OWS movement: We've seen this before!

To those of you who are sympathetic to the OWS movement, allow me to introduce you to a couple of cats from history you should know about. Their "message" was identical to those protesting in the OWS movement. The idea that capitalism has led to an elite class which controls all the wealth, while the majority of us do without. The concept that everyone deserves to share in economic equality and it should be distributed evenly. The idea comes from Mao Zedong, Chairman Mao... so we begin with him:

Maoists as an anti-Revisionist form of Marxist communist theory, derived from the teachings of the Chinese political leader Mao Zedong (1893–1976). Developed during the 1950s and 1960s, it was widely applied as the political and military guiding ideology of the Communist Party of China (CPC). It fell into disfavour in China in 1978, when Deng Xiaoping introduced sweeping reforms.
Definitions of Maoism vary. Within the Chinese context, Maoism can refer to Mao's belief in the mobilization of the masses, particularly in large-scale political movements [like OWS]; it can also refer to the egalitarianism [see next paragraph] that was seen during Mao's era as opposed to the free-market [capitalist] ideology of Deng Xiaoping; some scholars additionally define personality cults and political sloganeering as "Maoist" practices. Contemporary Maoists in China criticize the social inequalities created by a capitalist and 'revisionist' Communist party.

Egalitarianism (from French égal, meaning "equal") is a trend of thought that favors equality of some sort among moral agents, whether persons or animals. Emphasis is placed upon the fact that equality contains the idea of equity of quality. That is, all people should be treated with the same dignity or be regarded as possessing the same intrinsic qualities despite our societal diversity of race, religion, ethnicity, sex, sexual orientation, gender expression, species, political affiliation, socioeconomic status, (dis)ability or cultural heritage. [any of this sounding familiar?]

Egalitarian doctrines tend to maintain that all humans are equal in fundamental worth or social status. In large part, such a reaction is a response to the abuses of statist development and has two distinct definitions in modern English. It is defined either as a political doctrine that all people should be treated as equals and have the same political, economic, social, and civil rights or as a social philosophy advocating the removal of economic inequalities among people or the decentralization of power. An egalitarian believes that equality reflects the natural state of humanity. [again... sound familiar?]

In its post-revolutionary period, Mao Zedong's thought is defined in the CPC's Constitution as "Marxism-Leninism applied in a Chinese context", synthesized by Mao Zedong and China's "first-generation leaders". It asserts that class struggle continues even if the proletariat has already overthrown the bourgeoisie, and there are capitalist restorationist elements within the Communist Party itself. [in other words, IT FAILED!] Maoism provided the CPC's first comprehensive theoretical guideline with regards to how to continue socialist revolution, the creation of a socialist society, socialist military construction, and highlights various contradictions in society to be addressed by what is termed "socialist construction". While it continues to be lauded to be the major force that defeated "imperialism and feudalism" and created a "New China" by the Communist Party of China, the ideology survives only in name on the Communist Party's Constitution; Deng Xiaoping abolished most Maoist practices in 1978, advancing a guiding ideology called "Socialism with Chinese characteristics.

Shortly after Mao's death in 1976, Deng Xiaoping started the capitalist reforms [wow, shocker!] of the People's Republic of China (PRC) in 1978 beginning the radical change of Mao's ideology in the PRC. Although Mao Zedong Thought nominally remains the state ideology, Deng's admonition to seek truth from facts means that state policies are judged on their practical consequences; the role of ideology in determining policy, in many areas, has thus been considerably reduced. [Wha? it was supposed to be such a good idea!] Deng also separated Mao from Maoism, making it clear that Mao was fallible and hence that the truth of Maoism comes from observing social consequences rather than by using Mao's quotations as holy writ, as was done in Mao's lifetime. [Okay, so let's pretend we believe in it, although it doesn't work!]

In addition, the party constitution has been rewritten to give the capitalist ideas of Deng Xiaoping prominence over those of Mao. [WTF?] One consequence of this is that groups outside China which describe themselves as Maoist generally regard China as having repudiated Maoism and restored capitalism, and there is a wide perception both in and out of China that China has abandoned Maoism. [and look what that did for them!] However, while it is now permissible to question particular actions of Mao and to talk about excesses taken in the name of Maoism, there is a prohibition in China on either publicly questioning the validity of Maoism or questioning whether the current actions of the CPC are "Maoist."

Although Mao Zedong Thought is still listed as one of the four cardinal principles of the People's Republic of China, its historical role has been re-assessed. The Communist Party now says that Maoism was necessary to break China free from its feudal past, but that the actions of Mao are seen to have led to excesses during the Cultural Revolution.

