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Thread: Did Russian Interference Affect the 2016 Election Results?

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    Rosenstein, however, made the point very clear: the indictment included no allegation that the hacking altered any votes of affected the election result.

    “There is no allegation in this indictment that any American citizen committed a crime,” Rosenstein said Friday. “There is no allegation that the conspiracy changed the vote count or affected any election result. The special counsel investigation is ongoing and there will be no comments on a special counsel at this time.”

    Mueller did NOT disagree.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LV426 View Post
    But that's how you're presenting it because it's you framing a bad faith argument.

    All that shit you posted below is the byproduct of exactly what I've been talking about; the Conservative propaganda effort over the last 40 years to undermine faith in democratic institutions in order to break them up and sell them off to their rich friends.

    So I'm not sure what you think you're proving by posting those links other than that propaganda is successful.

    If you think government is institutionally flawed, then don't participate in the political process.
    You've obviously fallen for the old partisan propaganda line word for word. "Sell them to their rich friends" What a crock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    You've obviously fallen for the old partisan propaganda line word for word. "Sell them to their rich friends" What a crock.
    What else could possibly be the reason for Conservatives undermining faith in the institutions of government?

    Are you really that blind, or are you just being a contrarian because you can't stand to admit I'm right?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    You've obviously fallen for the old partisan propaganda line word for word. "Sell them to their rich friends" What a crock.
    So...private prisons, for-profit health care, charter schools, the VA, and all the privatization of government services that has occurred in the last 40 years is just a weird coincidence?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    "Sell them to their rich friends" What a crock.
    It takes true bad faith to pretend that Conservatives haven't been selling government off to their rich friends as one of those people is now the Secretary of Education.

    Betsy DeVos made her fortune off privatization of education in the last 40 years, stealing public school tax dollars for agenda-driven private Christian charter schools that only make kids dumber.

    Seriously, Flash, I feel like you're just being a contrarian because you're a bored and lazy person who thinks so highly of himself, that admitting your instincts and judgment are wrong would basically undermine everything you are.
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    Much was said about the exit polls being so wrong in 2016.

    Mostly, that they have always been accurate in every election previous to 2016.

    I believe the exit polls were not in error in 2016.

    I believe either many many Democrats votes were tampered with and manipulated, or thrown away, and hidden in 2016- in several states. States like Florida, Ohio, and Wisconsin!

    That explains the exit polls not being accurate!

    In fact, it points to the Republicans cheating in the election- through Russia's or Domestic Hackers helping the Republicans.

    And we already know they did that!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adolf_Twitler View Post
    Much was said about the exit polls being so wrong in 2016.

    Mostly, that they have always been accurate in every election previous to 2016.

    I believe the exit polls were not in error in 2016.

    I believe either many many Democrats votes were tampered with and manipulated, or thrown away, and hidden in 2016- in several states.

    That explains the exit polls not being accurate!

    In fact, it points to the Republicans cheating in the election- through Russia's or Hackers helping the Republicans.

    And we already know they did that!
    Dumbest bullshit posted today. Yay you! Let's get ONE thing correct lamb chops; you don't THINK. You EMOTE. You've never been right. Do you even have the intelligence to comprehend that and be embarrassed?
    "When government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny."


    A lie doesn't become the truth, wrong doesn't become right, and evil doesn't become good just because it is accepted by a majority.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nomad View Post
    Unless you just can't stand the idea of "ni**ers" teaching white kids.


    Quote Originally Posted by AProudLefty View Post
    Address the topic, not other posters.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LV426 View Post
    First of all, the results of 2016 are in doubt now because we know that Russia hacked into the voting systems of every single state, and only Rosenstein's assurance nothing was changed is all anyone is going on.

    We don't know if they changed vote totals, and we can't trust Rosenstein. So it stands to reason they would have changed the totals because why hack election systems if your intent wasn't to screw with them?



    ercentage of voters? No? Oh, so you're just substituting a bad faith assertion in order to retcon your shitty argument. From what study are you basing t
    Oh, so you have a scientific study you can produce that shows propaganda only affects a very small phis conclusion that propaganda only affects a small percentage of voters? What percentage? How many? And would 100,000 total voters be the "small percentage" affected? That was Trump's total margin in the states he won in the Midwest, BTW. 100,000 voters...so wouldn't 100,000 be a "small percentage"?
    So you think the 100,000 votes hypothetically affected just happened to be in the swing states that determined the election outcome? How do you know those 100,000 votes were not influenced by propaganda and social media posts by American sources?

