PDA

View Full Version : Survivalism: harmless hobby or paranoid fear?



Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 08:00 AM
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e5/SurvivalUnderAtomicAttack.jpg





Survivalism is a movement of individuals or groups (called survivalists or preppers) who are actively preparing (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_management) for emergencies as well as possible disruptions in social or political order, on scales ranging from local to international. Survivalists often have emergency medical and self-defence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-defence) training, stockpile food and water, prepare for self-sufficiency (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-sufficiency), and build structures that will help them survive or "disappear" (e.g. a survival retreat (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retreat_%28survivalism%29) or underground shelter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blast_shelter)).

Anticipated disruptions include the following:


Clusters of natural disasters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_disaster), patterns of apocalyptic planetary crises, or Earth Changes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth_Changes) (tornadoes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tornado), hurricanes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane), earthquakes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthquake), blizzards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blizzard), solar storms (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_storm), severe thunderstorms (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunderstorm))
A disaster (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_man-made_disasters) caused by the activities of humankind (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anthropogenic_behavior) (chemical (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chemical) spills, release of radioactive (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioactive) materials, nuclear (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_war) or conventional war (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conventional_war), oppressive governments)
The general collapse of society (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Societal_collapse) caused by the shortage (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shortage) or unavailability of resources such as electricity, fuel, food, or water
Financial disruption or economic collapse (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_collapse) (caused by monetary manipulation, hyperinflation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperinflation), deflation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deflation), or depression (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depression_%28economics%29))
A global pandemic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandemic)
Widespread chaos or some other unexplained apocalyptic (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypse) event



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivalism


Discuss...

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 04:05 PM
There are countless situations that can arise that a bit of planning can help a great deal. Post natural disastors are one that comes to mind. After a major disastor, the predators and scavengers come out of the woodwork like roaches. Being able to provide your family with food, clean water, first aid, and physical protection falls into your lap. The authorities will not be of any help for possibly weeks or longer.

I do not understand why people ridicule or even fear preppers. If they are planning for something that will not happen, why does anyone care? If something does happen and you are depending on the authorities to help you, why not be glad there are those who won't be adding to the number of people needing assistance?

It seems, at worst, a harmless hobby. Much better than some hobbies that seem totally socially acceptable.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 06:15 PM
There are countless situations that can arise that a bit of planning can help a great deal. Post natural disastors are one that comes to mind. After a major disastor, the predators and scavengers come out of the woodwork like roaches. Being able to provide your family with food, clean water, first aid, and physical protection falls into your lap. The authorities will not be of any help for possibly weeks or longer. I do not understand why people ridicule or even fear preppers. If they are planning for something that will not happen, why does anyone care? If something does happen and you are depending on the authorities to help you, why not be glad there are those who won't be adding to the number of people needing assistance? It seems, at worst, a harmless hobby. Much better than some hobbies that seem totally socially acceptable.

Thanks for your input.

Who said they "fear" survivalists?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 06:20 PM
Thanks for your input.

Who said they "fear" survivalists?

I did. I am the only other person who posted here.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 06:35 PM
I did. I am the only other person who posted here.

So you fear survivalists?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 06:44 PM
So you fear survivalists?

Did I say I am afraid of them?

But yes, I do believe some people fear preppers.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 06:50 PM
Did I say I am afraid of them? But yes, I do believe some people fear preppers.

When I asked who said they fear survivalists, you replied...


I did. I am the only other person who posted here.

Damocles
06-09-2012, 06:59 PM
There is, quite literally, a 100% chance of something happening that will cause distress to human survival on this planet. Will we be prepared as a specie? Maybe, if we're lucky enough that it comes far future.

Until the time we are prepared to deal with such a disaster as could come from any number of different avenues survivalists ensure the survival of our specie.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:01 PM
There is, quite literally, a 100% chance of something happening that will cause distress to human survival on this planet. Will we be prepared as a specie? Maybe, if we're lucky enough that it comes far future. Until the time we are prepared to deal with such a disaster as could come survivalists ensure the survival of humanity should it happen before we are prepared.