The official view is that China has now reached an economic and political stage, known as the primary stage of socialism, in which China faces new and different problems completely unforeseen by Mao, and as such the solutions that Mao advocated are no longer relevant to China's current conditions.



Moving on to another charming figure in history.... This cat is a disciple of Mao, he decided that Maoism had not been given a fair chance, and with a few authoritarian tweaks, he could make it work... he was determined! He killed millions trying!

Pol Pot, (Khmer: ប៉ុល ពត), was a Cambodian Maoist revolutionary who led the Khmer Rouge from 1963 until his death in 1998. From 1976 to 1979, he served as the Prime Minister of Democratic Kampuchea.
Pol Pot became leader of Cambodia on April 17th, 1975. During his time in power he imposed a version of agrarian socialism, forcing urban dwellers to relocate to the countryside to work in collective farms and forced labour projects, toward a goal of "restarting civilization" in "Year Zero".

The term Year Zero, applied to the takeover of Cambodia in 1975 by Pol Pot, is an analogy to the Year One of the French Revolutionary Calendar. During the French Revolution, after the abolition of the French monarchy (September 20, 1792), the National Convention instituted a new calendar and declared the beginning of the Year I. The Pol Pot takeover of Phnom Penh was rapidly followed by a series of drastic revolutionary agrarian socialism policies vastly exceeding those of the French Reign of Terror and culminating in the Cambodian Genocide.
The idea behind Year Zero is that all culture and traditions within a society must be completely destroyed or discarded and a new revolutionary culture must replace it, starting from scratch. All history of a nation or people before Year Zero is deemed largely irrelevant, as it will (as an ideal) be purged and replaced from the ground up.
In Cambodia, teachers, artists, and intellectuals were especially singled out and executed during the purges accompanying Pol Pot's Year Zero.

The Khmer Rouge period (1975–1979) refers to the rule of Pol Pot, Nuon Chea, Ieng Sary, Son Sen, Khieu Samphan and the Khmer Rouge Communist party over Cambodia, which the Khmer Rouge renamed as Democratic Kampuchea. The four-year period saw the deaths of approximately two million Cambodians through the combined result of political executions, starvation, and forced labour. Due to the large numbers, the deaths during the rule of the Khmer Rouge are often considered a genocide, and commonly known as the Cambodian Holocaust or Cambodian Genocide. The Khmer Rouge period ended with the invasion of Cambodia by neighbour and former ally Vietnam in the Cambodian–Vietnamese War, which left Cambodia under Vietnamese occupation for a decade.

Their Constitution: The "rights and duties of the individual" were briefly defined in Article 12. They included none of what are commonly regarded as guarantees of political human rights except the statement that "men and women are equal in every respect." The document declared, however, that "all workers" and "all peasants" were "masters" of their factories and fields. [sound familiar?] An assertion that "there is absolutely no unemployment in Democratic Kampuchea" rings true in light of the regime's massive use of force.
The Constitution defined Democratic Kampuchea's foreign policy principles in Article 21, the document's longest, in terms of "independence, peace, neutrality, and nonalignment." It pledged the country's support to anti-imperialist struggles in the Third World. In light of the regime's aggressive attacks against Vietnamese, Thai, and Lao territory during 1977 and 1978, the promise to "maintain close and friendly relations with all countries sharing a common border" bore little resemblance to reality.

On the surface, society in Democratic Kampuchea was strictly egalitarian. The Khmer language, like many in Southeast Asia, has a complex system of usages to define speakers' rank and social status. These usages were abandoned. People were encouraged to call each other "friend, or "comrade" (in Khmer, មិត្ដ mitt), and to avoid traditional signs of deference such as bowing or folding the hands in salutation... However, some people were "more equal" than others. Members and candidate members of the CPK, local-level leaders of poor peasant background who collaborated with the Angkar, and members of the armed forces had a higher standard of living than the rest of the population. Refugees agree that, even during times of severe food shortage, members of the grass-roots elite had adequate, if not luxurious, supplies of food. One refugee wrote that "pretty new bamboo houses" were built for Khmer Rouge cadres along the river in Phnom Penh.
According to Craig Etcheson, an authority on Democratic Kampuchea, members of the revolutionary army lived in self-contained colonies, and they had a "distinctive warrior-caste ethos." Armed forces units personally loyal to Pol Pot, known as the "Unconditional Divisions," were a privileged group within the military.

How did it work Economically?

