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  1. #76 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr.Mason View Post
    Im serious,read these people that were pushed into church,and end up non-believers because of organized religion.
    Every society throughout history has a 'Story' of how it all started. Thankfully, today, Scientist are better able to tell the 'Story' than the Medicine Men of old.

  2. #77 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by AssHatZombie View Post
    that's fucked up. what denomination was that?
    Pentecostal.
    Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
    - -- Aristotle

    Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
    - -- The Buddha

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
    - -- Aristotle

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  4. #78 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    Any chance you will have a change of mind ... when you burn in Hell for Eternity?
    No. Your version of "paradise" sounds awful.
    Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
    - -- Aristotle

    Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
    - -- The Buddha

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
    - -- Aristotle

  5. #79 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
    Pentecostal.
    I would like to go see a speaking in tongues session. that's gotta be some wild energy in the room.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AssHatZombie View Post
    I would like to go see a speaking in tongues session. that's gotta be some wild energy in the room.
    Old people babbling repetitive phrases while raising their arms in the air. Not that exciting.
    Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
    - -- Aristotle

    Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
    - -- The Buddha

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
    - -- Aristotle

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  8. #81 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
    Old people babbling repetitive phrases while raising their arms in the air. Not that exciting.
    don't shatter my dreams! now what am I gonna do?

  9. #82 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by AssHatZombie View Post
    don't shatter my dreams! now what am I gonna do?
    You should go to the prayer sessions where folks get "Slain in the Spirit"... Those are always exciting.
    Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
    - -- Aristotle

    Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
    - -- The Buddha

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
    - -- Aristotle

  10. #83 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
    No. Your version of "paradise" sounds awful.

    I have no idea what's on 'the other side'. If there is a 'Level II' (or III, IV, V), I think we would all end up at the same place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
    Just what it sounds like. We did Israeli dancing... The church thought it was important to try to convert Jewish folks, one of the ways they showed the importance of that was "Israel Awareness Day"... This is where some of the Art Ministry stuff came around. The church I grew up in had well over 10K regularly attending members, there was a large diversity of talent. We had several teams of dancers, from young kids in elementary school, through young adults in their 30s...

    Anyway, around 13 I was placed in charge of what I called the holocaust room, and each year I would put together a room that was supposed to give a slight idea of what it was like (enclosed space with slats, you would hear sounds of train, see passing scenes through slats, etc.). While all I could use were images and sound, I put together (with a team of folks) a room that reminded many of the survivors and deeply affected them (at least that is what they told me). I met quite a few folks, held conversations with survivors and in the next year would do better... Previous to that I did a 3D map of Jerusalem. I believe that it is still displayed at their yearly IAD... Like I said, often I would get benefit from their efforts, it just never was the "benefit" they were trying for... I just never believed in God any more than previously, and never would.
    Dancing for Jesus -- what an odd thing that is. What did the Israelis think of that?

    I find the whole concept of going to another country that has its own cultural and religious beliefs, and values to try to convert them to yours offensive as hell. There isn't much that screams "You're backwards idiots and we're here to fix that" like that. Have a nephew-in-law who is a missionary in Brazil, along with his wife and four kids. So he's down there doing some good work (they teach writing/spelling in both Portuguese and English) but they're also basically saying "Your Catholic (or indigenous) beliefs are wrong so if you want to go to Heaven you have to believe like we do." They're super nice, kind people but still.
    "Conservatism is the blind and fear-filled worship of dead radicals." -- Mark Twain

  12. #85 | Top
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    Quote Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
    Pentecostal.
    I had a girlfriend that was a Pentecostal. She said someone would stand up and start talking in tongues. Then ... someone else would stand up and decipher what the first person was saying.
    I asked her if she ever spoke in tongues and she said 'Yes'. She didn't know if it was real or not and had no idea what she was saying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    I had a girlfriend that was a Pentecostal. She said someone would stand up and start talking in tongues. Then ... someone else would stand up and decipher what the first person was saying.
    I asked her if she ever spoke in tongues and she said 'Yes'. She didn't know if it was real or not and had no idea what she was saying.
    It's really a 3 step process, first everybody babbles in a loud cacophony of voices saying nothing, then everybody gets quiet (almost instantly, but not really hard to describe) then one or two folks start babbling, if two do one will shut up (sometimes both then somebody new steps in to babble), then somebody translates it... apparently God speaks in Ye Olde English because there are many "verilies" "thous" etc. rarely does somebody just speak in normal English (it does happen, but not normally). When I was 8 I always wondered why folks suddenly sounded like King James' times when translating and figured it was because they felt it to be more holy because the pastor used the King James version of the Bible. It seemed to me as an 8 year old that God would want to get his point across clearly and wouldn't mess around with archaic languages.
    Excellence is an art won by training and habituation. We do not act rightly because we have virtue or excellence, but rather we have those because we have acted rightly. We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, then, is not an act but a habit.
    - -- Aristotle

    Believe nothing on the faith of traditions, even though they have been held in honor for many generations and in diverse places. Do not believe a thing because many people speak of it. Do not believe on the faith of the sages of the past. Do not believe what you yourself have imagined, persuading yourself that a God inspires you. Believe nothing on the sole authority of your masters and priests. After examination, believe what you yourself have tested and found to be reasonable, and conform your conduct thereto.
    - -- The Buddha

    It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it.
    - -- Aristotle

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    Quote Originally Posted by Damocles View Post
    You should go to the prayer sessions where folks get "Slain in the Spirit"... Those are always exciting.
    sounds awesome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatOwlWoman View Post
    Dancing for Jesus -- what an odd thing that is. What did the Israelis think of that?

    I find the whole concept of going to another country that has its own cultural and religious beliefs, and values to try to convert them to yours offensive as hell. There isn't much that screams "You're backwards idiots and we're here to fix that" like that. Have a nephew-in-law who is a missionary in Brazil, along with his wife and four kids. So he's down there doing some good work (they teach writing/spelling in both Portuguese and English) but they're also basically saying "Your Catholic (or indigenous) beliefs are wrong so if you want to go to Heaven you have to believe like we do." They're super nice, kind people but still.
    do you feel the same about islamic jihadists?

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    I feel like there's a big difference between sharing your truth, and coercive or violent measures.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThatOwlWoman View Post
    Dancing for Jesus -- what an odd thing that is. What did the Israelis think of that?

    I find the whole concept of going to another country that has its own cultural and religious beliefs, and values to try to convert them to yours offensive as hell. There isn't much that screams "You're backwards idiots and we're here to fix that" like that. Have a nephew-in-law who is a missionary in Brazil, along with his wife and four kids. So he's down there doing some good work (they teach writing/spelling in both Portuguese and English) but they're also basically saying "Your Catholic (or indigenous) beliefs are wrong so if you want to go to Heaven you have to believe like we do." They're super nice, kind people but still.
    I had a good friend who was what I would call a progressive pastor who told this story, and I'm paraphrasing:

    A remote village was visited by some Christian missionaries who decided they would convert the villagers to Christianity. They taught the villagers that salvation could be found only through belief in Jesus Christ. All others were cursed with eternal damnation'. One day the village elder asked the missionaries what would have happened to the villagers if no one had found them and taught them about the Christian Dogma. The missionaries replied 'You would certainly be saved. God would not punish you if you had no way of knowing the way to Him'. To which the village elder replied 'then why did you tell us?'

    It's a great point. Religion is personal. Stop trying to convert others to your way of belief. It only leads to the worst human atrocities on record.

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