Members banned from this thread: AssHatZombie, SmarterthanYou, USFREEDOM911, Havana Moon, PostmodernProphet, Legion, Truth Detector, Granule, I Love America, Boris The Animal, Teflon Don, Dark Soul, Irish, CFM, Ralph, Sailor, Life is Golden, Bigdog, TTQ64, Getin the ring, zymurgy, Superfreak, PraiseKek, Grumpy, katzgar, countryboy, Tommatthews, volsrock, The Ugly Truth, BodyDouble, coolzone, rhym3pays, LV426, Loving91390, Into the Night, Enlightened One, Anarchon and Arminius


Page 5 of 6 FirstFirst 123456 LastLast
Results 61 to 75 of 79

Thread: Money Truly Doesn't Buy Happiness - World's Richest Man Bezos Is Getting A Divorce...

  1. #61 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    52,106
    Thanks
    3,266
    Thanked 15,224 Times in 10,538 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 581 Times in 548 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by iolo View Post
    It's not my vision, kid. If the species is to survive at all (which I very much doubt it will) working people will have to take the dangerous toys away from your idiot masters. It's as simple as that.
    Again, just to be clear, idiot masters = entrepreneurs and those who create businesses, companies and jobs?

  2. #62 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Cymru/'Wales'
    Posts
    8,017
    Thanks
    4,017
    Thanked 3,456 Times in 2,386 Posts
    Groans
    23
    Groaned 941 Times in 861 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    Again, just to be clear, idiot masters = entrepreneurs and those who create businesses, companies and jobs?
    Thieving vermin who live off our backs - capitalists.

  3. #63 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    52,106
    Thanks
    3,266
    Thanked 15,224 Times in 10,538 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 581 Times in 548 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by iolo View Post
    Thieving vermin who live off our backs - capitalists.
    In your socialist world who creates new products and how are they funded?

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to cawacko For This Post:

    Earl (01-12-2019)

  5. #64 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Cymru/'Wales'
    Posts
    8,017
    Thanks
    4,017
    Thanked 3,456 Times in 2,386 Posts
    Groans
    23
    Groaned 941 Times in 861 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    In your socialist world who creates new products and how are they funded?
    They won't need to be funded - we'll just make what we need, obviously. And it won't be my world but humanity's. Leaves you out, I suppose, with your thieving masters?
    Last edited by iolo; 01-12-2019 at 07:01 AM.

  6. #65 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    52,106
    Thanks
    3,266
    Thanked 15,224 Times in 10,538 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 581 Times in 548 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by iolo View Post
    They won't need to be funded - we'll just make what we need, obviously. And it won't be my world but humanity'. Leaves you out, I suppose, with your thieving masters?
    "we'll just make what's needed"

    Who would have created that computer and then internet that is allowing us to communicate now? A mate in one part of the globe would have said back in the day "let's create something that allows us all to communicate!" And someone would have said "I've seen the future and it is called a computer and here's how you build it..." and voila, a computer was born?

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to cawacko For This Post:

    Earl (01-12-2019)

  8. #66 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Cymru/'Wales'
    Posts
    8,017
    Thanks
    4,017
    Thanked 3,456 Times in 2,386 Posts
    Groans
    23
    Groaned 941 Times in 861 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    "we'll just make what's needed"

    Who would have created that computer and then internet that is allowing us to communicate now? A mate in one part of the globe would have said back in the day "let's create something that allows us all to communicate!" And someone would have said "I've seen the future and it is called a computer and here's how you build it..." and voila, a computer was born?
    You making some point here? |How do you think computers were created, kid?

  9. #67 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    52,106
    Thanks
    3,266
    Thanked 15,224 Times in 10,538 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 581 Times in 548 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by iolo View Post
    You making some point here? |How do you think computers were created, kid?
    am I making a point that inventors (entrepreneurs), the ones who you call evil thief's, continually have created new products that have moved the world forward and needed funding to do so? No, not making a point at "kid".

