PDA

View Full Version : Israel Kidnaps Palestinian Politicians



AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 03:59 AM
Israeli forces have seized Palestinian Deputy Prime Minister Nasser al-Shaer in a raid on his home in the West Bank town of Ramallah.
He was held when troops burst into the house early on Saturday, his wife said.

The Israeli military confirmed the detention of Mr Shaer, who is a senior member of the governing Hamas movement, which does not recognise Israel.

Israel has detained about 30 MPs and a third of the cabinet since the capture of an Israeli soldier in June.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5265792.stm

Does this give the Palestinians the right to invade Israel, attack civilians and civilian infrastructure and attempt to impliment a policy of ethnic cleasning inside Israel?

Let's hear it for Israeli terrorism...whooop! whooop!

uscitizen
08-21-2006, 07:53 AM
Invading and kidnapping a countrys leaders ? Who appears to be the terrorists here ?

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 08:12 AM
Invading and kidnapping a countrys leaders ? Who appears to be the terrorists here ?

You see my point about them both being terrorists?

It is shocking that so many support such terrorism on one side and decry it on another

toby
08-21-2006, 08:12 AM
There is no country of Palestine, they rejected all offers for a country. Hamas is a terrorist organization. Israel is a sovergn country. But they may be willing to trade this guy to get thier citizens back.

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 08:16 AM
There is no country of Palestine, they rejected all offers for a country. Hamas is a terrorist organization. Israel is a sovergn country. But they may be willing to trade this guy to get thier citizens back.

The PA is a soveriegn democratically elected government.

Who'd have thought toby would be so anti-democratic and pro-terrorist???? :)

Isn't this sort of snatching (that time of Israelis) what kicked this whole thing off?

Gaffer
08-21-2006, 08:18 AM
Invading what country? There is no country of palestine. hamas is a terrorist organization and any members of it are subject to arrest or death. Israel can use this clown to get their soldier back. I know you have no concerns for the 19 year old kid they took. Your more concerned with the old terrorist leader and his well being.

toby
08-21-2006, 08:29 AM
Any are your confusing Hamas and the Hezbos? I am pro democratic and anti terrorist. The pali had a chance given to them by Clinton and they spit in his face, Bush first president to publicly state he would support a Pali state, and helped them with elections and they turned towards terror. They prove where they stand.

Damocles
08-21-2006, 08:33 AM
Let me see. If I were wanted by the Feds, I then got elected to the State Senate. The Feds then came in and took me into custody and imprisoned me...

Would I be "kidnapped" or "arrested"?

uscitizen
08-21-2006, 08:37 AM
Invading what country? There is no country of palestine. hamas is a terrorist organization and any members of it are subject to arrest or death. Israel can use this clown to get their soldier back. I know you have no concerns for the 19 year old kid they took. Your more concerned with the old terrorist leader and his well being.
Hmm I guess you forget about bush and his minions bragging about the democratic elections ? Well they were bragging until they realized how they turned out.

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 08:38 AM
Invading what country? There is no country of palestine. hamas is a terrorist organization and any members of it are subject to arrest or death. Israel can use this clown to get their soldier back. I know you have no concerns for the 19 year old kid they took. Your more concerned with the old terrorist leader and his well being.

Pathos-laden 'arguments' don't work on me.

I decry terrorism on both sides. I don't turn a blind eye to one groups terrorism just because I like them.

Hamas are the democratically elected government of the PA.

You obviously aren't too picky about former terrorists forming governments given your support for the Israeli government (or maybe you are unaware of the number of Israeli leaders who came from terrorist groups such as the Stern gang?)

So why don't you get on the side of democracy and anti-terrorism and denounce terrorism on both sides? [/B]

uscitizen
08-21-2006, 08:39 AM
Let me see. If I were wanted by the Feds, I then got elected to the State Senate. The Feds then came in and took me into custody and imprisoned me...

Would I be "kidnapped" or "arrested"?

Lets take this accross country borders Damocles. Say you were elected to the mexican govt and supported illegal immigration, the US govt went down and got you and took you back to the USA. This is more the scenario.

toby
08-21-2006, 08:42 AM
I don't think anyone is forgetting about the elections. The Palis choose terror, and will have to live with that choice as best they can. That is why we should cut all support for them. Don't feed them anymore. The elections were a good thing, they have shown how they believe. We need to take that into account when we deal with them.

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 08:50 AM
Let me see. If I were wanted by the Feds, I then got elected to the State Senate. The Feds then came in and took me into custody and imprisoned me...

Would I be "kidnapped" or "arrested"?

If the Israeli's entered the Palestinian Authority area to snatch members of the democratically elected government (30 of them) then that is kidnapping.

A better analogy would be the government of Canada snatching members of Congress because they don't like US government policy.

Damocles
08-21-2006, 08:50 AM
Lets take this accross country borders Damocles. Say you were elected to the mexican govt and supported illegal immigration, the US govt went down and got you and took you back to the USA. This is more the scenario.
The problem is it isn't accross international borders. The Palestinian Territory still is controlled by the Isreali Government...

This is more like a Fed/State issue than it is like a Mexican Government/US Government issue.

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 08:51 AM
The Palis choose terror,

Actually, before Israel kicked off this time, senior members of Hamas were meeting to discuss accepting the two state solution....

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 08:52 AM
The problem is it isn't accross international borders. The Palestinian Territory still is controlled by the Isreali Government...

It is controlled by the PA.

Damocles
08-21-2006, 08:54 AM
Let me see. If I were wanted by the Feds, I then got elected to the State Senate. The Feds then came in and took me into custody and imprisoned me...

Would I be "kidnapped" or "arrested"?

If the Israeli's entered the Palestinian Authority area to snatch members of the democratically elected government (30 of them) then that is kidnapping.

A better analogy would be the government of Canada snatching members of Congress because they don't like US government policy.
Once again, incorrect. Canada is actually a Nation and not in official control of the US territory...

Now, if we are to use this example it would be more like... I went up to Canada, bombed the crap out of a few buildings then returned to the US to hide. I then got elected to some sort of "government" over a territory not controlled by the US, formerly controlled by Canada, directly connected to Canada, that had as it's sole goal the total destruction of Canada... I then resurfaced to take my place of government. Is it "kidnapping", or an "arrest"?

Damocles
08-21-2006, 08:55 AM
It's the same thing with the "Hamas kidnapped a soldier"...

Rubbish he was taken prisoner by an enemy... It happens all the time to soldiers.

uscitizen
08-21-2006, 08:56 AM
Ahh the real threat of peace, really scary to the Israeli.

toby
08-21-2006, 09:34 AM
Hamas stated goal is to elimante the state of Israel. What's to talk about?

Sir Evil
08-21-2006, 09:39 AM
Israel kidnaps Palestinian Politicians

:lolup: :lolup: :lolup:

Don't even go an claim these politicians as the hamas leaders that were arrested! I don't even need to read the article and already I am seeing another shitbrick post!

what a bunch of mooks!

uscitizen
08-21-2006, 09:43 AM
Of course Shrivel, what do you expect ?

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 09:44 AM
Once again, incorrect. Canada is actually a Nation and not in official control of the US territory...

Israel isn't in official control of the Palestinian territories. It's occupation is not ratified anywhere and it's occupation is deemed illegal by the world community.

Israel isn't in charge of Palestine just because they conduct incursions there.

The equivilent would be Canada occupying NY state, illegally, snatching the state gov and admin and holding them.

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 09:50 AM
Israel kidnaps Palestinian Politicians

:lolup: :lolup: :lolup:

Don't even go an claim these politicians as the hamas leaders that were arrested! I don't even need to read the article and already I am seeing another shitbrick post!

what a bunch of mooks!

Stunning answer. "Gaffaw, I don't even need to answer that, I can just rely on my dislike of them there damn A-rabs! YeeeeeHaaaw!"

Damocles
08-21-2006, 09:52 AM
Once again, incorrect. Canada is actually a Nation and not in official control of the US territory...

Israel isn't in official control of the Palestinian territories. It's occupation is not ratified anywhere and it's occupation is deemed illegal by the world community.

Israel isn't in charge of Palestine just because they conduct incursions there.

The equivilent would be Canada occupying NY state, illegally, snatching the state gov and admin and holding them.
Hence in my description I stated "Formerly In Control of"... As well as "Not a Nation"...

Either way it isn't "kidnapped".. Somebody who is supposedly so specific about properly defining words is attempting to spin Propaganda...

I expect better of you. I don't know why, time and again you prove that you don't actually read responses to your posts.

AnyOldIron
08-21-2006, 09:58 AM
Hence in my description I stated "Formerly In Control of"... As well as "Not a Nation"...

Either way it isn't "kidnapped".. Somebody who is supposedly so specific about properly defining words is attempting to spin Propaganda...

I expect better of you. I don't know why, time and again you prove that you don't actually read responses to your posts.

An entity without authority snatching people and holding them against their will..... That's kidnapping, not arrest. The difference between kidnapping and arrest is authority.

Irrespective of the nature of the person being taken, whether we like them or not, the IDF have no authority to enter the PA territories and take people.

Sir Evil
08-21-2006, 09:58 AM
Stunning answer. "Gaffaw, I don't even need to answer that, I can just rely on my dislike of them there damn A-rabs! YeeeeeHaaaw!"

Well tell me how you can be a elected official as well as a militia man supported by another country? don't make too much sense does it? well then again by the posting of the majority of you shitbricks around here I guess it would.

Now pull the oldiron out of the keester, and start swinging like a man!

Damocles
08-21-2006, 10:18 AM
Hence in my description I stated "Formerly In Control of"... As well as "Not a Nation"...

Either way it isn't "kidnapped".. Somebody who is supposedly so specific about properly defining words is attempting to spin Propaganda...

I expect better of you. I don't know why, time and again you prove that you don't actually read responses to your posts.

An entity without authority snatching people and holding them against their will..... That's kidnapping, not arrest. The difference between kidnapping and arrest is authority.

Irrespective of the nature of the person being taken, whether we like them or not, the IDF have no authority to enter the PA territories and take people.
I think it is "war". The entity the man belongs to is at war with their nation. "kidnap" is not a proper term when one is taken in war. It is "taken Prisoner"... but "kidnap"... That's a silly propaganda term, just as it was for the Israelis with their soldier. He was taken prisoner, not kidnapped.

uscitizen
08-21-2006, 10:43 AM
I think it is "war". The entity the man belongs to is at war with their nation. "kidnap" is not a proper term when one is taken in war. It is "taken Prisoner"... but "kidnap"... That's a silly propaganda term, just as it was for the Israelis with their soldier. He was taken prisoner, not kidnapped.
//

Agreed. but Israel and the USA want to have their cake and eat it too. We are not officially at war but the W word is used all the time.

Damocles
08-21-2006, 10:52 AM
I think it is "war". The entity the man belongs to is at war with their nation. "kidnap" is not a proper term when one is taken in war. It is "taken Prisoner"... but "kidnap"... That's a silly propaganda term, just as it was for the Israelis with their soldier. He was taken prisoner, not kidnapped.
//

Agreed. but Israel and the USA want to have their cake and eat it too. We are not officially at war but the W word is used all the time.
This is because of the "War Powers Act"...

However, that has little to do with the fact that Israel is and has been at war with terrorist groups for a long time. Taking a soldier prisoner is not "kidnapping"... They are taken prisoner not kidnapped. That word is used to specifically make it seem more "Evil"...

toby
08-21-2006, 10:57 AM
Seems we always get to playing word games and ignoring the events. Typical liberal agenda. What is the defination of IS?

toby
08-21-2006, 11:01 AM
Israel usually just kills the Hamas leaders, this one they (kidnapped, abducted, took hostage, arrested, retained, detained, etc) Wonder why?

Damocles
08-21-2006, 11:09 AM
Israel usually just kills the Hamas leaders, this one they (kidnapped, abducted, took hostage, arrested, retained, detained, etc) Wonder why?
To make a more even trade. They'll give him back for their two soldiers.

toby
08-21-2006, 11:15 AM
These trades show the value of life by each side. For each jew the terrorist give up they usually get a couple hundred terrorist back. Last time they got back a hundred terrorist for a couple of dead jews!

Damocles
08-21-2006, 11:26 AM
These trades show the value of life by each side. For each jew the terrorist give up they usually get a couple hundred terrorist back. Last time they got back a hundred terrorist for a couple of dead jews!
Hence taking a more important hostage to get their soldiers back. They don't wish to release a ton of prisoners.

At least that is my opinion of what is happening here.

AnyOldIron
08-22-2006, 01:29 AM
If Israel act in the same manner as Hizbollah, what is the difference between them?

uscitizen
08-22-2006, 08:31 AM
That is the real question isn't it Anyold. You see where the end justifies the means mentality gets you ?

uscitizen
08-22-2006, 08:32 AM
And after all the Jews did pretty much spawn the tradition of terrorist bombing in the middle east.

Hermes Thoth
03-03-2007, 08:07 AM
Israeli forces have seized Palestinian Deputy Prime Minister Nasser al-Shaer in a raid on his home in the West Bank town of Ramallah.
He was held when troops burst into the house early on Saturday, his wife said.

The Israeli military confirmed the detention of Mr Shaer, who is a senior member of the governing Hamas movement, which does not recognise Israel.

Israel has detained about 30 MPs and a third of the cabinet since the capture of an Israeli soldier in June.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5265792.stm

Does this give the Palestinians the right to invade Israel, attack civilians and civilian infrastructure and attempt to impliment a policy of ethnic cleasning inside Israel?

Let's hear it for Israeli terrorism...whooop! whooop!

See, when you're The Chosen People, the rules do not apply to you. Stupid goy.