In its general contours, Democratic Kampuchea's economic policy was similar to, and possibly inspired by, China's radical Great Leap Forward that carried out immediate collectivisation of the Chinese countryside in 1958. During the early 1970s, the Khmer Rouge established "mutual assistance groups" in the areas they occupied.
After 1973, these were organised into "low-level cooperatives" in which land and agricultural implements were lent by peasants to the community but remained their private property. "High-level cooperatives," in which private property was abolished and the harvest became the collective property of the peasants, appeared in 1974. "Communities," introduced in early 1976, were a more advanced form of high-level cooperative in which communal dining was instituted. State-owned farms also were established.
Far more than the Chinese communists, the Khmer Rouge relentlessly pursued the ideal of economic self-sufficiency, in their case the version that Khieu Samphan had outlined in his 1959 doctoral dissertation. Extreme measures were taken. Currency was abolished, and domestic trade or commerce could be conducted only through barter. Rice, measured in tins, became the most important medium of exchange, although people also bartered gold, jewelry, and other personal possessions. [In other words: EPIC FAIL, AGAIN!]

Since 1990 Cambodia has gradually recovered, demographically and economically, from the Khmer Rouge regime, although the psychological scars affect many Cambodian families and émigré communities. The current government teaches little about Khmer Rouge atrocities in schools. Cambodia has a very young population and by 2005 three-quarters of Cambodians were too young to remember the Khmer Rouge years. The younger generations would only know the Khmer Rouge through word-of-mouth from parents and elders.


So how many MILLIONS of Americans do Comminists expect they'll need to kill this time around?

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" - George Santayana
 
To those of you who are sympathetic to the OWS movement, allow me to introduce you to a couple of cats from history you should know about. Their "message" was identical to those protesting in the OWS movement. The idea that capitalism has led to an elite class which controls all the wealth, while the majority of us do without. The concept that everyone deserves to share in economic equality and it should be distributed evenly. The idea comes from Mao Zedong, Chairman Mao... so we begin with him:

Maoists as an anti-Revisionist form of Marxist communist theory, derived from the teachings of the Chinese political leader Mao Zedong (1893–1976). Developed during the 1950s and 1960s, it was widely applied as the political and military guiding ideology of the Communist Party of China (CPC). It fell into disfavour in China in 1978, when Deng Xiaoping introduced sweeping reforms.
Definitions of Maoism vary. Within the Chinese context, Maoism can refer to Mao's belief in the mobilization of the masses, particularly in large-scale political movements [like OWS]; it can also refer to the egalitarianism [see next paragraph] that was seen during Mao's era as opposed to the free-market [capitalist] ideology of Deng Xiaoping; some scholars additionally define personality cults and political sloganeering as "Maoist" practices. Contemporary Maoists in China criticize the social inequalities created by a capitalist and 'revisionist' Communist party.

Egalitarianism (from French égal, meaning "equal") is a trend of thought that favors equality of some sort among moral agents, whether persons or animals. Emphasis is placed upon the fact that equality contains the idea of equity of quality. That is, all people should be treated with the same dignity or be regarded as possessing the same intrinsic qualities despite our societal diversity of race, religion, ethnicity, sex, sexual orientation, gender expression, species, political affiliation, socioeconomic status, (dis)ability or cultural heritage. [any of this sounding familiar?]

Egalitarian doctrines tend to maintain that all humans are equal in fundamental worth or social status. In large part, such a reaction is a response to the abuses of statist development and has two distinct definitions in modern English. It is defined either as a political doctrine that all people should be treated as equals and have the same political, economic, social, and civil rights or as a social philosophy advocating the removal of economic inequalities among people or the decentralization of power. An egalitarian believes that equality reflects the natural state of humanity. [again... sound familiar?]

In its post-revolutionary period, Mao Zedong's thought is defined in the CPC's Constitution as "Marxism-Leninism applied in a Chinese context", synthesized by Mao Zedong and China's "first-generation leaders". It asserts that class struggle continues even if the proletariat has already overthrown the bourgeoisie, and there are capitalist restorationist elements within the Communist Party itself. [in other words, IT FAILED!] Maoism provided the CPC's first comprehensive theoretical guideline with regards to how to continue socialist revolution, the creation of a socialist society, socialist military construction, and highlights various contradictions in society to be addressed by what is termed "socialist construction". While it continues to be lauded to be the major force that defeated "imperialism and feudalism" and created a "New China" by the Communist Party of China, the ideology survives only in name on the Communist Party's Constitution; Deng Xiaoping abolished most Maoist practices in 1978, advancing a guiding ideology called "Socialism with Chinese characteristics.