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to cawacko For This Post:

    Earl (01-12-2019)

  11. #68 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Cymru/'Wales'
    Posts
    8,017
    Thanks
    4,017
    Thanked 3,456 Times in 2,386 Posts
    Groans
    23
    Groaned 941 Times in 861 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    am I making a point that inventors (entrepreneurs), the ones who you call evil thief's, continually have created new products that have moved the world forward and needed funding to do so? No, not making a point at "kid".
    The greedy have made the means of prosperity for us all, so now it is time to kick them out and get on with sensible living instead of pretending we have to work twenty-four hours a day. Once we eliminate the thieves and their hatred, we have all the time in the world to develop humanity to its full extent, just as we choose. Now why not have a think and stop getting worked up about being old enough to have grandchildren, there's a good kid: thirty-year-olds can do that!

  12. #69 | Top
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Posts
    6,017
    Thanks
    10,680
    Thanked 2,548 Times in 2,006 Posts
    Groans
    4,668
    Groaned 329 Times in 313 Posts
    Blog Entries
    1

    Default

    Perhaps they will be happy when the divorce is final.

  13. #70 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    6,627
    Thanks
    3,286
    Thanked 3,439 Times in 2,265 Posts
    Groans
    0
    Groaned 583 Times in 528 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    Would there be a President or singular “leader” of any sort? Would there be elections or do they impede the path to socialism?
    We don't have to scarp our Constitution to implement more socialism. There is nothing in our Constitution which states that we will be a solely capitalist nation.
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Flame on me, mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you go on my PERMANENT Ignore List. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I won't participate in your threads, you will be banned from mine. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: if you like my PIP, feel free to use it. It works well.

  14. #71 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    6,627
    Thanks
    3,286
    Thanked 3,439 Times in 2,265 Posts
    Groans
    0
    Groaned 583 Times in 528 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    We don’t have unfettered capitalism or anything close. That is a massive straw man. And since you brought up conservatives are you with iolo that we shouldn’t have a president and somehow a workers parsdie of socialism will magically appear? Is that the liberal position now?
    I would advise you to stop trying to define 'the liberal position,' and stop trying to hold individuals responsible for your straw man. It is unrealistic, and invented. I think you will gain a better understanding of the world if you assume that people have differing positions and they each individual is entitled to their own view. I believe you have mischaracterized Iolo's position. And I certainly do not subscribe to that.

    I also never said we have unfettered capitalism. What we do have is too much unrestrained and improperly regulated capitalism. And it is hurting our nation.

    Think about it.

    What does capitalism do?

    It allows those with access to great capital to have great power. Capitalism makes the rich very powerful. It also creates a huge problem. When very greedy people who are obsessed with fortune-building get access to great power they always use it for the same thing. They seek to accumulate as much wealth as possible. More more more. It's all they know. The overall effect hurts the economy because their efforts concentrate wealth and sequester wealth OUT of circulation. Our economy is built on the active trading of wealth for products and services. If most people don't have much wealth, they can't be buying things. When people slow down on buying things (due to a lack of available funds for doing so,) that means the economy slows down.

    The result of improperly regulated capitalism is a that economic activity recedes. If it persists we call that a recession. If that goes on long enough, we call that a depression.

    Government regulation is our only defense against having recessions and depressions. Things like Social Security, government assistance programs and the minimum wage all act to forestall recessions. If those things are a form of socialism then that is what we need to prevent our economy from melting down.

    Without government regulation and socialism, capitalism would self-implode.

    Capitalism is not doing very well right now in the big overall picture. I say this despite the soaring stock market, and strong economy, because I am looking at other indicators. The US birth rate is so low that without immigration, we are losing population. People feel so economically insecure that they don't feel comfortable having large families. Or they just don't have kids at all. The other major indicator is the federal debt. The wild rise of the super-rich comes at a time when government is being deprived of sufficient revenue to maintain a balanced budget. The powerful get rich. The government gets poor. The rich take from the country as they give to themselves.

