented a kind of synchronicity, a larger web of significations, a collective unconscious that was inbuilt into the human psyche. Its contents included archetypes, universal symbolic representations that helped people to organize and give meaning to their existence. In tandem with rational, discursive thought, symbols and archetypes enabled people to approach the world in a balanced, meaningful way.



    Source credit:Professor Charles B. Jones

    I’m with Jung

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    I'm much more influenced by Jung than Freud. Freud was a trailblazer, whereas Jung was more of a "settler" where he built upon the field Freud founded.

    Jung was more holistic in his views of mind and body.

    http://www.differencebetween.net/sci...ung-and-freud/
    I did not know that much about Jung, but I am impressed with his balanced approach to the topic. Phantasmal sounds like she had really put some thought into Jung.

    I like his system of approaching religion as a social construct, and not worrying about whether the gods and spirits are actually true. He treats religion as sociology rather than theology.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    The points where all major religions dovetail is, IMO, is where truth is found.
    "Of course, one cannot declare that only my faith is correct and all other faiths are not. Of course God is endlessly multi-dimensional so every religion that exists on earth represents some face, some side of God." --- Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    I'm much more influenced by Jung than Freud. Freud was a trailblazer, whereas Jung was more of a "settler" where he built upon the field Freud founded.

    Jung was more holistic in his views of mind and body.

    http://www.differencebetween.net/sci...ung-and-freud/
    Freud was coked up and having sex with his patients. Jung can't compete with that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    I did not know that much about Jung, but I am impressed with his balanced approach to the topic. Phantasmal sounds like she had really put some thought into Jung.

    I like his system of approaching religion as a social construct, and not worrying about whether the gods and spirits are actually true. He treats religion as sociology rather than theology.
    Religion is a social construct. Look at what Jesus said and what Christian religions are practicing. You're a good example of a Christian seeking to follow the path of Christ whereas PmP is a lip-service Christian who uses religion as a tool for personal gratification.

    Martial arts, regardless of form, are to teach self-defense. They're also good for building confidence and physical conditioning. As such, martial arts, it doesn't matter much which form one chooses, is a means to an end with a goal of self-defense.

    Same goes with religion. The purpose is spiritual enlightenment. Sadly, like some use martial arts, adherents defend their form over the end goal be it self-defense or spiritual enlightenment.
    Stripping Americans of their rights, regardless if unalienable or unenumerated, is against American ideals

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    Quote Originally Posted by goat View Post
    We get to witness if suburbia accepts change. My personal belief is they will side with the police state.
    They have definitely trended to the dark side (the QOP) in recent years. They've always been about protecting and preserving the status quo.
    “Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.” -- Gandhi

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cypress View Post
    "Of course, one cannot declare that only my faith is correct and all other faiths are not. Of course God is endlessly multi-dimensional so every religion that exists on earth represents some face, some side of God." --- Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
    Great quote. Thanks and agreed.

    Those who say God is limited to one religion are limiting God.
    Stripping Americans of their rights, regardless if unalienable or unenumerated, is against American ideals

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dutch Uncle View Post
    The points where all major religions dovetail is, IMO, is where truth is found.
    "What is truth?" -- Pontius Pilate
    “Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.” -- Gandhi

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