If God were real, you wouldn’t need a book

[ZenMode]

Death is not a moral.

If you had the power to save a child just by thinking about it, would you?

 

[Into the Night]

Well, that's the one Christians often pick...while ignoring all of the other immoral behavior pushed in the Bible.

You are describing those that fight against God, Void. There is nothing immoral about the gospel or its council.

3 of the 10 are God saying "Look at me". Child abuse is ignored in the 10 commandments as is slavery.

Child abuse and how it conflicts with the gospel is described in the Bible, moron.
Mistreating slaves and how it conflicts with the gospel is also described in the Bible, moron.

I could rewrite the 10 Commandments in about 5 minutes and do a better job than the Christian God.

I seriously doubt that.

Let's see you try it.

 

[gfm7175]

Killing your neighbor for working on the Sabbath.

Yes, violating the Sabbath was a very serious offense during the days of "ancient Israel". So?

Killing your wife if she's not a virgin on your wedding night, etc.

Yes, violating God's design for marriage was a very serious offense during the days of "ancient Israel". So?

Self explanitory

Nope.

Nope. There are things that are obviously immoral that weren't included on a list from the being that, according to Christians, is THE single source for all that is moral.

The 10 Commandments aren't an exhaustive list of sins.

It's not my fault that I could write a better 10 commandments today.

"Pride goeth before destruction, and an haughty spirit before a fall" (Proverbs 16:18)
"When pride cometh, then cometh shame: but with the lowly is wisdom"
(Proverbs 11:2)

 

[Into the Night]

Through God? What does that even mean?

Just what it says.

What, is he going to take time away from planting fossils all over the world,

He doesn't plant fossils. They don't grow.

to confuse people, to suddenly make an appearance now, when he hasn't shown himself in 2000+ years?

He has.

 

[Into the Night]

Why would the all-knowing, all-moral creator of the universe leave obvious immoral behavior off of his master list?

Void argument fallacy.

 

[Ross Dolan]

Correct and throughout history, man is known to create gods, demons and other supernatural creatures to explain what they don't understand or fear. I've seen Christians legitimately talk about Baal as though he/it is obviously real.

But, the fact remains that things that were, at one time, unexplainable ended up being explained by science. Mental illness was believed to be demonic possession, so ancient man drilled holes in peoples' heads to let the demon out. Lightning was attributed to gods.

So, yes, I'm looking at the past of man, what their tendencies are the lack of true evidence FOR gods and aligning my beliefs accordingly. I'm playing the odds.

No...you are doing the equivalence of what religionists do when they say they have faith...which is little more than insisting that their blind guess is correct. PERIOD.

YOU are insisting your blind guess is correct...that it is more informed and logical and scientific.
'
IT IS NOT.

You may not think much of my intelligence...and that is fine with me.

But:



It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it.
-- Albert Einstein, 1954, from Albert Einstein: The Human Side, edited by Helen Dukas and Banesh Hoffman, Princeton University Press

“My position concerning God is that of an agnostic. I am convinced that a vivid consciousness of the primary importance of moral principles for the betterment and ennoblement of life does not need the idea of a law-giver, especially a law-giver who works on the basis of reward and punishment.”

Albert Einstein in a letter to M. Berkowitz, October 25, 1950; Einstein Archive 59-215; from Alice Calaprice, ed., The Expanded Quotable Einstein, Princeton, New Jersey: Princeton University Press, 2000, p. 216.
---------

In his book on Stephen Hawking, “Stephen Hawking, the Big Bang, and God, Henry F. Schaefer III, writes:

Now, lest anyone be confused, let me state that Hawking strenuously denies charges that he is an atheist. When he is accused of that he really gets angry and says that such assertions are not true at all. He is an agnostic or deist or something more along those lines. He's certainly not an atheist and not even very sympathetic to atheism.
----------

Carl Sagan: In a March 1996 profile by Jim Dawson in the Minneapolis Star-Tribune, Sagan talked about his then-new book The Demon Haunted World and was asked about his personal spiritual views: "My view is that if there is no evidence for it, then forget about it," he said. "An agnostic is somebody who doesn't believe in something until there is evidence for it, so I'm agnostic."

I e-mailed the person who would know Sagan’s views better than anyone: Ann Druyan, Sagan’s widow. I specifically asked her about the quote in my 1996 story (“An atheist has to know a lot more than I know. An atheist is someone who knows there is no God”). Druyan responded:

“Carl meant exactly what he said. He used words with great care. He did not know if there was a god. It is my understanding that to be an atheist is to take the position that it is known that there is no god or equivalent. Carl was comfortable with the label ‘agnostic’ but not ‘atheist.'”
----------

Neil deGrasse Tyson was raised in a Catholic family, but currently identifies as agnostic. He explicitly disavows the label of "atheist" due to his discomfort with one-word labels and a desire not to be associated with certain "obnoxious online atheism" behaviors, such as eschewing common cultural phrases or calendar systems like

 

[ZenMode]

Yes, violating the Sabbath was a very serious offense during the days of "ancient Israel". So?

