Have gun, will travel

FUCK THE POLICE

911 EVERY DAY
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/01/opinion/01collins.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

Have Gun, Will Travel



Article Tools Sponsored By
By GAIL COLLINS
Published: July 31, 2009

Plaxico Burress, the former football star, appeared before a grand jury in Manhattan this week to explain how he came to carry a concealed weapon into a nightclub. Burress, you may remember, had cannily tucked his loaded pistol into the waistband of his sweatpants when he went out for a night on the town. The gun started to slip, as objects in waistbands are wont to do. When he grabbed it, he accidentally shot himself in the thigh.

This is what is known as a bad plan.

The reason I am bringing all this up is that Burress’s spokespeople keep pointing out that he did have a permit to carry a handgun in Florida. (It was expired, but as the waistband business demonstrates, this guy does not excel in attention to detail.) So the story gives us an excellent entry into the question of whether states should be required to recognize other states’ gun carry permits.

The Senate recently held a debate on just such a proposal, during which the sponsor, John Thune of South Dakota, said that if people from his state were able to go to New York and visit tourist attractions while carrying their concealed weapons, “Central Park would be a much safer place.”

This suggests how much Americans have to learn about each other. Central Park is way safer than South Dakota. There were no murders and three serious assaults in Central Park in 2008, compared with five murders and 341 assaults in Sioux Falls alone. There was a horrible near-fatality in the park this week, but it involved a rotting tree limb that fell and hit a man on the head. If South Dakotans would like to come to visit carrying concealed chain saws, it is possible that we can do some business.

The vote on the Thune amendment was 58 to 39 in favor, which, of course, in the Senate world means that it was defeated. But it will be back. These days, whenever Congress feels the yen for a good old-fashioned debate about a hot-button social issue, it goes for guns. This year, we have already been blessed with legislation giving people the right to carry concealed weapons in national parks. Maybe soon there will also be a Plaxico’s Law, affirming that a gun permit, once granted, is good for a lifetime, just like Social Security numbers.

I like to think this gun obsession is progress of a sort, since it has almost completely replaced the offering of divisive gotcha amendments on abortion or gay rights.

Given the fact that lawmakers yelling about assault rifles and Glocks very seldom feel compelled to quote from the Bible, you’d think we could work toward a sensible national consensus on guns. Senator Charles Schumer of New York offered to work on a compromised concealed weapon bill that would only apply to truck drivers who haul valuable cargo around the country. Maybe, in turn, the other side would be a little more rational about regulating weapons sales at gun shows.

One barrier, of course, is the National Rifle Association, which is dedicated to the cause of making everybody as loony as possible on the subject. Another is the suspicion on the part of gun owners that people who favor gun control look down on them.

In that Senate debate, opponents of loosening the current laws did get a tad carried away, particularly when they kept equating carrying a concealed weapon with being a mass murderer. Senator Robert Menendez of New Jersey claimed that the newly empowered gun owners coming into his state would be “like Richard Poplawski, the white supremacist, armed with an AK-47, who allegedly murdered three Pittsburgh police officers on his front porch.”

Perhaps Menendez was having a bad day, what with a large chunk of the New Jersey Democratic Party teetering on the verge of indictment. But given the fact that nearly half the householders in America have guns, it doesn’t make sense to suggest that they’re all homicidal or that only good gun owners are the hunters. There are an estimated250 million guns in America. Jim Kessler of the Third Way, a nonpartisan think tank, noted that if the noncriminals only used them for hunting, “there wouldn’t be a varmint left in the country.”

Gun advocates tend to think of themselves as representatives of small-town or rural values. But their worldview is so dark, you’d think they were living in a dystopian Gotham City. Senator Thune said he was worried that his daughter might have to drive home from college through states that would not allow her the protection of a pistol in the glove compartment. Senator Jim Webb of Virginia fretted about his elderly father checking into a motel without a loaded gun to keep the criminals at bay.

In New York, I have never heard a single parent say they were afraid their kid couldn’t make it home from school unarmed. However, we do worry a little bit about idiots wandering into nightclubs with Glocks tucked in their sweats.
 
Selective 10th Amendment rights Epi?
What is selective about it? RTKBA is an ENUMERATED right of THE PEOPLE, not of the states. The 14th Amendment states that no citizen can be denied their constitutional protections without due process of law. (and, no, passing legislation into law is NOT "due process".) The 10th Amendment reserves rights to the states or THE PEOPLE. Triple hit - it is the right of THE PEOPLE to keep and bear arms. State laws which limit, interfere with, or, in some case, outright deny that right are in violation of the 2nd Amendment, the 14th Amendment, and the 10th Amendment. It's about time that fact is recognized and this right - as well as others - are actually returned to the people - or the states depending on circumstances - where they belong.
 
What is selective about it? RTKBA is an ENUMERATED right of THE PEOPLE, not of the states. The 14th Amendment states that no citizen can be denied their constitutional protections without due process of law. (and, no, passing legislation into law is NOT "due process".) The 10th Amendment reserves rights to the states or THE PEOPLE. Triple hit - it is the right of THE PEOPLE to keep and bear arms. State laws which limit, interfere with, or, in some case, outright deny that right are in violation of the 2nd Amendment, the 14th Amendment, and the 10th Amendment. It's about time that fact is recognized and this right - as well as others - are actually returned to the people - or the states depending on circumstances - where they belong.

