Grok On men's right to know paternity

christiefan915 said:
So no right to privacy?
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In a debate, anecdotal claims—personal stories or experiences—can be powerful for persuasion, but they’re shaky ground if someone’s trying to prove a point without evidence.

Relying on privacy as a shield to avoid backing up those claims doesn’t really hold water.

If you’re putting an anecdote out there to support an argument, you’re already choosing to share something.

Expecting others to just accept it without question, while dodging any call for verification by saying “that’s private,” undermines the whole point of a debate.

It’s like playing a card game but refusing to show your hand when the rules say you should.

That said, privacy’s a real thing. No one’s obligated to spill their life story or dox themselves to win an argument.

The catch is, if you’re leaning on personal experience as your evidence, you can’t reasonably expect it to carry much weight unless you’re willing to let it be scrutinized—or at least offer something concrete to back it up.

Otherwise, it’s just noise.

People can still make those claims, sure, but they shouldn’t be surprised when others call it weak or dismiss it outright.

Debates thrive on shared reasoning, not blind trust.


@Grok
 
christiefan915 said:
Turn them into the Sex Gestapo!
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Nah, just put chemicals in their water and food ... oh, wait ...

There’s growing evidence that certain chemicals in water and food might mess with fertility, though it’s not a straight line from exposure to infertility for everyone.

Endocrine-disrupting chemicals (EDCs) like BPA, phthalates, and PFAS—found in plastics, packaging, pesticides, and even water supplies—are the main suspects.

They can mimic or block hormones like estrogen and testosterone, which play big roles in reproduction.

Studies, mostly on animals, show these can lower sperm count, screw up ovulation, or throw off hormonal balance. In humans, it’s trickier to pin down—correlation doesn’t always mean causation—but there’s enough smoke to suggest a fire.

Take BPA: it’s in some food cans and water bottles. Research, like a 2011 study from Harvard, linked higher BPA levels in women to lower egg yields during IVF.

Phthalates, used in soft plastics, have been tied to reduced sperm quality in men—think lower motility and count—per a 2014 NIH-backed study.

PFAS, the “forever chemicals” in nonstick coatings and contaminated groundwater, are even nastier. A 2021 review in Environmental Health Perspectives found they’re associated with longer time-to-pregnancy and disruptions in menstrual cycles.

Then there’s pesticide: atrazine, a common herbicide, has been shown to feminize male frogs at low doses (EPA data), and human studies hint at similar reproductive hiccups.

Not every exposure guarantees problems—dose, timing, and individual factors matter.

The average person’s intake is usually below what regulators like the FDA or EPA call “safe,” but critics argue those limits might lag behind newer science.

Plus, these chemicals often mix together in real life, and we’re only starting to grasp the combo effects.

Fertility’s been dropping globally—sperm counts are down 50%+ since the 1970s, per a 2017 Human Reproduction Update meta-analysis—and while lifestyle and age get blame, chemical exposure’s a plausible piece of the puzzle. Hard proof’s still elusive, but the links are strong enough that it’s not just tinfoil-hat territory anymore.


@Grok



:evilnod:





Explain endocrine disruptors further
Discuss genetic fertility factors
 
Diogenes said:
In a debate, anecdotal claims—personal stories or experiences—can be powerful for persuasion, but they’re shaky ground if someone’s trying to prove a point without evidence.

Relying on privacy as a shield to avoid backing up those claims doesn’t really hold water.

If you’re putting an anecdote out there to support an argument, you’re already choosing to share something.

Expecting others to just accept it without question, while dodging any call for verification by saying “that’s private,” undermines the whole point of a debate.

It’s like playing a card game but refusing to show your hand when the rules say you should.

That said, privacy’s a real thing. No one’s obligated to spill their life story or dox themselves to win an argument.

The catch is, if you’re leaning on personal experience as your evidence, you can’t reasonably expect it to carry much weight unless you’re willing to let it be scrutinized—or at least offer something concrete to back it up.

