BUFFETT: TAX THE RICH

Bfgrn said:
You are missing the point Buffet is trying to make. The country needs to increase revenues. We have two wars to pay for and an economy that is still going through a recession. It needs to be mandatory, not voluntary.

He punches a hole in every right wing argument for continuing to coddle the wealthy...and so does history...
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how did i miss the point. i said i agreed with him. as usual you don't really read what people say, you have already formed a preconceived notion based on your biases.

why is it he cannot give more taxes now, since that is what he is advocating. he didn't need to reduce his effective tax rate. he chose to do that, then demands that others pay more. he did have a good argument about investing, i have never advocated otherwise and it is where i part with many on the right.
 
Superfreak said:
Side note Mott the fool....

I am not spinning ANYTHING.... you are just embarrassed that you were too fucking stupid to comprehend the SIMPLE concept of a flat tax.... and so now you are attempting to lash out. Go back and look Mott... you are the one that started the insults on this thread.... so stop crying about others returning the favor to you.
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Do you really think that you advance your argument by resorting to Anglo Saxon at every opportunity?
 
Superfreak said:
Not at all... I am mocking Mott for being a fucking idiot. He tried to mock my intelligence all the while displaying he had NO comprehension with regards to the differences between a flat tax and the fair tax. He is a fucking idiot. Plain and simple. The very fact that he accused me of ducking away from answering his 'questions/comments' is truly retarded given that I did answer them. He was just too fucking stupid to understand what was being written.

DO YOU understand the difference between a flat tax and the fair tax?

Are you going to pretend they are the same and then act like a fucking idiot like Mott?

Mott is embarrassed, so now he is going to continue to run around and say 'drink mo tea' because for some reason he thinks that is 'intelligent/funny'.
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Dude, you're not kidding anyone. You're VAT/National Sales Tax holds very little difference with any flat tax scheme. The only significant difference is your prebate and that's the worst part of the "Fair Tax". The prebate makes it progressive at the bottom but does not change the regressive nature at the top end. This makes it worse then if their was no prebate cause now the tax burden is dumped almost entirely on the middle and upper middle classes as the wealthy only make up a few percent of the population. It's a terrible idea!

And speaking of running why won't you address the the flaws of your fair flat tax (pun intended. :-)

How will you administer this tax? Don't give me some lame "Oh sure this will be far easier then our current income tax!" cause that's bull shit. Tell me the hell how you're going to do that?

Then also tell me how the hell you're going to change the constitution so that you can make your flat tax scheme possible with out us having to worry about congress coming along at a later date and adding an income tax to go with it. It takes real precise langauge, a super majority consensus and a lot of time to do this. How can this be done and what legal langauge would be used to make your flat tax scheme practical?

And while were at it how would you make up for the project $400+ billion projected shortfall in tax revenue that implementation of your flat tax scheme would create? And don't give me some blow off fantasy of "Oh it will be replaced by economic growth!".
 
change the definition of wealthy to billionaires and I'm cool, please see AMT for how the not rich get fucked by demtards definition.
 
Yurt said:
how did i miss the point. i said i agreed with him. as usual you don't really read what people say, you have already formed a preconceived notion based on your biases.

why is it he cannot give more taxes now, since that is what he is advocating. he didn't need to reduce his effective tax rate. he chose to do that, then demands that others pay more. he did have a good argument about investing, i have never advocated otherwise and it is where i part with many on the right.
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I don't have any 'preconceived' notions about you Yurt. My notions about you come FROM you. If you agree with him, why not leave it at that? Instead, you need to add some lame brained caveat. He 'could' pay more in taxes, but it would not solve our revenue problems.

Warren Buffett's Unprecedented Generosity

Warren Buffett, the world's second-richest man, is making an unprecedented donation to the foundation run by the world's richest man, Microsoft CEO Bill Gates.

Buffett, 75, the CEO of the Omaha, Neb.-based company Berkshire Hathaway, is worth $44 billion, according to Fortune magazine.

Fortune reports that Buffett will donate 85 percent of his fortune amassed from stock in the Berkshire Hathaway company to five foundations.

Warren Buffett signs over $30.7B to Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation

Warren Buffett's contribution of about $1.5 billion a year to the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation will be used to seek cures for the world's worst diseases and improve American education, Bill Gates said Monday.
 
Bfgrn said:
I don't have any 'preconceived' notions about you Yurt. My notions about you come FROM you. If you agree with him, why not leave it at that? Instead, you need to add some lame brained caveat. He 'could' pay more in taxes, but it would not solve our revenue problems.

Warren Buffett's Unprecedented Generosity

Warren Buffett, the world's second-richest man, is making an unprecedented donation to the foundation run by the world's richest man, Microsoft CEO Bill Gates.

