Berlin Summit starts as Libya rivals, world powers set for talks

[dukkha]

The two leading parties in Libya's war, as well as representatives from their foreign backers and other nations, are expected to gather in Germany on Sunday for a highly-anticipated summit aimed at ending nine months of conflict in the North African country.

Libyan Prime Minister Fayez al-Sarraj, head of the United Nations-recognised Government of National Accord (GNA), and Khalifa Haftar, commander of the self-styled Libyan National Army (LNA), are due to join discussions with Russia, Turkey, France, Italy, the United States and others on ending the war, which has raged since Haftar's forces began an advance on the capital, Tripoli, in April last year.

The warring sides earlier this month agreed to a ceasefire brokered by Russia and Turkey, though Haftar dramatically departed talks in Moscow on January 12 before signing the formalised agreement with al-Sarraj.

Sunday's Berlin summit is the latest attempt to restore stability and peace to Libya, which has been splintered between competing factions and militias since former leader Muammar Gaddafi was overthrown and killed by a NATO-supported uprising in 2011.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/...052038464.html

[dukkha]

Libya oil shipments halted in the meantime. US is there in Berlin, but the real players are Turkey against the Egypt/UAE block.
Russia is there - will go either way..

I doubt anything happens in terms of never ending Libya's civil war which we started back in 2011 by killing Qaddafi- but hope springs eternal

[Walt]

Libya oil shipments halted in the meantime. US is there in Berlin, but the real players are Turkey against the Egypt/UAE block.
Russia is there - will go either way..

I doubt anything happens in terms of never ending Libya's civil war which we started back in 2011 by killing Qaddafi- but hope springs eternal

Gaddafi died at the end of the original Libyan Civil War, so it was not caused by him being killed by it. We did not kill him. The Libyan Civil War restarted because we could not provide a stable government for them.

After trump abandoned our Kurdish allies, and allowed their children to be massacred, I doubt anyone in the Middle East(except Netanyahu) will trust America for a long time. We are no longer soft power players in the Middle East, and I doubt trump wants to be a hard power player in the Middle East. I am surprised that the USA even showed up in Berlin. It seems like a waste of time for the USA. Hopefully, someone else will solve Libya's problems.

[dukkha]

Gaddafi died at the end of the original Libyan Civil War, so it was not caused by him being killed by it. We did not kill him. The Libyan Civil War restarted because we could not provide a stable government for them.

After trump abandoned our Kurdish allies, and allowed their children to be massacred, I doubt anyone in the Middle East(except Netanyahu) will trust America for a long time. We are no longer soft power players in the Middle East, and I doubt trump wants to be a hard power player in the Middle East. I am surprised that the USA even showed up in Berlin. It seems like a waste of time for the USA. Hopefully, someone else will solve Libya's problems.

you fucking idiot. we DRONED HIS CONVOY outside of Sirte, and forced him to flee to the drainage ditch where the NTC jackals tore him apart. and you claim "we didn't kill him?" WTF

WE didn't even try to help the NTC transitional government survive -not that it would have helped -by then
"militia rule" had taken over, and the Libyan civil war 2 heated up -all because Hillary insisted we kill Qaddafi.
She was the one that screamed he must become a military target

I am surprised that the USA even showed up in Berlin. It seems like a waste of time for the USA. Hopefully, someone else will solve Libya's problems.

Well Russia and Turkey, and Egypt are there -is that a waste of time also?
But I get it -like Pontius Pilate/Obama supporters you don't want to deal with the carnage you've caused in Libya.
disgusting war pigs

[Iolo/Penderyn]

The notion that Libya has been better off since Col. Gaddafi was murdered lacks conviction, shocker though he was. Has colonialism helped Iraq or Afghanistan? Would Trumpf's deep concern for the Iranian people help them? I sometimes wonder if the interests of big business really are helpful to the populace, I really do!

[dukkha]

The notion that Libya has been better off since Col. Gaddafi was murdered lacks conviction, shocker though he was. Has colonialism helped Iraq or Afghanistan? Would Trumpf's deep concern for the Iranian people help them? I sometimes wonder if the interests of big business really are helpful to the populace, I really do!

U.S.interventionism invariably causes "blowback" not expected

[Walt]

you fucking idiot. we DRONED HIS CONVOY outside of Sirte, and forced him to flee to the drainage ditch where the NTC jackals tore him apart. and you claim "we didn't kill him?" WTF

At points you are a bit right, but overall you are off. There were no drones.

Let's start at the beginning. It was 10 months after the war began, not the cause of the war. Gaddfi had lost almost everything, including the capital. He was hiding out in one of the last strongholds he still controlled, but that was collapsing. He tried to make it out. He was bombed by NATO forces while his convoy tried to breakout. It was planes, not drones, and might not have been US forces. That stopped his convoy, but did not kill him.

