A journalist's disappearance endangers the anti-Iran alliance

[kudzu]

Again with Libya? it was a Howard Stern Show call in I think. Many people wanted Libyan interventionism.
The difference is Hillary had the inside track and knew the INTELLIGENCE ( which was non-existent) and led the international organizing and was the "51st%" perventage voice ( according to Gates) in the National Security Council
that persuaded a reluctant Obama to join the No Fly.
Then she agitated for full regime change. assassination.

Compare that to Trump who BROUGHT REGIME change but did not do so.
Trump is much more thoughtful about interventionism then Hillary ever was.
She did it when she had a change -he did not when he had a chance

The US had nothing to do with regime change in Libya.

[anatta]

The US had nothing to do with regime change in Libya.

ROFL. Operation Odyssey Dawn never happened?? lol

[kudzu]

ROFL. Operation Odyssey Dawn never happened?? lol

How would youhave kept Gaddafi in power after the emolation in Tunis set off the Arab Spring?

[kudzu]

Buoyed by the other revolts in neighbouring Arab countries such as Tunisia and Egypt, Libya's popular uprising against the authoritarian rule of Muammar Gaddafi began in February 2011.

What started off as protests against Gaddafi's rule quickly descended into an armed conflict as security forces, loyal to Gaddafi, clashed with protesters, using warplanes to bomb them.

As protests entered their second week, almost 300 civilians were reported to have been killed.

The increasing number of civilian casualties led the United Nations to pass a resolution that designated Libya a no-fly zone. The resolution also called for the protection of civilians by any means necessary.

On March 31, NATO began carrying out air strikes as a result of the UN's proposal to protect civilians.



https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/fe...083223563.html

[dukkha]

How would you have kept Gaddafi in power after the emolation in Tunis set off the Arab Spring?

this from an NTC combatant:

Libya's Arab spring: the revolution that ate its children
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...e-its-children
It was better under Gaddafi,” says the young Libyan student, studying the froth bubbling over the top of his cappuccino in a cafe in Tunis as he contemplates the revolution that swept Muammar Gaddafi from power four years ago. “I never thought to say this before, I hated him, but things were better then. At least we had security.”

Tuesday marks the fourth anniversary of that revolution but nobody is celebrating. Egyptian air strikes now hammering Islamic State positions in the east of the country, in response to the beheading of 21 Egyptian Christians, is a further twist in an already grim civil war. Four years ago the student picked up a gun and joined rebel militias. Now he wishes he had stayed home.

“If I had that time again, I would not join [the rebels],” he says. Like many of his former comrades, he has left the country, but won’t give his name, fearing retribution against his family back home.

“In the past, we would have a party for the anniversary of the revolution, but not this time,” says Ashraf Abdul-Wahab, a journalist. “A lot of people tell you it was better under Gaddafi, that the revolution was a mistake. What they mean is, things are worse now than they were then.”

[dukkha]

Buoyed by the other revolts in neighbouring Arab countries such as Tunisia and Egypt, Libya's popular uprising against the authoritarian rule of Muammar Gaddafi began in February 2011.

What started off as protests against Gaddafi's rule quickly descended into an armed conflict as security forces, loyal to Gaddafi, clashed with protesters, using warplanes to bomb them.

As protests entered their second week, almost 300 civilians were reported to have been killed.

The increasing number of civilian casualties led the United Nations to pass a resolution that designated Libya a no-fly zone. The resolution also called for the protection of civilians by any means necessary.

On March 31, NATO began carrying out air strikes as a result of the UN's proposal to protect civilians.

lies. Qadafi never bombed the Bengazi protestors.

[kudzu]

this from an NTC combatant:

Libya's Arab spring: the revolution that ate its children
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...e-its-children
It was better under Gaddafi,” says the young Libyan student, studying the froth bubbling over the top of his cappuccino in a cafe in Tunis as he contemplates the revolution that swept Muammar Gaddafi from power four years ago. “I never thought to say this before, I hated him, but things were better then. At least we had security.”

Tuesday marks the fourth anniversary of that revolution but nobody is celebrating. Egyptian air strikes now hammering Islamic State positions in the east of the country, in response to the beheading of 21 Egyptian Christians, is a further twist in an already grim civil war. Four years ago the student picked up a gun and joined rebel militias. Now he wishes he had stayed home.