Shortly after Mao's death in 1976, Deng Xiaoping started the capitalist reforms [wow, shocker!] of the People's Republic of China (PRC) in 1978 beginning the radical change of Mao's ideology in the PRC. Although Mao Zedong Thought nominally remains the state ideology, Deng's admonition to seek truth from facts means that state policies are judged on their practical consequences; the role of ideology in determining policy, in many areas, has thus been considerably reduced. [Wha? it was supposed to be such a good idea!] Deng also separated Mao from Maoism, making it clear that Mao was fallible and hence that the truth of Maoism comes from observing social consequences rather than by using Mao's quotations as holy writ, as was done in Mao's lifetime. [Okay, so let's pretend we believe in it, although it doesn't work!]

In addition, the party constitution has been rewritten to give the capitalist ideas of Deng Xiaoping prominence over those of Mao. [WTF?] One consequence of this is that groups outside China which describe themselves as Maoist generally regard China as having repudiated Maoism and restored capitalism, and there is a wide perception both in and out of China that China has abandoned Maoism. [and look what that did for them!] However, while it is now permissible to question particular actions of Mao and to talk about excesses taken in the name of Maoism, there is a prohibition in China on either publicly questioning the validity of Maoism or questioning whether the current actions of the CPC are "Maoist."

Although Mao Zedong Thought is still listed as one of the four cardinal principles of the People's Republic of China, its historical role has been re-assessed. The Communist Party now says that Maoism was necessary to break China free from its feudal past, but that the actions of Mao are seen to have led to excesses during the Cultural Revolution.

The official view is that China has now reached an economic and political stage, known as the primary stage of socialism, in which China faces new and different problems completely unforeseen by Mao, and as such the solutions that Mao advocated are no longer relevant to China's current conditions.



Moving on to another charming figure in history.... This cat is a disciple of Mao, he decided that Maoism had not been given a fair chance, and with a few authoritarian tweaks, he could make it work... he was determined! He killed millions trying!

Pol Pot, (Khmer: ប៉ុល ពត), was a Cambodian Maoist revolutionary who led the Khmer Rouge from 1963 until his death in 1998. From 1976 to 1979, he served as the Prime Minister of Democratic Kampuchea.
Pol Pot became leader of Cambodia on April 17th, 1975. During his time in power he imposed a version of agrarian socialism, forcing urban dwellers to relocate to the countryside to work in collective farms and forced labour projects, toward a goal of "restarting civilization" in "Year Zero".

The term Year Zero, applied to the takeover of Cambodia in 1975 by Pol Pot, is an analogy to the Year One of the French Revolutionary Calendar. During the French Revolution, after the abolition of the French monarchy (September 20, 1792), the National Convention instituted a new calendar and declared the beginning of the Year I. The Pol Pot takeover of Phnom Penh was rapidly followed by a series of drastic revolutionary agrarian socialism policies vastly exceeding those of the French Reign of Terror and culminating in the Cambodian Genocide.
The idea behind Year Zero is that all culture and traditions within a society must be completely destroyed or discarded and a new revolutionary culture must replace it, starting from scratch. All history of a nation or people before Year Zero is deemed largely irrelevant, as it will (as an ideal) be purged and replaced from the ground up.
In Cambodia, teachers, artists, and intellectuals were especially singled out and executed during the purges accompanying Pol Pot's Year Zero.

The Khmer Rouge period (1975–1979) refers to the rule of Pol Pot, Nuon Chea, Ieng Sary, Son Sen, Khieu Samphan and the Khmer Rouge Communist party over Cambodia, which the Khmer Rouge renamed as Democratic Kampuchea. The four-year period saw the deaths of approximately two million Cambodians through the combined result of political executions, starvation, and forced labour. Due to the large numbers, the deaths during the rule of the Khmer Rouge are often considered a genocide, and commonly known as the Cambodian Holocaust or Cambodian Genocide. The Khmer Rouge period ended with the invasion of Cambodia by neighbour and former ally Vietnam in the Cambodian–Vietnamese War, which left Cambodia under Vietnamese occupation for a decade.

Their Constitution: The "rights and duties of the individual" were briefly defined in Article 12. They included none of what are commonly regarded as guarantees of political human rights except the statement that "men and women are equal in every respect." The document declared, however, that "all workers" and "all peasants" were "masters" of their factories and fields. [sound familiar?] An assertion that "there is absolutely no unemployment in Democratic Kampuchea" rings true in light of the regime's massive use of force.
The Constitution defined Democratic Kampuchea's foreign policy principles in Article 21, the document's longest, in terms of "independence, peace, neutrality, and nonalignment." It pledged the country's support to anti-imperialist struggles in the Third World. In light of the regime's aggressive attacks against Vietnamese, Thai, and Lao territory during 1977 and 1978, the promise to "maintain close and friendly relations with all countries sharing a common border" bore little resemblance to reality.

