What happens if Biden gets his $15 minimum wage passed?

[danielpalos]

None of what you said is backed by data.

How is it that the working poor in "the largest economy in the US" which already has a government-mandated $14 hourly minimum wage cannot afford housing and utilities?

The data is a lagging indicator. The multiplier takes time to engender the effects. The fourteen dollar an hour minimum wage for employers with more than twenty-five employees took effect this year. And, they can afford it better now than before.

[LV426]

As I also pointed out, and you ignored, there are things besides taxes to consider here and we can't be sure how any of those will be handled before hand.

Well, we know right away that most of those 58M people don't get health care through their jobs. Most of them are on Medicaid. Others are on the ACA. When it comes down to it, very few of those 58M people have employer-provided health care. Most of them are on Medicaid or get their insurance through the ACA because their jobs don't offer them.

So what else ya got?

[LV426]

So, now it's ad hominem I stated clearly that straight tax percentages alone were a gross simplification

You're the one literally using gross numbers, pal.

Bad faith all around with you.

You say "well a higher wage means they pay more taxes overall"...yes, and they are also earning more overall and generating more wealth overall.

So I'm just working within the parameters YOU SET FOR YOURSELF.

[LV426]

Separate topic. But here too, there are trade offs. Medicare for all could seriously decrease the quality and availability of health care for example.

How so? Explain. Show your work.

[Legion]

[Legion]

The data is a lagging indicator. The multiplier takes time to engender the effects. The fourteen dollar an hour minimum wage for employers with more than twenty-five employees took effect this year. And, they can afford it better now than before.

How much time does it take (according to historical data, not according to your wishful thinking)?

The fourteen dollar an hour minimum wage for employers with more than twenty-five employees took effect this year.

Calipornia has been raising the statutory minimum wage for all employers for years.

https://www.dir.ca.gov/dlse/FAQ_MinimumWage.htm

And, they can afford it better now than before.

According to...you?

[danielpalos]

Is that so? Give me some examples.

So you say. Copied from the Wikipedia demand-side entry?

How's that working in the jurisdictions that already have legislated higher minimum wages?

So you say. Employers must be able to afford your first world wages, or they aren't competitive with countries (like Communist China) that don't protect the rights of workers.

It takes time for the multiplier to have the intended effect; however, anyone who is making more now has greater purchasing power now. The least wealthy tend to spend most of their income sooner rather than later on goods and services.

Employment is at the will of either party. There should be no requirement to work in any at-will employment State (for unemployment compensation); that is a legacy of black codes that were created to keep the Poor, poor.

I am not sure what you mean. It sounds more like lousy public policies on our part. Corporate welfare is alive and well and has even paid multimillion dollar bonuses.

From 1978 to 2018, CEO compensation grew by 1,007.5% (940.3% under the options-realized measure), far outstripping S&P stock market growth (706.7%) and the wage growth of very high earners (339.2%). In contrast, wages for the typical worker grew by just 11.9%.
https://www.epi.org/publication/ceo-compensation-2018/

Trade wars are worthless, especially when the right wing lost theirs.

[Legion]

Earlier I posted an article on how the $16 an hour minimum wage in Seattle, that's already in place, has negatively affected workers there but LV426 didn't bother to read that or if he did, didn't understand it.

Let's face it - the DEMOCRATS are in a position to do whatever they like. Remember how they rammed Obamacare through and then blamed Trump when it (predictably) failed to work as promised?

We'll see the national results soon enough.

The media can't hide a downturn for long, so I anticipate a lot of blame shifting.

[Legion]

It takes time for the multiplier to have the intended effect; however, anyone who is making more now has greater purchasing power now. The least wealthy tend to spend most of their income sooner rather than later on goods and services. Employment is at the will of either party. There should be no requirement to work in any at-will employment State (for unemployment compensation); that is a legacy of black codes that were created to keep the Poor, poor. I am not sure what you mean. It sounds more like lousy public policies on our part. Corporate welfare is alive and well and has even paid multimillion dollar bonuses. From 1978 to 2018, CEO compensation grew by 1,007.5% (940.3% under the options-realized measure), far outstripping S&P stock market growth (706.7%) and the wage growth of very high earners (339.2%). In contrast, wages for the typical worker grew by just 11.9%.

Irrelevant claims.

You failed to answer any of my questions, and I believe we both know why.

[CFM]

Well, we know right away that most of those 58M people don't get health care through their jobs. Most of them are on Medicaid. Others are on the ACA. When it comes down to it, very few of those 58M people have employer-provided health care. Most of them are on Medicaid or get their insurance through the ACA because their jobs don't offer them.

So what else ya got?

Tells me they either need to get a new job or offer better skills that warrants that as compensation. Either that or get you to pay their premiums.

[Legion]

Well, we know right away that most of those 58M people don't get health care through their jobs. Most of them are on Medicaid. Others are on the ACA. When it comes down to it, very few of those 58M people have employer-provided health care. Most of them are on Medicaid or get their insurance through the ACA because their jobs don't offer them.

Cite the data that substantiates these claims.

Naturally, I'll understand if you don't.

[Blackwater Lunchbreak]

Well, no one would know it based on how you framed it all. You left that shit out. Why? Because you are trying to frame the MW increase as a universally bad thing, not because of the economics, but because of your personal subjective judgement, which you articulated so cleanly here when you substituted that subjectivity for objectivity:



How so? If a worker is choosing to work less hours, how is that a bad thing?




?????

Consumer spending is the ONLY THING that always creates jobs. Consumer Spending = Demand. It's the same thing. Increasing consumer spending increases demand, and businesses have to expand in order to meet that demand.

Or they can close their doors and say "no thanks, I've made all the money I want to make"...though, I don't know how many would do something like that just to prove a point.

Killing your business to own da libs...




No, that's not what they said. You even said so yourself here:



So help me understand why you said what you said, but made no mention of the other piece of the MW increase, which is increased consumer spending and demand?

You left all that out of your "analysis" and final judgment here, and I want to know why?

yes. he is doing that. that's libertarians. they're kind of fascisty now

[CFM]

Irrelevant claims.

You failed to answer any of my questions, and I believe we both know why.

Is it just me or did those clamoring for a $15/hour minimum call it a living wage? The implication of the term "living wage" has nothing to do with what LV says the money would be used for, the extras that would create more demand, but being able to provide the basic needs of food, clothing, and shelter.

[Blackwater Lunchbreak]

biden is someone the globalists can work with. as long as he doesn't do something "crazy" like raise the minimum wage.

is biden gonna do it, lv? what is his position? I bet now isn't the time, for unity.

[Legion]

Is it just me or did those clamoring for a $15/hour minimum call it a living wage? The implication of the term "living wage" has nothing to do with what LV says the money would be used for, the extras that would create more demand, but being able to provide the basic needs of food, clothing, and shelter.

If hiking the minimum wage by government fiat is so effective at making the poor prosperous, why are four of the five American cities with the highest rate of unsheltered homelessness in Calipornia: San Franshitsco, Los Angeles, Santa Rosa and San Jose.

Deep- blue Seattle joins the Calipornia municipalities in the top five.

The DEMOCRAT-dominated District of Columbia has the highest unsheltered homeless rate in the country - 5.8 times the U.S. rate.

DEMOCRAT-dominated Blue York is next, followed by Hawaii, Oregon and Calipornia - all under one-party rule.

These five states together comprise 20% of the overall U.S. population but 45% of the country’s homeless population.



https://www.marketwatch.com/story/this-state-is-home-to-nearly-half-of-all-people-living-on-the-streets-in-the-us-2019-09-18