If God were real, you wouldn’t need a book

[gmark77]

ftfy

I know you're pissed out of your gourd right now, Cy. Maybe you can take a chill pill. Grow up. Recognize maybe you are a loser and a sub-intellectual. Get comfortable with your loser-dom, Dr. Google.

Or maybe talk to Doc. He's as good as your AI girlfriend.

 

[ZenMode]

A short little Youtube from a former evangelical pastor. Did the fire and brimstone shit for decades until he finally came to his senses. For those of you who are in denial or wish to remain willfully ignorant, he basically says this:

“Christians go in with their god as an assumption rather than a conclusion. When in fact, after close examination, the virgin birth falls apart, the resurrection falls apart, the basis of morality falls apart, the promise of afterlife fizzles into fear based marketing.”

“The gods of Islam, of Judaism, of Christianity only exist in scripture. If they actually existed, we wouldn’t need the books to claim they did. Once the book fails, the god goes with it.”

View: https://youtube.com/shorts/gI_OCjTkQG4?si=cyukCFBlj2u2kI4k

To put this another way....

If every Bible was wiped from the face of the earth, and all of our memories were wiped of any memory of Christianity, the Bible, Jesus, etc, Christianity would cease to exist forever. There's literally no evidence for the Christian God as the creator of the universe..

 

[domer76]

To put this another way....

If every Bible was wiped from the face of the earth, and all of our memories were wiped of any memory of Christianity, the Bible, Jesus, etc, Christianity would cease to exist forever. There's literally no evidence for the Christian God as the creator of the universe..

There’s literally no evidence of the Christian god. Period.

Nobody has seen, heard, nor spoken to it, or any god for that matter. There’s no evidence that prayers get answered. There’s no evidence of any afterlife. The Trinity was adopted after a fucking vote at Nicaea. On and on.

 

[gmark77]

To put this another way....

If every Bible was wiped from the face of the earth, and all of our memories were wiped of any memory of Christianity, the Bible, Jesus, etc, Christianity would cease to exist forever. There's literally no evidence for the Christian God as the creator of the universe..

I think that's the biggest point. True of any and all religions, but jarring to realize. That without someone writing it down there would be no way to infer the existence of Yahweh.

Given the outsized impact of our collected mythos on our society it is scary to realize it is all just made up by other humans just like us. People just accept in our society that someone has a legitimate "role" in our social network of standing in front of people and tell them what someone else made up.

 

[Dutch Uncle]

There’s literally no evidence of the Christian god. Period.

Besides Matt, the MAGAt drunk, who is arguing that there is?

 

[Cypress]

To put this another way....

If every Bible was wiped from the face of the earth, and all of our memories were wiped of any memory of Christianity, the Bible, Jesus, etc, Christianity would cease to exist forever.

Obviously if Jesus had never existed, or if he did and nobody documented what he said and did there would never be any Christiany.

It's hard to believe some posters see this as a profound revelation.

There would still be belief in a divine universal spirit if Jesus never existed.

There's literally no evidence for the Christian God as the creator of the universe..

There's no empirical evidence of infinity, the imaginary number i, or the natural right to liberty either.

Not all human knowledge is based on observation and sensory perception.

A lot of human knowledge is based on reason and logic.

If you're ever actually interested how Christian apologists logically infer God, read CS Lewis. You don't have to agree with it, but if you read it impartially I don't think you'll walk away from it saying CS Lewis is an irrational dunce with pathetically weak arguments.

 

[Hume]

Obviously if Jesus had never existed, or if he did and nobody documented what he said and did there would never be any Christiany.

It's hard to believe some posters see this as a profound revelation.

There would still be belief in a divine universal spirit if Jesus never existed.


There's no empirical evidence of infinity, the imaginary number i, or the natural right to liberty either.

Not all human knowledge is based on observation and sensory perception.

A lot of human knowledge is based on reason and logic.

If you're ever actually interested how Christian apologists logically infer God, read CS Lewis. You don't have to agree with it, but if you read it impartially I don't think you'll walk away from it saying CS Lewis is an irrational dunce with pathetically weak arguments.

Religion is a social practice. Some like it, some do not.

 

[Cypress]

Religion is a social practice. Some like it, some do not.

Why would Darwinian evolution equip us uniquely, out of all the life forms in Earth history, with an affinity for the spiritual and the transcendental?

I don't know the answer, but I've never heard a good one from anyone else that doesn't sound like just ad hoc guesswork

 

[gmark77]

Why would Darwinian evolution equip us uniquely, out of all the life forms in Earth history, with an affinity for the spiritual and the transcendental?

What a stupid question.

I don't know the answer, but I've never heard a good one from anyone else that doesn't sound like just ad hoc guesswork

Because it's a stupid question, Cletus.

The human brain is a "pattern matching" machine. It seeks explanatory variables for events beyond it's control. By your reasoning countless children fear a zombie under their bed so there must be zombies that live under beds.

It's not. It's what happens when a brain seeks patterns.


JEEZUS you are credulous.

 

[ZenMode]

Obviously if Jesus had never existed, or if he did and nobody documented what he said and did there would never be any Christiany.

It's hard to believe some posters see this as a profound revelation.