On the surface, society in Democratic Kampuchea was strictly egalitarian. The Khmer language, like many in Southeast Asia, has a complex system of usages to define speakers' rank and social status. These usages were abandoned. People were encouraged to call each other "friend, or "comrade" (in Khmer, មិត្ដ mitt), and to avoid traditional signs of deference such as bowing or folding the hands in salutation... However, some people were "more equal" than others. Members and candidate members of the CPK, local-level leaders of poor peasant background who collaborated with the Angkar, and members of the armed forces had a higher standard of living than the rest of the population. Refugees agree that, even during times of severe food shortage, members of the grass-roots elite had adequate, if not luxurious, supplies of food. One refugee wrote that "pretty new bamboo houses" were built for Khmer Rouge cadres along the river in Phnom Penh.
According to Craig Etcheson, an authority on Democratic Kampuchea, members of the revolutionary army lived in self-contained colonies, and they had a "distinctive warrior-caste ethos." Armed forces units personally loyal to Pol Pot, known as the "Unconditional Divisions," were a privileged group within the military.

How did it work Economically?

In its general contours, Democratic Kampuchea's economic policy was similar to, and possibly inspired by, China's radical Great Leap Forward that carried out immediate collectivisation of the Chinese countryside in 1958. During the early 1970s, the Khmer Rouge established "mutual assistance groups" in the areas they occupied.
After 1973, these were organised into "low-level cooperatives" in which land and agricultural implements were lent by peasants to the community but remained their private property. "High-level cooperatives," in which private property was abolished and the harvest became the collective property of the peasants, appeared in 1974. "Communities," introduced in early 1976, were a more advanced form of high-level cooperative in which communal dining was instituted. State-owned farms also were established.
Far more than the Chinese communists, the Khmer Rouge relentlessly pursued the ideal of economic self-sufficiency, in their case the version that Khieu Samphan had outlined in his 1959 doctoral dissertation. Extreme measures were taken. Currency was abolished, and domestic trade or commerce could be conducted only through barter. Rice, measured in tins, became the most important medium of exchange, although people also bartered gold, jewelry, and other personal possessions. [In other words: EPIC FAIL, AGAIN!]

Since 1990 Cambodia has gradually recovered, demographically and economically, from the Khmer Rouge regime, although the psychological scars affect many Cambodian families and émigré communities. The current government teaches little about Khmer Rouge atrocities in schools. Cambodia has a very young population and by 2005 three-quarters of Cambodians were too young to remember the Khmer Rouge years. The younger generations would only know the Khmer Rouge through word-of-mouth from parents and elders.


So how many MILLIONS of Americans do Comminists expect they'll need to kill this time around?

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" - George Santayana

I think you have misunderstood the movement. There are SOME who are using this as an excuse to promote communism, but from what I see the majority simply feel that the increasing wealth gap and the enormous threat to the economies of the world and the danger to democracy is a good enough reason to tell governments they have had enough.
I most certainly sympathise with the movement, but to paint it as you have done is totally wrong. It seems you have stumbled upon a political comment and, instead of reading it for relevance to the one thing that you have stuck up your arse at this moment, you simply post it thinking you have found the holy grail of political wisdom.
 
I think you have misunderstood the movement. There are SOME who are using this as an excuse to promote communism, but from what I see the majority simply feel that the increasing wealth gap and the enormous threat to the economies of the world and the danger to democracy is a good enough reason to tell governments they have had enough.
I most certainly sympathise with the movement, but to paint it as you have done is totally wrong. It seems you have stumbled upon a political comment and, instead of reading it for relevance to the one thing that you have stuck up your arse at this moment, you simply post it thinking you have found the holy grail of political wisdom.

Which is precisely the sentiment stoked to cause the revolutions in China and Cambodia, which ushered in both of these leaders. It's the exact same message... it's the exact same sentiment being stoked by the exact same Communist elements.
 
Which is precisely the sentiment stoked to cause the revolutions in China and Cambodia, which ushered in both of these leaders. It's the exact same message... it's the exact same sentiment being stoked by the exact same Communist elements.