“If I had that time again, I would not join [the rebels],” he says. Like many of his former comrades, he has left the country, but won’t give his name, fearing retribution against his family back home.

“In the past, we would have a party for the anniversary of the revolution, but not this time,” says Ashraf Abdul-Wahab, a journalist. “A lot of people tell you it was better under Gaddafi, that the revolution was a mistake. What they mean is, things are worse now than they were then.”

Of course it was better under Gaddafi..

[kudzu]

"We have in our hands the private document written in Hebrew that is an agreement between the would-be rebels and the Mossad. The agreement states that Israel will provide arms and training to the rebels until they take over the country and in return for that Israel will get to put a military base in the green mountain area of Libya."

http://themillenniumreport.com/2015/...sulate-attack/

Do you believe this over al Jazerra?

[evince]

lies. Qadafi never bombed the Bengazi protestors.

you or the guardian?


do you realize how stupid that makes you look?

[evince]

Of course it was better under Gaddafi..

warning: sarcasm is present in this post

[dukkha]

Of course it was better under Gaddafi..

according the the "rebel"who is quoted here it was.

Qadafi was a dictator and had uneven rule and favoritism -but Libya today is a hell hole.
I've seen pics of people drilling thru the sidewalk in Tripoli to access a water supply line.
Power goes out for hours/days at a time.
Bengazi Medical Center gets shelled and small arms fire regularly.. I could go on and on..

There were no ISIS or al Qaeda in Libya under Qadafi either. He locked up terrorists such as the
Libyan Islamic Fighter Group ( LIFG)

[kudzu]

according the the "rebel"who is quoted here it was.

Qadafi was a dictator and had uneven rule and favoritism -but Libya today is a hell hole.
I've seen pics of people drilling thru the sidewalk in Tripoli to access a water supply line.
Power goes out for hours/days at a time.
Bengazi Medical Center gets shelled and small arms fire regularly.. I could go on and on..

There were no ISIS or al Qaeda in Libya under Qadafi either. He locked up terrorists such as the
Libyan Islamic Fighter Group ( LIFG)

Civil wars often go wrong. Gaddafi shouldn't have sicced his Sudanese mercenaries on the civilians.

[dukkha]

"We have in our hands the private document written in Hebrew that is an agreement between the would-be rebels and the Mossad. The agreement states that Israel will provide arms and training to the rebels until they take over the country and in return for that Israel will get to put a military base in the green mountain area of Libya."

http://themillenniumreport.com/2015/...sulate-attack/

Do you believe this over al Jazerra?

i've never seen that before. it sounds ridiculous.

same link:

I would like to note that the Libyan people were not in any way extremist Muslims. The part of the Koran that was added by the Ayatollah Khomeini talking about killing infidels was thrown out of Libya by Ghadafi because he said it was not part of the Koran.
For this there was a fatwa or death order put on Ghadafi for over 20 years by the radical extremist Muslims.
All religions with a book were allowed in Libya. Women were emancipated in the 1970s by Ghadafi.
No special clothing were required and all women were highly educated if they choose to be.
They were doctors, lawyers, ministers, business owners, or just house wives whatever they decided.

[dukkha]

Civil wars often go wrong. Gaddafi shouldn't have sicced his Sudanese mercenaries on the civilians.

where? Bengazi?
Qadafi specifically told the NTC to lay down there arms and he would guarantee safe passage to Egypt.

He also told them if they didn't disperes he would go after them -fair warning.
But i've never seen where protestors ( unarmed civilians) were targeted


https://www.huffingtonpost.com/carin..._b_983506.html
common sense, along with a lack of credible evidence indicating otherwise, suggest that the majority of dark-skinned Africans detained, beaten, or killed by Libyan rebels aren’t mercenaries. No mercenary worth his salt would remain unarmed in plain site of an invading army. This raises the unsettling possibility that Libya’s rebels branded black Africans as mercenaries in an attempt to legitimize their abuse. An Amnesty International report released a couple week ago verified some of these violations.

[kudzu]

warning: sarcasm is present in this post

Gaddafi was horrible, but Libya was in better shape than it is now.