Unprecedented, historic corruption:

[Into the Night]

He was not only charged but also convicted of seven felonies.

Name them.

[Flash]

Name them.

five counts of lying to Congress
one count of witness tampering
one count of obstruction of a proceeding.

[christiefan915]

No, that post wasn't. The original claim to this thread is that the Stone commutation is the worst abuse of Presidential pardon power in history. I showed one example that clearly, easily, tops what Trump did. I can drag up plenty of others far worse than commuting--not pardoning, just commuting--the sentence of somebody close to the President by the President.

The Marc Rich pardon was pure political quid pro quo on the other hand. Clinton and others took huge bribes in the form of "campaign contributions" and acted immediately and quickly thereafter to pardon Marc Rich. Rich bought the sitting President through a series of bribes. That is far worse than what the OP in this thread claims.

Too funny that you think pardoning Rich was the most egregious abuse of power. Rich's crimes: Wire fraud, mail fraud, racketeering, racketeering conspiracy, criminal forfeiture, income tax evasion, trading with Iran in violation of trade embargo. trump pardoned a number of people with the same crimes, i.e. Conrad Black, Pat Nolan, Michael Milken, Eddie DeBartolo Jr., Rod Blagojevich etc. Furthermore, Clinton never pardoned a single person for murder while trump pardoned three... so far.

I think the most egregious abuse of power was the bush 43 pardons of all those traitors who were part of the Iran-Contra affair, but I guess treason falls lower on the scale of offenses that mail fraud or racketeering.

[T. A. Gardner]

Too funny that you think pardoning Rich was the most egregious abuse of power. Rich's crimes: Wire fraud, mail fraud, racketeering, racketeering conspiracy, criminal forfeiture, income tax evasion, trading with Iran in violation of trade embargo. trump pardoned a number of people with the same crimes, i.e. Conrad Black, Pat Nolan, Michael Milken, Eddie DeBartolo Jr., Rod Blagojevich etc. Furthermore, Clinton never pardoned a single person for murder while trump pardoned three... so far.

I think the most egregious abuse of power was the bush 43 pardons of all those traitors who were part of the Iran-Contra affair, but I guess treason falls lower on the scale of offenses that mail fraud or racketeering.

Actually you would be wrong. Clinton pardoned a bunch of truly evil murderous terrorists, two of them murderers.

Linda Evans a radical Leftist in the Weather Underground killed 2 police officers and a guard during the robbery of a Brinks truck.
Susan Rosenburg, Evans' accomplice in that crime.

The "murder" pardons were for members of the US military that were in a combat zone at the time and the deaths of enemy combatants.

But all that is a red herring. Marc Rich was hardly the only quid pro quo pardon Clinton did.

Susan McDougal who was convicted as part of the Whitewater scandal in which the Clintons were business partners with her and her husband. She refused to testify against the Clintons and got pardon for it.

Almon Braswell. Convicted of mail fraud, perjury, wire fraud, money laundering, etc., he funneled $200,000 through his lawyer to Hillary's brother Hugh Rodman. Rodman returned the money after the deal became known to the public...

Edgar and Vonna Jo Gregory. They funneled $107,000 to Tony Rodman, Hillary's younger brother and were pardoned soon afterwards. The money was supposedly a "loan" but it was never repaid.

Clinton also pardoned his brother Rodger...

[Grokmaster]

Unprecedented, historic corruption: an American president commutes the sentence of a person convicted by a jury of lying to shield that very president.

MARK RICH.

[Jarod]

MARK RICH.

But, But, But Clinton pardoned someone unconnected to himself 20 years ago....

That makes what Trump did okay.....

[Into the Night]

five counts of lying to Congress

Nope. He misspoke a few things to a committee, not Congress. The committee was out to witchhunt. Process 'crime'. A 'crime' that existed only because of the witchhunters.

one count of witness tampering

Who?

one count of obstruction of a proceeding.

Process 'crime'. When he stopped answering the questions the witchhunters were demanding. He was therefore determined to be in congress with Satan, and was convicted.

Do you have anything substantial?