So survivalism is a harmless hobby?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 07:05 PM
When I asked who said they fear survivalists, you replied...

Yes. I have said, more than once in this thread, that I believe some people fear preppers.

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 07:07 PM
So survivalism is a harmless hobby?

I believe it is prudent planning.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:13 PM
Yes. I have said, more than once in this thread, that I believe some people fear preppers.

So when I asked "who said they fear survivalists", and you replied "I did", what you really meant was that somebody else does?

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:13 PM
I believe it is prudent planning.

So it's harmless?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 07:20 PM
So when I asked "who said they fear survivalists", and you replied "I did", what you really meant was that somebody else does?

I certainly did. I said that people fear the preppers.

Damocles
06-09-2012, 07:20 PM
So survivalism is a harmless hobby?

It is a necessity, whether you want to mock them or not they are the ones that will survive if the stuff hits the fan before we are ready to deal with it. It's a repeating meme, shoot even humanity has suffered a near extinction in our short existence on this planet.

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 07:21 PM
So it's harmless?

It can be. It can also be an obsession. And it can be a sources of serious financial drain.

But, for the most part, preppers are harmless. Like anyone else.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:26 PM
I certainly did. I said that people fear the preppers.

Looks like you said "I did" when I asked who said they fear survivalists....so, who said they fear survivalists, since you now deny having said that you do?

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:29 PM
It is a necessity, whether you want to mock them or not they are the ones that will survive if the stuff hits the fan before we are ready to deal with it.

Did I say I want to mock them? Tell me more about your ability to foretell the future....


It's a repeating meme, shoot even humanity has suffered a near extinction in our short existence on this planet.

Humanity has suffered a near extinction in our short existence on this planet?

When was that?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 07:33 PM
Looks like you said "I did" when I asked who said they fear survivalists....so, who said they fear survivalists, since you now deny having said that you do?

I admitted saying that I said that people fear preppers. I have not changed what I said. Perhaps I misunderstood the question or you misunderstood the answer.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:43 PM
I admitted saying that I said that people fear preppers. I have not changed what I said. Perhaps I misunderstood the question or you misunderstood the answer.

I asked this:


Thanks for your input. Who said they "fear" survivalists?

You replied:


I did. I am the only other person who posted here.

Can you explain how I "misunderstood the answer"?

SmarterthanYou
06-09-2012, 07:43 PM
of course some people fear preppers. they also ridicule them because of that fear. It's simple cowardice on their part though. it's a self fulfilling prophecy of death though, considering the last multiple page thread about preppers. some nanny staters feel it's stupid to 'prep' for anything more than 3 weeks because the government will have everything resolved by then, or at least they'll be out taking care of their children citizens. And if they aren't, some think it will be a simple thing to either take the preppers supplies and share them among the populace, or kill them if they refuse to share.

Damocles
06-09-2012, 07:45 PM
Did I say I want to mock them? Tell me more about your ability to foretell the future....

Your OP is openly mocking, and it has nothing to do with "telling the future". It is simple reality. Something will come, a supercaldera, a comet, disease, scientific accident...

If we are not ready to deal with it technologically these people will survive while those of us who are not survivalists will not.



Humanity has suffered a near extinction in our short existence on this planet?

When was that?

Here is a link you should read: http://io9.com/5501565/extinction-events-that-almost-wiped-out-humans

Roughly 70,000 years ago, give or take a few thousand years, an enormous eruption occurred in what is now Sumatra, leaving behind Lake Toba (the crater lake pictured above). The eruption coincides with a population bottleneck that is often cited as the reason for the relatively low genetic diversity across Homo sapiens sapiens. Research suggests as few as 2,000 humans (actual homo sapiens) were left alive by the eruption and its aftereffects.