Otherwise, it’s just noise.

People can still make those claims, sure, but they shouldn’t be surprised when others call it weak or dismiss it outright.

Debates thrive on shared reasoning, not blind trust.


@Grok
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Do you want to put me under oath? :unsure:

"In the legal sphere, anecdotal evidence, if it passes certain legal requirements and is admitted as testimony, is a common form of evidence used in a court of law. In many cases, anecdotal evidence is the only evidence presented at trial. Scientific evidence in a court of law is called physical evidence, but this is much rarer. Anecdotal evidence, with a few safeguards, represents the bulk of evidence in court.

The legal rigors applied to testimony for it to be considered evidence is that it must be given under oath, that the person is only testifying to their own words and actions, and that someone intentionally lying under oath is subject to perjury. However, these rigors do not make testimony in a court of law equal to scientific evidence as there are far less legal rigors. Testimony about another person's experiences or words is called hearsay and is usually not admissible, though there are certain exceptions. However, any hearsay that is not objected to or thrown out by a judge is considered evidence for a jury. This means that trials contain quite a bit of anecdotal evidence, which is considered as relevant evidence by a jury. Eyewitness testimony (which is a form of anecdotal evidence) is considered the most compelling form of evidence by a jury."
 
christiefan915 said:
Where I work there are a couple of men who have their wages garnished for child support because they refused to obey court orders. These men are divorced, too, and the children are from the marriage. So they tried to get away with not paying until the court system finally caught up. What kind of parent would do that to the kids? Note that I said "parent," not man.
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no doubt that there are shitty parents, but we're also talking about issues pre birth, not after birth.
 
Scut Farkus said:
Sign in
do men have a human right to know the paternity of their children?

The question of whether men have a human right to know the paternity of their children involves a complex interplay of legal, ethical, and human rights considerations. Here's a breakdown:

  • Legal Perspective: In many jurisdictions, there are legal mechanisms for establishing paternity, including DNA testing. These rights can vary significantly by country. For instance, some countries might mandate paternity testing in certain circumstances (like child support disputes), while others might protect the privacy of the mother, especially if she opposes the test.
  • Human Rights Perspective:From a human rights viewpoint, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights doesn't explicitly address paternity rights.However, one could argue that knowing one's biological lineage might fall under broader rights like privacy, family life, or identity.
    • Right to Privacy: Both parents have privacy rights, which can conflict in paternity issues. The mother's right to privacy regarding her medical and personal life could be in tension with the father's interest in knowing paternity.
    • Right to Family Life: Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights protects the right to respect for private and family life. Courts in some countries have interpreted this to include a right to know one's biological origins, though this interpretation isn't universal.
  • Ethical Considerations: Ethically, there's debate about the moral obligations and rights concerning paternity. Some argue that knowing one's biological parentage is essential for personal identity, psychological well-being, and familial bonds. Others emphasize the potential harm to family dynamics, the child, and the mother if paternity is contested.
  • Practical Implications: There are practical considerations like child support, inheritance rights, and medical history knowledge that could argue in favor of paternity rights. However, these must be balanced against potential negative outcomes like family disruption or emotional distress.
In conclusion, while there isn't a globally recognized human right explicitly stating that men have a right to know the paternity of their children, various legal systems and human rights frameworks indirectly touch on elements of this issue through rights to family, privacy, and identity. The balance between these rights is often decided on a case-by-case basis, considering the interests of all parties involved, including the child.
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So Grok ends up basically saying nothing...

Meh....
 
christiefan915 said:
It's not flailing, it's rebutting. :nodyes:
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Is Lesion flirting with you again? He seems to like you since it's a common pattern with him.

Conversely, LIG had a crush on Lesion and he wanted nothing to do with her. LOL

6a05vl.gif
 
christiefan915 said:

Child Support Statistics by Gender​


Do child support numbers vary depending on the gender of the custodial and noncustodial parents? Who is more likely to pay child support? What is the role of mothers and fathers when it comes to child support? Here are 10 interesting facts.