    What propaganda determined how you voted? Maybe anti-Trump propaganda determined how you voted.

    The scientific studies are years of political science research showing most people vote their party affiliation and the independent and weak partisans make their decisions later and are more likely to be influenced by campaign advertising.

    You will say and believe anything if it meets your preconceived prejudices.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LV426 View Post
    It takes true bad faith to pretend that Conservatives haven't been selling government off to their rich friends as one of those people is now the Secretary of Education.

    Betsy DeVos made her fortune off privatization of education in the last 40 years, stealing public school tax dollars for agenda-driven private Christian charter schools that only make kids dumber.

    Seriously, Flash, I feel like you're just being a contrarian because you're a bored and lazy person who thinks so highly of himself, that admitting your instincts and judgment are wrong would basically undermine everything you are.
    I am the only one of us being honest. I admit we have no clue whether any votes were affected by Russian interference. We knew five years ago you would believe they did because it fits your beliefs determined by your ideology and party.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    So you think the 100,000 votes hypothetically affected just happened to be in the swing states that determined the election outcome?
    Yes!

    Because you had Manafort passing polling data on those states to Kilimnik.

    Russia knew which states and which voters to target because they were getting the polling data.

    This is all covered in Volume I of Mueller's report, which you still haven't read.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    How do you know those 100,000 votes were not influenced by propaganda and social media posts by American sources?
    If you read Mueller's report -which you still haven't done because...why?- you'd know that the social media posts were from Russia, and then disseminated by hapless, stupid Americans, or dummy Russian accounts, on social media.

    Again, this is covered in Volume I of Mueller's report which you refuse to read for some reason.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Truth Detector View Post
    Dumbest bullshit posted today. Yay you! Let's get ONE thing correct lamb chops; you don't THINK. You EMOTE. You've never been right. Do you even have the intelligence to comprehend that and be embarrassed?
    Yes, I was right not to vote for Donald Trump- a total racist, thief, cheater, liar, sexual abuser, and idiot!

    You are the one who is never right!

    And you are the idiot who voted for an idiot!

    So fuck off idiot!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    What propaganda determined how you voted? Maybe anti-Trump propaganda determined how you voted.
    Stop trying to be a sophist.

    You said yourself, in literally the last post, that propaganda is effective at changing people's minds, but only "a small percentage".

    THAT claim itself is bullshit, of course, because you didn't source it or back it up. What you did instead was substitute your bullshit judgment and poor instincts as a fact. But it's not a fact. It's bad faith because it's you trying to pass off your shitty judgment for conventional wisdom.

    From where did you get the idea that propaganda is only effective among "a small percentage of voters"?

    You made that assertion, so now you have to back it up because it is the keystone to your entire argument.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    The scientific studies are years of political science research showing most people vote their party affiliation and the independent and weak partisans make their decisions later and are more likely to be influenced by campaign advertising.
    So then it is entirely possible that Russia influenced 100,000 people across three states it knew to target, isn't it?

    You said yourself that a "small percentage of voters" are easily influenced and swayed, but then you stop short of saying at least 100,000 in three states were because if you did say it, then you'd have to admit Russian propaganda rigged the election by influencing at least 100,000 voters across three key states.

    So why are you arguing with me? Are you trying to say that those 100,000 people across those three states didn't have their minds changed by the Russian propaganda that was targeting them?

    All of this is covered in Volume I of Mueller's report, so why haven't you read it?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flash View Post
    You will say and believe anything if it meets your preconceived prejudices.
    That is literally what you are doing here, Flash.

    You're posting all this vague bullshit, unsourced, and making wild claims without defending them.

    You're substituting your shit judgment for conventional wisdom.

    You say propaganda doesn't work...
    ...then you say it does...
    ...then you say it only works on a few people...
    ...then you say it didn't on those in the three states Trump won by 100,000 that Russia also targeted with its propaganda.

    So your argument doesn't make much sense.
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