2,000 total humans on the planet after one volcanic eruption... and that is just one of the events. Earlier events nearly killed off the Homo genus several times. If any one of them caused full extinction rather than just a population bottleneck (that one with 2,000 humans is one of epic proportions), we would not exist today.

I watched it on the Smithsonian Channel a while back, some show with Hawking stating that the only way to ensure our survival is to spread humanity to more than one solar system.

However events like this one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permian%E2%80%93Triassic_extinction_event) happen, pretending they don't exist is just foolish. That particular event linked there killed of 90% of all animal and plant life on the planet...

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:45 PM
of course some people fear preppers. they also ridicule them because of that fear. It's simple cowardice on their part though. it's a self fulfilling prophecy of death though, considering the last multiple page thread about preppers. some nanny staters feel it's stupid to 'prep' for anything more than 3 weeks because the government will have everything resolved by then, or at least they'll be out taking care of their children citizens. And if they aren't, some think it will be a simple thing to either take the preppers supplies and share them among the populace, or kill them if they refuse to share.

Can you explain how you "know" these things?

SmarterthanYou
06-09-2012, 07:48 PM
Can you explain how you "know" these things?
it's called psychology. knowing how and why some people think. it's not that difficult if one likes to study things other than their chosen field of expertise.

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 07:48 PM
I asked this:



You replied:



Can you explain how I "misunderstood the answer"?

Is you misunderstanding my answer the only option?

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 07:56 PM
Your OP is openly mocking, and it has nothing to do with "telling the future".

Mocking? How so?


It is simple reality. Something will come, a supercaldera, a comet, disease, scientific accident...

Or global warming?


If we are not ready to deal with it technologically these people will survive while those of us who are not survivalists will not.

So you can foretell the future.


Here is a link you should read: http://io9.com/5501565/extinction-events-that-almost-wiped-out-humans

Thanks, I will.


Roughly 70,000 years ago, give or take a few thousand years, an enormous eruption occurred in what is now Sumatra, leaving behind Lake Toba (the crater lake pictured above). The eruption coincides with a population bottleneck that is often cited as the reason for the relatively low genetic diversity across Homo sapiens sapiens. Research suggests as few as 2,000 humans (actual homo sapiens) were left alive by the eruption and its aftereffects.

Research? Not the Bible?


2,000 total humans on the planet after one volcanic eruption... and that is just one of the events.

Was there an official count?

Say, don't some people think Noah and crew were the only survivors of a great flood?

Were they survivalists?


I watched it on the Smithsonian Channel a while back, some show with Hawking stating that the only way to ensure our survival is to spread humanity to more than one solar system.

Send me a postcard when you get there, will you?


However events like this one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permian%E2%80%93Triassic_extinction_event) happen, pretending they don't exist is just foolish. That particular even linked there killed of 90% of all animal and plant life on the planet...

So you live in fear?

Care to explain how some beans and bottled water combined with guns n' ammo will stave off a world-ending event?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 08:04 PM
Care to explain how some beans and bottled water combined with guns n' ammo will stave off a world-ending event?

So have some extra beans, bottled water, guns, and ammo is all it takes to be a prepper? Sounds like some unprepared preppers.

But, by having stored food, water, and a means of protecting yourself, you can survive when most others will not. The "world ending" events described in the link did not kill everything on the planet. Those with proper preparations and skills can survive when those who have no skills and preparations will die.

Not difficult to understand.

Damocles
06-09-2012, 08:09 PM
Mocking? How so?
Right. You didn't mean that then... :rolleyes:




Or global warming?

Maybe.



So you can foretell the future.

You are clearly symptomatic of RCDD. This is like telling you that someday everybody we know will be dead. It is simply true and has nothing to do with prognostication.



Thanks, I will.


You're welcome.



Research? Not the Bible?

Reminder for the RCDD sufferers with memory malfunctions. I'm a Buddhist.



Was there an official count?