  1. Male vs. female: Eighty percent of custodial parents are women. This is a decrease from 84 percent in 1994
  2. Outstanding child support: The majority of outstanding child support is owed by fathers who have a low income.
  3. Mothers who don’t receive child support: More than 40 percent of mothers who don’t receive child support are survivors of physical or emotional abuse.
  4. Custodial rates and marriage: Custodial fathers are more likely to have been divorced Custodial mothers are more likely to have never been wed before.
  5. Women are more likely to get child support orders: Fifty-one percent of mothers were due child support versus 41 percent of custodial fathers.
  6. Custodial mothers are more likely to have multiple children: Custodial mothers are more likely to have two or more children living with them than custodial fathers.
  7. Poverty by gender: Kids living with a custodial mother were more likely (23.7 percent) to live in poverty than kids living with custodial fathers (11.2 percent). The rate is even higher for mothers with two children (29.2 percent) or three children (50.8 percent).
  8. Employment by gender: Over half of custodial mothers had full-time jobs in 2017. Over 21 percent didn’t have a job. Over 74 percent of custodial fathers had full-time jobs versus 9.2 percent who didn’t work at all.
  9. Those who received no child support: 38.4 percent of custodial fathers did not receive any child support payments versus 28.7 percent of custodial mothers.
  10. Custodial fathers earn more: The median household income in 2017 for custodial fathers who were due child support was over $70,000. The median household income for custodial mothers who were due child support was $52,000.
momlovesbest.com

30 Child Support Statistics & Facts: 2025 Insights

Discover 30 revealing child support statistics and facts in the U.S., highlighting gender and race disparities.
momlovesbest.com momlovesbest.com
Click to expand...
there's no apparent argument in any of these random statements.

random statements fallacy.

:truestory:
 
christiefan915 said:

Child Support Statistics by Gender​


Do child support numbers vary depending on the gender of the custodial and noncustodial parents? Who is more likely to pay child support? What is the role of mothers and fathers when it comes to child support? Here are 10 interesting facts.

  1. Male vs. female: Eighty percent of custodial parents are women. This is a decrease from 84 percent in 1994
  2. Outstanding child support: The majority of outstanding child support is owed by fathers who have a low income.
  3. Mothers who don’t receive child support: More than 40 percent of mothers who don’t receive child support are survivors of physical or emotional abuse.
  4. Custodial rates and marriage: Custodial fathers are more likely to have been divorced Custodial mothers are more likely to have never been wed before.
  5. Women are more likely to get child support orders: Fifty-one percent of mothers were due child support versus 41 percent of custodial fathers.
  6. Custodial mothers are more likely to have multiple children: Custodial mothers are more likely to have two or more children living with them than custodial fathers.
  7. Poverty by gender: Kids living with a custodial mother were more likely (23.7 percent) to live in poverty than kids living with custodial fathers (11.2 percent). The rate is even higher for mothers with two children (29.2 percent) or three children (50.8 percent).
  8. Employment by gender: Over half of custodial mothers had full-time jobs in 2017. Over 21 percent didn’t have a job. Over 74 percent of custodial fathers had full-time jobs versus 9.2 percent who didn’t work at all.
  9. Those who received no child support: 38.4 percent of custodial fathers did not receive any child support payments versus 28.7 percent of custodial mothers.
  10. Custodial fathers earn more: The median household income in 2017 for custodial fathers who were due child support was over $70,000. The median household income for custodial mothers who were due child support was $52,000.
momlovesbest.com

30 Child Support Statistics & Facts: 2025 Insights

Discover 30 revealing child support statistics and facts in the U.S., highlighting gender and race disparities.
momlovesbest.com momlovesbest.com
Click to expand...
Good information that the deadbeat dads, wife beaters, cheating spouses and incels will choose to ignore.
 
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