:blah:

You have no right to own a gun, and especially not to own and conceal it in public places.
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/01/opinion/01collins.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss

Have Gun, Will Travel



Article Tools Sponsored By
By GAIL COLLINS
Published: July 31, 2009

Plaxico Burress, the former football star, appeared before a grand jury in Manhattan this week to explain how he came to carry a concealed weapon into a nightclub. Burress, you may remember, had cannily tucked his loaded pistol into the waistband of his sweatpants when he went out for a night on the town. The gun started to slip, as objects in waistbands are wont to do. When he grabbed it, he accidentally shot himself in the thigh.

This is what is known as a bad plan.

The reason I am bringing all this up is that Burress’s spokespeople keep pointing out that he did have a permit to carry a handgun in Florida. (It was expired, but as the waistband business demonstrates, this guy does not excel in attention to detail.) So the story gives us an excellent entry into the question of whether states should be required to recognize other states’ gun carry permits.

The Senate recently held a debate on just such a proposal, during which the sponsor, John Thune of South Dakota, said that if people from his state were able to go to New York and visit tourist attractions while carrying their concealed weapons, “Central Park would be a much safer place.”

This suggests how much Americans have to learn about each other. Central Park is way safer than South Dakota. There were no murders and three serious assaults in Central Park in 2008, compared with five murders and 341 assaults in Sioux Falls alone. There was a horrible near-fatality in the park this week, but it involved a rotting tree limb that fell and hit a man on the head. If South Dakotans would like to come to visit carrying concealed chain saws, it is possible that we can do some business.

The vote on the Thune amendment was 58 to 39 in favor, which, of course, in the Senate world means that it was defeated. But it will be back. These days, whenever Congress feels the yen for a good old-fashioned debate about a hot-button social issue, it goes for guns. This year, we have already been blessed with legislation giving people the right to carry concealed weapons in national parks. Maybe soon there will also be a Plaxico’s Law, affirming that a gun permit, once granted, is good for a lifetime, just like Social Security numbers.

I like to think this gun obsession is progress of a sort, since it has almost completely replaced the offering of divisive gotcha amendments on abortion or gay rights.

Given the fact that lawmakers yelling about assault rifles and Glocks very seldom feel compelled to quote from the Bible, you’d think we could work toward a sensible national consensus on guns. Senator Charles Schumer of New York offered to work on a compromised concealed weapon bill that would only apply to truck drivers who haul valuable cargo around the country. Maybe, in turn, the other side would be a little more rational about regulating weapons sales at gun shows.

One barrier, of course, is the National Rifle Association, which is dedicated to the cause of making everybody as loony as possible on the subject. Another is the suspicion on the part of gun owners that people who favor gun control look down on them.

In that Senate debate, opponents of loosening the current laws did get a tad carried away, particularly when they kept equating carrying a concealed weapon with being a mass murderer. Senator Robert Menendez of New Jersey claimed that the newly empowered gun owners coming into his state would be “like Richard Poplawski, the white supremacist, armed with an AK-47, who allegedly murdered three Pittsburgh police officers on his front porch.”

Perhaps Menendez was having a bad day, what with a large chunk of the New Jersey Democratic Party teetering on the verge of indictment. But given the fact that nearly half the householders in America have guns, it doesn’t make sense to suggest that they’re all homicidal or that only good gun owners are the hunters. There are an estimated250 million guns in America. Jim Kessler of the Third Way, a nonpartisan think tank, noted that if the noncriminals only used them for hunting, “there wouldn’t be a varmint left in the country.”

Gun advocates tend to think of themselves as representatives of small-town or rural values. But their worldview is so dark, you’d think they were living in a dystopian Gotham City. Senator Thune said he was worried that his daughter might have to drive home from college through states that would not allow her the protection of a pistol in the glove compartment. Senator Jim Webb of Virginia fretted about his elderly father checking into a motel without a loaded gun to keep the criminals at bay.

In New York, I have never heard a single parent say they were afraid their kid couldn’t make it home from school unarmed. However, we do worry a little bit about idiots wandering into nightclubs with Glocks tucked in their sweats.

Thanks for posting this...I got a kick out of it when I read it the first time! The points that this article puts forth will be ignored by the gunners, who will just keep parroting their disputed and distorted mantras until doomsday....with the gun manufacturers going to the bank.
 
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as long as the mall doesn't have 'no guns allowed' signs posted, it does. at least in texas.

gathering_-1.jpg
 
That's fine then, for Texas. A state. That can decide. Per the 10th. Getting it yet?

you didn't have any argument from me. I'm just reiterating that it's hypocrisy to demand states rights in a gun law argument and then federal control over health insurance......or banning texting while driving.
 
Travelling with guns does require a lot of research to make sure you follow all the various rules of the states you will be going thru.

Pain in the ass, if you asked me. But its something I can live with.
 
Selective 10th Amendment rights Epi?

I believe in the incorporation of the Bill of Rights to the states, and I disagree with the Court's holding in Presser v. Illinois that found it to be only applied to the federal government.

There are some rights so important (free speech, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, and the right to bear arms, for example) that I do not think that the states should be allowed to infringe upon them.
 
I believe in the incorporation of the Bill of Rights to the states, and I disagree with the Court's holding in Presser v. Illinois that found it to be only applied to the federal government.

There are some rights so important (free speech, protection against unreasonable search and seizure, and the right to bear arms, for example) that I do not think that the states should be allowed to infringe upon them.

The "right to a gun" is not a freedom. States should be REQUIRED to ban guns.
 
Travelling with guns does require a lot of research to make sure you follow all the various rules of the states you will be going thru.

Pain in the ass, if you asked me. But its something I can live with.

but how it should be is that in the 45 states that actually HAVE a right to bear arms in their state constitutions, need to have that right actually exist, like in open carry without a fricking license. otherwise, it's just a 'yeah, you have that right, but can't use it' piece of crap constitution.
 
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