    If the economy is strong right now, that should be generating the maximum revenue compared to a time when the economy is weak. If we can't pay down the federal debt during a strong economy we will never be able to do it during a weak one. A weak economy generates less revenue than a strong one. We need more revenue. Cutting spending will only weaken the economy and reduce revenue. More cuts after that would make it worse, not better. We need to tax the rich more, and expand our government safety net. We have to redistribute wealth, or it will be too concentrated.

    And we need to regulate capitalism even more strongly than we already are.
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Flame on me, mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you go on my PERMANENT Ignore List. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I won't participate in your threads, you will be banned from mine. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: if you like my PIP, feel free to use it. It works well.

  15. #72 | Top
    Join Date
    Mar 2018
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    6,627
    Thanks
    3,286
    Thanked 3,439 Times in 2,265 Posts
    Groans
    0
    Groaned 583 Times in 528 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cawacko View Post
    Again, just to be clear, idiot masters = entrepreneurs and those who create businesses, companies and jobs?
    You could categorize them like that. Or it could just as easily be said that they are the ones who extract wealth from society and government in order to concentrate it into vast personal fortunes, at the expense of everything else which others hold important.

    They begrudgingly hire workers only because it is required for them to build their fortunes. As soon as they find machines which can replace workers they do so without hesitation. Which is why capitalism is doomed. Capitalism is so efficient at developing new technology (used mostly for the purpose of wealth concentration) that it is poised on the precipice of eliminating vast categories of workers, with no real vision for generating new jobs or careers. As capitalists eliminate labor costs, they also unwittingly eliminate consumerism, the engine of capitalism.

    Capitalists are in the process of slowly destroying their own market.

    That is why capitalism as we know it is doomed.

    Did you think wealth extraction and concentration could just go on forever, wealth inequality becoming more and more extreme?

    And that wouldn't cause any unwanted consequences?

    We do live in interesting times.
    Personal Ignore Policy PIP: I like civil discourse. I will give you all the respect in the world if you respect me. Flame on me, mouth off to me, or express overt racism, you go on my PERMANENT Ignore List. Zero tolerance. No exceptions. I won't participate in your threads, you will be banned from mine. ... Ignore the shallow. Cherish the thoughtful. Long Live Civil Discourse, Mutual Respect, and Good Debate! ps: if you like my PIP, feel free to use it. It works well.

  16. #73 | Top
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    12,399
    Thanks
    2,978
    Thanked 3,825 Times in 2,646 Posts
    Groans
    1,229
    Groaned 449 Times in 410 Posts
    Blog Entries
    5

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PoliTalker View Post
    You could categorize them like that. Or it could just as easily be said that they are the ones who extract wealth from society and government in order to concentrate it into vast personal fortunes, at the expense of everything else which others hold important.

    They begrudgingly hire workers only because it is required for them to build their fortunes. As soon as they find machines which can replace workers they do so without hesitation. Which is why capitalism is doomed. Capitalism is so efficient at developing new technology (used mostly for the purpose of wealth concentration) that it is poised on the precipice of eliminating vast categories of workers, with no real vision for generating new jobs or careers. As capitalists eliminate labor costs, they also unwittingly eliminate consumerism, the engine of capitalism.

    Capitalists are in the process of slowly destroying their own market.

    That is why capitalism as we know it is doomed.

    Did you think wealth extraction and concentration could just go on forever, wealth inequality becoming more and more extreme?

    And that wouldn't cause any unwanted consequences?

    We do live in interesting times.
    Capitalism requires the humans to be skilled and useful. The problem is we are producing humans with few skills that are useful. Making youtube videos about unboxing items is not a skill that's useful to society. It might help advertisers.

  17. #74 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    52,106
    Thanks
    3,266
    Thanked 15,224 Times in 10,538 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 581 Times in 548 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PoliTalker View Post
    We don't have to scarp our Constitution to implement more socialism. There is nothing in our Constitution which states that we will be a solely capitalist nation.
    Poli, I was responding to iolo. Look at what he wrote then you will understand the context of my question.