Gaddafi then did a last stand against the Misrata Militia which was part of the NTC(National Transitional Council). They first heavily shelled his position with artillery, and then attacked with land forces. He was almost certainly injured by all this, but was captured alive. A few hours later, he was dead. It was either from untreated injuries from the battle, or an extrajudicial execution. Either way, it happened on the ground, and did not involve direct NATO action.

Now it is true that NATO did help get him. But it is definitely not true that getting him caused the war. The war had been going for 10 months, and actually getting him changed little.

WE didn't even try to help the NTC transitional government survive -not that it would have helped -by then
"militia rule" had taken over, and the Libyan civil war 2 heated up -all because Hillary insisted we kill Qaddafi.

First off, the NTC was a collection of the militias. We needed to provide aid to keep them working together, but there was no aid budgeted. The NTC was not going to spare Gaddafi, and sparing Gaddafi would not have helped anything. It would have made things worse, because it would have meant there was another power broker in the game.

She was the one that screamed he must become a military target

No, that would be the Libyan people screaming. The Misrata Militia had lost a lot of their people to Gaddafi. They were not going to let him live, no matter what we wanted.

Well Russia and Turkey, and Egypt are there -is that a waste of time also?

It certainly not a waste of their time. They are still real players in Libya, and I wish them the best. It is sad that we are depending on Russia to create peace in Libya, and will almost certainly pay a price whether they get peace or not. But peace is better than endless war, so whatever, good luck.

[evince]

Gaddafi died at the end of the original Libyan Civil War, so it was not caused by him being killed by it. We did not kill him. The Libyan Civil War restarted because we could not provide a stable government for them.

After trump abandoned our Kurdish allies, and allowed their children to be massacred, I doubt anyone in the Middle East(except Netanyahu) will trust America for a long time. We are no longer soft power players in the Middle East, and I doubt trump wants to be a hard power player in the Middle East. I am surprised that the USA even showed up in Berlin. It seems like a waste of time for the USA. Hopefully, someone else will solve Libya's problems.

the people world wide realize that Trump was caused by Putin


they will forgive this nation once Biden is elected
h

Biden is the BEST choice for this nation because the world will heave a huge sigh of relief the second he is elected

[evince]

Ghadafi was nothing more than a shit cork


Just like Sadam

[evince]

when an evil leader is a shit cork In a nation that is a bottle of bees it should be ONLY the people of that nation who should remove it

[dukkha]

At points you are a bit right, but overall you are off. There were no drones.

UPDATE U.S. Predator Drone, French Jet Stopped Qaddafi Convoy Before Capture
https://thinkprogress.org/update-u-s...-1413574c8184/ A U.S. defense official said Oct. 20 a U.S. Predator drone along with a French fighter jet had attacked a convoy of vehicles in Libya that Paris believed was carrying Moammar Gadhafi. […]
~~
The U.S. defense official, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said the unmanned Predator aircraft had struck “the same convoy” but could not confirm that Gadhafi was in one of the vehicles.

Col Gaddafi killed: convoy bombed by drone flown by pilot in Las Vegas
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...Las-Vegas.html
Col Muammar Gaddafi’s convoy was bombed by an American Predator drone and then attacked by French jets before the deposed dictator was killed by rebel fighters, defence sources disclosed.

Let's start at the beginning. It was 10 months after the war began, not the cause of the war. Gaddfi had lost almost everything, including the capital. He was hiding out in one of the last strongholds he still controlled, but that was collapsing. He tried to make it out. He was bombed by NATO forces while his convoy tried to breakout. It was planes, not drones, and might not have been US forces. That stopped his convoy, but did not kill him.

get your facts correct for once. Do you understand "proximate cause? the country had no army or even local police (dissolved) -hence the cities and locals hired mercenaries - "militia rule" - which could not maintain order as they fought among themselves
/THAT WAS THE BEGINNING OF LIBYA WAR 2 -which is officially listed as starting in 2014. There were the terrorists acts as well like the bombing of the Corinthia hotel..
Eventually the Parliament was bombed, and the new PM kidnapped -all of which led the House of Representatives to leave Tripoli for Bengazi

First off, the NTC was a collection of the militias. We needed to provide aid to keep them working together, but there was no aid budgeted. The NTC was not going to spare Gaddafi, and sparing Gaddafi would not have helped anything. It would have made things worse, because it would have meant there was another power broker in the game.

point being the NTC was beaten back by Qaddafi - it was only able to advance because we became their AF. So we were the ones that enabled the NTC to advance.
Qaddafi would have easily put down the insurrection otherwise
The bigger point is the NTC had AQ leadership -in fact the Canadian AF called it's sorties " Al-Qaeda AF"

[dukkha]

when an evil leader is a shit cork In a nation that is a bottle of bees it should be ONLY the people of that nation who should remove it

so why did we take out Qadaffi instead?