Buffett, 75, the CEO of the Omaha, Neb.-based company Berkshire Hathaway, is worth $44 billion, according to Fortune magazine.

Fortune reports that Buffett will donate 85 percent of his fortune amassed from stock in the Berkshire Hathaway company to five foundations.

Warren Buffett signs over $30.7B to Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation

Warren Buffett's contribution of about $1.5 billion a year to the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation will be used to seek cures for the world's worst diseases and improve American education, Bill Gates said Monday.
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There is no questioning Buffett's generosity with his pledge to give away the amount of money he has proposed. Why do you feel he decided to give it to certain charities as opposed to giving it to the government and letting them decide where is should best be used?
 
buffett likely spend the better part of his wealth development avoiding taxes. It's laughable libtards roll out this bs.
 
cawacko said:
There is no questioning Buffett's generosity with his pledge to give away the amount of money he has proposed. Why do you feel he decided to give it to certain charities as opposed to giving it to the government and letting them decide where is should best be used?
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You would have to ask Warren Buffet. But his point is that we need to raise revenues to address long term economic issues. We can't just cut without there being a tragic human toll. Why is that so hard for you people on the right to understand? The typical response from the right is total denial that people will be harmed...they WILL, that is why the tea party earns the label of terrorists.
 
Bfgrn said:
I don't have any 'preconceived' notions about you Yurt. My notions about you come FROM you. If you agree with him, why not leave it at that? Instead, you need to add some lame brained caveat. He 'could' pay more in taxes, but it would not solve our revenue problems.

Warren Buffett's Unprecedented Generosity

Warren Buffett, the world's second-richest man, is making an unprecedented donation to the foundation run by the world's richest man, Microsoft CEO Bill Gates.

Buffett, 75, the CEO of the Omaha, Neb.-based company Berkshire Hathaway, is worth $44 billion, according to Fortune magazine.

Fortune reports that Buffett will donate 85 percent of his fortune amassed from stock in the Berkshire Hathaway company to five foundations.

Warren Buffett signs over $30.7B to Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation

Warren Buffett's contribution of about $1.5 billion a year to the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation will be used to seek cures for the world's worst diseases and improve American education, Bill Gates said Monday.
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you absolutely have preconceived notions of anyone who isn't as far left as you. your logic is typical of "do as i say, not as i do". taxing the wealthy alone isn't going to solve the problem either, but that isn't stopping you and him from suggesting we do that. thus, why not practice what he preaches. he does not have to decrease his tax rate, it is simple wrong to claim he shouldn't pay more now because it wouldn't solve the problem. it would help though.

i think it is great he gives money to private charities. unlike many libs who believe only the government should manage our money, buffet clearly doesn't believe that.
 
Mott the Hoople said:
Dude, you're not kidding anyone. You're VAT/National Sales Tax holds very little difference with any flat tax scheme. The only significant difference is your prebate and that's the worst part of the "Fair Tax". The prebate makes it progressive at the bottom but does not change the regressive nature at the top end. This makes it worse then if their was no prebate cause now the tax burden is dumped almost entirely on the middle and upper middle classes as the wealthy only make up a few percent of the population. It's a terrible idea!
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NOTE TO MOTT: AGAIN..... THE FLAT TAX IS NOT A VAT TAX. IT IS NOT A NATIONAL SALES TAX. THEY ARE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT. THERE IS NO PREBATE. IT IS AN INCOME TAX. IT IS A TAX ON INCOME. IT IS A TAX ON INCOME. IT IS NOT A NATIONAL SALES TAX.

And speaking of running why won't you address the the flaws of your fair flat tax (pun intended. :-)

How will you administer this tax? Don't give me some lame "Oh sure this will be far easier then our current income tax!" cause that's bull shit. Tell me the hell how you're going to do that?
Click to expand...

IT IS AN INCOME TAX. IT IS ADMINISTERED BY THE IRS. HOW MANY TIMES DO I HAVE TO STATE THIS BEFORE YOU GET IT? I HAVE ANSWERED YOUR 'QUESTIONS' EVERY TIME YOU HAVE ASKED AND YOU CONTINUE TO IGNORE THE ANSWERS. WHY IS THAT MOTT?

Then also tell me how the hell you're going to change the constitution so that you can make your flat tax scheme possible with out us having to worry about congress coming along at a later date and adding an income tax to go with it. It takes real precise langauge, a super majority consensus and a lot of time to do this. How can this be done and what legal langauge would be used to make your flat tax scheme practical?
Click to expand...

IT IS AN INCOME TAX. IT IS AN INCOME TAX. IT IS AN INCOME TAX. IT IS AN INCOME TAX. NO NEED TO CHANGE THE CONSTITUTION MORON.
 
