Turkey’s Downward Spiral

[Phantasmal]

Do you recall the name of a Turkish political writer about 15-20 years ago.. He was brilliant.. I want to say his name was something like Herclav.

I don’t recall that name, but like Meral Aksener.

[kudzu]

I don’t recall that name, but like Meral Aksener.

Thanks but that not who I'm looking for.

[FUCK THE POLICE]

fter Mr. Erdogan took office in 2003 and began reforms, Turkey looked set to become a model Muslim democracy with aspirations to join the European Union, a path similar to that taken by Mustafa Kemal Ataturk a century ago when he founded Turkey as a pro-Western, secular republic.

Mr. Erdogan, who heads the country’s largest Islamic party, probably was never a real democrat. But over the years, he has shown his true colors as an autocrat, skilled at promoting economic populism, militant nationalism and social conservatism — all while cultivating his own cult of personality. He has all but crushed independent media, jailing journalists and other critics, and fosters corruption. He effectively took control of all government institutions when he was re-elected in June under a new, more centralized presidential system.

Experts offer a number of reasons for Turkey’s democratic implosion. Ataturk imposed democracy from above, focusing on the elite, as opposed to cultivating it organically, from the citizenry up. In June’s election, a few credible candidates emerged to challenge Mr. Erdogan. Still, in general, Turkey’s political opposition has for years been fractured and feckless, detached from much of the population and offering no compelling alternative to Mr. Erdogan, who has been the only leader to effectively appeal to religious communities that have long felt marginalized.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/10/o...ol-left-region
Mr. Erdogan was emboldened in 2007 when the military,......

Ataturk never really established a democracy. He established republican and liberal institutions which he hoped would eventually catch on, but in most respects he ruled Turkey as a single party state.

[FUCK THE POLICE]

Erdogan is a total bastard, he needs to go.

He has total control of Turkey for at least five years. Turkey is doomed. They had the misfortune of "electing" their Trump a decade ago, and this is the eventual end result. Erdogan will rule Turkey with an iron fist until the day he dies, just as Trump will rule America until the day he dies, and so will his appointed successor.

[Rune]

I don't know.. but it hardly seem right for the US to cook up a war and Turkey to be swarmed with refugees.

Yes, all of Europe now suffers the burden of too many refugees as a result of the Neocon's idiotic Long War.
Destroy their Homeland and they leave, it is a given, yet even now, we bomb and drone and threaten. Fools

[kudzu]

Yes, all of Europe now suffers the burden of too many refugees as a result of the Neocon's idiotic Long War.
Destroy their Homeland and they leave, it is a given, yet even now, we bomb and drone and threaten. Fools

That has NEVER occurred to Trump.

[kudzu]

He has total control of Turkey for at least five years. Turkey is doomed. They had the misfortune of "electing" their Trump a decade ago, and this is the eventual end result. Erdogan will rule Turkey with an iron fist until the day he dies, just as Trump will rule America until the day he dies, and so will his appointed successor.

You got it! Trump is like Erdogan.

[kudzu]

Ataturk never really established a democracy. He established republican and liberal institutions which he hoped would eventually catch on, but in most respects he ruled Turkey as a single party state.

Before Erdogan Turkey was very secular.. and had basically rooted out all extreme Islamic ideas. I am curious at what caused the shift.

[Minister of Truth]

Maybe we were wrong to invade.
Is France a reliable Ally?

Well, it's not Islamic, so, I'm going to vote my approval for France as a reliable ally. They did knife us in the back during the retaliatory airstrike against Libya, following the discotheque bombing, though.

[dukkha]

Ataturk never really established a democracy. He established republican and liberal institutions which he hoped would eventually catch on, but in most respects he ruled Turkey as a single party state.

Ataturk imposed democracy from above, focusing on the elite, as opposed to cultivating it organically, from the citizenry up.

"top to down" democracy

[dukkha]

Well, it's not Islamic, so, I'm going to vote my approval for France as a reliable ally. They did knife us in the back during the retaliatory airstrike against Libya, following the discotheque bombing, though.

French are still neo-colonialists

Macron isn’t about to loosen France’s paternalistic grip in Africa
https://qz.com/africa/998126/emmanue...rip-in-africa/

he 2017 French election was watched with great nervousness by millions across Francophone Africa. That’s because the French president remains a pivotal figure in about 20 former French colonies on the continent.

Over the past 60 years France has maintained disproportionate influence over its former African colonies. This has included control over their military and currencies.

Despite being led by different presidents over the past six decades, the French government’s policy on Africa has been faithful to its neo-colonial roots and grounded in a yearning for the lost Empire.

[iolo]

Before Erdogan Turkey was very secular.. and had basically rooted out all extreme Islamic ideas. I am curious at what caused the shift.

The failure of the EU to accept Turkey, essentially because it was a Muslim country.

[Jack]

The failure of the EU to accept Turkey, essentially because it was a Muslim country.

I wouldn't call that a 'failure'.

[iolo]

I wouldn't call that a 'failure'.

Matter of perspective. Bit like the failure of the EU to give up its own interests to accommodate brexiteer nonsense, but less justifiable.

[Mason Michaels]

Turkey has been on a downward spiral,every since White men brought Chickens to the Americas.
Before that Turkey was the main poultry!