First, are you admitting that you didn't read the article? And are you saying that scientific method isn't good enough for you?



Say, don't some people think Noah and crew were the only survivors of a great flood?

Again, Buddhist here.



Were they survivalists?


If the story were true then I guess they must be.



Send me a postcard when you get there, will you?
You are now being purposefully stupid. I don't know why you would want to do that.




So you live in fear?

Nope. But the temporary nature of current reality is a large part of Buddhism. I don't live in fear any more than somebody else who can tell you that someday I will die. It is simply true.



Care to explain how some beans and bottled water combined with guns n' ammo will stave off a world-ending event?

Are you going to continue to pretend you are not mocking here?

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 08:09 PM
Is you misunderstanding my answer the only option?

You included it here:


I admitted saying that I said that people fear preppers. I have not changed what I said. Perhaps I misunderstood the question or you misunderstood the answer.

Now, did I misunderstand your answer ("I did") when I asked who said they fear survivalists?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 08:12 PM
You included it here:



Now, did I misunderstand your answer ("I did") when I asked who said they fear survivalists?

You are dancing around again. Did I give you only one option or two? You seem to think the only option is that you did not understand my answer. If that is true, we are fine. However, it was not the only option I listed. Further discussion of so trivial a matter seems like a waste of time.

Damocles
06-09-2012, 08:12 PM
You included it here:



Now, did I misunderstand your answer ("I did") when I asked who said they fear survivalists?

He answered, "I said they fear survivalists."

I can't read it to you any slower than that, so just read it slowly. Sometimes people with RCDD need to mouth the words.. Some even have to whisper while they read.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 08:22 PM
Right. You didn't mean that then...

So you admit you had no reason to say I was engaged in mockery. Thanks.


You're welcome.


This is like telling you that someday everybody we know will be dead. It is simply true and has nothing to do with prognostication.

If we'll all be dead, then how will survivalists keep living?


I'm a Buddhist.

Your signature line proudly proclaims your belief system. Are you having doubts?


Are you saying that scientific method isn't good enough for you?

Did I say that?


Again, Buddhist here.

Do you have to remind yourself frequently?


If the story were true then I guess they must be.

So Buddhists believe the literal truth of the Bible?


You are now being purposefully stupid. I don't know why you would want to do that.

Perhaps because I'm not, and wouldn't.


Are you going to continue to pretend you are not mocking here?

Wow, maybe you should resume smoking. You just admitted you had no basis for saying that, didn't you?

Damocles
06-09-2012, 08:31 PM
So you admit you had no reason to say I was engaged in mockery. Thanks.
Incorrect. And yet another sign that you have RCDD.


If we'll all be dead, then how will survivalists keep living?

Wow. Do you think we'll not have children... who later will also die, after most have children? Or do you believe that you will somehow live for eternity unlike every other human who came before?


Your signature line proudly proclaims your belief system. Are you having doubts?

No.


Did I say that?

Read the article it tells you how they come up with the figure. You can also do more research into the event.


Do you have to remind yourself frequently?

Apparently I have to remind you frequently.


So Buddhists believe the literal truth of the Bible?

RCDD again. Do you know what the word "if" means?


Perhaps because I'm not, and wouldn't.
Then it is accidental stupidity? I don't care which, the result is the same.


Wow, maybe you should resume smoking. You just admitted you had no basis for saying that, didn't you?
No, I did not.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 08:35 PM
it's called psychology. knowing how and why some people think. it's not that difficult if one likes to study things other than their chosen field of expertise.

You should get together with Damocles. He keeps referring to something called 'RCDD'.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 08:42 PM
He answered, "I said they fear survivalists." I can't read it to you any slower than that, so just read it slowly. Sometimes people with RCDD need to mouth the words.. Some even have to whisper while they read.


Thanks for your input.

Who said they "fear" survivalists?


I did. I am the only other person who posted here.

You stand corrected.