Bfgrn said:
You would have to ask Warren Buffet. But his point is that we need to raise revenues to address long term economic issues. We can't just cut without there being a tragic human toll. Why is that so hard for you people on the right to understand? The typical response from the right is total denial that people will be harmed...they WILL, that is why the tea party earns the label of terrorists.
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great...keep up that rhetoric. another do as i say, not as i do from bfgrn. you criticize right leaning rhetoric while calling political opponents terrorists. why don't you call the fbi and have these terrorists arrested fear monger?
 
tom prendergast said:
Do you really think that you advance your argument by resorting to Anglo Saxon at every opportunity?
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Do you really think that you are doing any good by defending that idiot?

By all means, please explain to the moron the difference between a flat tax and a VAT/national sales tax/fair tax.... see how far you get with the idiot.
 
Yurt said:
you absolutely have preconceived notions of anyone who isn't as far left as you. your logic is typical of "do as i say, not as i do". taxing the wealthy alone isn't going to solve the problem either, but that isn't stopping you and him from suggesting we do that. thus, why not practice what he preaches. he does not have to decrease his tax rate, it is simple wrong to claim he shouldn't pay more now because it wouldn't solve the problem. it would help though.

i think it is great he gives money to private charities. unlike many libs who believe only the government should manage our money, buffet clearly doesn't believe that.
Click to expand...

The only preconceived beliefs I come here with is that HUMAN BEINGS are what matter. There is not even a close second. If government programs like Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid helps fellow Americans, then we need to make sure they are funded and enhanced, not slashed or cancelled.

Are we clear?
 
Bfgrn said:
You would have to ask Warren Buffet. But his point is that we need to raise revenues to address long term economic issues. We can't just cut without there being a tragic human toll. Why is that so hard for you people on the right to understand? The typical response from the right is total denial that people will be harmed...they WILL, that is why the tea party earns the label of terrorists.
Click to expand...

But that is going on the assumption that all government spending is good and thus to reduce government spending will cause harm. We could spend days here showing examples of poor government spending and the negative consquences it has had. So to say cutting government spending will have a tragic human toll doesn't hold water on its own.
 
Bfgrn said:
The only preconceived beliefs I come here with is that HUMAN BEINGS are what matter. There is not even a close second. If government programs like Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid helps fellow Americans, then we need to make sure they are funded and enhanced, not slashed or cancelled.

Are we clear?
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We can go back to the charts that both you and Superfreak recently posted which said the percentage of people in poverty has stayed the same in the 40 years since the war on poverty started. Now there is no question that some of that spending helped people. There is also no question that when requirements for receiving government aid made it more attractive to be single than marry the father of your child(ren) that it tore apart families, especially in the black community, and did more long run harm than good.
 
Warren Buffet is a VERY successful capitalist.
Warren Buffet is an American.
Warren Buffet points out the FACT that the rich folk have used their bucks to lobby down their fair share of the comparative tax revenue in this country DESPITE THE FACT THAT THEY WERE STILL MAKING MILLIONS BEFORE THE TAX CUTS, BREAKS AND LOOPHOLES.

Neocon/teabagger/libertarian parrots and toadies regurgitate the assinine mantras fed to them by the people Buffet points out is screwing them....DESPITE THE FACT THAT ALL THE TAX BREAKS AND TAX CUTS AND LOOPHOLES GIVEN THE WEALTHY HAVE NOT RESULTED IN JOBS IN THIS COUNTRY.

NO ONE ON THIS THREAD CAN LOGICALLY OR FACTUALLY REFUTE OR DISPROVE WHAT BUFFET STATES IN HIS ARTICLE. Instead, they create their own little scenarios to try and bypass Buffet's reality based statements.

Irrational hatred for Obama, liberals, progressives or anyone perceived as "them" has once again led people to support the very entities that are diminishing their country and their society's financial situation....those who outsource, downsize and off-shore without giving a damn about the middle and working class in America....so long as they are serving them.
 
Why Warren Buffett is wrong

The first problem with Buffett's view is that the number of super-rich is too small for higher rates to make much difference to our budget problems.

In 2009, the income earned by the 236,833 taxpayers with more than $1 million in adjusted gross income was about $727 billion. Imposing a 10% surcharge on this income would generate at most $73 billion in new revenue -- only about 2% of federal spending. And $73 billion is optimistic; the super-rich will avoid or evade much of the surcharge, significantly lowering its yield.

http://www.cnn.com/2011/OPINION/08/16/miron.buffett.wrong/index.html?hpt=po_bn1

another viewpoint, also offers why buffet is right

since bfgrn claims that no one can counter buffet...can you counter this guy?
 
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