No it wasnt. No it isnt. No it won't be.
And whatever the sentiment of a few it does not follow that that is the view of the many.
No one ... let me repeat that slowly ... N O O N E seriously wants a return to Maoism, Stalinism,or any other communist system. Your focus upon that few is disingenuous.
 
No it wasnt. No it isnt. No it won't be.
And whatever the sentiment of a few it does not follow that that is the view of the many.
No one ... let me repeat that slowly ... N O O N E seriously wants a return to Maoism, Stalinism,or any other communist system. Your focus upon that few is disingenuous.

Again, READ SOME HISTORY! It is the same exact message of the Maoists.. The Rich control all the wealth... The top 1% have everything, and the bottom 99% have nothing! ....Everything should be equal... We should ALL have a piece of the pie! Capitalists are getting richer while the Workers get poorer! The People Must Revolt!

It is identical in an uncanny and bizarre kind of way, to the message most notably articulated by the OWS protesters.

What they want to do, is EXACTLY... almost to the letter... what Maoist and the Khmer Rouge wanted to do! They want to confiscate the collective wealth and redistribute it to the masses, so that we have an Egalitarian society! Maybe this is why it has been so difficult for this bunch to come out and articulate a defined objective... it's so fucking insane and unbelievable, they dare not mention it!
 
Again, READ SOME HISTORY! It is the same exact message of the Maoists.. The Rich control all the wealth... The top 1% have everything, and the bottom 99% have nothing! ....Everything should be equal... We should ALL have a piece of the pie! Capitalists are getting richer while the Workers get poorer! The People Must Revolt!

It is identical in an uncanny and bizarre kind of way, to the message most notably articulated by the OWS protesters.

What they want to do, is EXACTLY... almost to the letter... what Maoist and the Khmer Rouge wanted to do! They want to confiscate the collective wealth and redistribute it to the masses, so that we have an Egalitarian society! Maybe this is why it has been so difficult for this bunch to come out and articulate a defined objective... it's so fucking insane and unbelievable, they dare not mention it!

Sorry Dixie, but you are wrong. The argument you gleefully cite is a standard argument that has appeared regularly through the ages. It was NOT the motivating force behind Mao. You need to read a book or two. Major political movements have never prospered upon one single and simple platform. What you seem to believe, my friend, is simply propaganda. The story of Mao is more complicated and much more successful in the early days than many western historians report. You need to look at the last emperor then at Sun Yat Sen (who, incidentally, lived for a while just a couple of miles from where i am typing this). Then look at the Japanese invasion, the Russion introduction of communes, their withdrawal, the long march. Incidentally Mao was a small bit part player until the end.
if you wish to draw comparisons you may, but there are many much closer to home and many, if not most, come about as a result of man's exploitation of man. Not everywhere did communism result. Think of your own recent past. The great depression. The anti slavery movement.
 
Sorry Dixie, but you are wrong. The argument you gleefully cite is a standard argument that has appeared regularly through the ages. It was NOT the motivating force behind Mao. You need to read a book or two. Major political movements have never prospered upon one single and simple platform. What you seem to believe, my friend, is simply propaganda. The story of Mao is more complicated and much more successful in the early days than many western historians report. You need to look at the last emperor then at Sun Yat Sen (who, incidentally, lived for a while just a couple of miles from where i am typing this). Then look at the Japanese invasion, the Russion introduction of communes, their withdrawal, the long march. Incidentally Mao was a small bit part player until the end.
if you wish to draw comparisons you may, but there are many much closer to home and many, if not most, come about as a result of man's exploitation of man. Not everywhere did communism result. Think of your own recent past. The great depression. The anti slavery movement.

No, sorry LowIQ, but nothing I posted is wrong. There is no 'argument' posted, it is all documented historical fact. The revolutions which swept both Mao and Pol Pot into power, were rooted in the same class warfare, anti-capitalist sentiment we're seeing with OWS. I think this is why they have difficulty stating their objectives, because they know it's Maoism, and people are smart enough to know that ain't good. So while they struggle with a word to really describe their sentiment, the ignorant masses grow more and more sympathetic, not realizing what they advocate is Maoism!
 
No, sorry LowIQ, but nothing I posted is wrong. There is no 'argument' posted, it is all documented historical fact. The revolutions which swept both Mao and Pol Pot into power, were rooted in the same class warfare, anti-capitalist sentiment we're seeing with OWS. I think this is why they have difficulty stating their objectives, because they know it's Maoism, and people are smart enough to know that ain't good. So while they struggle with a word to really describe their sentiment, the ignorant masses grow more and more sympathetic, not realizing what they advocate is Maoism!