  18. #75 | Top
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    52,106
    Thanks
    3,266
    Thanked 15,224 Times in 10,538 Posts
    Groans
    2
    Groaned 581 Times in 548 Posts

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by PoliTalker View Post
    I would advise you to stop trying to define 'the liberal position,' and stop trying to hold individuals responsible for your straw man. It is unrealistic, and invented. I think you will gain a better understanding of the world if you assume that people have differing positions and they each individual is entitled to their own view. I believe you have mischaracterized Iolo's position. And I certainly do not subscribe to that.

    I also never said we have unfettered capitalism. What we do have is too much unrestrained and improperly regulated capitalism. And it is hurting our nation.

    Think about it.

    What does capitalism do?

    It allows those with access to great capital to have great power. Capitalism makes the rich very powerful. It also creates a huge problem. When very greedy people who are obsessed with fortune-building get access to great power they always use it for the same thing. They seek to accumulate as much wealth as possible. More more more. It's all they know. The overall effect hurts the economy because their efforts concentrate wealth and sequester wealth OUT of circulation. Our economy is built on the active trading of wealth for products and services. If most people don't have much wealth, they can't be buying things. When people slow down on buying things (due to a lack of available funds for doing so,) that means the economy slows down.

    The result of improperly regulated capitalism is a that economic activity recedes. If it persists we call that a recession. If that goes on long enough, we call that a depression.

    Government regulation is our only defense against having recessions and depressions. Things like Social Security, government assistance programs and the minimum wage all act to forestall recessions. If those things are a form of socialism then that is what we need to prevent our economy from melting down.

    Without government regulation and socialism, capitalism would self-implode.

    Capitalism is not doing very well right now in the big overall picture. I say this despite the soaring stock market, and strong economy, because I am looking at other indicators. The US birth rate is so low that without immigration, we are losing population. People feel so economically insecure that they don't feel comfortable having large families. Or they just don't have kids at all. The other major indicator is the federal debt. The wild rise of the super-rich comes at a time when government is being deprived of sufficient revenue to maintain a balanced budget. The powerful get rich. The government gets poor. The rich take from the country as they give to themselves.

    If the economy is strong right now, that should be generating the maximum revenue compared to a time when the economy is weak. If we can't pay down the federal debt during a strong economy we will never be able to do it during a weak one. A weak economy generates less revenue than a strong one. We need more revenue. Cutting spending will only weaken the economy and reduce revenue. More cuts after that would make it worse, not better. We need to tax the rich more, and expand our government safety net. We have to redistribute wealth, or it will be too concentrated.

    And we need to regulate capitalism even more strongly than we already are.
    Poli, you brought up in the post I responded to what you felt conservatives believe. It you don't want me to state what liberals believe in response don't do the same yourself. And my post and discussion with iolo had nothing to do with liberals and conservatives. Most U.S. liberals are still capitalists according to iolo's beliefs and he believes capitalists are evil.

    Feel free to respond to him with where you agree or disagree with him. It could make for an interesting discussion.

Similar Threads

  1. Richest 1% now owns half the world's wealth
    By Bill in forum Current Events Forum
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 11-19-2017, 05:41 AM
  2. World's richest woman says poor should have less fun, work harder
    By Havana Moon in forum Current Events Forum
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 09-05-2012, 07:49 PM
  3. World’s richest woman suggests $2 a day wages for Australian miners
    By ZappasGuitar in forum Current Events Forum
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 09-05-2012, 05:24 PM
  4. Americans make up half of the world's richest 1%
    By RockX in forum Current Events Forum
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-06-2012, 09:34 AM
  5. Mexican tycoon overtakes Bill Gates as world's richest man
    By uscitizen in forum Off Topic Forum
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 07-05-2007, 10:15 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Rules

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •