The existence of Israel is proof there is no God

[FUCK THE POLICE]

How could a just God allow such an injustice to occur? Israel is proof of the inherent evil and barbarism of man, that people with power will take whatever they want from whomever they want, that there is no such thing as justice, that, as Thucydides put it 2000 years ago, "Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must."

[USFREEDOM911]

How could a just God allow such an injustice to occur? Israel is proof of the inherent evil and barbarism of man, that people with power will take whatever they want from whomever they want, that there is no such thing as justice, that, as Thucydides put it 2000 years ago, "Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must."


:thisisgettinggood:

[iewitness]

"ANTI" mania, this kid has. I think I will call the waterhead... "the "NOT" man...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiHdr4rWG98

[Darth Omar]

Well, this one rates as the most ridiculous OP the week.

[Buckly J. Ewer]

"ANTI" mania, this kid has. I think I will call the waterhead... "the "NOT" man...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiHdr4rWG98

Anthrax are a Satan worshiping messinger band gomer...
You listen to that crap?

[moon]

How could a just God allow such an injustice to occur? Israel is proof of the inherent evil and barbarism of man, that people with power will take whatever they want from whomever they want, that there is no such thing as justice, that, as Thucydides put it 2000 years ago, "Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must."

The nearest that we've come to divine justice is international law as described by the United Nations. Israel is most certainly a pariah under international law so, in those terms, you make a good point. Why- every believer in law should be asking- do we continually suffer the transgressions of America's scurrilous client state ?

[Minister of Truth]

Saudi Arabia is a client state, as well...

[Darth Omar]

Saudi Arabia is a client state, as well...

But they're Muslim and not Jewish, so there's that...

[moon]

Surely, the crimes of neoZionism are not diminished by pointing to other geographical locations or religions ?

[Truth Detector]

OH goody; another Jew hate Nazi propaganda thread on Just Plain Pathetic ; color me surprised.

[moon]

Truth Detector

OH goody; another Jew hate Nazi propaganda thread on Just Plain Pathetic ; color me surprised.

I think that the days of false accusations of antisemitism as a defence for neoZionist criminality are long gone. The internet has exposed that particular diversionary tactic for what it is.

Let's examine the thread for any possible basis for such false charges.
There is not one mention of ' Jews ' let alone any professed hatred for Jews. As for ' Nazis ' there's not one mention of them either.

No, the thread concerns Zionism , plain and simple- and even that doctrine of ethnic cleansing is not the creation of Judaism. Jewish Zionists are far outnumbered by Christian Zionists, the former occupying Palestine for purely territorial reasons and the latter suffering from the primitive delusion that the ethnic cleansing of Palestine will precipitate the ' second coming ' of their Christ. It is these forces of ignorance which have caused the suffering and slaughter of Palestinians- a fact which the ' antisemitic ' slur can no longer mask.

[Minister of Truth]

OH goody; another Jew hate Nazi propaganda thread on Just Plain Pathetic ; color me surprised.

If you don't like it, then go away...

[Buckly J. Ewer]

If you don't like it, then go away...

He can't...
He likes the abuse.

[georgephillip]

When Zionism began in Europe a little over a hundred years ago there were ten times as many non-Jew as Jews living in Palestine. By 1948 the ratio had shrunk to 2:1 which allowed 650,000 Jews to inflict their state upon twice as many non-Jews, driving 700,000 refugees into the surrounding Arab states. Today, the borders of the New Middle East are being redrawn from Syria to Iraq to Yemen, and there are roughly equal numbers of Jews and non-Jews living between the River and the sea. Any chance of peace in that part of the world probably starts in the Jordan valley, imho.

[FUCK THE POLICE]

If there were a God, Israel wouldn't exist. Just like Rhodesia doesn't exist. All the remnants of injustice and racism would be wiped away.

[georgephillip]

Israel as a Jewish state might not exist, but what would take its place? The possibility of another Arab state west of the Jordan river doesn't seem likely at this time with current levels of racism among young Jews in Israel. Does that leave a one-state option as the only other possibility?

[moon]

Israel as a Jewish state might not exist, but what would take its place? The possibility of another Arab state west of the Jordan river doesn't seem likely at this time with current levels of racism among young Jews in Israel. Does that leave a one-state option as the only other possibility?

As georgephillip points out Jews were a minority when the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians began and , recent demographic studies tell us, Jews will be a minority again next year across Israel and occupied Palestine. Bearing in mind the terrible atrocities that neoZionists have committed against the Palestinians since 1947 and in recent years the concept of One State sits very poorly with Israelis who fear- rightly so- retribution at some future point. Israelis live by a policy of vengeance, based upon the experiences of European Jewry at the hands of Third Reich fascists, and that policy has gone a long way towards the rise of Israeli fascism that we witness today.
Fascists, by their very nature, believe in a ' purity of race ' and neoZionism has turned Israel into the most ' racially ' conscious state on earth so the prospect of Israelis accepting a One State solution is remote in the extreme, particularly as the overwhelming majority of UN member states back the Two State solution. Further, the current Israeli regime is anxious to fan the flames of hatred and apartheid , or ' hafrada ' as Israelis call it, as can be demonstrated by its actions against Muslim holy sites in Jerusalem ( al Quds in Arabic ) and its murder of Palestinian protesters since then. Anybody doubting this policy has only to view the videos of Israeli soldiers planting weapons on Palestinians before arresting or murdering them;

http://azvsas.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/soldiers-force-palestinian-girl-to-pick.html

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Israelis+plant+knife+on+Palestinian+girl&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=X4mHVtHXKsbPOprFhPgG

However, such actions are proof that neoZionism FEARS public opinion and that can only mean that they are themselves aware of their own criminal activities with regard to Palestine and Palestinians. Thus, in their minds, there can never ever be any ' sharing ' with their victims. That's not to say that there are no Israelis who sympathise with the Palestinian cause but they will never influence the racist Knesset which continually passes ever more repressive legislation against them. Our real hope lies in the curtailment of North American blanket support for Israel and each nail in the coffin of Israeli ' democracy ' brings that day closer. Israel cannot win- and neither should it.

[evince]

Anthrax are a Satan worshiping messinger band gomer...
You listen to that crap?

he has no set morals hes a republican

[Darth Omar]

As georgephillip points out Jews were a minority when the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians began and , recent demographic studies tell us, Jews will be a minority again next year across Israel and occupied Palestine. Bearing in mind the terrible atrocities that neoZionists have committed against the Palestinians since 1947 and in recent years the concept of One State sits very poorly with Israelis who fear- rightly so- retribution at some future point. Israelis live by a policy of vengeance, based upon the experiences of European Jewry at the hands of Third Reich fascists, and that policy has gone a long way towards the rise of Israeli fascism that we witness today.
Fascists, by their very nature, believe in a ' purity of race ' and neoZionism has turned Israel into the most ' racially ' conscious state on earth so the prospect of Israelis accepting a One State solution is remote in the extreme, particularly as the overwhelming majority of UN member states back the Two State solution. Further, the current Israeli regime is anxious to fan the flames of hatred and apartheid , or ' hafrada ' as Israelis call it, as can be demonstrated by its actions against Muslim holy sites in Jerusalem ( al Quds in Arabic ) and its murder of Palestinian protesters since then. Anybody doubting this policy has only to view the videos of Israeli soldiers planting weapons on Palestinians before arresting or murdering them;

http://azvsas.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/soldiers-force-palestinian-girl-to-pick.html

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Israelis+plant+knife+on+Palestinian+girl&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=X4mHVtHXKsbPOprFhPgG

However, such actions are proof that neoZionism FEARS public opinion and that can only mean that they are themselves aware of their own criminal activities with regard to Palestine and Palestinians. Thus, in their minds, there can never ever be any ' sharing ' with their victims. That's not to say that there are no Israelis who sympathise with the Palestinian cause but they will never influence the racist Knesset which continually passes ever more repressive legislation against them. Our real hope lies in the curtailment of North American blanket support for Israel and each nail in the coffin of Israeli ' democracy ' brings that day closer. Israel cannot win- and neither should it.

You're an apparent Jew hater, but I have to ask this.

What's your end game with Israel? What do you expect of them? Cede all the territory back to 'Palestine'? Become another Arab country or otherwise cease to exist?

I'm curious.

[evince]

recognizing the REAL history is not hate.


you know just like recognizing that Greenwood Ok was burned and pillaged by white racists even though the white racists tried tot pretend it never happened

[Darth Omar]

recognizing the REAL history is not hate.


you know just like recognizing that Greenwood Ok was burned and pillaged by white racists even though the white racists tried tot pretend it never happened

If you want to talk about 'real' history Palestine is a figmentary nation.

[evince]

your intelligence an fairness is a figment of your imagination

[Darth Omar]

your intelligence an fairness is a figment of your imagination

Fair lol? Israel is a tiny slice of land while Arabs have the rest of the Middle East. What's 'fair' about forcing them to cede more of it to the Palestinians?

[evince]

well when you live on stolen land its hard for people to just ignore that

[Darth Omar]

well when you live on stolen land its hard for people to just ignore that

Do you believe there was a Jewish presence on the land long before Palestine existed? Or is that fact of history inconvenient?

[evince]

dear fucking asshole


the people who had it taken from them didn't steal it from anyone huh

[Darth Omar]

dear fucking asshole


the people who had it taken from them didn't steal it from anyone huh

Really lol? The Palestinians spring up out of the ground or something? All land was taken from someone else at some prior time. The ancient Jews took it from the Philistines and some others. The Jews had it for centuries before the Babylonians came along; after that it was the Assyrians and then finally the Romans came along.

When did the Palestinians have a nation there?

[evince]

the people who were alive and living in those homes that were taken from them stole no ones land you liar

[Damocles]

the people who were alive and living in those homes that were taken from them stole no ones land you liar

He listed facts, you simply spout. There is the difference in this "argument". It's easy to pretend there were no Jews in Israel before 1948, but it is only pretending. It's also easy to pretend that the history of the place isn't real because it is inconvenient.

At this point, right now, what do you see as the solution? Make the Jews leave?

[evince]

convince the evil nutinbutayahoo followers to allow the decent people in Israel to run the show.


they don't all back nuttins evil

[Darth Omar]

Israel as a Jewish state might not exist, but what would take its place? The possibility of another Arab state west of the Jordan river doesn't seem likely at this time with current levels of racism among young Jews in Israel. Does that leave a one-state option as the only other possibility?

What would take place of the Jewish state? Hmm....how about an Islamist state. Yeah, exactly what we need lol.

[kaz]

How could a just God allow such an injustice to occur? Israel is proof of the inherent evil and barbarism of man, that people with power will take whatever they want from whomever they want, that there is no such thing as justice, that, as Thucydides put it 2000 years ago, "Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must."

Yeah, getting endless rockets shot at them and getting blown up by terrorists in buses and cafes. What are they thinking?

[kaz]

the people who were alive and living in those homes that were taken from them stole no ones land you liar

You're such a racist. You don't know anything but lies, you need to look at facts

[cancel2 2022]

If there were a God, Israel wouldn't exist. Just like Rhodesia doesn't exist. All the remnants of injustice and racism would be wiped away.

I would love for my black Zimbabwean friends to set you straight about the realities in Africa, however I fear that you are beyond any kind of help. They came to London via South Africa as Zimbabwe is an economic basket case brought to its knees by the arrogance and ineptitude of Mugabe and his ZANU cronies.

[iolo]

What would take place of the Jewish state? Hmm....how about an Islamist state. Yeah, exactly what we need lol.

A non-racist, non-religious state backed by the UN, obviously.

[cancel2 2022]

He listed facts, you simply spout. There is the difference in this "argument". It's easy to pretend there were no Jews in Israel before 1948, but it is only pretending. It's also easy to pretend that the history of the place isn't real because it is inconvenient.

At this point, right now, what do you see as the solution? Make the Jews leave?

I also notice that Israel haters never mention the Jewish Nakba, I wonder why not? These were Sephardic and Mizrahi Jews who had lived in Arab countries for hundreds of years.

Israeli columnist Ben Dror Yemini (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Dror_Yemini), himself a Mizrahi Jew, wrote the following:


However, there is another Nakba: the Jewish Nakba. During those same years [the 1940s], there was a long line of slaughters, of pogroms, of property confiscation and of deportations against Jews in Islamic countries. This chapter of history has been left in the shadows. The Jewish Nakba was worse than the Palestinian Nakba. The only difference is that the Jews did not turn that Nakba into their founding ethos. To the contrary.

[iolo]

Yeah, getting endless rockets shot at them and getting blown up by terrorists in buses and cafes. What are they thinking?

I only wish the buggers had atomic bombs dropped on them, the Nazi swine.

[cancel2 2022]

A non-racist, non-religious state backed by the UN, obviously.

Yes because Saudi Arabia and just about every Arab country are an example to us all about non-racist, non-religious states. Tell me Taffy, why did Jordan kick the Palestinians out after Black September?

[evince]

You're such a racist. You don't know anything but lies, you need to look at facts

they had lived there for how many generations before it was taken from them after WWII.


the families actually living on that land at he time took it from no one

[evince]

Yes because Saudi Arabia and just about every Arab country are an example to us all about non-racist, non-religious states. Tell me Taffy, why did Jordan kick the Palestinians out after Black September?

and the nutinbutayahoo crowd in Israel want to war with them.


the other side of the political coin in Israel wanted what?


there is another point of view IN Israel huh

[kaz]

A non-racist, non-religious state backed by the UN, obviously.

What color is the sky in your world?

[kaz]

I only wish the buggers had atomic bombs dropped on them, the Nazi swine.

Gotcha, Adolph. The only good Jew is a dead Jew

[kaz]

they had lived there for how many generations before it was taken from them after WWII.


the families actually living on that land at he time took it from no one

History, yet another topic you know nothing about...

[evince]

go get your learnin material you fucking asshole


school me fucktard

[kaz]

go get your learnin material you fucking asshole


school me fucktard

You do just have a thirst for knowledge, don't you?

[stoned]

Do you believe there was a Jewish presence on the land long before Palestine existed? Or is that fact of history inconvenient?

By your reasoning the native Americans have a just claim to the entire western hemisphere.

[Boris The Animal]

For the Biblically illiterate like Underwear Star Bomber, Israel has every right, according to the Abrahamic Covenant to that land.

[moon]

You're an apparent Jew hater, but I have to ask this.

What's your end game with Israel? What do you expect of them? Cede all the territory back to 'Palestine'? Become another Arab country or otherwise cease to exist?

I'm curious.

If you want any sort of constructive discussion then you're going to have to learn to focus.
I say this because there is nothing in any of my posts which could possibly feed your illusions of ' jew hatred '. Nothing. Nor will there ever be. I'll explain again.

Zionism is a political doctine of ethnic cleansing. It has nothing to do with Judaism other than that it uses Judaism as a smokescreen for its - very unJewish- apartheid policies. It follows that those who oppose Zionism do not ' hate Jews ' by default. Many who oppose Zionism are in fact Jewish themselves.
How many ' Jew haters ' can you detect here ?
http://static1.demotix.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/a_crop_small_aspect/5200-5/photos/1405119544-orthodox-jews-from-neturei-karta-back-gaza-and-palestine_5232985.jpg
http://www.demotix.com/news/5233544/orthodox-jews-neturei-karta-back-gaza-and-palestine

[moon]

If you want to talk about 'real' history Palestine is a figmentary nation.

False. The Palestinians have always been a ' nation ' by definition.

noun
1.
a large body of people, associated with a particular territory, that is sufficiently conscious of its unity to seek or to possess a government peculiarly its own:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/nation?s=t

Today the state of Palestine is recognised by the overwhelming majority of the world's other states. It is only opposed by the USA, Israel, the Czech Republic and a few South Pacific Islanders in the pay of the USA who aren't even sure where Israel is.

[moon]

For the Biblically illiterate like Underwear Star Bomber, Israel has every right, according to the Abrahamic Covenant to that land.

This is the 21st Century and every nation's ' right ' to anywhere at all has been decided by the United Nations since 1947. Israel- as a case in point- does not even have any legally-defined borders other than those ascribed to it by Resolution 181 of the United Nations in 1947. Certainly, no elderly parchment of dubious origin carries any weight whatsoever with regard to a state- Israel- which has existed only since 1948- and even that unilateral declaration has not been recognised by all of the many other world states. Wishful thinking does not trump law.

[moon]

I also notice that Israel haters never mention the Jewish Nakba, I wonder why not? These were Sephardic and Mizrahi Jews who had lived in Arab countries for hundreds of years.

Israeli columnist Ben Dror Yemini (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Dror_Yemini), himself a Mizrahi Jew, wrote the following:

Viewed in its historical context the eviction of Jews from Islamic countries at that time was entirely due to the unsustainable influx of Zionists into Palestine and their intent to ethnically-cleanse the Palestinians. There was also an element of voluntary emigration- although that's not based upon proof any more than Zionist claims that the Palestinians left their ancestral homes ' voluntarily '


The only difference is that the Jews did not turn that Nakba into their founding ethos.

With regard to your quote the Zionists- and neoZionists after them - have built their sandcastles in their entirety on sympathy for the victims of the Holocaust.

[Boris The Animal]

This is the 21st Century and every nation's ' right ' to anywhere at all has been decided by the United Nations since 1947. Israel- as a case in point- does not even have any legally-defined borders other than those ascribed to it by Resolution 181 of the United Nations in 1947. Certainly, no elderly parchment of dubious origin carries any weight whatsoever with regard to a state- Israel- which has existed only since 1948- and even that unilateral declaration has not been recognised by all of the many other world states. Wishful thinking does not trump law.No, but Biblical prophecy does. We are seeing the beginning of the End Times now. Lemme ask, do you support a one world government? And if so, do you advocate the slaughter of Evangelicals?

[moon]

No, but Biblical prophecy does. We are seeing the beginning of the End Times now. Lemme ask, do you support a one world government? And if so, do you advocate the slaughter of Evangelicals?

No- " Biblical prophecy " does not trump law. Any practicing judge who claimed that it did would be an object of ridicule and his rulings overturned on appeal.
The only ' end times ' to fear are those brought about by climatic devastation and the threat of nuclear holocaust on the back of climatic despondency. The bible- as you may already know- has been frequently edited in relatively modern times by all manner of self-interested ' editors '. That's scientific fact and demonstrable.

[Minister of Truth]

I think we are no nearer to climatic devastation than we are God's judgment.

[moon]

I think we are no nearer to climatic devastation than we are God's judgment.

We each comfort ourselves with preference prophesies. However, climatic apocalypse has the authority of scientific support. It would be very easy though for religious doom-sayers to link climatic change with ' god's judgement '- and that's probably what will transpire. Those of us who know that it is wholly due to the folly of Man will find it difficult to find an audience when the waves come lapping.

[iewitness]

We each comfort ourselves with preference prophesies. However, climatic apocalypse has the authority of scientific support. It would be very easy though for religious doom-sayers to link climatic change with ' god's judgement '- and that's probably what will transpire. Those of us who know that it is wholly due to the folly of Man will find it difficult to find an audience when the waves come lapping.

ye do err, moonbat. the rising waters was the previous judgment against man's apostasy; the earth was cleansed with water...21- http://biblehub.com/kjv/genesis/7.htm. the damned of earth should have stuck with their first falsity : "global warming", because the soon to be fulfilled judgments will include scorching men with great heat and 100 pound hailstones. that is scientifically correct judgment. I agree with The Lord that it is just and is deserved. esp. 9... http://biblehub.com/kjv/revelation/16.htm you are living proof of the soon coming judgment; you and all who follow your cursing of Israel, which includes, as the primary cursing, which you moonbats are corporately guilty of; the persecution and murder of Christians and Jews. "Palestinians "/ "philistines" are blessed by Israel and invited to behave as civilized human beings, but are incited to behave as ravening dogs by you and the world at large. keep it up. you are bringing the wrath of the Almighty by your reprobate acts of hatred, violence and touching the apple of The Lord's eye, Jerusalem. see sig. some reinforcing evidence to the fact that the yiolence and hatred is islamist based... http://www.unitedjerusalem.org/index2.asp?id=1984048. I must remind all of the moonbats that barack hussein obama is the global director of universal evil; fulfilling the antichrist islamic purpose his father, allah/ Lucifer/ [satan] ; according to the writings of the false prophet mohamed [damned forever].

[Darth Omar]

If you want any sort of constructive discussion then you're going to have to learn to focus.
I say this because there is nothing in any of my posts which could possibly feed your illusions of ' jew hatred '. Nothing. Nor will there ever be. I'll explain again.

Zionism is a political doctine of ethnic cleansing. It has nothing to do with Judaism other than that it uses Judaism as a smokescreen for its - very unJewish- apartheid policies. It follows that those who oppose Zionism do not ' hate Jews ' by default. Many who oppose Zionism are in fact Jewish themselves.
How many ' Jew haters ' can you detect here ?
http://static1.demotix.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/a_crop_small_aspect/5200-5/photos/1405119544-orthodox-jews-from-neturei-karta-back-gaza-and-palestine_5232985.jpg
http://www.demotix.com/news/5233544/orthodox-jews-neturei-karta-back-gaza-and-palestine

I noticed you didn't answer the question. What is your endgame for Israel? What do you expect of them?

Be specific.

[moon]

ye do err, moonbat. the rising waters was the previous judgment against man's apostasy; the earth was cleansed with water...21- http://biblehub.com/kjv/genesis/7.htm. the damned of earth should have stuck with their first falsity : "global warming", because the soon to be fulfilled judgments will include scorching men with great heat and 100 pound hailstones. that is scientifically correct judgment. I agree with The Lord that it is just and is deserved. esp. 9... http://biblehub.com/kjv/revelation/16.htm you are living proof of the soon coming judgment; you and all who follow your cursing of Israel, which includes, as the primary cursing, which you moonbats are corporately guilty of; the persecution and murder of Christians and Jews. "Palestinians "/ "philistines" are blessed by Israel and invited to behave as civilized human beings, but are incited to behave as ravening dogs by you and the world at large. keep it up. you are bringing the wrath of the Almighty by your reprobate acts of hatred, violence and touching the apple of The Lord's eye, Jerusalem. see sig. some reinforcing evidence to the fact that the yiolence and hatred is islamist based... http://www.unitedjerusalem.org/index2.asp?id=1984048. I must remind all of the moonbats that barack hussein obama is the global director of universal evil; fulfilling the antichrist islamic purpose his father, allah/ Lucifer/ [satan] ; according to the writings of the false prophet mohamed [damned forever].

It's obvious that you need some corrective information;

Barack Obama is the freely elected president of the United States of America. He was elected by a system of Representative Democracy which is currently the model for the whole of the democratic world. It allows for freedom of religion which means that even those who appear certifiable to others may have a voice. It's a system which you should support if you want your own voice to be heard.

Representative democracy allows freedom of religion for both Judaism and Islam and views them equally. There are, currently, a majority of Christian Zionist representatives on the Hill but this will, inevitably, become a Catholic majority as the demographics of the USA lean towards a Latino majority over the next 25-30 years. Those who put religion before law might have to take up their complaints with a Pope. Good luck with that.

All ancient religious texts present allegory, not fact, and the Christian bible has been edited over time to suit those who desired to popularise their own ' message'. Such is the nature of Man and it is amplified by Man with a printing press. Fortunately, for all sane men, the Internet is in the process of rescuing us from such monopolies over our information. Many will try to control it in order to silence those with whom they disagree- but they will fail.

Lastly, I am not at all sure that your ' Lord ' will be comforted by having you ' agree ' with him- but it's your belief and your own area of ...er....expertise.

[moon]

I noticed you didn't answer the question. What is your endgame for Israel? What do you expect of them?

Be specific.

Nobody is obliged to respond to those who insult them. If you'd care to make an apology for your charge of ' Jew hatred ' then we can move on into the realms of constructive discussion. If you'd prefer to choke on your apology then that's your choice to make. Of course, you'll be unable to present any evidence of ' Jew hatred ' whatsoever so an apology is the wise route.

[Darth Omar]

Nobody is obliged to respond to those who insult them. If you'd care to make an apology for your charge of ' Jew hatred ' then we can move on into the realms of constructive discussion. If you'd prefer to choke on your apology then that's your choice to make. Of course, you'll be unable to present any evidence of ' Jew hatred ' whatsoever so an apology is the wise route.

You're kind of thin-skinned for this place lol. But isn't it your contention that Zionism is ethnic cleansing? Since I'm a Zionist, that makes me an advocate of ethnic cleansing, based on your own reasoning.

Which makes us even. So, about that question...

[moon]

You're kind of thin-skinned for this place lol. But isn't it your contention that Zionism is ethnic cleansing? Since I'm a Zionist, that makes me an advocate of ethnic cleansing, based on your own reasoning.

Which makes us even. So, about that question...

' Zionism ' takes many forms- as you should know- some of which are benign, ' Social Zionism ' for example. Your own brand, touted in your avatar space, is fascist, intolerant and dangerous Readers might care to review the Wiki entry on ' neoZionism ' for clarification of this point.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neo-Zionism
Nevertheless, in castigating neoZionism I am opposing and attacking a political doctrine. That's a distance from personal insult. It would be personally insulting for me to term you an ' Arab-hater ' just as it is personally insulting for you to proclaim that I hate Jews. So we're not ' even ' at all and an apology is due.

[evince]

It's obvious that you need some corrective information;

Barack Obama is the freely elected president of the United States of America. He was elected by a system of Representative Democracy which is currently the model for the whole of the democratic world. It allows for freedom of religion which means that even those who appear certifiable to others may have a voice. It's a system which you should support if you want your own voice to be heard.

Representative democracy allows freedom of religion for both Judaism and Islam and views them equally. There are, currently, a majority of Christian Zionist representatives on the Hill but this will, inevitably, become a Catholic majority as the demographics of the USA lean towards a Latino majority over the next 25-30 years. Those who put religion before law might have to take up their complaints with a Pope. Good luck with that.

All ancient religious texts present allegory, not fact, and the Christian bible has been edited over time to suit those who desired to popularise their own ' message'. Such is the nature of Man and it is amplified by Man with a printing press. Fortunately, for all sane men, the Internet is in the process of rescuing us from such monopolies over our information. Many will try to control it in order to silence those with whom they disagree- but they will fail.

Lastly, I am not at all sure that your ' Lord ' will be comforted by having you ' agree ' with him- but it's your belief and your own area of ...er....expertise.

alas you are speaking to the mindless minions of likes of he Koch brothers so any citation of FACTS will merely incite them to yet more mindless mumbling of invective and lies.


they are devoid of any real moral code or viable information

[evince]

go get your learnin material you fucking asshole


school me fucktard

this is pretty much what they understand best

[moon]

this is pretty much what they understand best

Well, one should be cautious not to throw out the baby with the bath-water

Darth Hussein Omar shows a certain level of intellect in attempting to dodge an apology- and (he) didn't lapse into emotional religious canards as wrapping for Islamophobia. :) He's also aware of the term ' neoZionism '. Most Islamophobes think it's an ' antisemitic' slur. Time will tell.

[evince]

yet he is still completely FACT adverse when it come right down to facts.


he denys GW

he denys the massive USA court records that PROVE the republican party cheats in elections

[moon]

Truth has a characteristic of persistence- so I won't be in the least bothered by its denial.

[evince]

oh I get fully pissed when people deny FACTS



those people need to be publically shamed for their crimes against man

[moon]

oh I get fully pissed when people deny FACTS



those people need to be publically shamed for their crimes against man


A good fact has numerous authoritative sources. Usually just quoting/linking to two or three adds shame enough.

[evince]

nope


that is not the reality for these brain dead fucks

[Darth Omar]

By your reasoning the native Americans have a just claim to the entire western hemisphere.

Nope. The Indians rooted someone else out.

[Darth Omar]

Well, one should be cautious not to throw out the baby with the bath-water

Darth Hussein Omar shows a certain level of intellect in attempting to dodge an apology- and (he) didn't lapse into emotional religious canards as wrapping for Islamophobia. :) He's also aware of the term ' neoZionism '. Most Islamophobes think it's an ' antisemitic' slur. Time will tell.

Ok, whatever, I'm sorry lol.

Now stop avoiding the question.

[evince]

Nope. The Indians rooted someone else out.

who asshole?

[moon]

Ok, whatever, I'm sorry lol.

Now stop avoiding the question.

Accepted.

I wasn't avoiding your question. Your erroneous assumption had to be corrected before replying.

For starters, Israel has the legal right to exist. Even its main protagonists, Fatah and Hamas, accept the pre-1967 borders as the demarcation line between the separated states of Israel and Palestine. This border is also accepted by the overwhelming majority of other world states too so it is very likely that it will , eventually, be accepted by the United States of America. Of course, neoZionists do not, currently, accept it and therein lies the problem.
We have to ask ourselves, that is everybody who is not a neoZionist, whether world peace and the rule of international law are more important to seven billion people than the neoZionist doctrine - which is important to only a few million Israelis at best. The answer is self-evident.
I assume that- once neoZionism is overcome and disgarded as a hate-filled doctrine of ethnic-cleansing, apartheid, murder and theft- that decent Israelis will accept that the pre-1967 borders are vastly superior for them than the borders designated for them by the separation Resolution, 181, of 1947. They should be satisfied that they will have gained huge swathes of the best territory in Palestine and that the rest of the world is willing to accept that. If they continue to REJECT their own good-fortune in favour of a greedy grab at further territorial gains then they will be at odds with the world at large and....when the North Americans are no longer influenced by Zionist cash and false promises....they will find that their current pariah status becomes indelible.
That's my prognosis for neoZionism and Israel as a legitimate state.

[kaz]

For starters, Israel has the legal right to exist. Even its main protagonists, Fatah and Hamas, accept the pre-1967 borders as the demarcation line between the separated states of Israel and Palestine. This border is also accepted by the overwhelming majority of other world states too so it is very likely that it will , eventually, be accepted by the United States of America

Actually, 32 countries don't recognize Israel, including 18 of the 21 members of the UN Arab league. You can argue for Fatah, but not Hamas. Facts are great when you can just make them up!

[moon]

Actually, 32 countries don't recognize Israel, including 18 of the 21 members of the UN Arab league. You can argue for Fatah, but not Hamas. Facts are great when you can just make them up!


You'd be in the best position to judge that. Hamas does indeed accept the pre-1967 borders;

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/hamas-accepts-1967-borders-but-will-never-recognize-israel-top-official-says-1.361072

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hamas+acepts+pre-1967+borders&gws_rd=cr,ssl&ei=TRKMVoiDJeX_ygOM5oroCQ

However, you're correct in stating that all states do not recognise Israel- but I haven't seen any claims to the contrary here.

[kaz]

You'd be in the best position to judge that. Hamas does indeed accept the pre-1967 borders;

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/hamas-accepts-1967-borders-but-will-never-recognize-israel-top-official-says-1.361072

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=hamas+acepts+pre-1967+borders&gws_rd=cr,ssl&ei=TRKMVoiDJeX_ygOM5oroCQ

However, you're correct in stating that all states do not recognise Israel- but I haven't seen any claims to the contrary here.

They don't recognize Israel, mastermind. What does accepting the borders even mean for country you don't recognize their right to exist?

[evince]

the stupid is strong in this one

[Phantasmal]

I noticed you didn't answer the question. What is your endgame for Israel? What do you expect of them?

Be specific.

Compliance with the UN resolutions would be a start.

[moon]

They don't recognize Israel, mastermind. What does accepting the borders even mean for country you don't recognize their right to exist?

They are not REQUIRED to recognise Israel. Nobody is. The point of accepting the pre-1967 borders is that it confounds the neoZionist dream of an illegal ' Greater Israel ' and enables the Palestinians to consolidate their own statehood. Of course, the Israelis are not required to recognise it- but the borders can be legally imposed as Israel has no legal claim to any occupied territory at all. ' Facts on the ground ' is a neoZionist pipe-dream. As I said, Israelis would be well advised to accept the pre-1967 borders and not look a gift horse in the mouth.
Also, please try to avoid insulting invective. It will only backfire on you.

[kaz]

They are not REQUIRED to recognise Israel. Nobody is. The point of accepting the pre-1967 borders is that it confounds the neoZionist dream of an illegal ' Greater Israel ' and enables the Palestinians to consolidate their own statehood. Of course, the Israelis are not required to recognise it- but the borders can be legally imposed as Israel has no legal claim to any occupied territory at all. ' Facts on the ground ' is a neoZionist pipe-dream. As I said, Israelis would be well advised to accept the pre-1967 borders and not look a gift horse in the mouth.
Also, please try to avoid insulting invective. It will only backfire on you.

You're making such a ridiculous argument there is no seriousness to start. We want to destroy you, but if you'd at least pull your borders in we'd agree with that while we continue to try to destroy you...

[moon]

You're making such a ridiculous argument there is no seriousness to start. We want to destroy you, but if you'd at least pull your borders in we'd agree with that while we continue to try to destroy you...

Well, you talk like you're going to have a choice. As I said earlier, albeit in different terms, the world is not going to forgo its objectives of peace and the rule of law for the sake of Israeli greed and intransigence. The United Nations is far too important a body to have one pariah state threaten its usefulness. Israelis should take their- undeserved- gift of Palestinian territory and be eternally gratefeful for the legitimacy gained therein. As for neoZionism- nobody will miss it.

[kaz]

Well, you talk like you're going to have a choice. As I said earlier, albeit in different terms, the world is not going to forgo its objectives of peace and the rule of law for the sake of Israeli greed and intransigence. The United Nations is far too important a body to have one pariah state threaten its usefulness. Israelis should take their- undeserved- gift of Palestinian territory and be eternally gratefeful for the legitimacy gained therein. As for neoZionism- nobody will miss it.

If only the Jew bastards would do the decent thing and die, huh, Adolph? The UN is rampant with anti-sematism

[moon]

Jews aren't the only ethnic minorities which produce bastards, of course, but you're really describing Jewish extremists- and nobody wants extremists of any description, Jewish included. Here's a list of Jewish extremist groups which are proscribed by the US State Department;

From Presidential Executive Order 13224: "Blocking Property and Prohibiting Transactions With Persons Who Commit, Threaten to Commit, Or Support Terrorism." (Sept. 2001)

Kach; Kahane; Kahane Chai; Kahane Lives
American Friends Of The United Yeshiva
American Friends Of Yeshivat Rav Meir
Committee For The Safety Of The Roads
Dikuy Bogdim
Dov
Forefront Of The Idea
Friends Of The Jewish Idea Yeshiva
Jewish Idea Yeshiva
Jewish Legion
Judea Police
Judean Congress
Kahane Tzadak
Kfar Tapuah Fund
Koach
Meir's Youth
New Kach Movement (New York chapter)
No'ar Meir
Repression Of Traitors
State Of Judea
Sword Of David
The Committee Against Racism And Discrimination (CARD)
The Hatikva Jewish Identity Center
The International Kahane Movement
The Jewish Idea Yeshiva
The Judean Legion
The Judean Voice; The Voice of Judea
The Qomemiyut Movement
The Rabbi Meir David Kahane Memorial Fund
The Way Of The Torah
The Yeshiva Of The Jewish Idea
Yeshivat Harav Meir



Who wants 'em to survive ?

Is the US State Department ' antisemitic ' ? Of course not.
Is the UN ' antisemitic ' ? Of course not.
Are all Jews terrorist rats ? Of course not.
Will Israeli terror make Israel legitimate ? No.

[moon]

Israeli Arabs Removed From Flight at Demand of Jewish Passengers
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.695633

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.695633

Will the world accept neoZionist racism ? No.
Are there any racist democracies ? No
Will the US support an undemocratic Israel ? Not for much longer.

[Darth Omar]

They are not REQUIRED to recognise Israel. Nobody is. The point of accepting the pre-1967 borders is that it confounds the neoZionist dream of an illegal ' Greater Israel ' and enables the Palestinians to consolidate their own statehood. Of course, the Israelis are not required to recognise it- but the borders can be legally imposed as Israel has no legal claim to any occupied territory at all. ' Facts on the ground ' is a neoZionist pipe-dream. As I said, Israelis would be well advised to accept the pre-1967 borders and not look a gift horse in the mouth.
Also, please try to avoid insulting invective. It will only backfire on you.

So, Palestine has never been a state?

[moon]

So, Palestine has never been a state?

Palestine has been a United Nations-recognised state since November, 2012.

http://www.un.org/press/en/2012/ga11317.doc.htm

The recognition gave the Palestinians access to the International courts- much to the horror of their oppressors and their oppressors backers. Names unnecessary.

Israel has been a United Nations-recognised state since 1948.

[moon]

if being a Zionist means that I believe the pre 1967 borders will be restored, according to the representation of this map; count me in as a "Zionist"....... https://www.google.com/search?q=abrahamic+covenant+land+map&biw=1093&bih=570&tbm=isch&imgil=ZuP8vxd2OZC1uM%253A%253BVEDrHmfrN3_uyM%253Bh ttp%25253A%25252F%25252Ffilesfromtoni.blogspot.com %25252F2009%25252F01%25252Fhow-much-land-did-god-give-israel-in.html&source=iu&pf=m&fir=ZuP8vxd2OZC1uM%253A%252CVEDrHmfrN3_uyM%252C_&usg=__994oLeYn3mBJrISi7RdN9KLOFWM%3D&ved=0ahUKEwiEgYWOoJTKAhVE8j4KHRMnB0kQyjcIQA&ei=2oqMVoSsMcTk-wGTzpzIBA#imgrc=ZuP8vxd2OZC1uM%3A&usg=__994oLeYn3mBJrISi7RdN9KLOFWM%3D

Good move. You'll get to wear kewl sandals;

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ed/Shem%2C_Ham_and_Japheth.jpg

[Darth Omar]

Palestine has been a United Nations-recognised state since November, 2012.

http://www.un.org/press/en/2012/ga11317.doc.htm

The recognition gave the Palestinians access to the International courts- much to the horror of their oppressors and their oppressors backers. Names unnecessary.

Israel has been a United Nations-recognised state since 1948.

And long before that it was a nation with a well recorded history, a capital, a long succession of kings, etc.

It's astounding that people take 'the Palestinian cause' seriously. In 2006 the terrorist organization Hamas was *voted* into power by the same people who would make up a putative Nation of Palestine. Of course, 2006 was before the Arab Spring when the Islamists were voted into power in Egypt...and we saw how that turned out.

But perhaps your oblivious to the lesson. If so, here is how Islamists roll, politically: democracy only exists as a means to an end both for Islamic terrorists and their Islamist comrades. And the END IS ALWAYS sharia because these people cannot conceive of a government apart from Islamic law. In fact, they consider secular government an affront to Allah and the supremacy of Islam. Including our own, btw.

Hint: this, and not the crusades or imperialism or the Iraq war is why they hate us.

They hate Israel for the same reason. Moreover, many of these people are taught out of the Koran to hate Jews which only further complicates matters. Even leaving Israel out of it, enabling a Palestinian nation is enabling sharia law and Islamist control of territory in the region. Have we learned nothing over the past 15 years or so about what it means for women, religious minorities, gays, even Muslims of the wrong stripe[!] living under Islamic rule?

Do you advocate sharia law in any other instances?

[iolo]

In due course 'Israel' will inevitably go the way of the Crusader States. What I fear is that decent Jews will suffer by contamination from these Nazi child-killers.

[moon]

It's astounding that people take 'the Palestinian cause' seriously. In 2006 the terrorist organization Hamas was *voted* into power by the same people who would make up a putative Nation of Palestine. Of course, 2006 was before the Arab Spring when the Islamists were voted into power in Egypt...and we saw how that turned out.


It's clear that you oppose free and fair elections and supported the sedition and bribery which undermined free and fair elections in Palestine and Egypt.
Both Israel and the USA are on open record as having poured money into the attempted coup in Palestine and both now openly cavort with the successful coup leaders in Egypt.
It can be very safely concluded that neoZionism is an enemy of democracy- that neoZionists prefer military juntas over elected bodies and that neoZionism, not Palestine, is opposed to peace.

Take heart though. The Palestinians have offered all illegal squatters in their country the option to remain and become Palestinian citizens once the Israeli occupation has been defeated. They will get to live in Palestine- but not as invaders.

[iolo]

Gotcha, Adolph. The only good Jew is a dead Jew

These scum are not Jews, Goebbels.

[moon]

In due course 'Israel' will inevitably go the way of the Crusader States. What I fear is that decent Jews will suffer by contamination from these Nazi child-killers.

I agree.

[kaz]

These scum are not Jews, Goebbels.

Again using my insult, you really have nothing, huh?

And Israel isn't Jewish? LOL, keep talking, Jew haters self identify

[moon]

And Israel isn't Jewish?

No, Israel isn't Jewish.
25% of Israeli citizens are not Jewish.
Israeli legislation which uses Israel's Jewish majority against its Arab citizens is racist- as all can plainly see.

Nobody recognises Israel as a ' Jewish ' state. In fact, when Israel made its unilateral declaration of statehood , in 1948 , President Truman crossed out ' Jewish state ' in the recognition document and inserted ' state of Israel '- as is evident from this record;
http://www.camera.org/images_user/truman%20letter.jpg


Further;
The Balfour Declaration and the Mandate provided not for a Jewish state, but for a Jewish national home.2 Neither the United States nor the British Government has ever interpreted the term 'Jewish national home' to be a Jewish national state."

http://www.wrmea.com/backissues/0994/9409074.htm

What do you have in mind for the 25% of Israeli citizens who are not Jewish ?

[kaz]

No, Israel isn't Jewish
25% of Israeli citizens are not Jewish.

LMAO

[moon]

This might further serve to discredit the notion of a ' Jewish State '


It is obviously a contradiction in terms to say that Palestinian-Israelis have full equal rights with Jewish Israelis (which anyway is not true) and then to say that Israel is the national homeland only of the Jewish Israelis. Some rights are obviously being lost by exclusion from the national homeland. In fact, given that Netanyahu is in coalition with Avigdor Lieberman and other extreme nationalists who want to ethnically cleanse the Palestinian-Israelis and perhaps the Palestinians in general, one can only entertain dark fears that Netanyahu’s rhetoric, depriving the Palestinian-Israelis of any rights in the national homeland, is a prelude to their removal from it. And, it is outrageous that Netanyahu sees Jews as the only partakers in the national homeland when there were virtually no Jews in geographical Palestine (what is now Israel and Palestine) from 1000-1800 AD, whereas the Palestinians have lived there all along.

http://www.juancole.com/2014/05/netanyahus-nationalism-jewish.html


....and 25% of Israeli citizens are not Jewish, as previously stated
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Israel

[iolo]

Again using my insult, you really have nothing, huh?

And Israel isn't Jewish? LOL, keep talking, Jew haters self identify

It is, you know, pure Nazi racist, And its founders detested traditional Jewry,. nazi grovellr You Nazis are a sickening phenomenon, an insult to all the Jews your Great Model murdered.

[kaz]

It is, you know, pure Nazi racist, And its founders detested traditional Jewry,. nazi grovellr You Nazis are a sickening phenomenon, an insult to all the Jews your Great Model murdered.

Riiiiigggghhhhtttt. I'm a Nazi who supports Jews having a homeland and not being murdered by Arabs. That makes so much sense.

You forgot the rim shot, Rickles

[Sentistar]

Israeli legislation which uses Israel's Jewish majority against its Arab citizens is racist- as all can plainly see.


It isn't racist because Jewish isn't a race. Now you can argue that their citizen requirements are strict or that it shouldn't be mainly based on bloodline, but it most certainly isn't racist.

[moon]

It isn't racist because Jewish isn't a race.

You're correct that ' Jewish ' isn't a ' race '. It's an ethnicity. However, that does not mean that victimisation, exploitation and rejection of Arabs, including Israel's Palestinian citizens is not ' racist '. It most certainly is. This is because the term ' racism ' covers attitudes towards aspects and characteristics of people other than the genetic differences which we have observed as defining ' race ' in the past. Indeed, though Jewishness cannot be seen as ' racial ', bad attitudes towards Jews on the basis that they are simply Jews is most certainly ' racist ' . The term covers bad attitudes towards ethnicity too.



Legal

The UN does not define "racism"; however, it does define "racial discrimination": According to the United Nations International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination,

the term "racial discrimination" shall mean any distinction, exclusion, restriction, or preference based on race, colour, descent, or national or ethnic origin that has the purpose or effect of nullifying or impairing the recognition, enjoyment or exercise, on an equal footing, of human rights and fundamental freedoms in the political, economic, social, cultural or any other field of public life.[22]

This definition does not make any difference between discrimination based on ethnicity and race, in part because the distinction between the two remains debatable among anthropologists.[23] Similarly, in British law the phrase racial group means "any group of people who are defined by reference to their race, colour, nationality (including citizenship) or ethnic or national origin".[24]

In Norway, the word "race" has been removed from national laws concerning discrimination as the use of the phrase is considered problematic and unethical.[25][26] The Norwegian Anti-Discrimination Act bans discrimination based on ethnicity, national origin, descent and skin color.[27]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism





Now you can argue that their citizen requirements are strict or that it shouldn't be mainly based on bloodline, but it most certainly isn't racist.

Yes, it most certainly is and for the reasons outlined above. Indeed, Israelis themselves recognise racism in Israel and term it as such;


A racist Jewish State
Every day the Knesset has the option of passing laws that will advance Israel as a democratic Jewish state or turn it into a racist Jewish state. There is a very thin line between the two. This week, the line was crossed. If the Knesset legal counselor did not consider the bill entitled "the Jewish National Fund Law" as sufficiently racist to keep it off the agenda, it is hard to imagine what legislation she will consider racist.

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/884358.html

[kaz]

You're correct that ' Jewish ' isn't a ' race '. It's an ethnicity. However, that does not mean that victimisation, exploitation and rejection of Arabs, including Israel's Palestinian citizens is not ' racist '. It most certainly is. This is because the term ' racism ' covers attitudes towards aspects and characteristics of people other than the genetic differences which we have observed as defining ' race ' in the past. Indeed, though Jewishness cannot be seen as ' racial ', bad attitudes towards Jews on the basis that they are simply Jews is most certainly ' racist ' . The term covers bad attitudes towards ethnicity too.








Yes, it most certainly is and for the reasons outlined above. Indeed, Israelis themselves recognise racism in Israel and term it as such;

So that means if it's about "race" that Israelis would discriminate against Arab Jews. What evidence do you have of that?

[moon]

So that means if it's about "race" that Israelis would discriminate against Arab Jews. What evidence do you have of that?

You're going to have to define ' Arab Jew '.

[kaz]

You're going to have to define ' Arab Jew '.

An Arab (a race) who is a Jew (a religion). You said Israel is "racist." If that is true, they care about race over religion. So you should be able to prove they treat Arab Jews like Arabs, not Jews.

This is butt obvious, you seriously needed it explained to you?

[moon]

An Arab (a race) who is a Jew (a religion).

It's already been established that ' Jewish ' is an ethnicity as well as a religion. You're basing your definition on a false premise. Can you correct it, please.


Here are some pointers;

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_Jews

[Darth Omar]

An Arab (a race) who is a Jew (a religion). You said Israel is "racist." If that is true, they care about race over religion. So you should be able to prove they treat Arab Jews like Arabs, not Jews.

This is butt obvious, you seriously needed it explained to you?

Everything is race or racial to the left. If I converted to Judaism I'd be a white Appalachian American Jew. Wish me luck in getting assigned a victim status by the left lol.

Actually, it's the Palestinians who aren't anything. They're predominantly Arab but they're not all Muslim; a lot of them are from Jordan or other places. In contrast, the Jews are an ancient people that share a common cultural heritage that goes back for milennia. Their nation existed for many centuries before the word 'Palestinians' was ever coined, and Jerusalem was its capital.

In a more rational world, who belongs to the territory would be a no-brainer.

[moon]

=Darth Hussein Omar;1524467



Actually, it's the Palestinians who aren't anything. They're predominantly Arab but they're not all Muslim; a lot of them are from Jordan or other places. In contrast, the Jews are an ancient people that share a common cultural heritage that goes back for milennia. Their nation existed for many centuries before the word 'Palestinians' was ever coined, and Jerusalem was its capital.



Those who rely on extremist Israeli propaganda for their ' historical ' information always forget that there was no ' Israel ' until 1948 and that the onset of the United Nations compounded modern international law to the detriment of spurious parchment-based territorial claims .
Your wildly inaccurate claims also omit the very real fact that Arabs and Jews are from the same Semitic stock- people that have occupied the Palestinian regions since the Neolithic period. Attempting to legitimise the illegal occupation of Palestine on any ' we were here first ' basis is doomed to failure- as is the plan to legitimise illegal Israeli squats in Palestinian territory.

Again, Israelis should be grateful that they have been allowed to settle in the Palestinian lands bestowed upon them by the victors of WW2. They should immediately withdraw from the lands designated Palestinian by those same victors of WW2 and accept the pre-1967 borders. Otherwise Israel has no future.

[Damocles]

Nobody is obliged to respond to those who insult them. If you'd care to make an apology for your charge of ' Jew hatred ' then we can move on into the realms of constructive discussion. If you'd prefer to choke on your apology then that's your choice to make. Of course, you'll be unable to present any evidence of ' Jew hatred ' whatsoever so an apology is the wise route.

The Dead Sea Scrolls put an end to most of the idea that the texts were edited. The current translations held true. Amazingly so.

[moon]

The Dead Sea Scrolls put an end to most of the idea that the texts were edited. The current translations held true. Amazingly so.

What is your point in introducing the Dead Sea scrolls ?
Apart from the fact that the Israelis stole the scrolls and refuse to return them - another indicator of the immorality of neoZionism- where is the relevance of the scrolls to Israel's illegal occupation of Palestine ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Sea_Scrolls

[Damocles]

What is your point in introducing the Dead Sea scrolls ?
Apart from the fact that the Israelis stole the scrolls and refuse to return them - another indicator of the immorality of Zionism- where is the relevance of the scrolls to Israel's illegal occupation of Palestine ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_Sea_Scrolls

The point is direct translations of the scrolls show that the current translations of the Bible were amazingly well done. This idea that there was a bunch of judicial "editing" is just made up nonsense.

[USFREEDOM911]

Everything is race or racial to the left. If I converted to Judaism I'd be a white Appalachian American Jew. Wish me luck in getting assigned a victim status by the left lol.

Actually, it's the Palestinians who aren't anything. They're predominantly Arab but they're not all Muslim; a lot of them are from Jordan or other places. In contrast, the Jews are an ancient people that share a common cultural heritage that goes back for milennia. Their nation existed for many centuries before the word 'Palestinians' was ever coined, and Jerusalem was its capital.

In a more rational world, who belongs to the territory would be a no-brainer.

It's getting to the point that every time I hear a liberal saying that the Jews are committing genocide, I'm almost wishing they would.
I mean hell; they're already being accused of such, so how much more could the Israel haters hate??

[moon]

The point is direct translations of the scrolls show that the current translations of the Bible were amazingly well done. This idea that there was a bunch of judicial "editing" is just ases made up nonsense.

I disagree. There has been substantial editing of biblical texts over time. However- that's irrelevant to the illegal Israeli occupation but I'd be pleased to present evidence for editing in a relevant thread. My own references to ' spurious parchments ' concerned the forged land titles which are frequently produced by neoZionist land thieves in support of their flagrant larceny in cases which are sometimes heard before squatter-friendly neoZionist judges.

[moon]

It's getting to the point that every time I hear a liberal saying that the Jews are committing genocide, I'm almost wishing they would.
I mean hell; they're already being accused of such, so how much more could the Israel haters hate??

What is the value of stating that you ' almost ' support genocide ? I can understand the insane emotions of a dedicated neoZionist baby-burner but I'm having difficulty envisioning somebody teetering on the edge.

You should also note that it is decent Israeli Jews who point the finger;
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.668871

[USFREEDOM911]

What is the value of stating that you ' almost ' support genocide ? I can understand the insane emotions of a dedicated neoZionist baby-burner but I'm having difficulty envisioning somebody teetering on the edge.

You should also note that it is decent Israeli Jews who point the finger;
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.668871

Your response provided nothing, but a platform for you to express your unsupported conjecture.
Would you care to address the issue, again?

[moon]

Your response provided nothing, but a platform for you to express your unsupported conjecture.
Would you care to address the issue, again?

To which ' issue ' do you refer ? Your own vacillation with regard to genocide ?

Also, if I'm expressing conjecture then I'll say so. Otherwise I post supportive links. Such as this one from post #112.
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.668871
As I said, I do not understand anybody who states that they ' almost wish ' to see this on a larger scale.

[evince]

Palestinian Infant Burned to Death in West Bank Arson Attack; IDF Blames 'Jewish Terror'

Settlers reportedly firebombed West Bank house early Friday morning; Hebrew graffiti





you will find his ilk don't like facts



they prefer lies and fact denial

[USFREEDOM911]

To which ' issue ' do you refer ? Your own vacillation with regard to genocide ?

Also, if I'm expressing conjecture then I'll say so. Otherwise I post supportive links. Such as this one from post #112.
http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.668871
As I said, I do not understand anybody who states that they ' almost wish ' to see this on a larger scale.

Do you have anything that supports the haters opinions and yours, that Israel is committing genocide?

By the way; your response was a most excellent example of how someone who has no facts are able to just string together expressive words, all in an attempt to appear knowledgeable.
:good4u:

[moon]

Do you have anything that supports the haters opinions and yours, that Israel is committing genocide?

I wasn't aware that I'd expressed any such opinion. Could you quote this supposed claim, please. If you can't then I'm afraid it will bring an end to your enquiry. You'll obviously be addressing the wrong person.


By the way; your response was a most excellent example of how someone who has no facts are able to just string together expressive words, all in an attempt to appear knowledgeable.
:good4u:

My response was a valid question. As evince says, you do seem a little averse to facts.

[AnyOldIron]

I've got a solution. Nobody gets the 'holy land'. Both sides conquered and occupied it. Jews in pre-historic times (taking it from Aegean 'Sea People' who in turn had conquered and occupied it), Muslims in 637AD (taking it from the Eastern Romans who in turn conquered it.). Neither side can get on or act like anything better than savages.

So how about we evict everyone, concrete it over and it can be the carpark for a megasize Wally World we build instead of Jerusalem?

[moon]

I've got a solution. Nobody gets the 'holy land'. Both sides conquered and occupied it. Jews in pre-historic times (taking it from Aegean 'Sea People' who in turn had conquered and occupied it), Muslims in 637AD (taking it from the Eastern Romans who in turn conquered it.). Neither side can get on or act like anything better than savages.

So how about we evict everyone, concrete it over and it can be the carpark for a megasize Wally World we build instead of Jerusalem?

The ' problem ' is only caused by those who refuse to abide by international law. Their criminal actions are to blame- and they should be treated as criminals.

[kaz]

Palestinian Infant Burned to Death in West Bank Arson Attack; IDF Blames 'Jewish Terror'

Settlers reportedly firebombed West Bank house early Friday morning; Hebrew graffiti





you will find his ilk don't like facts



they prefer lies and fact denial

Wow, arabs blamed jews. That's incredible, has it ever happened before?

[USFREEDOM911]

I wasn't aware that I'd expressed any such opinion. Could you quote this supposed claim, please. If you can't then I'm afraid it will bring an end to your enquiry. You'll obviously be addressing the wrong person.



My response was a valid question. As evince says, you do seem a little averse to facts.

Like most bigots and such, you obviously have a limited memory on what you've posted; so for this one time and one time only, I'm showing the posts that you have left.


Truth Detector


I think that the days of false accusations of antisemitism as a defence for neoZionist criminality are long gone. The internet has exposed that particular diversionary tactic for what it is.

Let's examine the thread for any possible basis for such false charges.
There is not one mention of ' Jews ' let alone any professed hatred for Jews. As for ' Nazis ' there's not one mention of them either.

No, the thread concerns Zionism , plain and simple- and even that doctrine of ethnic cleansing is not the creation of Judaism. Jewish Zionists are far outnumbered by Christian Zionists, the former occupying Palestine for purely territorial reasons and the latter suffering from the primitive delusion that the ethnic cleansing of Palestine will precipitate the ' second coming ' of their Christ. It is these forces of ignorance which have caused the suffering and slaughter of Palestinians- a fact which the ' antisemitic ' slur can no longer mask.


As georgephillip points out Jews were a minority when the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians began and , recent demographic studies tell us, Jews will be a minority again next year across Israel and occupied Palestine. Bearing in mind the terrible atrocities that neoZionists have committed against the Palestinians since 1947 and in recent years the concept of One State sits very poorly with Israelis who fear- rightly so- retribution at some future point. Israelis live by a policy of vengeance, based upon the experiences of European Jewry at the hands of Third Reich fascists, and that policy has gone a long way towards the rise of Israeli fascism that we witness today.
Fascists, by their very nature, believe in a ' purity of race ' and neoZionism has turned Israel into the most ' racially ' conscious state on earth so the prospect of Israelis accepting a One State solution is remote in the extreme, particularly as the overwhelming majority of UN member states back the Two State solution. Further, the current Israeli regime is anxious to fan the flames of hatred and apartheid , or ' hafrada ' as Israelis call it, as can be demonstrated by its actions against Muslim holy sites in Jerusalem ( al Quds in Arabic ) and its murder of Palestinian protesters since then. Anybody doubting this policy has only to view the videos of Israeli soldiers planting weapons on Palestinians before arresting or murdering them;

http://azvsas.blogspot.co.uk/2015/12/soldiers-force-palestinian-girl-to-pick.html

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=Israelis+plant+knife+on+Palestinian+girl&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&gws_rd=cr&ei=X4mHVtHXKsbPOprFhPgG

However, such actions are proof that neoZionism FEARS public opinion and that can only mean that they are themselves aware of their own criminal activities with regard to Palestine and Palestinians. Thus, in their minds, there can never ever be any ' sharing ' with their victims. That's not to say that there are no Israelis who sympathise with the Palestinian cause but they will never influence the racist Knesset which continually passes ever more repressive legislation against them. Our real hope lies in the curtailment of North American blanket support for Israel and each nail in the coffin of Israeli ' democracy ' brings that day closer. Israel cannot win- and neither should it.


If you want any sort of constructive discussion then you're going to have to learn to focus.
I say this because there is nothing in any of my posts which could possibly feed your illusions of ' jew hatred '. Nothing. Nor will there ever be. I'll explain again.

Zionism is a political doctine of ethnic cleansing. It has nothing to do with Judaism other than that it uses Judaism as a smokescreen for its - very unJewish- apartheid policies. It follows that those who oppose Zionism do not ' hate Jews ' by default. Many who oppose Zionism are in fact Jewish themselves.
How many ' Jew haters ' can you detect here ?
http://static1.demotix.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/a_crop_small_aspect/5200-5/photos/1405119544-orthodox-jews-from-neturei-karta-back-gaza-and-palestine_5232985.jpg
http://www.demotix.com/news/5233544/orthodox-jews-neturei-karta-back-gaza-and-palestine


Viewed in its historical context the eviction of Jews from Islamic countries at that time was entirely due to the unsustainable influx of Zionists into Palestine and their intent to ethnically-cleanse the Palestinians. There was also an element of voluntary emigration- although that's not based upon proof any more than Zionist claims that the Palestinians left their ancestral homes ' voluntarily '

With regard to your quote the Zionists- and neoZionists after them - have built their sandcastles in their entirety on sympathy for the victims of the Holocaust.

Those comments and your agreements with iolo are all the proof that is needed, that you do nothing but try and play at wordsmithing in an attempt to hide your hatred.

Now add in that all you did was hide responding to the suggestion that since Israel is accused of genocide; how much worse would they be looked upon, if they actually committed what you and your ilk have and are accusing them of.

At least your hatred will keep you warm at night.

[moon]

Let's take a look at your own posts. Here's the post in which you, erroneously, state that you believe I have made reference to Israeli genocide against Palestinians;

USFREEDOM911;

Do you have anything that supports the haters opinions and yours, that Israel is committing genocide?

When questioned on this point you've produced several of my posts which criticize Zionism for its doctrine of ethnic cleansing and its obvious brutality and criminality but without even one of the references to genocide which you claim. Not one. It's clear- now- that you've let your assumptions loose unbridled as it's patently obvious that I've made no such references. None.
Some Israelis might ' almost wish ' that Israel was engaged in genocide- as you , shamefully for an American, do yourself- but I've made no reference to it. If you'd care to apologise for that false claim then we can move on. There are charges of ' slow genocide ' against neoZionists in which you might be interested.

USFREEDOM911;

Those comments and your agreements with iolo are all the proof that is needed
Let's just be hopeful that you don't preside over a court someplace.

[USFREEDOM911]

Let's take a look at your own posts. Here's the post in which you, erroneously, state that you believe I have made reference to Israeli genocide against Palestinians;

USFREEDOM911;


When questioned on this point you've produced several of my posts which criticize Zionism for its doctrine of ethnic cleansing and its obvious brutality and criminality but without even one of the references to genocide which you claim. Not one. It's clear- now- that you've let your assumptions loose unbridled as it's patently obvious that I've made no such references. None.
Some Israelis might ' almost wish ' that Israel was engaged in genocide- as you , shamefully for an American, do yourself- but I've made no reference to it. If you'd care to apologise for that false claim then we can move on. There are charges of ' slow genocide ' against neoZionists in which you might be interested.

USFREEDOM911;

Let's just be hopeful that you don't preside over a court someplace.

Well then, why don't you explain YOUR meaning of the phrase "ethnic cleansing of Palestinians".
OH - and learn how to use the quote feature, you moron. :D

[moon]

Well then, why don't you explain YOUR meaning of the phrase "ethnic cleansing of Palestinians".
OH - and learn how to use the quote feature, you moron. :D

I'll use the ' reply with quote ' tab when I want a post in its entirety- otherwise I'll be selective. But let's not be drawn - your apology is overdue.

Now then, while we're waiting for USFREEDOM911 to do the decent thing let's venture into the ' Ethics ' aspect of this forum.
The Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions movement has become a powerful, non-violent tool in the global war against all the inhuman criminality which neoZionism practices and represents, so effective in fact that crime-friendly governments are attempting to make the boycotting of Israel illegal. In effect, this would be akin to our government making it illegal for us to reject dealing with any criminal organisation. So who holds the ethical high ground in this issue, those who are pro-law or those who are pro-Zionism ? Zionists, remember, are internationally condemned for their illegal activities.

Here are two more large and important companies which have recently decided- for ethical or financial reasons- that their association with Israeli criminality must end;


The brand image of Israel has become “increasingly toxic,” said O’Quigley. “It appears that international companies are eventually learning that it doesn’t pay to do business with the apartheid state.”
http://tinyurl.com/gmlpmqy


“Bad for business”

“This news is a significant success for the BDS movement and shows that international companies and investors are waking up to the fact that being linked to Israel’s regime of colonization, occupation and apartheid is bad for business,” Guman Mussa, the Arab-world campaigns officer with the Palestinian BDS National Committee, the Palestinian coalition that leads the global boycott, divestment and sanctions movement,
http://tinyurl.com/h3derbg

You might not think that CRH and Orange are important in the overall scheme of things but they are just the latest in a mass of BDS withdrawals and dissociations.

[iolo]

Like Hitler's genocide, Zionist genocide will only begin when they think they can get away with it. The will is there, and they have murdered 2,000 children for practice..

[kaz]

Like Hitler's genocide, Zionist genocide will only begin when they think they can get away with it. The will is there, and they have murdered 2,000 children for practice..
If only the Jew bastards would do the decent thing and die like the dogs they are, Adolph.

Jews need to man up and kill people with bombs on buses, in cafes and ambulances and shoot rockets into neighborhoods like the real men Arabs do. Jews go around shooting at people trying to kill them, complete cowardice. I feel you

[moon]

Jews need to man up and kill people with bombs on buses, in cafes and ambulances and shoot rockets into neighborhoods ............

There must be few people on the face of the earth who do not know that neoZionists do far, far worse than that- and on a far, far greater scale.

Anybody doubting this has merely to compare Israeli and Palestinian civilian casualties over the past sixty years.

[kaz]

There must be few people on the face of the earth who do not know that neoZionists do far, far worse than that- and on a far, far greater scale.

Anybody doubting this has merely to compare Israeli and Palestinian civilian casualties over the past sixty years.

There are stupid people all around us. They see what they want to see

[USFREEDOM911]

I'll use the ' reply with quote ' tab when I want a post in its entirety- otherwise I'll be selective. But let's not be drawn - your apology is overdue.

Now then, while we're waiting for USFREEDOM911 to do the decent thing let's venture into the ' Ethics ' aspect of this forum.
The Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions movement has become a powerful, non-violent tool in the global war against all the inhuman criminality which neoZionism practices and represents, so effective in fact that crime-friendly governments are attempting to make the boycotting of Israel illegal. In effect, this would be akin to our government making it illegal for us to reject dealing with any criminal organisation. So who holds the ethical high ground in this issue, those who are pro-law or those who are pro-Zionism ? Zionists, remember, are internationally condemned for their illegal activities.

Here are two more large and important companies which have recently decided- for ethical or financial reasons- that their association with Israeli criminality must end;


The brand image of Israel has become “increasingly toxic,” said O’Quigley. “It appears that international companies are eventually learning that it doesn’t pay to do business with the apartheid state.”
http://tinyurl.com/gmlpmqy


“Bad for business”

“This news is a significant success for the BDS movement and shows that international companies and investors are waking up to the fact that being linked to Israel’s regime of colonization, occupation and apartheid is bad for business,” Guman Mussa, the Arab-world campaigns officer with the Palestinian BDS National Committee, the Palestinian coalition that leads the global boycott, divestment and sanctions movement,
http://tinyurl.com/h3derbg

You might not think that CRH and Orange are important in the overall scheme of things but they are just the latest in a mass of BDS withdrawals and dissociations.

Lying haters are gonna hate and in case you missed it, this means you. :D

[USFREEDOM911]

There must be few people on the face of the earth who do not know that neoZionists do far, far worse than that- and on a far, far greater scale.

Anybody doubting this has merely to compare Israeli and Palestinian civilian casualties over the past sixty years.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight :good4u:

[moon]

There are stupid people all around us. They see what they want to see

That's a fact beyond dispute.
As an example- some people see Israeli white phosphorous shells raining down upon Palestinian civilians. Others see people running for more beer for a neoZionist firework party.

http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/660/media/images/67255000/jpg/_67255958_009839494-1.jpg

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22310544

[moon]

U.S. Church Puts Five Israeli Banks on Investment Blacklist
The pension fund of the United Methodist Church, the largest Protestant group in the U.S., makes the move in an effort to exclude companies that profit from abuse of human rights; Officials: Israel will try change the decision.
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.697148

Returning to the ethical question- who holds the ethical high ground in this instance, the United Methodist Church or the bagmen for neoZionism ?


"This is the first step toward an effort that helps send a clear message that we as a church are listening and that we are concerned about human rights violations," Susanne Hoder, a leader of United Methodist Kairos Response, said Tuesday. "We hope it will also be encouraging to people in the Jewish community who are working for justice."
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.697148

http://www.haaretz.com/polopoly_fs/1.689454.1448978381!/image/239888877.jpg_gen/derivatives/headline_857x482/239888877.jpg

[USFREEDOM911]

That's a fact beyond dispute.
As an example- some people see Israeli white phosphorous shells raining down upon Palestinian civilians. Others see people running for more beer for a neoZionist firework party.

http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/660/media/images/67255000/jpg/_67255958_009839494-1.jpg

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22310544

From 2013....:dunno:

[moon]

Does the date matter to you or are you bereft of a pro-slaughter response ?

No. The photograph is from Israel's ' Operation Cast Lead- December 27, 2008 – January 18, 2009 when the Israelis murdered over 400 Palestinian children during the Christmas period- along with a thousand other people.
You might say that the slaughter emphasised neoZionist contempt for the life and teachings of Christ. Then again, you might detest Christianity and claim that the children deserved it. You might even detest children. It's hard to gauge somebody who ' almost wishes ' for genocide.

Would you like some more recent information on neoZionists' atrocities ?
Here's a snippet from ' Operation Defensive Edge ' of 2014


The number of civilians killed during Israel's Operation Protective Edge offensive has raised international concern and condemnation.

Between 8 July and 27 August, more than 2,100 Palestinians were killed in the Gaza Strip, along with 66 Israeli soldiers and seven civilians in Israel.

The UN says the vast majority of Palestinian deaths are civilian. But figures from previous operations over the past six years in the densely populated Gaza Strip show it is not the first time civilians have paid a heavy price.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-28439404

Over 500 children were murdered on that occasion. The Israelis' aim is improving.

[evince]

That's a fact beyond dispute.
As an example- some people see Israeli white phosphorous shells raining down upon Palestinian civilians. Others see people running for more beer for a neoZionist firework party.

http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/660/media/images/67255000/jpg/_67255958_009839494-1.jpg

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22310544

they cheered when Bush did It to fallughia too

[AnyOldIron]

Israel has gotten to the point where it is losing its humanity when it reacts. The reaction is always excessive.

After years of being under attack from without and within, you can certainly see the root of their excess, even though that doesn't excuse it.

But Hamas are very cynical in their approach. They play to the court of global public opinion with the lives of their children.

They fire rockets they know are ineffectual and unlikely to cause significant death tolls because they know that the Israeli reaction will be excessive. They fire these rockets from civilian areas; schools, hospitals etc to draw that excessive fire. And then play this up to the world media to generate sympathy for their cause. That is sickeningly cynical.

Considering neither side has a legitimate claim to the land, both sides are twats.

[Phantasmal]

Everything is race or racial to the left. If I converted to Judaism I'd be a white Appalachian American Jew. Wish me luck in getting assigned a victim status by the left lol.

Actually, it's the Palestinians who aren't anything. They're predominantly Arab but they're not all Muslim; a lot of them are from Jordan or other places. In contrast, the Jews are an ancient people that share a common cultural heritage that goes back for milennia. Their nation existed for many centuries before the word 'Palestinians' was ever coined, and Jerusalem was its capital.

In a more rational world, who belongs to the territory would be a no-brainer.

The Arabs have always been in the region when there were very few Jews there, temember the Diaspora, it amuses me when you write your own version of history.

There were 700,000 Arabs, referred to as Palestinians, living in the area in 1919.

[AnyOldIron]

Not surprising. The Jews were evicted by the Romans in 70AD. The Arabs evicted the Romans and occupied the land from 687AD (approximately, can't be arsed to look up the exact date of the seige of Jerusalem.)

The Jews claim is older, but still shakey. They evicted the Aegean Sea People and occupied it.

Both sides claim to be the 'aboriginal' people is pure bullshit.

[evince]

which is why they need to share

[AnyOldIron]

But will either side ever agree to that? And then follow that through by being good neighbours?

Neither side seems to want the other's existence.

[evince]

well yes they will some day



how many evil ones have to die before the change?


that I don't know

[AnyOldIron]

well yes they will some day



how many evil ones have to die before the change?


that I don't know

I admire your optimism. I'm not sure what, in the long history of this region, inspires it though.

[evince]

human goodness


the kids get sick of the evil if they can be connected to the rest of the world

[AnyOldIron]

Hate to sound like a pessimist but even the briefest of glances through human history shows that goodness rarely if ever plays a part in geopolitics.

[moon]

Israel has gotten to the point where it is losing its humanity when it reacts. The reaction is always excessive.

After years of being under attack from without and within, you can certainly see the root of their excess, even though that doesn't excuse it.

But Hamas are very cynical in their approach. They play to the court of global public opinion with the lives of their children.

They fire rockets they know are ineffectual and unlikely to cause significant death tolls because they know that the Israeli reaction will be excessive. They fire these rockets from civilian areas; schools, hospitals etc to draw that excessive fire. And then play this up to the world media to generate sympathy for their cause. That is sickeningly cynical.

Considering neither side has a legitimate claim to the land, both sides are twats.

There's a lot of misinformation evident in your post .
For one- Hamas ceased attacking Israel directly some time ago as a matter of policy. Hamas now responds only when it is attacked but the Western press only reports the Hamas response and not the Israeli aggression. This gives precisely the wrong account of events that the Israelis want. Unsurprisingly, many of the Western media outlets are owned by billionaire supporters of Zionism. So the best way for the Zionists to have Hamas condemned is for the Zionists to attack Hamas. Which they frequently do.
Secondly, Gaza is utterly impoverished- due to Israelis' illegal attacks and the Israeli illegal blockade- and Gazans have to adapt to poverty and earn a living. One way that some do this is to fire rockettes into Israel which have been commisioned by families which have had a relative of friend murdered by the Israelis. For a sum of money or a promised favour the guerrilla brigades - not Hamas- will fire into Israel. Of course we all know that these rockettes are relatively harmless. They are inaccurate and carry no warhead. Very few Israelis have been killed or injured by them. Also, the main target for the rockettes is the nearby settlement known as Sderot. Sderot is actually the Palestinian village of Nadj- from which the Zionists drove the indigenous Palestinian people in the early 1950s. The Palestinians are actually firing at the illegal occupants of their own Palestinian homes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sderot
Lastly, Gaza is the most densely populated region on earth. To say that the rockette brigades deliberately site their launchers near hospitals and schools is a nonsense. It is the Israelis who deliberately target such buildings as a form of- illegal- collective punishment of Palestinians. They also target other aspects of Palestinian civilisation, such as water plants and generators. They started their ' Cast Lead ' offensive by murdering a square full of Palestinian police cadets on parade. Such attacks are part of the neoZionist ethnic cleansing policy.
It is wholly inaccurate to blame the Palestinians for any aspect of the invasion of their own country. You would not be blamed for resisting invasion of yours- except by the invaders.

[kaz]

human goodness


the kids get sick of the evil if they can be connected to the rest of the world

You like a good self hating Jew, do you, Fraulein?

[AnyOldIron]

There's a lot of misinformation evident in your post .
For one- Hamas ceased attacking Israel directly some time ago as a matter of policy. Hamas now responds only when it is attacked but the Western press only reports the Hamas response and not the Israeli aggression. This gives precisely the wrong account of events that the Israelis want. Unsurprisingly, many of the Western media outlets are owned by billionaire supporters of Zionism. So the best way for the Zionists to have Hamas condemned is for the Zionists to attack Hamas. Which they frequently do.
Secondly, Gaza is utterly impoverished- due to Israelis' illegal attacks and the Israeli illegal blockade- and Gazans have to adapt to poverty and earn a living. One way that some do this is to fire rockettes into Israel which have been commisioned by families which have had a relative of friend murdered by the Israelis. For a sum of money or a promised favour the guerrilla brigades - not Hamas- will fire into Israel. Of course we all know that these rockettes are relatively harmless. They are inaccurate and carry no warhead. Very few Israelis have been killed or injured by them. Also, the main target for the rockettes is the nearby settlement known as Sderot. Sderot is actually the Palestinian village of Nadj- from which the Zionists drove the indigenous Palestinian people in the early 1950s. The Palestinians are actually firing at the illegal occupants of their own Palestinian homes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sderot
Lastly, Gaza is the most densely populated region on earth. To say that the rockette brigades deliberately site their launchers near hospitals and schools is a nonsense. It is the Israelis who deliberately target such buildings as a form of- illegal- collective punishment of Palestinians. They also target other aspects of Palestinian civilisation, such as water plants and generators. They started their ' Cast Lead ' offensive by murdering a square full of Palestinian police cadets on parade. Such attacks are part of the neoZionist ethnic cleansing policy.

Your interpretation of what has occurred over the last few years is entirely one sided, your use of language clearly indicates that you have a partisan opinion on the situation and it is pretty much impossible to discuss anything with a confirmed partisan because they never see issue with the side they have adopted.

Simply presenting details of the excessive violence that I have mentioned several times coming from the IDF, doesn't negate the fact that, particularly in 2014, Hamas (or partners) fired barrages of ineffective rockets at Israeli targets knowing exactly what the Israeli response would be. The evidence of this is undeniable.

Switching tactics to knife attacks produces exactly the same effect, designed to prompt an overreaction by the Israelis to play court to global public opinion.

And this Desh, is another reason why there will never be peace in this land. Neither side, nor their partisans, will ever admit to doing any wrong. Both sides see themselves as innocents. I'm sure the Germans will have a name for this form of myopic delusion.

[AnyOldIron]

An example of how language used indicates partisan allegiance, that you are buying into one side's propaganda.


For one- Hamas ceased attacking Israel directly some time ago as a matter of policy. Hamas now responds only when it is attacked

What you really have here is a tit for tat situation. Each side will look back at the last attack on them to justify their next attack. It is impossible to identify one side as the initial aggressor because tit for tat violence is cyclic.

Anyone who has kids will recognise this. "He kicked me", "yeah because she pinched me", " that's because he pulled the head off my doll", "yeah because she tripped me up" etc etc ad nauseum.

The truth is, both sides are wrong. As a parent you separate them and tell them both off.

The quoted paragraph shows no balance, it is telling one child off, whilst ignoring the actions and tit for tat behaviour of the other.

[Phantasmal]

An example of how language used indicates partisan allegiance, that you are buying into one side's propaganda.



What you really have here is a tit for tat situation. Each side will look back at the last attack on them to justify their next attack. It is impossible to identify one side as the initial aggressor because tit for tat violence is cyclic.

Anyone who has kids will recognise this. "He kicked me", "yeah because she pinched me", " that's because he pulled the head off my doll", "yeah because she tripped me up" etc etc ad nauseum.

The truth is, both sides are wrong. As a parent you separate them and tell them both off.

the only problem with your analogy is that one kid is 6'4" 250 lbs, while the other is 5'0 89 lbs.

[moon]

Your interpretation of what has occurred over the last few years is entirely one sided, your use of language clearly indicates that you have a partisan opinion on the situation and it is pretty much impossible to discuss anything with a confirmed partisan because they never see issue with the side they have adopted.

You speak as if an impartial position is moral- whereas it is halfway towards supporting a doctrine of ethnic cleansing and an illegal occupation.


Simply presenting details of the excessive violence that I have mentioned several times coming from the IDF, doesn't negate the fact that, particularly in 2014, Hamas (or partners) fired barrages of ineffective rockets at Israeli targets knowing exactly what the Israeli response would be. The evidence of this is undeniable.

You claim that Palestinians fire ineffective rockettes at Israelis in the full knowledge that the Israelis will slaughter thousands of Palestinians ? I think you had better review your ' undeniable evidence ' and post it here .


Switching tactics to knife attacks produces exactly the same effect, designed to prompt an overreaction by the Israelis to play court to global public opinion.

Again, you have omitted the neoZionist provocation. Are you entirely unaware of what the neoZionists did at al-Quds holy sites in order to provoke a Palestinian response ? Are you entirely unaware that Israeli soldiers have been planting knives on Palestinian Israeli citizens as an excuse to murder them in the streets in cold blood ? Look at the video evidence;

https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/video-israeli-soldier-forces-knife-palestinian-girl

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cKr2omHgXhc


Does the Israeli Army Plant Knives on Palestinians?


To the Israeli ear the allegation sounds far-fetched. Israelis find it hard to believe that our soldiers and commanders could lie, until it’s proven otherwise by security footage or photos.
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.686280



And this Desh, is another reason why there will never be peace in this land. Neither side, nor their partisans, will ever admit to doing any wrong. Both sides see themselves as innocents. I'm sure the Germans will have a name for this form of myopic delusion.

Peace will come when Israel is forced to comply with international law. Law is all we have to prevent global catastrophe- so we'd all better get behind it. Israeli criminality is a fine place to start.

[AnyOldIron]

I have one child who is five and another who is a teenager. They squabble all the time. Her size doesn't excuse the five year old for continuing the tit for tat, or for the mischief she does to her brother in her turn.

They both get told to stop squabbling.

[Minister of Truth]

the only problem with your analogy is that one kid is 6'4" 250 lbs, while the other is 5'0 89 lbs.

Wow, what a shorty!

[moon]

An example of how language used indicates partisan allegiance, that you are buying into one side's propaganda.



What you really have here is a tit for tat situation. Each side will look back at the last attack on them to justify their next attack. It is impossible to identify one side as the initial aggressor because tit for tat violence is cyclic.

That's simply an attempt to justify Zionist aggression by creating a moral ' side ' for it. In truth the first act of aggression was the invasion of Palestine by European Zionists. No invasion = no resistance to invasion. Mull on that for a while.

[Phantasmal]

I have one child who is five and another who is a teenager. They squabble all the time. Her size doesn't excuse the five year old for continuing the tit for tat, or for the mischief she does to her brother in her turn.

They both get told to stop squabbling.

I expect my teenagers to have the maturity to understand that the other is just five and deal with them accordingly.

[moon]

Another example of Israeli incitement. Who can wonder why this fascist state is hated worldwide and supported only by a Zionist-controlled US government ?


Gaza faces harsh winter after Israel cuts gas supply

Palestinians say Israel has drastically reduced natural gas into Gaza, worsening bitter cold weather conditions.

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/01/gaza-faces-harsh-winter-israel-cuts-gas-supply-160113151958861.html

The fascist government of Israel has been working hard to provoke West Bank Palestinians so that it can ' legitimise ' and increase its squatter programme. Now it wants to incite Gazans in order to attack Gaza again.


Gaza's agricultural sector - which depends heavily on gas to run greenhouses, especially since Israel sprayed herbicides to destroy vast swathes of crops near the border as part of a "no-grow zone" - has been further hurt by the gas crisis.

This is not the work of decent Jews. This is the work of neoZionist filth backed by deluded Americans.

[AnyOldIron]

You speak as if an impartial position is moral- whereas it is halfway towards supporting a doctrine of ethnic cleansing and an illegal occupation.

This made me chortle. I would describe partisans of both sides as having a dodgy moral compass. As I have said, to be partisan means seeing fault only in your opponent and to turn a blind side to the fault of your own side.

How can you ever come to a peaceful settlement without being impartial, without admitting the faults on both sides and working to fix them? To be a partisan is to fan the violence. Which is difficult to see as moral.

Also, by logical extension of your argument, the violence of the crusades is justified by the illegal occupation and ethnic cleansing of the Christians when Arab Islam conquered the area in the C7th? You realise that, right?


You claim that Palestinians fire ineffective rockettes at Israelis in the full knowledge that the Israelis will slaughter thousands of Palestinians ? I think you had better review your ' undeniable evidence ' and post it here

You want me to link that Hamas were firing ineffectual rockets into Israel? Or are you struggling to comprehend that Hamas knew what the reaction would be? What do you imagine Hamas thought the reaction would be? Do you think they thought that Israel would immediately retreat to the 1948 borders in the face of this terrifying barrage of ineffectual rockets? Really?

Knives.... again, two partisan sources. google 'echo chamber'. And again, tit for tat. You are taking a side when this violence is clearly cyclic.


Peace will come when Israel is forced to comply with international law.

Lets examine the time before Israeli illegal occupation started. How much peace occurred then exactly?

[evince]

You like a good self hating Jew, do you, Fraulein?

its self hate not to kill people?

[AnyOldIron]

That's simply an attempt to justify Zionist aggression by creating a moral ' side ' for it.

Wow, comprehension not really your strong point is it? I am not condoning Israeli actions or violence. I am not condoning Palestinian violence (that's where you're at). I am condemning the stupid tit for tat violence on both sides that perpetuates this cyclic bullshit merry-go-round.


In truth the first act of aggression was the invasion of Palestine by European Zionists. No invasion = no resistance to invasion. Mull on that for a while.

Oh, you're under the impression that the Palestinians are some kind of aboriginal people and didn't illegally conquer and occupy the area in the C7th, culminating in the seige and fall of Jerusalem in 637AD. Does your no invasion = no resistance rule not apply here? I mean, the Jews did illegally invade and occupy the land (from the Aegean Sea People) before the Palestinians. They were there first, and the land only fell to the Muslim Arabs through illegal invasion and occupation. See how this tit for tat bullshit cyclic merry-go-round stretches into millennia now?

[evince]

but you od seem o be pretending all of those people are doing the evil


many are just stuck

[moon]

This made me chortle. I would describe partisans of both sides as having a dodgy moral compass. As I have said, to be partisan means seeing fault only in your opponent and to turn a blind side to the fault of your own side.
You think that's a convenient moral niche you've created for yourself but it's a rejection of morality. You fail to recognise Zionism as the root of the problem, a doctrine of ethnic cleansing - condemned by its own speeches and writings- which seeks to rob an indigenous people of their homeland by means of a programme of brutal aggression, murder and theft. You've swallowed the Zionist propaganda and been recruited by an organisation which specialises in scorn for law- and you don't realise what's happened to you.


How can you ever come to a peaceful settlement without being impartial, without admitting the faults on both sides and working to fix them? To be a partisan is to fan the violence. Which is difficult to see as moral.

Not at all. To support the Palestinian cause is to support international law. The impartiality fudge that you are attempting to sell makes no mention that Israel gets flayed alive every time its actions are judged by those legally qualified. Instead, you ' chortle '


Also, by logical extension of your argument, the violence of the crusades is justified by the illegal occupation and ethnic cleansing of the Christians when Arab Islam conquered the area in the C7th? You realise that, right?

I haven't seen any sign of sound logic on your part to date- so you can hardly expect any of your ' logical extensions ' to receive a response.




You want me to link that Hamas were firing ineffectual rockets into Israel? Or are you struggling to comprehend that Hamas knew what the reaction would be? What do you imagine Hamas thought the reaction would be? Do you think they thought that Israel would immediately retreat to the 1948 borders in the face of this terrifying barrage of ineffectual rockets? Really?

You claimed to have ' evidence ' that Hamas launched ' barrages of rockets ' in order to provoke the Israelis to kill Palestinians. I can see from your words, above, that you are already attempting a smoke screen and I anticipate more fudge of impartiality to take the place of any evidence claimed.


Knives.... again, two partisan sources. google 'echo chamber'. And again, tit for tat. You are taking a side when this violence is clearly cyclic.

You're shocked by the video evidence, I can see. You also seem unaware that, whilst one source of Israeli knife-planting is from the Electronic Intifada- a non-violent pro-Palestinian Internet organisation based in Chicago- the question of this aspect of almost unbelievable Israeli criminalty is being asked by an Israeli newspaper. It's enough to make Humpty-Dumpty fall off his wall, is it not ?




Lets examine the time before Israeli illegal occupation started. How much peace occurred then exactly?

The Jews and Arabs of Palestine existed together for millennia before Zionism laid claim to it all.

[AnyOldIron]

I expect my teenagers to have the maturity to understand that the other is just five

What very disciplined teenage/child siblings you all must have over there. Over here, you sit down to play a boardgame with them, five minutes later...squabbling.

I just expect them both to stop squabbling.

[Phantasmal]

What very disciplined teenage/child siblings you all must have over there. Over here, you sit down to play a boardgame with them, five minutes later...squabbling.

I just expect them both to stop squabbling.
Thank you, my children are wonderful.

[AnyOldIron]

but you od seem o be pretending all of those people are doing the evil


many are just stuck

I agree. I'm not pretending 'all' the people on either side. Many thousands of people on both sides are stuck on the cyclic bullshit merry-go-round.

[AnyOldIron]

Thank you, my children are wonderful.

We should do a cultural exchange. We've never yet got to the end of a game of buckeroo. ;)

[AnyOldIron]

You think that's a convenient moral niche you've created for yourself but it's a rejection of morality.

No, it's not. It's about making moral judgements through refusing to be myopic about either sides excesses, by refusing to form opinion by echo chamber and by removing as much pathos as possible fromthe argument.



indigenous people of their homeland

See my above. Palestinians are not an indigenous people but one in a long line of illegal conquers and occupiers going back millenia

Then there's some blah, blah, blah about being sucked into propaganda which is kind of ironic (and we get told you Americans don't do irony!)


I haven't seen any sign of sound logic on your part to date- so you can hardly expect any of your ' logical extensions ' to receive a response.

Oh, good use of chaff. Always good to throw a bit of that up if you can't think of a retort.


You claimed to have ' evidence ' that Hamas launched ' barrages of rockets ' in order to provoke the Israelis to kill Palestinians. I can see from your words, above, that you are already attempting a smoke screen and I anticipate more fudge of impartiality to take the place of any evidence claimed.

More chaff? Let me break it down a little simpler for you before I break out the secret Hamas documents where they conveniently wrote down their plan in a James Bond badguy kind of way. Do you think Hamas thought that by firing ineffectual rockets into Israel, Israel would:

a. Send a strongly worded letter through the UN.
b. Retreat to the 1948 borders.
c. Continue the tit for tat retaliations with hugely excessive force.

Now this multiple choice. You've got a good chance here...


The Jews and Arabs of Palestine existed together for millennia before Zionism laid claim to it all.

The Arabs haven't been there for millenia, so that would be a neat trick. They invaded and conquered (illegally) the area as part of the Muslim Arab conquest of the Levant. Took it from the Christian Eastern Romans, who in turn took it from the Jews in 70AD. The only time there has been peace in the Holy Land for any significant length of time was when it fell into the hands of local superpowers, the Romans and Ottoman Turks. And then it was only a superficial peace. But maybe that's what we need. A superpower to control it and enforce peace. Wonder if the Russians fancy the job....

[USFREEDOM911]

Does the date matter to you or are you bereft of a pro-slaughter response ?

No. The photograph is from Israel's ' Operation Cast Lead- December 27, 2008 – January 18, 2009 when the Israelis murdered over 400 Palestinian children during the Christmas period- along with a thousand other people.
You might say that the slaughter emphasised neoZionist contempt for the life and teachings of Christ. Then again, you might detest Christianity and claim that the children deserved it. You might even detest children. It's hard to gauge somebody who ' almost wishes ' for genocide.

Would you like some more recent information on neoZionists' atrocities ?
Here's a snippet from ' Operation Defensive Edge ' of 2014



Over 500 children were murdered on that occasion. The Israelis' aim is improving.

I'm waiting on proof that Israel is committing genocide, like the bleeding heart liberals say they are.

[USFREEDOM911]

There's a lot of misinformation evident in your post .
For one- Hamas ceased attacking Israel directly some time ago as a matter of policy. Hamas now responds only when it is attacked but the Western press only reports the Hamas response and not the Israeli aggression. This gives precisely the wrong account of events that the Israelis want. Unsurprisingly, many of the Western media outlets are owned by billionaire supporters of Zionism. So the best way for the Zionists to have Hamas condemned is for the Zionists to attack Hamas. Which they frequently do.
Secondly, Gaza is utterly impoverished- due to Israelis' illegal attacks and the Israeli illegal blockade- and Gazans have to adapt to poverty and earn a living. One way that some do this is to fire rockettes into Israel which have been commisioned by families which have had a relative of friend murdered by the Israelis. For a sum of money or a promised favour the guerrilla brigades - not Hamas- will fire into Israel. Of course we all know that these rockettes are relatively harmless. They are inaccurate and carry no warhead. Very few Israelis have been killed or injured by them. Also, the main target for the rockettes is the nearby settlement known as Sderot. Sderot is actually the Palestinian village of Nadj- from which the Zionists drove the indigenous Palestinian people in the early 1950s. The Palestinians are actually firing at the illegal occupants of their own Palestinian homes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sderot
Lastly, Gaza is the most densely populated region on earth. To say that the rockette brigades deliberately site their launchers near hospitals and schools is a nonsense. It is the Israelis who deliberately target such buildings as a form of- illegal- collective punishment of Palestinians. They also target other aspects of Palestinian civilisation, such as water plants and generators. They started their ' Cast Lead ' offensive by murdering a square full of Palestinian police cadets on parade. Such attacks are part of the neoZionist ethnic cleansing policy.
It is wholly inaccurate to blame the Palestinians for any aspect of the invasion of their own country. You would not be blamed for resisting invasion of yours- except by the invaders.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight :good4u:

[USFREEDOM911]

the only problem with your analogy is that one kid is 6'4" 250 lbs, while the other is 5'0 89 lbs.

Then maybe the that is 5'0 89 lbs should stop trying to act like he's 6'4" 250 lbs.

[USFREEDOM911]

I expect my teenagers to have the maturity to understand that the other is just five and deal with them accordingly.

So you just let your younger children abuse your older ones; because you expected the older ones to put up with it?
Gee, what a great role model you were. Teaching your children to not only be bullies; but victims also.

[AnyOldIron]

So you just let your younger children abuse your older ones; because you expected the older ones to put up with it?
Gee, what a great role model you were. Teaching your children to not only be bullies; but victims also.

It's not bullying, that's a bit overdramatic.lol Siblings squabble that's what they do. One minute they are squabbling because one went in the other's room, the next they're playing Xbox together.

[USFREEDOM911]

It's not bullying, that's a bit overdramatic.lol Siblings squabble that's what they do. One minute they are squabbling because one went in the other's room, the next they're playing Xbox together.

In the real world, YES; but in Rana's world, she allows her younger children to be bullies and expects the older ones to be victims.

[moon]

No, it's not. It's about making moral judgements through refusing to be myopic about either sides excesses, by refusing to form opinion by echo chamber and by removing as much pathos as possible fromthe argument.

Again, you have concocted a moral ' side ' for neoZionism- which is in fact a more brutal manifestation of the original European ethnic cleansing movement which had no moral foundation for invading Palestine whatsoever. Sympathy for the victims of German fascism just doesn't amount to licence to invade, rob and ethnically cleanse Palestinians. Sympathy for neoZionism shouldn't exist at all either- but your fudge of impartiality attempts to ignore justice in favour of pompous fence-squatting. Pompous fence-squatters have allowed Israelis to promote their illegal activities over the past sixty-odd years- and much of the blame for the deaths and injustices can be ascribed to the fudge of impartiality. The remainder of the blame can be ascribed to self-serving industrialists, arms dealers, estate agents and a whole myriad of shysters of whom you- by maintaining the falsehood of a ' moral ' neoZionism- are an unconcious yet avid supporter. On the other hand- bizarrely- fence-squatters such as yourself purport to , simultaneously, sympathise with neoZionism's Palestinian victims. That's not ' impartiality '- that's double standards, and it's such hypocrisy which has prevented a legal solution to the illegal occupation before now.




See my above. Palestinians are not an indigenous people but one in a long line of illegal conquers and occupiers going back millenia

No, your potted history of Palestine reeks of other myopic 'observers ' attempts to obscure the European invasion by linking ' European Jews ' to the indigenous Jews of Palestine. Such tentative connections, again, are not licence to ethnically cleanse Palestine of its indigenous people- except its indigenous Jews, of course- and they are indigenous people because they are Semitic people and Semitic people have been the indigenous people of the region since the neolithic period. That they became ' Jews ' and 'Arabs' over time is irrelevant to the question of ' who was here first ' in the light of Semitic origins and even sillier when the question has been nullified by the onset of the United Nations in 1947 and the international law dispensed therein. Your ' impartial ' parchment-waving and potted histories are a nonsense - and will be highlighted as such when Israel's fascist government appears before the international courts.
Fence-squatters- such as yourself- would facilitate justice if they took their ' impartiality ' away with them and left the problem to be decided between the protagonists and the courts. After all, what have they got to offer when all they do is complain, posture and trumpet ' insoluble ' over a situation which they have helped create ? Believe it, it will be settled without you.


Then there's some blah, blah, blah about being sucked into propaganda which is kind of ironic (and we get told you Americans don't do irony!)

Zionism luuurvs fence-squatters. They are propaganda sponges and offer fascism legitimacy.




Oh, good use of chaff. Always good to throw a bit of that up if you can't think of a retort.
I've now dealt fully with your offered potted anthropology. Let's hope it doesn't crop again in the guise of any " logical extension "




More chaff? Let me break it down a little simpler for you before I break out the secret Hamas documents where they conveniently wrote down their plan in a James Bond badguy kind of way. Do you think Hamas thought that by firing ineffectual rockets into Israel, Israel would:

a. Send a strongly worded letter through the UN.
b. Retreat to the 1948 borders.
c. Continue the tit for tat retaliations with hugely excessive force.

Now this multiple choice. You've got a good chance here...

Either produce the claimed evidence or be silent. Bear in mind that if this ' evidence ' is found wanting then you are done, chum. This was your claim;
" in 2014, Hamas (or partners) fired barrages of ineffective rockets at Israeli targets knowing exactly what the Israeli response would be. The evidence of this is undeniable."
As you're not even sure who fired any rockettes the prospect of ' undeniable evidence ' is tantalising.




The Arabs haven't been there for millenia, so that would be a neat trick. They invaded and conquered (illegally) the area as part of the Muslim Arab conquest of the Levant. Took it from the Christian Eastern Romans, who in turn took it from the Jews in 70AD. The only time there has been peace in the Holy Land for any significant length of time was when it fell into the hands of local superpowers, the Romans and Ottoman Turks. And then it was only a superficial peace. But maybe that's what we need. A superpower to control it and enforce peace. Wonder if the Russians fancy the job....

Drone on if you can still find an audience.

[iolo]

its self hate not to kill people?Self-hating Jews turned Zionist and tried to make a religion into another tedious racist Volk, like Hitler's. They
are pure Nazis these days and they and the real Jews should never be confused.

[USFREEDOM911]

Again, you have concocted a moral ' side ' for neoZionism- which is in fact a more brutal manifestation of the original European ethnic cleansing movement which had no moral foundation for invading Palestine whatsoever. Sympathy for the victims of German fascism just doesn't amount to licence to invade, rob and ethnically cleanse Palestinians. Sympathy for neoZionism shouldn't exist at all either- but your fudge of impartiality attempts to ignore justice in favour of pompous fence-squatting. Pompous fence-squatters have allowed Israelis to promote their illegal activities over the past sixty-odd years- and much of the blame for the deaths and injustices can be ascribed to the fudge of impartiality. The remainder of the blame can be ascribed to self-serving industrialists, arms dealers, estate agents and a whole myriad of shysters of whom you- by maintaining the falsehood of a ' moral ' neoZionism- are an unconcious yet avid supporter. On the other hand- bizarrely- fence-squatters such as yourself purport to , simultaneously, sympathise with neoZionism's Palestinian victims. That's not ' impartiality '- that's double standards, and it's such hypocrisy which has prevented a legal solution to the illegal occupation before now.




No, your potted history of Palestine reeks of other myopic 'observers ' attempts to obscure the European invasion by linking ' European Jews ' to the indigenous Jews of Palestine. Such tentative connections, again, are not licence to ethnically cleanse Palestine of its indigenous people- except its indigenous Jews, of course- and they are indigenous people because they are Semitic people and Semitic people have been the indigenous people of the region since the neolithic period. That they became ' Jews ' and 'Arabs' over time is irrelevant to the question of ' who was here first ' in the light of Semitic origins and even sillier when the question has been nullified by the onset of the United Nations in 1947 and the international law dispensed therein. Your ' impartial ' parchment-waving and potted histories are a nonsense - and will be highlighted as such when Israel's fascist government appears before the international courts.
Fence-squatters- such as yourself- would facilitate justice if they took their ' impartiality ' away with them and left the problem to be decided between the protagonists and the courts. After all, what have they got to offer when all they do is complain, posture and trumpet ' insoluble ' over a situation which they have helped create ? Believe it, it will be settled without you.



Zionism luuurvs fence-squatters. They are propaganda sponges and offer fascism legitimacy.



I've now dealt fully with your offered potted anthropology. Let's hope it doesn't crop again in the guise of any " logical extension "




Either produce the claimed evidence or be silent. Bear in mind that if this ' evidence ' is found wanting then you are done, chum. This was your claim;
" in 2014, Hamas (or partners) fired barrages of ineffective rockets at Israeli targets knowing exactly what the Israeli response would be. The evidence of this is undeniable."
As you're not even sure who fired any rockettes the prospect of ' undeniable evidence ' is tantalising.




Drone on if you can still find an audience.

By any chance, would you happen to be Palestinian?

[moon]

By any chance, would you happen to be Palestinian?

Are you going to make your overdue apology with regard to your erroneous outburst- post #116- or is you ain't ? What does it take for you to admit your mistake ?

[USFREEDOM911]

Are you going to make your overdue apology with regard to your erroneous outburst- post #116- or is you ain't ? What does it take for you to admit your mistake ?

Why would I apologize for what is obviously truthful; but I do find it amusing that in your confusion you refer to it as an "erroneous outburst"??

[FUCK THE POLICE]

250 pages of awesome, brought to you by yours truly.

[Damocles]

I've got a solution. Nobody gets the 'holy land'. Both sides conquered and occupied it. Jews in pre-historic times (taking it from Aegean 'Sea People' who in turn had conquered and occupied it), Muslims in 637AD (taking it from the Eastern Romans who in turn conquered it.). Neither side can get on or act like anything better than savages.

So how about we evict everyone, concrete it over and it can be the carpark for a megasize Wally World we build instead of Jerusalem?

Welcome back!

[moon]

Why would I apologize for what is obviously truthful; but I do find it amusing that in your confusion you refer to it as an "erroneous outburst"??


You were challenged to find a reference to genocide in my contributions. You failed. That's because no reference exists. It was your invention. You got caught.

[USFREEDOM911]

You were challenged to find a reference to genocide in my contributions. You failed. That's because no reference exists. It was your invention. You got caught.

Then you must not have read the quotes of yours, that I provided; but then, I can give you the proof, I'm just unable to force you to be honest about your own behavior.

More's the pity. :palm:

[moon]

Then you must not have read the quotes of yours, that I provided; but then, I can give you the proof, I'm just unable to force you to be honest about your own behavior.

More's the pity. :palm:

There was no mention of genocide in any of them. You attempted to deceive- you got caught.

[USFREEDOM911]

There was no mention of genocide in any of them. You attempted to deceive- you got caught.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight!! :good4u:

[moon]

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight!! :good4u:

You were challenged to find a reference to genocide in my contributions. You failed. That's because no reference exists. It was your invention. You got caught.

[USFREEDOM911]

You were challenged to find a reference to genocide in my contributions. You failed. That's because no reference exists. It was your invention. You got caught.

The fact that you refuse to accept your own comments, is not my problem.
Not my circus.
Not my monkey

Own your own behavior.

[moon]

The fact that you refuse to accept your own comments, is not my problem.
Not my circus.
Not my monkey

Own your own behavior.

Your invention
Your deceit
Your guilt
Your shame
My satisfaction.

[moon]

Resolution would more firmly distinguish between Israel and territory gained during the 1967 war

The Israeli Foreign Ministry is working on a last minute push ahead of Monday's meeting of the European Union's Foreign Affairs Council, to halt a pending resolution that would more firmly distinguish Israel and the additional territory gained during the 1967 war, a report by the Israeli daily Haaretz reveals.


http://www.i24news.tv/en/news/israel/diplomacy-defense/99304-160115-european-union-settlements-israel

As world opinion- and more importantly action- moves inexorably towards the rejection of Israeli fascism a very important question arises. Who will protect the new Israel from the forces which will seek to exert revenge against it for the terrible wrongs which fascist Israel has inflicted upon its neighbours ? Perhaps that will be an important role for the new Palestinian state.

[USFREEDOM911]

Your invention
Your deceit
Your guilt
Your shame
My satisfaction.

So you feel satisfaction, when you make accusations of genocide.
:palm:

[moon]

There was no mention of genocide in any of them. You attempted to deceive- you got caught. How would you describe yourself ?

[canceled.2021.1]

Unleash the Jews on the muslime filth.

[evince]

There was no mention of genocide in any of them. You attempted to deceive- you got caught. How would you describe yourself ?

you don't want to go there with that one


its not pretty



he is obviously a sociopath

[evince]

As world opinion- and more importantly action- moves inexorably towards the rejection of Israeli fascism a very important question arises. Who will protect the new Israel from the forces which will seek to exert revenge against it for the terrible wrongs which fascist Israel has inflicted upon its neighbours ? Perhaps that will be an important role for the new Palestinian state.

there are good people in isreal who want to do it right


there are good people in plaestine who want to do I right.



Most people are mostly good


the nature of mankind is actually in our favor.


if mankind learns to SPOT he sociopaths and realizes just how many there are in the world ( 4 in 100 people are sociopathic) then we can shut down any sociopath like Nutinbutayahoo before they get any power.

[moon]

Unleash the Jews on the muslime filth.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9e/Gene_Wilder_1970.JPG/225px-Gene_Wilder_1970.JPG

" Say what ? "

[evince]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9e/Gene_Wilder_1970.JPG/225px-Gene_Wilder_1970.JPG

" Say what ? "

yeap most people are mostly good


he was a good man



the right will never win in the end because humans are not as evil as they need them to be

[USFREEDOM911]

There was no mention of genocide in any of them. You attempted to deceive- you got caught. How would you describe yourself ?

I see you're still running from your own statements; but I understand why.
It's because you finally realizing how pathetic it makes you look, that you're trying to hide from yourself. :good4u:

[moon]

I see you're still running from your own statements; but I understand why.
It's because you finally realizing how pathetic it makes you look, that you're trying to hide from yourself. :good4u:

A classic example of projection.

[USFREEDOM911]

A classic example of projection.

Yes, you are exhibiting such and I applauded you for recognizing your own behavior. :hand::hand::hand::hand:

Now maybe you can work on how you present yourself.

[moon]

Another classic example of projection.

[USFREEDOM911]

Another classic example of projection.

I have to admit, that you are pretty good at it; just not good enough to pass it off.

[moon]

I have to admit, that you are pretty good at it; just not good enough to pass it off.

What is it that you think I am ' pretty good ' at but ' not good enough ' ?

[iolo]

It is marvellous to me how the very same classes and families that supported Hitler now support the Zionist racists with the same half-witted malignity, whereas those who fought and died for the real Jews try to destroy the child-murdering Nazi state of 'Israel'.
Sometimes I wonder if anything really changes ever!

[evince]

yeap most people are mostly good


he was a good man



the right will never win in the end because humans are not as evil as they need them to be






https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosewood_massacre


this kind of stuff just doesnt appeal to decent humans in the end

[kaz]

It is marvellous to me how the very same classes and families that supported Hitler now support the Zionist racists with the same half-witted malignity, whereas those who fought and died for the real Jews try to destroy the child-murdering Nazi state of 'Israel'.
Sometimes I wonder if anything really changes ever!

Bad trip, huh? That sucks. Remember whatever you're taking right now not to take it again

[USFREEDOM911]

What is it that you think I am ' pretty good ' at but ' not good enough ' ?

Your attempts at projecting; but I'm sure with practice you'll improve. :good4u:

[USFREEDOM911]

It is marvellous to me how the very same classes and families that supported Hitler now support the Zionist racists with the same half-witted malignity, whereas those who fought and died for the real Jews try to destroy the child-murdering Nazi state of 'Israel'.
Sometimes I wonder if anything really changes ever!

Why are you complaining about the Welsh?
I doubt whether there any other of them on this board.

[moon]

Your attempts at projecting; but I'm sure with practice you'll improve. :good4u:

You think so, huh ? OK, let's spark up the projector again in order to observe a classic star at work.

In your post, #116, you stated that I held the opinion that Israel was engaged in genocide - an illegal activity which you confessed to ' almost wishing ' upon the Palestinians. When challenged to provide evidence for this invented claim you produced several of my earlier contributions, none of which made mention of genocide at all. When this obvious omission was highlighted you lapsed into an agenda of parroting in the hope that the demand for you to retract and apologise would go away. It didn't. When this characteristic childishness failed to get you off the hook you attempted to boost your flagrant projecting with some ill-chosen emoticons , still in the hope that it would go away. It hasn't.

Now then , why not simply admit that you made an error, apologise and then try to add someting constructive to this board - instead of leaving dollops of crap all over its threads like some incontinent troll ?

[USFREEDOM911]

You think so, huh ? OK, let's spark up the projector again in order to observe a classic star at work.

In your post, #116, you stated that I held the opinion that Israel was engaged in genocide - an illegal activity which you confessed to ' almost wishing ' upon the Palestinians. When challenged to provide evidence for this invented claim you produced several of my earlier contributions, none of which made mention of genocide at all. When this obvious omission was highlighted you lapsed into an agenda of parroting in the hope that the demand for you to retract and apologise would go away. It didn't. When this characteristic childishness failed to get you off the hook you attempted to boost your flagrant projecting with some ill-chosen emoticons , still in the hope that it would go away. It hasn't.

Now then , why not simply admit that you made an error, apologise and then try to add someting constructive to this board - instead of leaving dollops of crap all over its threads like some incontinent troll ?

I've always found it interesting that when someone, like you, are caught in their own comments, that they think they can hide behind making long comments while proclaiming their innocence.

At least you have your hatred to keep you warm. :D

[Buckly J. Ewer]

I've always found it interesting that when someone, like you, are caught in their own comments, that they think they can hide behind making long comments while proclaiming their innocence.

At least you have your hatred to keep you warm. :D

You are such a worthless pussy.

[moon]

Aye to that.

[USFREEDOM911]

You are such a worthless pussy.
I understand that's all you have left, Leo; but do try to better yourself. :D

[moon]

I responded to the OP by stating that it was my belief that the closest we could get to divine justice was the concept of international law. Here is a list of UN resolutions which the rogue state of Israel has scorned up until 2009;


Rogue State: Israeli Violations of U.N. Security Council Resolutions

Res. 1402 (Mar. 30, 2002) – Expresses grave concern “at the further deterioration of the situation, including the recent suicide bombings in Israel and the military attack against the headquarters of the president of the Palestinian Authority”, “Calls upon both parties to move immediately to a meaningful cease-fire” and “calls for the withdrawal of Israeli troops from Palestinian cities, including Ramallah”.

Res. 1403 (Apr. 4, 2002) – Expresses grave concern “at the further deterioration of the situation on the ground” and “Demands the implementation of its resolution 1402 (2002) without delay”.

Res. 1405 (Apr. 19, 2002) – Expresses concern for “the dire humanitarian situation of the Palestinian civilian population, in particular reports from the Jenin refugee camp of an unknown number of deaths and destruction”, calls for “the lifting of restrictions imposed, in particular in Jenin, on the operations of humanitarian organizations, including the International Committee of the Red Cross and United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East”, and “Emphasizes the urgency of access of medical and humanitarian organizations to the Palestinian civilian population”.

Res. 1435 (Sep. 24, 2002) – Expresses grave concern “at the reoccupation of the headquarters of the President of the Palestinian Authority in the City of Ramallah that took place” on September 19, 2002, demands “its immediate end”, expresses alarm “at the reoccupation of Palestinian cities as well as the severe restrictions imposed on the freedom of movement of persons and goods, and gravely concerned at the humanitarian crisis being faced by the Palestinian people”, reiterates “the need for respect in all circumstances of international humanitarian law, including the Fourth Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War”, “Demands that Israel immediately cease measures in and around Ramallah including the destruction of Palestinian civilian and security infrastructure”, and “Demands also the expeditious withdrawal of the Israeli occupying forces from Palestinian cities towards the return to the positions held prior to September 2000”.

Res. 1544 (May 19, 2004) – Reaffirms resolutions 242, 338, 446, 1322, 1397, 1402, 1405, 1435, and 1515, reiterates “the obligation of Israel, the occupying Power, to abide scrupulously by its legal obligations and responsibilities under the Fourth Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War”, calls “on Israel to address its security needs within the boundaries of international law”, expresses “grave concern at the continued deterioration of the situation on the ground in the territory occupied by Israel since 1967”, condemns “the killing of Palestinian civilians that took place in the Rafah area”, expresses grave concern “by the recent demolition of homes committed by Israel, the occupying Power, in the Rafah refugee camp”, reaffirms “its support for the Road Map, endorsed in resolution 1515”, “Calls on Israel to respect its obligations under international humanitarian law, and insists, in particular, on its obligation not to undertake demolition of homes contrary to that law”, and “Calls on both parties to immediately implement their obligations under the Road Map”.

Res. 1701 (Aug. 11, 2006) – Expresses “its utmost concern at the continuing escalation of hostilities in Lebanon and in Israel” that “has already caused hundreds of deaths and injuries” and “extensive damage to civilian infrastructure and hundreds of thousands of internally displaced persons”, and “Calls for a full cessation of hostilities” including “the immediate cessation by Israel of all offensive military operations”.

Res. 1860 (Jan. 8, 2009) – Expresses “grave concern at the escalation of violence and the deterioration of the situation, in particular the resulting heavy civilian casualties since the refusal to extend the period of calm”, expresses “grave concern also at the deepening humanitarian crisis in Gaza”, “calls for an immediate, durable and fully respected ceasefire, leading to the full withdrawal of Israeli forces from Gaza”, “Calls for the unimpeded provision and distribution throughout Gaza of humanitarian assistance, including of food, fuel and medical treatment”, and “Condemns all violence and hostilities directed against civilians and all acts of terrorism”.

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Res. 298 (Sep. 25, 1971) – Recalls resolutions 252 and 267 and General Assembly resolutions 2253 and 2254 concerning Israel’s measures to annex Jerusalem, reaffirms “the principle that acquisition of territory by military conquest is inadmissible”, notes “the non-compliance by Israel” of the recalled resolutions, deplores Israel’s failure to respect the resolutions, confirms that Israel’s actions “are totally invalid”, and urgently calls on Israel to rescind its measures and take “no further steps in the occupied section of Jerusalem” to change the status of the city.

Res. 313 (Feb. 28, 1972) – “Demands that Israel immediately desist and refrain from any ground and air military action against Lebanon and forthwith withdraw all its military forces from Lebanese territory.”

Res. 316 (Jun. 26, 1972) – Deplores “the tragic loss of life resulting from all acts of violence”, expresses grave concern “at Israel’s failure to comply with Security Council resolutions” 262, 270, 280, 285, and 313 “calling on Israel to desist forthwith from any violation of the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Lebanon”, calls on Israel to abide by the resolutions, and condemns “the repeated attacks of Israeli forces on Lebanese territory and population in violation of the principles of the Charter of the United Nations and Israel’s obligations thereunder”.

Res. 317 (Jul. 21, 1972) – Notes resolution 316, deplores the fact that Israel had not yet released “Syrian and Lebanese military and security personnel abducted by Israeli armed forces from Lebanese territory” on June 21, 1972, and calls on Israel to release the prisoners.

Res. 332 (Apr. 21, 1972) – “Condemns the repeated military attacks conducted by Israel against Lebanon and Israel’s violation of Lebanon’s territorial integrity and sovereignty” in violation of the U.N. Charter, the armistice agreement, and cease-fire resolutions.

Res. 337 (Aug. 15, 1973) – Notes “the violation of Lebanon’s sovereignty and territorial integrity” by Israel “and the hijacking, by the Israeli air force, of a Lebanese civilian airliner on lease to Iraqi Airways”, expresses grave concern “that such an act carried out by Israel, a Member of the United Nations, constitutes a serious interference with international civil aviation and a violation of the Charter of the United Nations”, recognizes “that such an act could jeopardize the lives and safety of passengers and crew and violates the provisions of international conventions safeguarding civil aviation”, condemns Israel “for violating Lebanon’s sovereignty and territorial integrity and for the forcible diversion and seizure by the Israeli air force of a Lebanese airliner from Lebanon’s air space”, and considers that Israel’s actions constitute a violation of the armistice agreement, cease-fire resolutions, the U.N. Charter, “the international conventions on civil aviation and the principles of international law and morality”.

Res. 347 (Apr. 24, 1974) – “Condemns Israel’s violation of Lebanon’s territorial integrity and sovereignty and calls once more on the Government of Israel to refrain from further military actions and threats against Lebanon”, and calls on Israel “to release and return to Lebanon the abducted Lebanese civilians”.

Res. 425 (Mar. 19, 1978) – “Calls for strict respect for the territorial integrity, sovereignty and political independence of Lebanon within its internationally recognized boundaries”, and “Calls upon Israel immediately to cease its military action against Lebanese territorial integrity and withdraw forthwith its forces from all Lebanese territory”.

Res. 427 (May 3, 1978) – “Calls upon Israel to complete its withdrawal from all Lebanese territory without any further delay”.

Res. 446 (Mar. 22, 1979) – Affirms “once more that the Fourth Geneva Convention … is applicable to the Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”, “Determines that the policy and practices of Israel in establishing settlements in the Palestinian and other Arab territories occupied since 1967 have no legal validity and constitute a serious obstruction to achieving a comprehensive, just and lasting peace in the Middle East”, “Strongly deplores the failure of Israel to abide by” resolutions 237, 252, and 298, and General Assembly resolutions 2253 and 2254, and calls on Israel “as the occupying Power” to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention, to “rescind its previous measures and to desist from any action which would result in changing the legal status and geographical nature and materially affecting the demographic composition of the Arab territories occupied since 1967, including Jerusalem, and, in particular, not to transfer parts of its own civilian population into the occupied Arab territories”.

Res. 450 (Jun. 14, 1979) – “Strongly deplores acts of violence against Lebanon that have led to the displacement of civilians, including Palestinians, and brought about destruction and loss of innocent lives”, and calls on Israel to cease actions against Lebanon, “in particular its incursions into Lebanon and the assistance it continues to lend to irresponsible armed groups”.

Res. 452 (Jul. 20, 1979) – Strongly deplores “the lack of co-operation of Israel” with the Security Council Commission “established under resolution 446 (1979) to examine the situation relating to settlements in the Arab territories occupied since 1967, including Jerusalem”, considers “that the policy of Israel in establishing settlements in the occupied Arab territories has no legal validity and constitutes a violation of the Fourth Geneva Convention”, expresses deep concern at Israel’s policy of constructing settlements “in the occupied Arab territories, including Jerusalem, and its consequences for the local Arab and Palestinian population”, and calls on Israel to cease such activities.

Res. 465 (Mar. 1, 1980) – Strongly deplores Israel’s refusal to co-operate with the Security Council Commission, regrets Israel’s “formal rejection of” resolutions 446 and 452, deplores Israel’s decision “to officially support Israeli settlement” in the occupied territories, expresses deep concern over Israel’s settlement policy “and its consequences for the local Arab and Palestinian population”, “Strongly deplores the decision of Israel to prohibit the free travel” of the mayor of Hebron “to appear before the Security Council”, and “Determines that all measures taken by Israel to change the physical character, demographic composition, institutional structure or status of the Palestinian and other Arab territories occupied since 1967, including Jerusalem, or any part thereof, have no legal validity and that Israel’s policy and practices of settling parts of its population and new immigrants in those territories constitute a flagrant violation of the Fourth Geneva Convention”.

Res. 467 (Apr. 24, 1980) – “Condemns all actions contrary to” resolutions 425, 426, 427, 434, 444, 450, and 459 “and, in particular, strongly deplores” any “violation of Lebanese sovereignty and territorial integrity” and “Israel’s military intervention into Lebanon”.

Res. 468 (May 8, 1980) – Expresses deep concern “at the expulsion by the Israeli military occupation authorities of the Mayors of Hebron and Halhoul and the Sharia Judge of Hebron” and “Calls upon the Government of Israel as occupying Power to rescind these illegal measures and facilitate the immediate return of the expelled Palestinian leaders so that they can resume the functions for which they were elected and appointed”.

Res. 469 (May 20, 1980) – Recalls the Fourth Geneva Convention “and in particular article 1, which reads ‘The High Contracting Parties undertake to respect and to ensure respect for the present Convention in all circumstances,’ and article 49, which reads ‘Individual or mass forcible transfers, as well as deportations of protected persons from the occupied territory to the territory of the occupying Power or to that of any other country, occupied or not, are prohibited, regardless of their motive”, “Strongly deplores the failure of the Government of Israel to implement Security Council resolution 468”, “Calls again upon the Government of Israel, as occupying Power, to rescind the illegal measures taken by the Israeli military occupation authorities in expelling the Mayors of Hebron and Halhoul and the Sharis Judge of Hebron, and to facilitate the immediate return of the expelled Palestinian leaders, so that they can resume their functions for which they were elected and appointed”.

Res. 471 (Jun. 5, 1980) – Recalls “once again” the Fourth Geneva Convention, “and in particular article 27, which reads, ‘ Protected persons are entitled, in all circumstances, to respect for their persons… They shall at all times be humanely treated, and shall be protected especially against all acts of violence or threats thereof…’”, reaffirms the applicability of the Fourth Geneva Convention “to the Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”, expresses deep concern “that the Jewish settlers in the occupied Arab territories are allowed to carry arms, thus enabling them to perpetrate crimes against the civilian Arab population”, “Condemns the assassination attempts against the Mayors of Nablus, Ramallah and Al Bireh and calls for the immediate apprehension and prosecution of the perpetrators of these crimes”, “Expresses deep concern that Israel, as the occupying Power, has failed to provide adequate protection to the civilian population in the occupied territories in conformity with the provisions of the Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War”, calls on Israel “to provide the victims with adequate compensation for the damage suffered as a result of these crimes”, “Calls again upon the government of Israel to respect and to comply with the provisions of” the Fourth Geneva Convention and “the relevant resolutions of the Security Council”, “Calls once again upon all States not to provide Israel with any assistance to be used specifically in connexion [sic] with settlements in the occupied territories”, “Reaffirms the overriding necessity to end the prolonged occupation of Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”.
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Res. 476 (Jun. 30, 1980) – Reaffirms that “the acquisition of territory by force is inadmissible”, deplores “the persistence of Israel, in changing the physical character, demographic composition, institutional structure and the status of the Holy City of Jerusalem”, expresses grave concern “over the legislative steps initiated in the Israeli Knesset with the aim of changing the character and status of the Holy City of Jerusalem”, reaffirms “the overriding necessity to end the prolonged occupation of Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”, “Strongly deplores the continued refusal of Israel, the occupying Power, to comply with the relevant resolutions of the Security Council and the General Assembly”, “Reconfirms that all legislative and administrative measures and actions taken by Israel, the occupying Power, which purport to later the character and status of the Holy City of Jerusalem have no legal validity and constitute a flagrant violation of the Fourth Geneva Convention”, “Reiterates that all such measures … are null and void and must be rescinded in compliance with the relevant resolutions of the Security Council”, and “Urgently calls on Israel, the occupying Power, to abide by this and previous Security Council resolutions and to desist forthwith from persisting in the policy and measures affecting the character and status of the Holy city of Jerusalem”.

Res. 478 (Aug. 20, 1980) – Reaffirms “again that the acquisition of territory by force is inadmissible”, notes “that Israel has not complied with resolution 476”, “Censures in the strongest terms the enactment by Israel of the ‘basic law’ on Jerusalem and the refusal to comply with relevant Security Council resolutions”, “Affirms that the enactment of the ‘basic law’ by Israel constitutes a violation of international law”, “Determines that all legislative and administrative measures and actions taken by Israel, the occupying Power, which have altered or purport to alter the character and status of the Holy City of Jerusalem, and in particular the recent ‘basic law’ on Jerusalem, are null and void and must be rescinded forthwith”.

Res. 484 (Dec. 19, 1980) – Expresses “grave concern at the expulsion by Israel of the Mayor of Hebron and the Mayor of Halhoul”, “Reaffirms the applicability of” the Fourth Geneva Convention “to all the Arab territories occupied by Israel in 1967”, “Calls upon Israel, the occupying Power, to adhere to the provisions of the Convention”, and “Declares it imperative that the Mayor of Hebron and the Mayor of Halhoul be enabled to return to their homes and resume their responsibilities”.

Res. 487 (Jun. 19, 1981) – Expresses full awareness “of the fact that Iraq has been a party to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons since it came into force in 1970, that in accordance with that Treaty Iraq has accepted IAEA safeguards on all its nuclear activities, and that the Agency has testified that these safeguards have been satisfactorily applied to date”, notes “furthermore that Israel has not adhered to the non-proliferation Treaty”, expresses deep concern “about the danger to international peace and security created by the premeditated Israeli air attack on Iraqi nuclear installations on 7 June 1981, which could at any time explode the situation in the area, with grave consequences for the vital interests of all States”, “Strongly condemns the military attack by Israel in clear violation of the Charter of the United Nations and the norms of international conduct”, “Further considers that the said attack constitutes a serious threat to the entire IAEA safeguards regime which is the foundation of the non-proliferation Treaty”, “Fully recognizes the inalienable sovereign right of Iraq, and all other States, especially the developing countries, to establish programmes of technological and nuclear development to develop their economy and industry for peaceful purposes in accordance with their present and future needs and consistent with the internationally accepted objectives of preventing nuclear-weapons proliferation”, and “Calls upon Israel urgently to place its nuclear facilities under IAEA safeguards”.

Res. 497 (Dec. 17, 1981) – Reaffirms “that the acquisition of territory by force is inadmissible, in accordance with the United Nations Charter, the principles of international law, and relevant Security Council resolutions”, “Decides that the Israeli decision to impose its laws, jurisdiction and administration in the occupied Syrian Golan Heights is null and void and without international legal effect”, “Demands that Israel, the occupying Power, should rescind forthwith its decision”, and “Determines that all the provisions of the” Fourth Geneva Convention “continue to apply to the Syrian territory occupied by Israel since June 1967”.

Res. 501 (Feb. 25, 1982) – Reaffirms resolution 425 calling upon Israel to cease its military action against Lebanon.

Res. 509 ( Jun. 6, 1982) – “Demands that Israel withdraw all its military forces forthwith and unconditionally to the internationally recognized boundaries of Lebanon”.

Res. 515 (Jul. 29, 1982) – “Demands that the Government of Israel lift immediately the blockade of the city of Beirut in order to permit the dispatch of supplies to meet the urgent needs of the civilian population and allow the distribution of aid provided by United Nations agencies and by non-governmental organizations, particularly the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC)”.

Res. 517 (Aug. 4, 1982) – Expresses deep shock and alarm “by the deplorable consequences of the Israeli invasion of Beirut on 3 August 1982”, “Confirms once again its demand for an immediate cease-fire and withdrawal of Israeli forces from Lebanon”, and “Censures Israel for its failure to comply with” resolutions 508, 509, 512, 513, 515, and 516.

Res. 518 (Aug. 12, 1982) – “Demands that Israel and all parties to the conflict observe strictly the terms of Security Council resolutions relevant to the immediate cessation of all military activities within Lebanon and, particularly, in and around Beirut”, “Demands the immediate lifting of all restrictions on the city of Beirut in order to permit the free entry of supplies to meet the urgent needs of the civilian population in Beirut”.

Res. 520 (Sep. 17, 1982) – “Condemns the recent Israeli incursions into Beirut in violation of the cease-fire agreements and of Security Council resolutions”, and “Demands an immediate return to the positions occupied by Israel before” September 15, 1982 “as a first step towards the full implementation of Security Council resolutions”.

Res. 521 (Sep. 19, 1982) – “Condemns the criminal massacre of Palestinian civilians in Beirut” in the Sabra and Shatila refugee camps.

Res. 573 (Oct. 4, 1985) – “Condemns vigorously the act of armed aggression perpetrated by Israel against Tunisian territory in flagrant violation of the Charter of the United Nations, international law and norms of conduct”.

Res. 592 (Dec. 8, 1986) – Reaffirms that the Fourth Geneva Convention “is applicable to the Palestinian and other Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”, and “Strongly deplores the opening of fire by the Israeli army resulting in the death and the wounding of defenceless students”.

Res. 605 (Dec. 22, 1987) – “Strongly deplores those policies and practices of Israel, the occupying Power, which violate the human rights of the Palestinian people in the occupied territories, and in particular the opening of fire by the Israeli army, resulting in the killing and wounding of defenceless Palestinian civilians”, and reaffirms the applicability of the Fourth Geneva Convention “to the Palestinian and other Arab territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”.

Res. 607 (Jan. 5, 1988) – Expresses “grave concern over the situation in the occupied Palestinian territories”, notes “the decision of Israel, the occupying Power, to ‘continue the deportation’ of Palestinian civilians in the occupied territories”, “Reaffirms once again” the applicability of the Fourth Geneva Convention “to Palestinian and other Arab territories, occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”, “Calls upon Israel to refrain from deporting any Palestinian civilians from the occupied territories”, and “Strongly requests Israel, the occupying Power, to abide by its obligations arising from the Convention”.
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Res. 608 (Jan. 14, 1988) – Reaffirms resolution 607, expresses “deep regret that Israel, the occupying Power, has, in defiance of that resolution, deported Palestinian civilians”, and “Calls upon Israel to rescind the order to deport Palestinian civilians and to ensure the safe and immediate return to the occupied Palestinian territories of those already deported”.

Res. 611 (Apr. 25, 1988) – Notes “with concern that the aggression perpetrated” by Israelis on April 16, 1988 “in the locality of Sidi Bou Said”, Tunisia, “has caused loss of human life, particularly the assassination of Mr. Khalil El Wazir”, and “Condemns vigorously the aggression perpetrated … against the sovereignty and territorial integrity of Tunisia in flagrant violation of the Charter of the United Nations, international law and norms of conduct”.

Res. 636 (Jul. 6, 1989) – Reaffirms resolutions 607 and 608, notes “that Israel, the occupying Power, has once again, in defiance of those resolutions, deported eight Palestinian civilians on 29 June 1989”, Expresses deep regret “the continuing deportation by Israel, the occupying Power, of Palestinian civilians”, “Calls upon Israel to ensure the safe and immediate return to the occupied Palestinian territories of those deported and to desist forthwith from deporting any other Palestinian civilians”, and “Reaffirms that” the Fourth Geneva Convention “is applicable to the Palestinian territories, occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem, and to other occupied Arab territories”.

Res. 641 (Aug. 30, 1989) – Reaffirms resolutions 607, 608, and 636, notes that Israel “has once again, in defiance of those resolutions, deported five Palestinian civilians on 27 August 1989”, and “Deplores the continuing deportation by Israel, the occupying Power, of Palestinian civilians”.

Res. 672 (Oct. 12, 1990) – “Expresses alarm at the violence which took place” on October 8, 1990, “at the Al Haram al Shareef and other Holy Places of Jerusalem resulting in over twenty Palestinian deaths and to the injury of more than one hundred and fifty people, including Palestinian civilians and innocent worshippers”, “Condemns especially the acts of violence committed by the Israeli forces resulting in injuries and loss of human life”, and “Requests, in connection with the decision of the Secretary-General to send a mission to the region, which the Council welcomes, that he submit a report to it before the end of October 1990 containing his findings and conclusions and that he use as appropriate all the resources of the United Nations in the region in carrying out the mission.”

Res. 673 (Oct. 24, 1990) – “Deplores the refusal of the Israeli Government to receive the mission of the Secretary-General to the region”, and “Urges the Israeli Government to reconsider its decision and insists that it comply fully with resolution 672 (1990) and to permit the mission of the Secretary-General to proceed in keeping with its purpose”.

Res. 681 (Dec. 20, 1990) – Reaffirms “the obligations of Member States under the United Nations Charter”, reaffirms “also the principle of the inadmissibility of the acquisition of territory by war”, expresses alarm “by the decision of the Government of Israel to deport four Palestinians from the occupied territories in contravention of its obligations under the Fourth Geneva Convention” in contravention to resolutions 607, 608, 636, and 641, “Expresses its grave concern over the rejection by Israel of Security Council resolutions” 672 and 673, and “Deplores the decision by the Government of Israel, the occupying Power, to resume deportations of Palestinian civilians in the occupied territories”.

Res. 694 (May 24, 1991) – Reaffirms resolution 681 calling on Israel to respect the Fourth Geneva Convention, notes “with deep concern and consternation that Israel has, in violation of its obligations under the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949, and acting in opposition to relevant Security Council resolutions, and to the detriment of efforts to achieve a comprehensive, just and lasting peace in the Middle East, deported four Palestinian civilians” on May 18, 1991, “Declares that the action of the Israeli authorities of deporting four Palestinians … is in violation of the Fourth Geneva Convention …, which is applicable to all the Palestinian territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”, and “Deplores this action and reiterates that Israel, the occupying Power, refrain from deporting any Palestinian civilian from the occupied territories and ensure the safe and immediate return of all those deported”.

Res. 726 (Jan. 6, 1992) – Recalls resolutions 607, 608, 636, 641, and 694 calling on Israel to respect the Fourth Geneva Convention, “Strongly condemns the decision of Israel, the occupying Power, to resume deportations of Palestinian civilians”, “Reaffirms the applicability of the Fourth Geneva Convention … to all the Palestinian territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem”, and “requests Israel, the occupying Power, to ensure the safe and immediate return to the occupied territories of all those deported”.

Res. 799 (Dec. 18, 1992) – Reaffirms resolutions 607, 608, 636, 641, 681, 694, and 726 calling on Israel to respect the Fourth Geneva Convention, notes “with deep concern that Israel, the occupying Power, in contravention of its obligations under the Fourth Geneva Convention …, deported to Lebanon” on December 17, 1992 “hundreds of Palestinian civilians from the territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jersualem”, “Strongly condemns the action taken by Israel, the occupying Power, to deport hundreds of Palestinian civilians, and expresses its firm opposition to any such deportation by Israel”, “Reaffirms the applicability of the Fourth Geneva Convention … to all the Palestinian territories occupied by Israel since 1967, including Jerusalem, and affirms that deportation of civilians constitutes a contravention of its obligations under the Convention”, and “Demands that Israel, the occupying Power, ensure the safe and immediate return to the occupied territories of all those deported”.

Res. 904 (Mar. 18, 1994) – Expresses shock at “the appalling massacre committed against Palestinian worshippers in the Mosque of Ibrahim in Hebron” on February 25, 1994 by Jewish settler Baruch Goldstein “during the holy month of Ramadan”, expresses grave concern with “the consequent Palestinian casualties in the occupied Palestinian territory as a result of the massacre, which underlines the need to provide protection and security for the Palestinian people”, notes “the condemnation of this massacre by the entire international community”, “Strongly condemns the massacre in Hebron and its aftermath which took the lives of more than fifty Palestinian civilians and injured several hundred others”, and “Calls upon Israel, the occupying Power, to continue to take and implement measures, including, inter alia, confiscation of arms, with the aim of preventing illegal acts of violence by Israeli settlers”.

Res. 1073 (Sep. 28, 1996) – Expresses “deep concern about the tragic events in Jerusalem and the areas of Nablus, Ramallah, Bethlehem and the Gaza Strip, which resulted in a high number of deaths and injuries among the Palestinian civilians, and concerned also about the clashes between the Israeli army and the Palestinian police and the casualties on both sides”, and “Calls for the safety and protection for Palestinian civilians to be ensured”.

Res. 1322 (Oct. 7, 2000) – Expresses deep concern “by the tragic events that have taken place” since September 28, 2000 “that have led to numerous deaths and injuries, mostly among Palestinians”, “Deplores the provocation carried out at Al-Haram Al-Sharif in Jerusalem” on September 28, 2000 “and the subsequent violence there and at other Holy Places, as well as in other areas throughout the territories occupied by Israel since 1967, resulting in over 80 Palestinian deaths and many other casualties”, “Condemns acts of violence, especially the excessive use of force against Palestinians, resulting in injury and loss of human life”, and “Calls upon Israel, the occupying Power, to abide scrupulously by its legal obligations and its responsibilities under the Fourth Geneva Convention”.
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Res. 1402 (Mar. 30, 2002) – Expresses grave concern “at the further deterioration of the situation, including the recent suicide bombings in Israel and the military attack against the headquarters of the president of the Palestinian Authority”, “Calls upon both parties to move immediately to a meaningful cease-fire” and “calls for the withdrawal of Israeli troops from Palestinian cities, including Ramallah”.

Res. 1403 (Apr. 4, 2002) – Expresses grave concern “at the further deterioration of the situation on the ground” and “Demands the implementation of its resolution 1402 (2002) without delay”.

Res. 1405 (Apr. 19, 2002) – Expresses concern for “the dire humanitarian situation of the Palestinian civilian population, in particular reports from the Jenin refugee camp of an unknown number of deaths and destruction”, calls for “the lifting of restrictions imposed, in particular in Jenin, on the operations of humanitarian organizations, including the International Committee of the Red Cross and United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East”, and “Emphasizes the urgency of access of medical and humanitarian organizations to the Palestinian civilian population”.

Res. 1435 (Sep. 24, 2002) – Expresses grave concern “at the reoccupation of the headquarters of the President of the Palestinian Authority in the City of Ramallah that took place” on September 19, 2002, demands “its immediate end”, expresses alarm “at the reoccupation of Palestinian cities as well as the severe restrictions imposed on the freedom of movement of persons and goods, and gravely concerned at the humanitarian crisis being faced by the Palestinian people”, reiterates “the need for respect in all circumstances of international humanitarian law, including the Fourth Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War”, “Demands that Israel immediately cease measures in and around Ramallah including the destruction of Palestinian civilian and security infrastructure”, and “Demands also the expeditious withdrawal of the Israeli occupying forces from Palestinian cities towards the return to the positions held prior to September 2000”.

Res. 1544 (May 19, 2004) – Reaffirms resolutions 242, 338, 446, 1322, 1397, 1402, 1405, 1435, and 1515, reiterates “the obligation of Israel, the occupying Power, to abide scrupulously by its legal obligations and responsibilities under the Fourth Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War”, calls “on Israel to address its security needs within the boundaries of international law”, expresses “grave concern at the continued deterioration of the situation on the ground in the territory occupied by Israel since 1967”, condemns “the killing of Palestinian civilians that took place in the Rafah area”, expresses grave concern “by the recent demolition of homes committed by Israel, the occupying Power, in the Rafah refugee camp”, reaffirms “its support for the Road Map, endorsed in resolution 1515”, “Calls on Israel to respect its obligations under international humanitarian law, and insists, in particular, on its obligation not to undertake demolition of homes contrary to that law”, and “Calls on both parties to immediately implement their obligations under the Road Map”.

Res. 1701 (Aug. 11, 2006) – Expresses “its utmost concern at the continuing escalation of hostilities in Lebanon and in Israel” that “has already caused hundreds of deaths and injuries” and “extensive damage to civilian infrastructure and hundreds of thousands of internally displaced persons”, and “Calls for a full cessation of hostilities” including “the immediate cessation by Israel of all offensive military operations”.

Res. 1860 (Jan. 8, 2009) – Expresses “grave concern at the escalation of violence and the deterioration of the situation, in particular the resulting heavy civilian casualties since the refusal to extend the period of calm”, expresses “grave concern also at the deepening humanitarian crisis in Gaza”, “calls for an immediate, durable and fully respected ceasefire, leading to the full withdrawal of Israeli forces from Gaza”, “Calls for the unimpeded provision and distribution throughout Gaza of humanitarian assistance, including of food, fuel and medical treatment”, and “Condemns all violence and hostilities directed against civilians and all acts of terrorism”.

That's just to 2009. The neoZionists have killed thousands more Palestinians since then.

http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2010/01/27/rogue-state-israeli-violations-of-u-n-security-council-resolutions/ [/quote]

How ? How can any law-abiding person support this rogue state ? It beggars belief.

[moon]

Pardon me- I missed some;


Res. 251 (May 2, 1968) – Recalls resolution 250 and “Deeply deplores the holding by Israel of the military parade in Jerusalem” on May 2, 1968 “in disregard of” resolution 250.

Res. 252 (May 21, 1968) – “Deplores the failure of Israel to comply with” General Assembly resolutions 2253 and 2254, considers Israel’s annexation of Jerusalem “invalid”, and calls upon Israel “to rescind all such measures already taken and to desist forthwith from taking any further action which tends to change the status of Jerusalem”.

Res. 256 (Aug. 16, 1968) – Recalls Israel’s “flagrant violation of the United Nations Charter” condemned in resolution 248, observes that further Israeli air attacks on Jordan “were of a large scale and carefully planned nature in violation of resolution 248”, “Deplores the loss of life and heavy damage to property”, and condemns Israel’s attacks.

Res. 259 (Sep. 27, 1968) – Expresses concern for “the safety, welfare and security” of the Palestinians “under military occupation by Israel”, deplores “the delay in the implementation of resolution 237 (1967) because of the conditions still being set by Israel for receiving a Special Representative of the Secretary-General”, and requests Israel to receive the Special Representative and facilitate his work.

Res. 262 (Dec. 31, 1968) – Observes “that the military action by the armed forces of Israel against the civil International Airport of Beirut was premeditated and of a large scale and carefully planned nature”, and condemns Israel for the attack.

Res.265 (Apr. 1, 1969) – Expresses “deep concern that the recent attacks on Jordanian villages and other populated areas were of a pre-planned nature, in violation of resolutions” 248 and 256, “Deplores the loss of civilian life and damage to property”, and “Condemns the recent premeditated air attacks launched by Israel on Jordanian villages and populated areas in flagrant violation of the United Nations Charter and the cease-fire resolutions”.

Res. 267 (Jul. 3, 1969) – Recalls resolution 252 and General Assembly resolutions 2253 and 2254, notes that “since the adoption of the above-mentioned resolutions Israel has taken further measures tending to change the status of the City of Jerusalem”, reaffirms “the established principle that acquisition of territory by military conquest is inadmissible”, “Deplores the failure of Israel to show any regard for the resolutions”, “Censures in the strongest terms all measures taken to change the status of the City of Jerusalem”, “Confirms that all legislative and administrative measures and actions taken by Israel which purport to alter the status of Jerusalem, including expropriation of land and properties thereon, are invalid and cannot change that status”, and urgently calls on Israel to rescind the measures taken to annex Jerusalem.

Res. 270 (Aug. 26, 1969) – “Condemns the premeditated air attack by Israel on villages in southern Lebanon in violation of its obligations under the Charter and Security Council resolutions”.

Res. 271 (Sep. 15, 1969) – Expresses grief “at the extensive damage caused by arson to the Holy Al-Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem” on August 21, 1969 “under the military occupation of Israel”, reaffirms “the established principle that acquisition of territory by military conquest is inadmissible”, “Determines that the execrable act of desecration and profanation of the Holy Al-Aqsa Mosque emphasizes the immediate necessity of Israel’s desisting from acting in violation” previous resolutions and rescinding measures to annex Jerusalem, calls on Israel “to observe the provisions of the Geneva Conventions and international law governing military occupation”, and condemns Israel’s failure to comply with previous resolutions.

Res. 279 (May 12, 1970) – “Demands the immediate withdrawal of all Israeli armed forces from Lebanese territory.”

Res. 280 (May 19, 1970) – Expresses conviction that “that the Israeli military attack against Lebanon was premeditated and of a large scale and carefully planned in nature”, recalls resolution 279 “demanding the immediate withdrawal of all Israeli armed forces from Lebanese territory”, deplores Israel’s violation of resolutions 262 and 270, “Condemns Israel for its premeditated military action in violation of its obligations under the Charter of the United Nations”, and “Deplores the loss of life and damage to property inflicted as a result” of Israeli violations of Security Council resolutions.

Res. 285 (Sep. 5, 1970) – “Demands the complete and immediate withdrawal of all Israeli armed forces from Lebanese territory.”

Res. 298 (Sep. 25, 1971) – Recalls resolutions 252 and 267 and General Assembly resolutions 2253 and 2254 concerning Israel’s measures to annex Jerusalem, reaffirms “the principle that acquisition of territory by military conquest is inadmissible”, notes “the non-compliance by Israel” of the recalled resolutions, deplores Israel’s failure to respect the resolutions, confirms that Israel’s actions “are totally invalid”, and urgently calls on Israel to rescind its measures and take “no further steps in the occupied section of Jerusalem” to change the status of the city.

[moon]

And who is supporting this rogue state which scorns the very institutions which prevent nuclear conflagration ?


Netanyahu: Israel, U.S. to Finalize Military Aid Package in Coming Months
read more: http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.698782

[Minister of Truth]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosewood_massacre


this kind of stuff just doesnt appeal to decent humans in the end

Rosewood is the most exciting medical examiner ever to grace Miami.

[moon]

Rosewood is the most exciting medical examiner ever to grace Miami.

The choices are to either ignore thread-derailing ignorance or to try to discover what drives it. In cases of objections to Israeli excesses the driver is, commonly, desire for the material rewards of such criminality and identification with successful criminals.

[moon]

Netanyahu demands more billions from US after Iran Deal, insults US Envoy, Steals more Land

A former aid to Netanyahu went on Israeli television on Tuesday and put Shapiro down as a yahudon or “little Jew boy,” a deeply offensive epithet used by some far rightwing Israelis to characterize diaspora Jews they view as insufficiently Jewish or insufficiently supportive of Israel.
Then yesterday the Netanyahu government made Shapiro’s point for him by announcing that it will steal 350 acres of Palestinian land near Jericho in the Jordan Valley.
So, to summarize: Netanyahu tried to humiliate the president of the United States by addressing Congress and urging it to overturn Obama’s Iran negotiations. Then when he was defeated he turned around and demanded extra billions in military aid. He and his friends insulted Ambassador Shapiro for daring criticize their vast land thefts and Jewish-only colonial policies in Palestinian territory. Then they barefacedly announced that they are in fact going to steal another 350 acres from Palestinian owners.
Not sure if their shoplifting that land requires that we give them yet more billions.



How can decent people still support these thieves and murderers ?

[moon]

How can decent people still support these thieves and murderers ?


Let me attempt to answer my own question.
OK, so six million Jews were ' liquidated ' by the Nazis of the Third Reich in the 1940s. That disgusting crime against all humanity will never be forgotten. However, the total of victims of that madness is eighteen million. A further twelve million Roma and other minorities were slaughtered. The survivors call this ' The Devouring ', not the ' Holocaust. Who has ever even heard of the Devouring ? Precious few, I dare say, yet it represents twice as many victims as the Holocaust.
Why then is ' our ' sympathy directed only at the Jewish survivors of WW2 - so much so that 'we ' are willing to sit back and applaud while the descendants of the Holocaust survivors act like Nazis against the innocent people whose land was divided and given to Europeans by the victors of WW2 ?
Was it that the Zionists' propaganda machinery was employed to good effect and that Zionists were in positions which enabled them to gain the ears and twist the arms of the leaders of these victors ? It certainly seems that way. Yet it is a fact that the early recorded writings and speeches of the Zionist leadership clearly outline their plans for the brutal ethnic cleansing of Palestinians. Now, this may have been ' under the radar ' of the war-torn Western people of the 1940s - but that's not the case today . The Internet has exposed neoZionism for what it is- a secular doctrine of ethnic cleansing which is preying upon an indigenous people and there is NOTHING- as the OP suggests- remotely ' godly ' about that. ' We' are propaganda victims- and it's high time that we took a realistic moral stand.

[USFREEDOM911]

Let me attempt to answer my own question.
OK, so six million Jews were ' liquidated ' by the Nazis of the Third Reich in the 1940s. That disgusting crime against all humanity will never be forgotten. However, the total of victims of that madness is eighteen million. A further twelve million Roma and other minorities were slaughtered. The survivors call this ' The Devouring ', not the ' Holocaust. Who has ever even heard of the Devouring ? Precious few, I dare say, yet it represents twice as many victims as the Holocaust.
Why then is ' our ' sympathy directed only at the Jewish survivors of WW2 - so much so that 'we ' are willing to sit back and applaud while the descendants of the Holocaust survivors act like Nazis against the innocent people whose land was divided and given to Europeans by the victors of WW2 ?
Was it that the Zionists' propaganda machinery was employed to good effect and that Zionists were in positions which enabled them to gain the ears and twist the arms of the leaders of these victors ? It certainly seems that way. Yet it is a fact that the early recorded writings and speeches of the Zionist leadership clearly outline their plans for the brutal ethnic cleansing of Palestinians. Now, this may have been ' under the radar ' of the war-torn Western people of the 1940s - but that's not the case today . The Internet has exposed neoZionism for what it is- a secular doctrine of ethnic cleansing which is preying upon an indigenous people and there is NOTHING- as the OP suggests- remotely ' godly ' about that. ' We' are propaganda victims- and it's high time that we took a realistic moral stand.


http://images.memes.com/meme/266289

[moon]

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/respawnables/images/4/45/Fool.gif/revision/latest?cb=20151201092454

.....

[moon]

In support of post #220;


Genocide Scholar Blasts Israel's 'Racist' Teaching of the Holocaust
Prof. Yair Auron's thesis is clear: Israel prefers to avoid, repress and minimize the suffering of other peoples in the Holocaust and other circumstances, to perpetuate victimization and isolationism.

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.699749



So let's see all you Israel buffs salute the other twelve million victims whose descendants are NOT ethnic cleansing land thieves and international scoundrels.

[moon]

In support of post #220;



So let's see all you Israel buffs salute the other twelve million victims whose descendants are NOT ethnic cleansing land thieves and international scoundrels.


What ? Not a single word of remembrance for the other twelve million victims of Hitler's ' final solution ' ? Why would that be, do you think ? Could we be witnessing the harmful effects of allowing our media to be controlled by vested interests ?

[Minister of Truth]

In support of post #220;



So let's see all you Israel buffs salute the other twelve million victims whose descendants are NOT ethnic cleansing land thieves and international scoundrels.

Hail Gypsies!

[moon]

There's nothing like a bit of spontaneous compassion for ones fellow man.

Gypsies have contributed hugely to all our cultures, of course, so there really should be some form of commemoration of ' The Devouring '. Nazi criminality goes way beyond the Jewish torment- yet the Holocaust is all we ever hear about. Further, Gypsies are still being persecuted today to a far greater extent than Jews are suffering real and contrived forms of ' antisemitism ' . It's time that the pendulum was in swing again, surely.

[baileyjay]

but you od seem o be pretending all of those people are doing the evil

[Minister of Truth]

There's nothing like a bit of spontaneous compassion for ones fellow man.

Gypsies have contributed hugely to all our cultures, of course, so there really should be some form of commemoration of ' The Devouring '. Nazi criminality goes way beyond the Jewish torment- yet the Holocaust is all we ever hear about. Further, Gypsies are still being persecuted today to a far greater extent than Jews are suffering real and contrived forms of ' antisemitism ' . It's time that the pendulum was in swing again, surely.

I was told once that there's a sizable Gypsy population in Eastern WA. We do have a German town called Leavenworth in Central WA, so that's interesting...


EDIT: I found a NYT article from 1992 about how actions taken by Spokane, WA police in a 1986 incident had gotten the city sued by a Gypsy family. It explains that the Pacific NW is home to a sizable chunk of the US Gypsy population.

http://www.nytimes.com/1992/04/14/us/police-raid-and-suit-open-window-into-gypsy-life.html

[moon]

Demographics can be revealing, even if based partly upon hearsay.

A quick search shows a lot of Gypsy activity in Leavenworth- including Gypsy music, cafes and horse fairs. Never been there. Sounds interesting.

[moon]

but you od seem o be pretending all of those people are doing the evil

Pretending ? Which people ?

[moon]

Almost Half of Israeli Jews Back Transfer or Expulsion of Arabs

About half of Israel’s Jews support the transfer of Arabs to other countries, according to a survey by the American Pew Research Center published Tuesday.

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.707589

It doesn't come across as any sort of a ' godly ' country, does it.

Quid pro quo . Now let's see a survey amongst Israel's Arabs to determine their support for the expulsion and transfer of Jews to other countries.

[moon]

No such survey ? Fancy that.

Now then- I challenge anybody to read the following and not conclude that Israel's chief rabbi is barking mad;


Chief Rabbi Urges Israeli Soldiers to Kill Palestinian Assailants, Not Worry About Court or Chief of Staff


Rabbi Yosef made his statement during a discussion of the question as to whether it is permitted to kill Amalekites, a biblical enemy of the Hebrews, on Shabbat. “On Shabbat you can’t kill Amalek,” he said. “If some terrorist comes to me now, and I know he’s a terrorist, and we caught him. He doesn’t have a knife in his hand, he doesn’t have anything. And I know, Elijah the Prophet will come to me and tell me that he’s from Amalek. Is it permitted to kill him on Shabbat? No. But Elijah the Prophet says that it’s Amalek. Put him in prison, after Shabbat say a blessing and kill him.”
Yosef also said that it’s impossible today to know with certainty that a terrorist belongs to the seed of Amalek, and therefore he shouldn’t be executed that way: “Now, we don’t know if he’s a seed of Amalek until the righteous Messiah comes. Put him in prison, let him get life imprisonment, until the righteous Messiah comes and tells *us if he’s the seed of Amalek - and then we can kill them.”


http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/1.708648

Ask yourself- who was responsible for allowing these people to evict three-quarters of a million indigenous Palestinians and set up camp ? The conclusion of the OP might be a tad theatrical but no sane person could fail to acknowledge that Israel's top religious honchos are loonies.
And what if Palestinians issued an edict that all armed Zionists in Palestine should be killed ? You know what ? We'd be siding with the loonies.

[Ralph]

More Bigotry...from those who state they are seeking "social justice"? Really?

Why Blame "God" for the free will choices of man? The revelations from God make it clear....Man is made in the image of God (in a spiritual manner, as God is a Spirit) via the Specific Reason that only man out of all God's creation has the innate ability to reason his/her own mortality and make judgement's that are either Good or Evil in nature.

God made man in His own imagine and gave mankind dominion over the earth and all the creatures that dwell on it, on it or under it, Birds, Fish, Animals, over the land itself....man was ordered to reproduce until such time as he had subdued it. (Genesis 1:27-28). Man was separated from God because of the free will choices he made, and brought physical death to mankind...but the power of God still rests within man, THE POWER TO JUDGE and MAKE DECISIONS concerning and effecting not only himself but others, either Good or Evil.

"Then the Lord God said, "Behold the man has become like one of us, to know good and evil......" Genesis 3:22-24.

Thus....man is to blame for his/her own choices, NOT GOD. And FYI...it was the United Nations that created the modern nation calling itself Israel (in name only)...NOT GOD. Biblical Israel was destroyed "never to be made whole again." As God promised to destroy Israel or allow it to be destroyed if it ever disobeyed the righteousness of God's commandments (Lev. 26:27-39), they would be driven from the land of promise (Deut. 4:25-28).

THEY WOULD CEASE TO BE A NATION (Deut. 8:19-20)

Some claim that God promised the land to Israel for ever and are still awaiting for God to Keep His Promise. Never mind the fact that the Scriptures declare the truth, God Fulfilled ALL THE LAND PROMISES in their entirety, "So the Lord gave to Israel all the land which He had sworn to give to their fathers, and they took possession of it and dwelt in it. The Lord gave them rest all, around, according to all that He had sworn to their fathers.......NOT A WORD FAILED ANY GOOD THING WHICH THE LORD HAD SPOKEN TO THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL. ALL CAME TO PASS." -- Joshua 21:43-45.

Indeed God promised the land with a covenant...but, that promise had exceptions, the land would be Israel's forever "IF" Israel remained loyal to God. God had longsuffering and mercy. He allowed some to return to the land...another chance, but Israel would never be whole again, like a broken potters jar, there would always be pieces missing. (Jer. 19:7-13). It was in such a fractured nature that the Christ was born into this world....and when Israel rejected the promised Messiah.....they were totally destroyed in the 1st century. It was promised "forever" as long Israel obeyed God "....be careful to seek out all the commandments of the Lord your God...that you may possess the GOOD LAND....and leave it as an inheritance to your children." -- 1 Chron. 28:8

Israel did not and God kept His promise, "....but if you Forsake Him....He will cast you out forever." -- 1 Chron. 28:9

Jerusalem fell to the Roman Empire in 70AD. And was gone for over 2000 years. Until the United Nations allowed the creation of another nation calling itself ISRAEL...but living by none of the guidelines established by God and given to Moses. Today's Israel is governed by Man Made Laws. Biblical Israel was governed by a King appointed by God. Modern Israel is ruled by a type of European government. Biblical Israel had a royal Priesthood...Modern Israel does not. Modern Israel has no Tribal IDs as did Biblical Israel.

Do I support modern Israel? Of course...but not because of some mistranslated type of reasoning declaring they are God's Chosen People. I support them because they are a US ALLY surrounded in a sea of 14th century ignorance and despotism.

[moon]

The neoZionists have plenty of '14th century ignorance and despotism' of their own;


Jewish Activists Arrested Trying to Enter Temple Mount for Banned Passover Sacrifice

Kach activist Noam Federman, who tries to perform sacrifice on the Temple Mount every year, among the arrested.

http://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-1.716008

These throwbacks were trying to sacrifice baby goats.

' Kach ' is, of course, a neoZionist terrorist organization which, among many other neoZionist terrorist groups, is proscribed by the US State Department;


From Presidential Executive Order 13224: "Blocking Property and Prohibiting Transactions With Persons Who Commit, Threaten to Commit, Or Support Terrorism." (Sept. 2001)

Kach; Kahane; Kahane Chai; Kahane Lives
American Friends Of The United Yeshiva
American Friends Of Yeshivat Rav Meir
Committee For The Safety Of The Roads
Dikuy Bogdim
Dov
Forefront Of The Idea
Friends Of The Jewish Idea Yeshiva
Jewish Idea Yeshiva
Jewish Legion
Judea Police
Judean Congress
Kahane Tzadak
Kfar Tapuah Fund
Koach
Meir's Youth
New Kach Movement (New York chapter)
No'ar Meir
Repression Of Traitors
State Of Judea
Sword Of David
The Committee Against Racism And Discrimination (CARD)
The Hatikva Jewish Identity Center
The International Kahane Movement
The Jewish Idea Yeshiva
The Judean Legion
The Judean Voice; The Voice of Judea
The Qomemiyut Movement
The Rabbi Meir David Kahane Memorial Fund
The Way Of The Torah
The Yeshiva Of The Jewish Idea
Yeshivat Harav Meir

[moon]

Do I support modern Israel? Of course...but not because of some mistranslated type of reasoning declaring they are God's Chosen People. I support them because they are a US ALLY surrounded in a sea of 14th century ignorance and despotism.

In the light of the evidence provided you support neoZionism because you're conditioned to support neoZionism.
In the light of the evidence of neoZionist theft, brutality, ethnic cleansing and murder neoZionism has no respectability and cannot qualify for rational support- so conditioning it must be.

[Lumberjack]

How could a just God allow such an injustice to occur? Israel is proof of the inherent evil and barbarism of man, that people with power will take whatever they want from whomever they want, that there is no such thing as justice, that, as Thucydides put it 2000 years ago, "Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must."

By that reasoning, America is proof there is no God.

[moon]

By that reasoning, America is proof there is no God.

I repeat post #6


The nearest that we've come to divine justice is international law as described by the United Nations. Israel is most certainly a pariah under international law so, in those terms, you make a good point. Why- every believer in law should be asking- do we continually suffer the transgressions of America's scurrilous client state ?

In the sense of there being no 'divine justice ' manifested through the application of international law then yes, you're correct in pointing out America's part in obstructing justice when it comes to its client state. So you could say that Israel's and the USA's obstruction of international law proves that democracy cannot provide justice and so both are equally guilty of contributing to a godless world order.
It's time for change, isn't it.

[Alter2Ego]

How could a just God allow such an injustice to occur? Israel is proof of the inherent evil and barbarism of man, that people with power will take whatever they want from whomever they want, that there is no such thing as justice, that, as Thucydides put it 2000 years ago, "Right, as the world goes, is only in question between equals in power, while the strong do what they will and the weak suffer what they must."

If the mere existence of Israel is your proof there is no God, you will have to do better than that if you expect to convince any reasonable person. Particularly since the entire earth is over-run by rebellious humans committing wrongdoing against one another.

And since you claim there is no God, suppose you explain to the rest of us why our universe is fine-tuned for life. Are you suggesting that that happened by itself?


Alter2Ego


________________
"That people may know that you, whose name is JEHOVAH, you alone are the Most High over all the earth." ~ Psalms 83:18

[Leonthecat]

If the mere existence of Israel is your proof there is no God, you will have to do better than that if you expect to convince any reasonable person. Particularly since the entire earth is over-run by rebellious humans committing wrongdoing against one another.

And since you claim there is no God, suppose you explain to the rest of us why our universe is fine-tuned for life. Are you suggesting that that happened by itself?


Alter2Ego


________________


Yes. And you are insane

[iolo]

'Israel' is a profoundly evil state, but there have been lots of them over history, many of them worshipping evil gods. It seems to me that the God question and the question of why racist scumbags manage to gain power are very different, and the second is at least answerable

[moon]

'Israel' is a profoundly evil state, but there have been lots of them over history, many of them worshipping evil gods.

None have survived- and Israel will be no exception. The life-span of supposedly ' evil ' regimes is dependent upon the rulers' ability to shape and dominate the mindset of its populations. This was far easier in the past when rulers could offer booty and territory to those who followed orders but it is a great deal more difficult in today's age of mass communications.
Israel today still attempts to offer booty and territory to its followers- indeed even Americans go to Israel to become part of the squatter movement in the hope of such rewards- but all of Israel's activities are being monitored by the rest of the world. In order for Israel to succeed the rest of the world would have to agree that such practices were acceptable. While some might think that expansion and pillage are not such bad ideas the thought of it actually happening to THEM serves as deterrent enough to ensure that the concept of a world-wide MORAL body will endure.
Rat-finks beware.