There would still be belief in a divine universal spirit if Jesus never existed.


There's no empirical evidence of infinity, the imaginary number i, or the natural right to liberty either.

Not all human knowledge is based on observation and sensory perception.

A lot of human knowledge is based on reason and logic.

If you're ever actually interested how Christian apologists logically infer God, read CS Lewis. You don't have to agree with it, but if you read it impartially I don't think you'll walk away from it saying CS Lewis is an irrational dunce with pathetically weak arguments.

To clarify, I didn't say Jesus never existed. I said any memories of him, Christianity, God etc were erased from our memories.

In other words, without stories being passed down from generation to generation, and a book about it, there would be absolutely no way for the story of Christianity to be revived.

There is nothing in existence today to support Christianity's existence.

 

[Cypress]

To clarify, I didn't say Jesus never existed. I said any memories of him, Christianity, God etc were erased from our memories.

So through an act of magic Christianity would go away? Okay, but that's not a compelling argument to me

In other words, without stories being passed down from generation to generation, and a book about it, there would be absolutely no way for the story of Christianity to be revived.

Same for Islam, Buddhism, Taoism, Stoicism. This is so obvious I can't fathom why it's a subject of debate

 

[gmark77]

So through an act of magic Christianity would go away? Okay, but that's not a compelling argument to me

Same for Islam, Buddhism, Taoism, Stoicism. This is so obvious I can't fathom why it's a subject of debate

The point is: there is nothing in the real world that verifies the existence of any specific given God. Nothing. The only thing there are are "questions" (where did it all come from? why do bad things happen to good people? etc. etc.)

Yet we are talking about easily the most important question of all: Is there a God? There is literally nothing to point to any specific God. Even you favored deist position of mush-mouthed "semi-squishy nearly meaningless" concept of "god" is not present anywhere except as a placeholder for your favorite question about fine tuning.

All you have are mysteries. God is a placeholder because there is literally nothing to point to God as an explanatory variable for anything.

 

[ZenMode]

So through an act of magic Christianity would go away? Okay, but that's not a compelling argument to me

Well, what would happen as it relates to math, science and technology if all of their existence was wiped from the Earth? Would we eventually rediscover electricity? Medicine? Computers?

The answer is obviously yes.

Same for Islam, Buddhism, Taoism, Stoicism.

Correct. Anything not based in fact and evidence would suffer the same fate.

This is so obvious I can't fathom why it's a subject of debate

Me either, yet here we are

 

[Into the Night]

You can be insulted, too, Dutch. As you know, I could hardly care less what you and Cypress imagine about my intentions. I dare either of you to explain to me how a belief in a god is rational. You can't. So both of you can fan yourselves and sniff your smelling salts in private.

A belief in any god or gods is based on a circular argument. That is NOT a fallacy, and is completely rational.

 

[Into the Night]

You are as much agnostic as Damocles is libertarian. I didn't call you irrational. I said your beliefs are irrational. You're also a fucking idiot, so there's that.

Denial of logic.

 

[Into the Night]

It's a fucking word with a fucking meaning. Irrational is irrational. Does green gets its feelings hurt when I call it green? Grow the fuck up. You, Dutch, and gmark, all of you.

Denial of logic. Circular definition. Circular argument fallacy (fundamentalism).

 

[Into the Night]

That's rich. You said virtually the same thing about me after I told you multiple times that I have studied religion my entire life. Then you repeated that I did a 5-minute Google search. You're a liar. You're not credible. Your blatant insecurities influence your interactions with other people. You aren't honest with or about yourself. You give yourself too much credit, but I do appreciate your earnestness.

Lie. You denied religion. Argument of the Stone fallacy.

 

[Into the Night]

Syntax is everything. Since English is my second language, I committed myself to mastering it. I think I'm a really effective communicator, but it is those little flairs that make a message more effective.

No, you don't know English. You still use a lot of buzzwords without meaning.

 

[Into the Night]

It is the farthest thing from rational logic that I can imagine.

Denial of logic.

"Everything that has an origin has a cause." Says who?

Says the one that set the origin.

"Something does not come from nothing." Is that so?

Yup. See Einstein's theories on the subject.

"Rational mathematical design does not come from random inanimate chance." Maybe it does.

Nope. Mathematics is designed...by us.

"Therefore, the universe is the creation of some purposeful and rational organizing entity." Prove it.

Was the Universe created? Maybe it's just simply always been here, and always will.

That entire "syllogism", respectfully, is bat shit insane.

No syllogism specified. Attempted argument of the Stone by void.

 

[Into the Night]

The Atheists are just slightly more militant than radical Islam in their desire for forced conversion.

There is no such thing as a 'militant atheist'.

An agnostic is a person who is not convinced there is a god or gods.

WRONG. An agnostic thinks there is a god, but cannot describe it. He assumes that such is unknowable.

An Atheist is one who has absolute faith in god and is at war against that god.

WRONG. An atheist cares not whether a god or gods exist or not. Science, for example, is atheistic. So is mathematics. So is logic. NONE of them care whether a god or gods exist or not. They simply don't go there.
Atheism is not a religion.

The Church of No God is a fundamentalist style religion.