[Into the Night]

Too funny that you think pardoning Rich was the most egregious abuse of power. Rich's crimes: Wire fraud, mail fraud, racketeering, racketeering conspiracy, criminal forfeiture, income tax evasion, trading with Iran in violation of trade embargo. trump pardoned a number of people with the same crimes, i.e. Conrad Black, Pat Nolan, Michael Milken, Eddie DeBartolo Jr., Rod Blagojevich etc. Furthermore, Clinton never pardoned a single person for murder while trump pardoned three... so far.

I think the most egregious abuse of power was the bush 43 pardons of all those traitors who were part of the Iran-Contra affair, but I guess treason falls lower on the scale of offenses that mail fraud or racketeering.

Bill is married to Hillary. That's why he didn't prosecute her for murder.

[Flash]

Do you have anything substantial?

I said 7 felonies (usually considered serious). Calling it a "process" crime does not make it any less serious.

Who did he threaten?

"The indictment says the threatening messages to Credico came after Stone told the House Intelligence Committee in September 2017 that he and Credico had not exchanged any texts or emails. In fact, the two had texted and emailed frequently during the course of the 2016 presidential campaign, including about WikiLeaks, special counsel Robert Mueller alleges.

After learning three months later that Credico had been subpoenaed to testify before the committee, Stone allegedly urged him to “do a ‘Frank Pentangeli’” — a reference to the mobster in “The Godfather” — in order to avoid revealing that Stone had perjured himself.

In “The Godfather: Part II,” which Mueller notes Credico and Stone had discussed, Pentangeli lies to a congressional committee to avoid incriminating mob leader Michael Corleone.

In response to Stone’s plea, Credico urged Stone to “amend your testimony before I testify on the 15th,” the indictment said.

Stone allegedly responded: “If you testify you’re a fool. Because of tromp I could never get away with a certain [sic] my Fifth Amendment rights but you can. I guarantee you you are the one who gets indicted for perjury if you’re stupid enough to testify.”...."

[christiefan915]

Bill is married to Hillary. That's why he didn't prosecute her for murder.

Conspiracy theory.

[christiefan915]

Actually you would be wrong. Clinton pardoned a bunch of truly evil murderous terrorists, two of them murderers.

Linda Evans a radical Leftist in the Weather Underground killed 2 police officers and a guard during the robbery of a Brinks truck.
Susan Rosenburg, Evans' accomplice in that crime.

The "murder" pardons were for members of the US military that were in a combat zone at the time and the deaths of enemy combatants.

But all that is a red herring. Marc Rich was hardly the only quid pro quo pardon Clinton did.

Susan McDougal who was convicted as part of the Whitewater scandal in which the Clintons were business partners with her and her husband. She refused to testify against the Clintons and got pardon for it.

Almon Braswell. Convicted of mail fraud, perjury, wire fraud, money laundering, etc., he funneled $200,000 through his lawyer to Hillary's brother Hugh Rodman. Rodman returned the money after the deal became known to the public...

Edgar and Vonna Jo Gregory. They funneled $107,000 to Tony Rodman, Hillary's younger brother and were pardoned soon afterwards. The money was supposedly a "loan" but it was never repaid.

Clinton also pardoned his brother Rodger...

Here is the list of Clinton pardons. Evans and Rosenburg aren't on any list. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...y_Bill_Clinton

However, I found this article about them.

"A story Jan. 21 about presidential pardons and commuted prison sentences incorrectly reported the status of Susan Rosenberg and Linda Sue Evans; their sentences on weapons charges were commuted. The story also omitted that the charges relating to the 1981 Brink's armored truck robbery were dropped when Rosenberg was convicted in the New Jersey weapons case. The accompanying graphic incorrectly described the legal status of former Arizona governor J. Fife Symington III. He was convicted of bank fraud, but his conviction was overturned and the case was remanded back to a lower court. He never served any time in prison. (Published 1/22/01)"

Clinton refused to pardon Michael Milken so trump took care of that. I can't find anything about the military members who killed enemy combatants; this doesn't mean I don't believe it, just that I couldn't find references to it. Btw trump also cleared three servicemen who were accused or convicted of war crimes: Clint Lorance, Maj. Mathew L. Golsteyn and Chief Petty Officer Edward Gallagher.