Yes, violating God's design for marriage was a very serious offense during the days of "ancient Israel".

Would you be ok living in a society where it was ok to kill your neighbor for working on the Sabbath?

Would you be ok living in a society where it was ok to kill your wife for not being a virgin?

 

[ZenMode]

Void argument fallacy.

Incoherent babbling.

 

[ZenMode]

No...you are doing the equivalence of what religionists do when they say they have faith...which is little more than insisting that their blind guess is correct. PERIOD.

YOU are insisting your blind guess is correct...that it is more informed and logical and scientific.
'
IT IS NOT.

Nope, it is a fact that man has invoked extraterrestrial beings to explain what he doesn't understand and/or is afraid of. The track record of those things being explained by science is 100% so far.

My beliefs and "guess" is based on that objective track record.

 

[Into the Night]

Anything you could write about universal love, universal charity, mercy, kindness, are things you smuggled in from Christianity. There is no canonical atheist code of ethics.

He is not an atheist. He is a fundamentalist.

From a purely scientific Darwinian perspective there is no benefit from practicing love, kindness, charity outside your family, tribe, or social group.

Ignoring Darwin again? You should probably read Origin of Species. I bet you've never read it.
Science is not Darwin or any other individual.

Ensuring the survival and propagation of your genetic information is all that science requires.

Science requires no such thing.

What you think would write about social justice, innate human value, humility, non-violence, non-judgementalism, universal love and charity are things you plucked and smuggled in from the New testament, the Sermon on the Mount, and the rest of Christian ethical thought that has developed for millennia.

This part is probably going to wind up being true.

 

[ZenMode]

He doesn't plant fossils. They don't grow.

Go learn English.

 

[Into the Night]

Killing your neighbor for working on the Sabbath. Killing your wife if she's not a virgin on your wedding night, etc.

Already a commandment against that.

Self explanitory

Then explain.

Nope. There are things that are obviously immoral that weren't included on a list from the being that, according to Christians, is THE single source for all that is moral.

The Ten Commandments are not the single source for all that is moral.

It's not my fault that I could write a better 10 commandments today.

Then let's see you do it.

 

[Monad Portal]

Correct and throughout history, man is known to create gods, demons and other supernatural creatures to explain what they don't understand or fear. I've seen Christians legitimately talk about Baal as though he/it is obviously real.

But, the fact remains that things that were, at one time, unexplainable ended up being explained by science. Mental illness was believed to be demonic possession, so ancient man drilled holes in peoples' heads to let the demon out. Lightning was attributed to gods.

So, yes, I'm looking at the past of man, what their tendencies are the lack of true evidence FOR gods and aligning my beliefs accordingly. I'm playing the odds.

but its about morality. not miracles or science.

 

[gfm7175]

It’s always bothered me why an all powerful god would not interact with humans directly, in person.

He always has (and always will), but it's not always been "in person".

 

[Into the Night]

Christians aren't the first or only people to try to determine what is/isn't moral

So?

and the Bible, as I referenced multiple times, not only misses obvious immoral behavior on its Top 10 list, but openly endorses immoral behavior.

Where? Be specific.

 

[ZenMode]

Then let's see you do it.

Easy, take out two of the three of God self-glorifying and put in "Do not enslave any man" and "Do not abuse, in any way, children".

Done.

Any questions?

 

[Into the Night]

Not lying and not killing covers about everything

Those two DO cover quite a lot.

 

[ZenMode]

but its about morality. not miracles or science.

The fact that the Bible so obviously misses on morality is more evidence against the Christian god.

 

[Into the Night]

Easy, take out two of the three of God self-glorifying and put in "Do not enslave any man"

So...no prisons, prisoners, etc. No arrests. No work release programs. No taxes, and therefore no government.

and "Do not abuse, in any way, children".

Wups. That's already in the Bible as part of the gospel. Children should also not abuse their parents.

Done.

So all the rest you steal from God. You are ignoring the 8th commandment right there. How do you account for this?

Any questions?

Just asked them.

 

[ZenMode]

Already a commandment against that.

So God changed his mind regarding what is moral?

Huh....sounds an awful lot like what I mentioned earlier, which is that SOCIETAL norms change and religion is left trying to retro-fit those new norms into their archaic religious doctrine/beliefs.