At this point I will leave it with you. I am not arguing with you, I have told you the truth, not my opinion, not propaganda but the truth. There is no argument so you may remain banging your head against as many walls as you wish. Your cause and effect reasoning is totally false.
TTFN.
 
Again, READ SOME HISTORY! It is the same exact message of the Maoists.. The Rich control all the wealth... The top 1% have everything, and the bottom 99% have nothing! ....Everything should be equal... We should ALL have a piece of the pie! Capitalists are getting richer while the Workers get poorer! The People Must Revolt!

It is identical in an uncanny and bizarre kind of way, to the message most notably articulated by the OWS protesters.



What they want to do, is EXACTLY... almost to the letter... what Maoist and the Khmer Rouge wanted to do! They want to confiscate the collective wealth and redistribute it to the masses, so that we have an Egalitarian society! Maybe this is why it has been so difficult for this bunch to come out and articulate a defined objective... it's so fucking insane and unbelievable, they dare not mention it!

How the fuck do you know EXACTLY...almost to the letter...what the OWS movement wants you bat-shit crazy section 8 psychopath?
 
Dixie is pissing his pink panties because he claimed to be rich on the internet and he fears the protesters are going to picket his double-wide...
 
Dixie can't believe you support bailouts for the banks and Hampton sailors.

Ugh.. I don't support bailouts, for the banks or any capitalist business. Is that what your stupid ass thinks they are protesting with OWS?

But now... let's talk about "The Banks" for a minute... Aren't these the same entities who are constantly being mandated by the government to do this or that? Like, giving out loans like Halloween candy, to people who don't have sufficient credit history? Like requiring a mountain of legal paperwork to purchase a home? The Evil and Greedy Banks are the "front group" for all this massive governmental bullshit, they are the ones charged with implementing it and administering it. So you think they should put up with all this bullshit without making a profit? And when the government's brilliant plan to dole out billions to people who can't pay it back, fails miserably, as just about anyone with any sense could have predicted, should "The Banks" take it in the shorts for what our government made them do?

I can't believe how many dumbasses out there, want to make "The Banks" into the bad guys, simply because you have some warped 'It's a Wonderful Life' view of what a bank does, and it's easy to throw the blame on them, rather than holding government accountable, which is what you should be doing. Bravo to the politicians for hoodwinking you again.
 
How the fuck do you know EXACTLY...almost to the letter...what the OWS movement wants you bat-shit crazy section 8 psychopath?

I admit, it's difficult to know what they really want, because they don't seem to be able to articulate it. But from what little has been said, it's the same exact message which sparked the people's revolutions in China and Cambodia. The Rich have everything, The Poor have nothing.... take from the Rich and give to the Poor! Everyone deserves economic equality! It's not fair that a few have so much, while the majority of us suffer! ...This is ALL the sentiments which drove those revolutions, and it is driving this one as well.
 
Which is precisely the sentiment stoked to cause the revolutions in China and Cambodia, which ushered in both of these leaders. It's the exact same message... it's the exact same sentiment being stoked by the exact same Communist elements.

It's not really that same message.
 
In the 50's, we had a much more equal society due to heavy taxation on the rich, and we also had very strict banking regulations. And that's what I and others aim for. We did not require mass executions and political repression to get to the 50's, we will not require them to get back to it.

Dixie uses the primitive logic of a toddler. OWS wants more equal society... Mao wanted more equal society... Mao = OWS?!!??! EXACT THE SAME?!?21/!!?!/! I suppose that if someone wants fewer immigrants, they also necessarily supports the execution of 6 million Jews as well.
 
Dixie you redneck cousin marrier, bailing out walstreet and not mainstreet is a main issue dumbass.

Fuck you, Government can't "bail out" a goddamn thing, governments don't produce anything or earn income. The American taxpayer is the one who is doing all this "bailing out" through politicians who apparently think they were elected to spend all of our money. The best way to "bail out mainstreet" would be for the government to de-regulate, stand down, get out of the fucking way, and allow capitalist free enterprise to work.

Point of order, Wall Street is a place in New York where stocks are traded, meaning they are bought and sold, meaning that people make and lose money in the process. There are rules and regulations on what is fair and what is legal, and if anyone breaks the rules or laws, they should be prosecuted and sent to prison, but if people actively participate in capitalism on Wall Street, legally and within the rules and regulations, why are they not entitled to keep the profits they realize? They took the risk.... and make no mistake, there should be a risk... they shouldn't be 'bailed out' if they take the risk and lose. But it seems to me, Leftists want to paint this evil sinister picture with a monster named "Wall Street" lumbering on its own volition, along with "Evil Corporations" ...trampling our freedoms and gobbling up wealth... starving school kids and pushing elderly people off the cliff.... no regard for humanity at all... just out of control evil monsters we must stop! You fuckwits are too stupid for your own good. "Wall Street" and "Evil Corporations" are YOU and ME! PEOPLE! Participating in the greatest system ever devised by free men, CAPITALISM!