You may disagree but I believe trump's pardon of Joe Arpaio was a quid pro quo.

All of the other people you mentioned committed the same type of crimes that trump pardoned people for. So the bottom line is that every president is going to pardon or commute sentences of people we think didn't deserve them.

Just out of curiosity, is there a reason you overlooked the bush 43 pardons of the Iran-Contra traitors?

[Into the Night]

I said 7 felonies (usually considered serious). Calling it a "process" crime does not make it any less serious.

Manufactured 'felonies'. Convicting people because of semantics fallacies is actually a crime in and of itself.

Who did he threaten?

No one.

"The indictment says the threatening messages to Credico came after Stone told the House Intelligence Committee in September 2017 that he and Credico had not exchanged any texts or emails. In fact, the two had texted and emailed frequently during the course of the 2016 presidential campaign, including about WikiLeaks, special counsel Robert Mueller alleges.

After learning three months later that Credico had been subpoenaed to testify before the committee, Stone allegedly urged him to “do a ‘Frank Pentangeli’” — a reference to the mobster in “The Godfather” — in order to avoid revealing that Stone had perjured himself.

Semantics fallacy.

In “The Godfather: Part II,” which Mueller notes Credico and Stone had discussed, Pentangeli lies to a congressional committee to avoid incriminating mob leader Michael Corleone.

In response to Stone’s plea, Credico urged Stone to “amend your testimony before I testify on the 15th,” the indictment said.

Stone allegedly responded: “If you testify you’re a fool. Because of tromp I could never get away with a certain [sic] my Fifth Amendment rights but you can. I guarantee you you are the one who gets indicted for perjury if you’re stupid enough to testify.”...."

Semantics fallacy.

Do you have anything substantial?

[Into the Night]

Conspiracy theory.

Why yes. Yes it is. It is a conspiracy between husband and wife.

[crowonapost]

Manufactured 'felonies'. Convicting people because of semantics fallacies is actually a crime in and of itself.

No one.

Semantics fallacy.

Semantics fallacy.

Do you have anything substantial?

lol 'semantics fallacies'. iT'S a CrImE. Can't seem to find that on the Googles.
Your substance is the premise that 'semantics fallacies' is literally a crime on some statute somewhere. Wow. Don't exist.
Sooo... back at you, Do you have anything substantial?


Cuz that's some serious word salad bullshit right there.

WiTh QuOTe ResPonSe.

[crowonapost]

Here is the list of Clinton pardons. Evans and Rosenburg aren't on any list. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...y_Bill_Clinton

However, I found this article about them.

"A story Jan. 21 about presidential pardons and commuted prison sentences incorrectly reported the status of Susan Rosenberg and Linda Sue Evans; their sentences on weapons charges were commuted. The story also omitted that the charges relating to the 1981 Brink's armored truck robbery were dropped when Rosenberg was convicted in the New Jersey weapons case. The accompanying graphic incorrectly described the legal status of former Arizona governor J. Fife Symington III. He was convicted of bank fraud, but his conviction was overturned and the case was remanded back to a lower court. He never served any time in prison. (Published 1/22/01)"

Clinton refused to pardon Michael Milken so trump took care of that. I can't find anything about the military members who killed enemy combatants; this doesn't mean I don't believe it, just that I couldn't find references to it. Btw trump also cleared three servicemen who were accused or convicted of war crimes: Clint Lorance, Maj. Mathew L. Golsteyn and Chief Petty Officer Edward Gallagher.

You may disagree but I believe trump's pardon of Joe Arpaio was a quid pro quo.

All of the other people you mentioned committed the same type of crimes that trump pardoned people for. So the bottom line is that every president is going to pardon or commute sentences of people we think didn't deserve them.

Just out of curiosity, is there a reason you overlooked the bush 43 pardons of the Iran-Contra traitors?

Ugh. Shits disturbing. Just commenting on how fucked up this timeline is man. Fuck. Good points btw.