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 08:59 PM
I admitted saying that I said that people fear preppers. I have not changed what I said. Perhaps I misunderstood the question or you misunderstood the answer.

Now, in this post (to which you keep referring), did I give you only one option for what happened? Is you misunderstanding the ONLY option listed here?

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 09:16 PM
Now, in this post (to which you keep referring), did I give you only one option for what happened? Is you misunderstanding the ONLY option listed here?

What did I misunderstand?

I asked "who said they fear survivalists" and you replied "I did".

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 09:21 PM
What did I misunderstand?



Did I say the only possibility what that you misunderstood? So far you seem bound and determined that it is.

Perhaps you could reread it one more time and grasp the meaning of what I said.


But that is just more trivial diversion. The fact is, I am not afraid of preppers. But some people ARE afraid of preppers. The fact that most preppers have guns means that some people are scared of them.

But the preppers are just people who think having homeowners insurance, fire extinguishers and a few smoke alarms is not enough. So they take it upon themselves to be prepared for disastors, whatever their origins might be.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 09:28 PM
Did I say the only possibility what that you misunderstood? So far you seem bound and determined that it is. Perhaps you could reread it one more time and grasp the meaning of what I said. But that is just more trivial diversion. The fact is, I am not afraid of preppers. But some people ARE afraid of preppers. The fact that most preppers have guns means that some people are scared of them. But the preppers are just people who think having homeowners insurance, fire extinguishers and a few smoke alarms is not enough. So they take it upon themselves to be prepared for disastors, whatever their origins might be.

LOL, you won't admit it was you that misunderstood, will you?

Very telling that you and your "allies" carefully avoid the term "survivalist"....

So who are these fearful folks?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 09:35 PM
LOL, you won't admit it was you that misunderstood, will you?

Very telling that you and your "allies" carefully avoid the term "survivalist"....

So who are these fearful folks?

I think I admitted it. It was you who stayed focused on only one portion of my statement. I am not avoiding using the word survivalist. I just think that is a misnomer. We all want to survive. But few actually prepare for disasters. So the word "preppers" is more accurate.


And thanks for being such a diligent spell-checker.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 09:38 PM
I think I admitted it. It was you who stayed focused on only one portion of my statement. I am not avoiding using the word survivalist. I just think that is a misnomer. We all want to survive. But few actually prepare for disastors. So the word "preppers" is more accurate.

Is it?

Canceled.2014.1
06-09-2012, 09:40 PM
Is it?

Yes, I think the word "preppers" is a more accurate term.

Damocles
06-09-2012, 09:55 PM
You stand corrected.
Reading Comprehension Dysfunction Disorder, you need help.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 09:56 PM
Reading Comprehension Dysfunction Disorder...

Diagnosed by Doc Damo?

Damocles
06-09-2012, 10:00 PM
Mocking? How so?
Care to explain how some beans and bottled water combined with guns n' ammo will stave off a world-ending event?
Mocking. Oddly enough in a post where you claim not to be mocking.

Anyway. If we have another near extinction event before we are technologically ready to deal with it these are the people who will survive, because they prepared for it while we did not. They will be prepared to hunt, to protect what is theirs. Most will not be ready, some few of those will survive, but the higher percentage of survivors will be among those who prepared.

Not only are they harmless, they are also necessary if a little odd to those of us who are not preparing.

Damocles
06-09-2012, 10:03 PM
Diagnosed by Doc Damo?

Nobody needs a doctor with this much evidence.

Guns Guns Guns
06-09-2012, 10:06 PM
Mocking. Oddly enough in a post where you claim not to be mocking. Anyway. If we have another near extinction event before we are technologically ready to deal with it these are the people who will survive, because they prepared for it while we did not. They will be prepared to hunt, to protect what is theirs. Most will not be ready, some few of those will survive, but the higher percentage of survivors will be among those who prepared. Not only are they harmless, they are also necessary if a little odd to those of us who are not preparing.

You've convinced me.