There Is No Russian Plot Against America

[LV426]

lol.
DA RUSSIANS!! please. not every road goes to the Kremlin -some do -some dont

So you are arguing two conflicting points:

On the one hand, you argue Russia is justified in retaliating via tit-for-tat because that's just what happens

But on the other hand, you argue Russia didn't attack our elections, but rather private Russians and private Russian businesses did.

So how come Russia's government responds tit-for-tat, as you said, but didn't have anything to do with its own people and businesses attacking our elections?

[LV426]

lol.
DA RUSSIANS!! please. not every road goes to the Kremlin -some do -some dont

You sure about that? Nothing in Russia happens without Putin's OK. Unless you are going to now argue that Putin is a weak leader who cannot control his own country...?

[anatta]

So then it was the Russian government behind the attacks on our elections doing a tit for tat?

Because you can't argue that Russia acts "tit-for-tat", and then in the next breath say "well THIS wasn't tit for tat".

I mean you could, but you'd end up contradicting yourself and casting doubt on your sincerity and integrity.

there is no proof the IRA was a Russian gov't op.
It could be -but it's history doesn't show that.

I'm not making the claims -you and Mueller are making the claims of Russian govt interference thru the IRA.
You cannot support those claims

[LV426]

Which has absolutely nothing to do with your topic post, “there is no Russian plot against America”

You are just listing American actions you believe pissed off Russia attempting to create a false paradigm

Right? He's making the case for a Russian plot, not against one.

[LV426]

there is no proof the IRA was a Russian gov't op.

So if it's not a Russian government op, then that means it was done outside of Putin's oversight, which is hard to believe given he is Russia's dictator.

[LV426]

there is no proof the IRA was a Russian gov't op.
It could be -but it's history doesn't show that.s

History DOES show that because of all the personal connections between the GRU and the IRA.

But this skips the big point, which is that you're claiming Russians were launching international attacks on our elections and Putin had no idea it was happening.

That requires quite a suspension of disbelief.

[anatta]

So you are arguing two conflicting points:

On the one hand, you argue Russia is justified in retaliating via tit-for-tat because that's just what happens

But on the other hand, you argue Russia didn't attack our elections, but rather private Russians and private Russian businesses did.

So how come Russia's government responds tit-for-tat, as you said, but didn't have anything to do with its own people and businesses attacking our elections?

ROFL.. your mind only has an on/off switch!!
It cant do any nuance - there is no proof of Kremlin backed Russian interference thru the IRA -got that?
I mean it's important you finally get the base line.

which casts all this Russiaphobic jinoism into doubt -which means we dont know any line that exists or not
yet we write Mueller as it surely does, and the Press dutifully repeats it as true

[LV426]

I'm not making the claims -you and Mueller are making the claims of Russian govt interference thru the IRA.
You cannot support those claims

The claims are supported in Volume 1 of the Mueller Report, which you refuse to read because you're scared.

[LV426]

ROFL.. your mind only has an on/off switch!!
It cant do any nuance - there is no proof of Kremlin backed Russian interference thru the IRA -got that?
I mean it's important you finally get the base line.

which casts all this Russiaphobic jinoism into doubt -which means we dont know any line that exists or not
yet we write Mueller as it surely does, and the Press dutifully repeats it as true

You keep saying there's no connection between the Kremlin and the IRA, but that requires a suspension of disbelief that Putin has no idea what his own people are doing when they attack our elections.

That is a tough sell.

[LV426]

so you are asking the same thing 3x as usual?

You're not answering it, though.

So do you believe that these Russians and Russian companies waged this massive attack on our elections under Putin's nose from 2014 (yes, the Russian attacks started in 2014) through today?

You're arguing Putin still doesn't know that his people and companies are attacking our elections?

To satisfy your argument, we have to suspend our disbelief that Putin wouldn't know about attacks on American elections by people in his own country, who report to his oligarch friends.

That's like asking me to suspend my disbelief that a serum really caused some bony kid from Brooklyn to become a super soldier in WWII.

[LV426]

lol.
DA RUSSIANS!! please. not every road goes to the Kremlin -some do -some dont

So you backed yourself into a corner, rhetorically...

You first argued that no one attacked our elections
Then, you argued that it was actually Clinton who had Ukraine attack our elections
Then, you argued that Mueller didn't say Russia attacked us
Then, you argued that Mueller did say Russia attacked us, but that he was sloppy
Then, you argued that Mueller did say Russia attacked us, but he was conflating the actions of private Russians with that of the Russian government
Then, you argued that Putin had no idea that people he is connected to were waging an attack on American democracy for the last 6 years

So in order for us to buy your argument, we have to suspend disbelief that Putin would be clueless to the attacks people and corporations in his country were making against our elections, after you had spent half a dozen posts justifying Russian "tit for tat"...in a thread about Russian plots that you say don't exist, but then go on to say exist within the thread.

You're a hack and a joke. A complete and total failure.

So, your argument has changed quite a bit, hasn't it? Yet mine has remained consistent and doesn't need qualifiers.

[LV426]

LMAO @ this threadfail...

"There is no Russian Plot Against America....

...except for all the tit-for-tat...

...and except for all the actions Russia took...

...but if you don't count their actual plots, then there's no plots!"

[Hawkeye10]

Russia is now irretrievably part of The New Chinese Empire , they are out to hurt us, and after the Empire defeats us they will dance on the grave of our Super Power status.

Make no mistakes here.

[LV426]

Russia is now irretrievably part of The New Chinese Empire , they are out to hurt us, and after the Empire defeats us they will dance on the grave of our Super Power status.

Make no mistakes here.

I'm not so sure that Russia is a part of China's empire, but Russia is out to harm us, has already done so, and is continuing to do so today.

[Hawkeye10]

I'm not so sure that Russia is a part of China's empire, but Russia is out to harm us, has already done so, and is continuing to do so today.

It did not need to be this way...our forcing Russia to hitch their wagon to China in a very humiliating deal where Russia is a very second rate partner may turn out to be a bigger driver of America's decline then the debacles in Iraq and Afghanistan.

We are so fucked, and we did it to ourselves to a large degree....Stupid gets charged by the Universe.