YOU WANT TO DESTROY THAT! RETARD!
 
Fuck you, Government can't "bail out" a goddamn thing, governments don't produce anything or earn income. The American taxpayer is the one who is doing all this "bailing out" through politicians who apparently think they were elected to spend all of our money. The best way to "bail out mainstreet" would be for the government to de-regulate, stand down, get out of the fucking way, and allow capitalist free enterprise to work.

Point of order, Wall Street is a place in New York where stocks are traded, meaning they are bought and sold, meaning that people make and lose money in the process. There are rules and regulations on what is fair and what is legal, and if anyone breaks the rules or laws, they should be prosecuted and sent to prison, but if people actively participate in capitalism on Wall Street, legally and within the rules and regulations, why are they not entitled to keep the profits they realize? They took the risk.... and make no mistake, there should be a risk... they shouldn't be 'bailed out' if they take the risk and lose. But it seems to me, Leftists want to paint this evil sinister picture with a monster named "Wall Street" lumbering on its own volition, along with "Evil Corporations" ...trampling our freedoms and gobbling up wealth... starving school kids and pushing elderly people off the cliff.... no regard for humanity at all... just out of control evil monsters we must stop! You fuckwits are too stupid for your own good. "Wall Street" and "Evil Corporations" are YOU and ME! PEOPLE! Participating in the greatest system ever devised by free men, CAPITALISM!

YOU WANT TO DESTROY THAT! RETARD!

Say what you will, no one is going to fiddle while Rome burns and watch the US economy be destroyed. If radical anarchists like you had their way, the US would be a third world country. Let's return to a better time, to the 50's, where anarchists like you, who want to destroy America, would rightly be summarily executed by true patriots who don't despise their country.

You wish to enslave the American people, and tell them it is freedom! Slavery isn't freedom! Go do the world a favor and kill yourself!
 
I admit, it's difficult to know what they really want, because they don't seem to be able to articulate it. But from what little has been said, it's the same exact message which sparked the people's revolutions in China and Cambodia. The Rich have everything, The Poor have nothing.... take from the Rich and give to the Poor! Everyone deserves economic equality! It's not fair that a few have so much, while the majority of us suffer! ...This is ALL the sentiments which drove those revolutions, and it is driving this one as well.

It's not about economic equality. It's about survival. Try to grasp that important point.

As I said before if the average person earning $50,000/yr can afford a home and dinner every night and a car does that mean the person earning $500,000 deserves 10 homes and 10 dinners and 10 cars? Or the person earning $5,000,000/yr. Do they deserve 100 homes and 100 dinners and 100 cars while others go hungry or end up losing their home and their family splits apart?

It has nothing to do with "equality". It's about being fair.

The current "system" allows vacant homes to deteriorate while people live on the street.

Nevada's boom and bust leaves 167,000 empty houses
http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/housing/2011-03-26-nevada-real-estate.htm

Also, vacant homes succumb to vandalism and animal/insect damage. New homes are still being constructed because people don't want to buy a home that has been empty for a long period even if it's much cheaper. Those homes are going to eventually rot. No one benefits.

What does it take for people to see there is something wrong with the "system"? 167,000 vacant homes. The government could buy a block of homes and use it as a retirement community for the needy elderly.

(Excerpt) Thousands of roofers, carpet layers, drywall installers, road pavers and other workers poured into the state in the early 2000s as stretches of desert were transformed into subdivisions, apartment complexes and malls. Many are empty now.

Driving through Henderson, the state’s second-largest city, Realtor Terry Nacion, who migrated from Hawaii in 2003, said she remembered when there was waiting list of 1,500 for 300 condo units that were priced at $99,000 and that went for as much as $225,000. “Now they are worth $50,000 to $60,000,” she said. (End)
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...ms-with-unemployment-stranded-homeowners.html

The government could use TARP funds to buy blocks of condos. The elderly could either rent or purchase them for approximately $300/mth. Available for people 60+ years only with the stipulation the community would be reclassified after 20 years as a "regular" community. The government would receive interest on the money for 20 years and get a bonus when they sold the rental units.

That's the government helping people.

What do you think about that idea?
 
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